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Fair enough leancuisine. As HansNZ pointed out, yours is an extremely common point of view, especially amongst bodybuilders. But in my experience, it's not the protein source that makes or breaks a BB......there are millions of Americans out there who are omnivorous and have high meat intakes. They are hardly recommendations for this type of diet though since they are obese and lazy slobs with no knwoledge of decent nutrition. The same applies to the majority of vegetarians I have known (skinny, sickly, weak salad eaters), and this was shown quite clearly in a study published by Campbell et al in 1999 where they put some old male omnivores on a weight training program for 12 weeks, and had half of them eliminate meat from their diet. Without any nutritional counselling the poor old guys on the meat free diet had a dramatic drop in protein intake and did not get nearly as good muscle growth as the guys that continued eating meat. However just last year this same group of researchers did the exact same experiment but this time they controlled for protein intake. They told both groups how and what to eat to ensure that everyone got adequate protein and it should be no surprise that both groups but on equally decent amounts of muscle. Admittedly these were old guys, and it wasn't a totally vegan diet they put them on, but it certainly illustrates that AN EDUCATED VEGETARIAN bodybuilder, just like an EDUCATED OMNIVOROUS bodybuilder, can make equally good gains. I also would point out that the majority of 'omnivores' I see weight training at the gym do not make any decent gains in spite of the inclusion of meat in their diets. It's really not about the source of the protein, it's about adequate protein, protein and carb timing (and all the other macro and micronutients), adequate calories, training, rest etc....
Now I would relate to you better if you just said "I hate eating nothing but chick peas, lentils and brown rice with soy protein, and could not personally stick to a meat free diet well enough to grow because I don't like those foods, but I love meat". This is more honest than saying that a plant based diet is always inadequate compared to an omnivorous diet.
Effect of protein source on resistive-training-induced changes in body composition and muscle size in older men.
Haub MD, Wells AM, Tarnopolsky MA, Campbell WW.
Department of Human Nutrition, Kansas State University, Manhattan, KS 66506, USA. [email protected]
BACKGROUND: Aging is associated with reductions in muscle mass and strength, but nutrition and exercise interventions can delay this progression and enhance the quality of life. OBJECTIVE: We examined whether the predominant source of protein consumed by older men influenced measures of muscle size and strength, body composition, resting energy expenditure, and skeletal muscle creatine concentrations in response to 12 wk of resistive training. DESIGN: After consuming a lactoovovegetarian (LOV) diet for 2 wk, 21 men aged 65 +/- 5 y were randomly assigned to either consume a beef-containing (BC) diet (n = 10) or to continue the LOV diet (n = 11) throughout resistive training. The BC diet included 0.6 g protein per kg per day from beef and the LOV diet included 0.6 g proteinper kg per day from textured vegetable protein (soy) sources. The remaining protein in the diets came from self-selected LOV sources. RESULTS: The mean total protein intake for both groups ranged from 1.03 to 1.17 grams per kg per day during the intervention. Men in both groups had improvements (14-38%) in maximal dynamic strength of all the muscle groups trained with no significant difference between groups. With resistive training, cross- sectional muscle area of the vastus lateralis increased in both groups with no significant difference between groups. Body composition, resting energy expenditure, and concentrations of muscle creatine, phosphocreatine, and total creatine did not differ significantly between groups or change over time. CONCLUSIONS: These data suggest that increases in muscle strength and size were not influenced by the predominant source of protein consumed by older men with adequate total protein intake.
Now I would relate to you better if you just said "I hate eating nothing but chick peas, lentils and brown rice with soy protein, and could not personally stick to a meat free diet well enough to grow because I don't like those foods, but I love meat". This is more honest than saying that a plant based diet is always inadequate compared to an omnivorous diet.
Effect of protein source on resistive-training-induced changes in body composition and muscle size in older men.
Haub MD, Wells AM, Tarnopolsky MA, Campbell WW.
Department of Human Nutrition, Kansas State University, Manhattan, KS 66506, USA. [email protected]
BACKGROUND: Aging is associated with reductions in muscle mass and strength, but nutrition and exercise interventions can delay this progression and enhance the quality of life. OBJECTIVE: We examined whether the predominant source of protein consumed by older men influenced measures of muscle size and strength, body composition, resting energy expenditure, and skeletal muscle creatine concentrations in response to 12 wk of resistive training. DESIGN: After consuming a lactoovovegetarian (LOV) diet for 2 wk, 21 men aged 65 +/- 5 y were randomly assigned to either consume a beef-containing (BC) diet (n = 10) or to continue the LOV diet (n = 11) throughout resistive training. The BC diet included 0.6 g protein per kg per day from beef and the LOV diet included 0.6 g proteinper kg per day from textured vegetable protein (soy) sources. The remaining protein in the diets came from self-selected LOV sources. RESULTS: The mean total protein intake for both groups ranged from 1.03 to 1.17 grams per kg per day during the intervention. Men in both groups had improvements (14-38%) in maximal dynamic strength of all the muscle groups trained with no significant difference between groups. With resistive training, cross- sectional muscle area of the vastus lateralis increased in both groups with no significant difference between groups. Body composition, resting energy expenditure, and concentrations of muscle creatine, phosphocreatine, and total creatine did not differ significantly between groups or change over time. CONCLUSIONS: These data suggest that increases in muscle strength and size were not influenced by the predominant source of protein consumed by older men with adequate total protein intake.
