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RipStone's 5x5-GFH journal
- Thread starter RipStone
- Start date
Cynical Simian
New member
In addition to any lingering effects of your illness, you might have dropped the volume too much and been insufficiently warmed up. Going from five reps on four sets to five reps total (I'm assuming the workout entry, not post 162, is what you did) before working near your top weight is a pretty big change. Adding a few reps to the lightest two sets while keeping them low on the next two might help and wouldn't risk leaving you fatigued for the top set.
young_squatter
New member
Well I was just giving a suggestion Rip, Because I know by switching my stance either closer or wider my form usually gets better.
Load that camera up and tape it.
Load that camera up and tape it.
YS- I know bro and I appreciate the advice. I just dont think it would be the best step for me to take right now. Sorry if I sounded like an ass.
donny, CS, everyone else- I hope Madcow doesnt mind, but this part of the PM...
Originally Posted by RipStone
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madcow2
Yes and no, 3x5 is fine but when you are stuck in a single lift and already have progression in PR range on all other lifts, what you don't do is suddenly rachet up the workload on the big lift. These are pretty different programs, Rippetoe's might certainly be better but what I really doubt he'd do is patch in more work in the particular scenario that you are in right now. This program that you are on is different, more exercises, and more sets, obviously you need to do something with your squat but jacking it up at this point is a bad choice. Wait until more stuff stalls and then reset the whole program completely and do 3x5 under his design if you want.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madcow2
I'm only hesitant in that you are adding workload, as everything as rachets up it gets harder and harder naturally but now you are altering your format and inducing greater drain so what can happen is that everything slows as a result of this. The squat is important but when every other big lift is climbing you don't want to douche the whole thing fixing your squat (i.e. the right tire needs air at lap 100, let's swap the engine and chasis out and overhaul everything). You'll notice that my recommendations other than just resetting involve slashing workload in most places just to get a tad of progression on the squat, you are going about it the opposite way. So this is what makes me hesitant, not that it can't work but your progression is going to stop on most lifts anyway - I'd rather tweak the squat around a bit than risk crushing your entire program when you might very well still have a number of weeks left in you.
Like I said before, there are a lot of ways to go about it and the squat is important but purely from a judgement call, I'd rather not add workload this far on in the game. If you do add it, you have to take it from somewhere so the more I think about it the more I like to strip the Friday down if you are going that route on Monday. Definitely not 3x3 of the same weight, maybe drop Wed and do that for Friday along with an 8 rep set. I don't know, a lot of ways to go about it but I think this might make it clearer in why I'm hesitant for you to take a slight reset and then jack 3x5 and 3x3 for straight sets on the squat. Might bring your whole program down. If you want to go that route, I'd reset a lot lower - or save it for later.
Try it and see, I'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish by cutting Friday or if you are looking for a rebound or something but fatigue is systemic. If you are setting records in other lifts you aren't overreaching. Your squat is stalled but this isn't enough of a drop in volume to get a rebound and there isn't enough fatigue in place to be rebounding from. The whole idea with linear programs is that fatigue never catches you or only after several weeks of failure/stalled work on the majority of lifts maybe. Like I said though, I'm not sure if this is what you are going for, it doesn't work on an individual lift basis.
My advice would be to either reset the squat back 3 weeks and continue doing this program OR reset the squat back 1-2 weeks and drop the sets of 5 from your warmups and just concentrate on the big 5 on Monday and the triple on Friday (this might get you a few more weeks and better lifts before the other lifts start to drag on you).
donny, CS, everyone else- I hope Madcow doesnt mind, but this part of the PM...
Originally Posted by RipStone
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madcow2
Yes and no, 3x5 is fine but when you are stuck in a single lift and already have progression in PR range on all other lifts, what you don't do is suddenly rachet up the workload on the big lift. These are pretty different programs, Rippetoe's might certainly be better but what I really doubt he'd do is patch in more work in the particular scenario that you are in right now. This program that you are on is different, more exercises, and more sets, obviously you need to do something with your squat but jacking it up at this point is a bad choice. Wait until more stuff stalls and then reset the whole program completely and do 3x5 under his design if you want.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madcow2
I'm only hesitant in that you are adding workload, as everything as rachets up it gets harder and harder naturally but now you are altering your format and inducing greater drain so what can happen is that everything slows as a result of this. The squat is important but when every other big lift is climbing you don't want to douche the whole thing fixing your squat (i.e. the right tire needs air at lap 100, let's swap the engine and chasis out and overhaul everything). You'll notice that my recommendations other than just resetting involve slashing workload in most places just to get a tad of progression on the squat, you are going about it the opposite way. So this is what makes me hesitant, not that it can't work but your progression is going to stop on most lifts anyway - I'd rather tweak the squat around a bit than risk crushing your entire program when you might very well still have a number of weeks left in you.
Like I said before, there are a lot of ways to go about it and the squat is important but purely from a judgement call, I'd rather not add workload this far on in the game. If you do add it, you have to take it from somewhere so the more I think about it the more I like to strip the Friday down if you are going that route on Monday. Definitely not 3x3 of the same weight, maybe drop Wed and do that for Friday along with an 8 rep set. I don't know, a lot of ways to go about it but I think this might make it clearer in why I'm hesitant for you to take a slight reset and then jack 3x5 and 3x3 for straight sets on the squat. Might bring your whole program down. If you want to go that route, I'd reset a lot lower - or save it for later.
Try it and see, I'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish by cutting Friday or if you are looking for a rebound or something but fatigue is systemic. If you are setting records in other lifts you aren't overreaching. Your squat is stalled but this isn't enough of a drop in volume to get a rebound and there isn't enough fatigue in place to be rebounding from. The whole idea with linear programs is that fatigue never catches you or only after several weeks of failure/stalled work on the majority of lifts maybe. Like I said though, I'm not sure if this is what you are going for, it doesn't work on an individual lift basis.
My advice would be to either reset the squat back 3 weeks and continue doing this program OR reset the squat back 1-2 weeks and drop the sets of 5 from your warmups and just concentrate on the big 5 on Monday and the triple on Friday (this might get you a few more weeks and better lifts before the other lifts start to drag on you).
Jim Ouini said:
Thanks.
Not really doing a PLing squat. I am using a wide stance though cus it helps me go deeper. I try to squat below parallel. My flexibity needs some work though. I guess you got that impression cus I noted Dave Tate, etc. I read his stuff cus IMO its a good way to learn about proper squat form, but I do realize their is a slight difference in what PLers are trying to accomplish and what I am trying to accomplish.
week 7-saturday
-grip work: farmers walk and plate pinching
-cardio: 20mins on elliptial
-stretching
questions: So did anyone get the chance to read Madcow's PM to me(post #174)? If so, what are your thoughts? Also, should I go ahead with my proposed plan tommorow(post#162)?
Thanks guys.
-grip work: farmers walk and plate pinching
-cardio: 20mins on elliptial
-stretching
questions: So did anyone get the chance to read Madcow's PM to me(post #174)? If so, what are your thoughts? Also, should I go ahead with my proposed plan tommorow(post#162)?
Thanks guys.
anotherbutters
New member
I'm a bit confused by what madcow said because he's talking about a 3x5 and increased workload, but you didn't suggest that in your post #162. I feel like I've only got half the conversation, or he misunderstood your intentions.
3x5 is where you'd work up to 3 sets of 5 at the same top weight. So that would be an increase in workload because you're currently only doing 1 set at the top weight. His concern was that with you already stalling on squats, you might be close to stalling on the other lifts, so you need to tread carefully. If you increase workload by doing 3x5 on squats, that might push you over the edge and you could stall on everything. So he was suggesting reducing the reps on the earlier sets to make the one top set of 5 more attainable. But that's what you were also suggesting in post #162. So it sounds like he's arguing that you should do what you said you were going to do in the first place!
So... go ahead with what you said in post #162.
3x5 is where you'd work up to 3 sets of 5 at the same top weight. So that would be an increase in workload because you're currently only doing 1 set at the top weight. His concern was that with you already stalling on squats, you might be close to stalling on the other lifts, so you need to tread carefully. If you increase workload by doing 3x5 on squats, that might push you over the edge and you could stall on everything. So he was suggesting reducing the reps on the earlier sets to make the one top set of 5 more attainable. But that's what you were also suggesting in post #162. So it sounds like he's arguing that you should do what you said you were going to do in the first place!
So... go ahead with what you said in post #162.
anotherbutters said:
Sorry bro, I guess I wasnt being clear enough. Post #162 was the end result of my PM coversation with Madcow, so if it looks good to you that is just what I wanted to hear. Nice job deciphering the convo dective butters, ha
And yes, this is not the entire PM, but only like 40% of Madcow's replies to me. I wasnt sure how to post the replies so they would read chronologically(so Madcow's 1st reply would follow my first question, etc).Thanks again for your help.
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