Effective Diet Approach When "On". (Vets please chime in)

[Izzman]

I was just wondering about this lately, since being on makes for a tremendous improvement is nutrition utilization and decent growth with enough calories, what would be the more effective approach: 1) Moderate Carbs/Fat (1.5-2 g/lb carbs and .5g/lb fats) with high protein (2 g/lb) on training days and High Protein and High Fat (healthy) with .25 - 5 g/lb carbs on off days. Or Number 2) A keto style bulk with high protein/fats and no carbs 6 days (w/ 1 day carbup of course), wouldn't this help minimize fat gain (since bodyfat is always used for fuel) and still provide the calories for growth for when on? Anyone ever try this, especially when on? I may try this on my next cycle. Vets please chime in (Mavy, BBF, Ulter, Macro, and etc). K for help.

 

[Izzman]

Bump for the vets.

 

[rpol]

The Keto Diet never worked for me to Bulk/Gain muscle. However the low fat moderate carb, high protein served me well except I did 3 grams per lb. protein that gained me the most muscle but too high calories still put on fat. I think calorie restriction and the right ratios is the Key and am having some success by keeping calories at only 500 over maintenance and making that extra 500 calories all protein

 

[OMEGA]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Cutting diet I wanted to share (tha crumb cake: original Author)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is a Strict Diet for 8 weeks. No CHEAT days, None. 56 days Straight. If you can't deal with it, then this isn't for you. If you can hang, The results will be Phenomenal.

This is a Diet for someone who is in Shape, but just needs to lose those LAST few pounds of Stubborn fat.

This diet will work ESPECIALLY for those with excess Fat in the lower abs, thighs, lower back area.

Diet Guidelines:

Avoid All starches, You don't need them if your goal is to get down to 4-7 ****ing Percent BodyFat.

1. Eat Tons of Green Veggies (Fiber)

2. Eat Lots of Healthy Fats ex. Steak, Flax Oil, E.v. OliveOil, Salmon, Fish Oils, etc. (Energy)

3. Eat TONS of Protein (Preserve Muscles)

4. DRINK 1 1/2 gallons of H20 a day AT LEAST.

Avoid ALL fruit drinks, Juices, rice, breads.

Eat carbos ONLY after a grueling Glycogen depleting workout.

You will have Tons of energy from the Healthy Fats,
Good digestion from the Fiber,
and great Muscle Hardness and Protection from the Protein.

Healthy Fats = Energy
Protein = Muscle Hardness, Muscle Protection
Fiber = Digestion, and various other health Benefits.


Healthy Fats, Lots of Fiber, And TONS of Protein. That's the key.

Not only will you DROP bodyfat while maintaing Muscle, but you will ALSO have an abundance of energy and your skin (complexion) will be looking great as well.

Example of a Day...

1. 3 servings of Whey/ 1 tablespoon of Flax Oil
2. 8 - 10oz London Broil Steak (Extra Lean)/ 1-2 cups Green Veggies.
3. Grilled Salmon/ 1-2 cups Green Veggies.
4. 3 servings of Whey/ 1 tablespoon of Flax Oil
5. 2 Cans of Tuna/ Chopped Onions/Celery/ 1 tablespoon of Safflower Mayonaise.
6. (Post Workout) MRP or 2 servings of Whey/10oz Orange Juice.
7. 8-10oz Extra Lean Steak/ 2 cups Veggies.

Breaks Down to about:
Protein 1.5 - 2 grams per lb of Bodyweight
Fat .5 - .75grams per lb of Bodyweight
Carbs (only post workout) 30-50 grams
Fiber in the form of Green Veggies - As much as Possible.

Supplements:

Do NOT take ANY FAT BURNERS...why? They will Surpress your appetite TOO much, You need to eat every 2 hours. If you take a fat burner you won't be up to it.

1 Multivitamin
Extra Zinc 30 - 50mgs
Fish Oil Caps
Flax Oil Liquid
200mcg Selenium
800mgs Folic Acid
800iu Vitamin E
2grams Vitamin C

WORKOUTS:

Staying ACTIVE!! is the KEY. ALWAYSSSS stay Active.

Lift 4 times a Week. Alternate Between Heavy Low Rep workouts, and High repetition Moderate Weight Workouts.

Cardio, 4-7 days a week, Alernate Between 20 min High Intensity (Jump Ropes, Sprints) and Low intensity for 45min - 1hour (Walking, Light Jogging, Jumping Jacks (lol) )



This DIET is NOT easy by Anymeans, It takes proper planning a day ahead of time. (You have to have the Steaks/ Veggies/ Chicken/ Salmon, Thawed out Before cooking them, Put stuff in Tupper Ware..you Just have to be Prepared.)
Be prepared to Go through at LEAST 1lb of lean Steak a day, and 10 servings of Whey Powder a day and TONS of Green Veggies a day. Be prepared to be going grocery shopping at least twice a week.

Like I said ths diet is not easy, But oh well, No one said this game is Easy.

But Remember if you can stick through it for 8 Grueling weeks, You'll be Satified at the End with your Amazing Results.

Good Luck.

p.s. NEVER mix Fat and Carbs at the Same meal.

Peace,

Crumcake.

 

[Mythicalbeing]

I know you asked for vets opinions bro, But I'd go Number 1.
Keto type diet has some friends and foes Muscular Development Jan 2004 has an excellent article on the topic.

Keto type diet is a good diet for a dieting bodybuilder(while on, pre contest ect.)
....but for bulk you need to include carbs and fat in moderation. With high calories and a min of 2 grams of protien per pound of bodyweight.

I would say your answer depends on your goals.

 

[Izzman]

Thanks Mythical Being and Rpol, what do some of you guys believe is the ideal cals Per lb rate to gain LBM only (14-15 or 16-17)? I always get mixed answers on this.

 

[Mavy]

Eh bro ... This is something that you are just honestly going to have to experiment with bro, until you find out what works for you. I am personally not a big fan of Ketos, but then again, I have never ran one strictly for an extended period of time. I really see no need to. I have always ate a very low carb diet before, not full out keto, but still very low carbs. I started cutting recently, and have actually ADDED carbs into my diet, and have lost about 4 lbs in two weeks so far (also taking clen). Workouts are going great, and I feel great, compared to the times I tried to illimanate carbs.

I personally feel that a lot of people have to get it out of their heads that carbs are the enemy, especially with this whole Atkins fad going on right now. You can go Keto for a long time, then eat a plate of pancakes, drink a liter of gatorade and gain all your weight back! lol. I would personally pass on going keto. Carbs are good for you, you just need to eat the right ones. The only carbs in my diet right now are sweet potatoes, brown rice, oatmeal, multigrain toast, and black beans. Then, I eat a bunch of fibrous "carbless carbs" as well, mainly spinach and brocoli. I eat the fibrous carbs on non-training days, and the grainier carbs on training days. Fast carbs that I use (usually "around" my workouts) are dextrose and honey. I also drink prune juice in the morning for fibre (its grouse). Again though, you are not going to know what foods really work well for you, until you give em a shot. Different somatotypes different chemical makeup, different stats, and different metabolisms in different people are all going to play a huge role, which is obviously why Bills diet dosnet work worth a shit for Jim etc... If you are trying to build mass, I really wouldnt go with a Keto diet. If you are cutting and want to try it .. give it a shot. My personal recomendation is to go with a full balanced diet of protiens, fats and carbs everyday. Keeping the foods clean, will allow you to still lean gain. My 2ccs.

Mavy

 

[Ic3b3rg]

tha crumb cake's diet is the diet that worked perfectly for me and I am currently doing it once again only need 13 days to go and the results so far a good. Its a pain but hell, who said the game was easy. You want a good body u suffer 1st then u enjoy

 

[Mavy]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Cutting diet I wanted to share (tha crumb cake: original Author)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is a Strict Diet for 8 weeks. No CHEAT days, None. 56 days Straight. If you can't deal with it, then this isn't for you. If you can hang, The results will be Phenomenal.

This is a Diet for someone who is in Shape, but just needs to lose those LAST few pounds of Stubborn fat.

This diet will work ESPECIALLY for those with excess Fat in the lower abs, thighs, lower back area.

Diet Guidelines:

Avoid All starches, You don't need them if your goal is to get down to 4-7 ****ing Percent BodyFat.

1. Eat Tons of Green Veggies (Fiber)

2. Eat Lots of Healthy Fats ex. Steak, Flax Oil, E.v. OliveOil, Salmon, Fish Oils, etc. (Energy)

3. Eat TONS of Protein (Preserve Muscles)

4. DRINK 1 1/2 gallons of H20 a day AT LEAST.

Avoid ALL fruit drinks, Juices, rice, breads.

Eat carbos ONLY after a grueling Glycogen depleting workout.

You will have Tons of energy from the Healthy Fats,
Good digestion from the Fiber,
and great Muscle Hardness and Protection from the Protein.

Healthy Fats = Energy
Protein = Muscle Hardness, Muscle Protection
Fiber = Digestion, and various other health Benefits.


Healthy Fats, Lots of Fiber, And TONS of Protein. That's the key.

Not only will you DROP bodyfat while maintaing Muscle, but you will ALSO have an abundance of energy and your skin (complexion) will be looking great as well.

Example of a Day...

1. 3 servings of Whey/ 1 tablespoon of Flax Oil
2. 8 - 10oz London Broil Steak (Extra Lean)/ 1-2 cups Green Veggies.
3. Grilled Salmon/ 1-2 cups Green Veggies.
4. 3 servings of Whey/ 1 tablespoon of Flax Oil
5. 2 Cans of Tuna/ Chopped Onions/Celery/ 1 tablespoon of Safflower Mayonaise.
6. (Post Workout) MRP or 2 servings of Whey/10oz Orange Juice.
7. 8-10oz Extra Lean Steak/ 2 cups Veggies.

Breaks Down to about:
Protein 1.5 - 2 grams per lb of Bodyweight
Fat .5 - .75grams per lb of Bodyweight
Carbs (only post workout) 30-50 grams
Fiber in the form of Green Veggies - As much as Possible.

Supplements:

Do NOT take ANY FAT BURNERS...why? They will Surpress your appetite TOO much, You need to eat every 2 hours. If you take a fat burner you won't be up to it.

1 Multivitamin
Extra Zinc 30 - 50mgs
Fish Oil Caps
Flax Oil Liquid
200mcg Selenium
800mgs Folic Acid
800iu Vitamin E
2grams Vitamin C

WORKOUTS:

Staying ACTIVE!! is the KEY. ALWAYSSSS stay Active.

Lift 4 times a Week. Alternate Between Heavy Low Rep workouts, and High repetition Moderate Weight Workouts.

Cardio, 4-7 days a week, Alernate Between 20 min High Intensity (Jump Ropes, Sprints) and Low intensity for 45min - 1hour (Walking, Light Jogging, Jumping Jacks (lol) )



This DIET is NOT easy by Anymeans, It takes proper planning a day ahead of time. (You have to have the Steaks/ Veggies/ Chicken/ Salmon, Thawed out Before cooking them, Put stuff in Tupper Ware..you Just have to be Prepared.)
Be prepared to Go through at LEAST 1lb of lean Steak a day, and 10 servings of Whey Powder a day and TONS of Green Veggies a day. Be prepared to be going grocery shopping at least twice a week.

Like I said ths diet is not easy, But oh well, No one said this game is Easy.

But Remember if you can stick through it for 8 Grueling weeks, You'll be Satified at the End with your Amazing Results.

Good Luck.

p.s. NEVER mix Fat and Carbs at the Same meal.

Peace,

Crumcake.

Thats an intersting diet Omega. Except for at the beginning he warns ... Avoid ALL fruit drinks and Juices, then he recommends drinking orange juice for meal number 6. Is this because its post workout? I personally think that OJ is a poor carb choice for post workout. I guess that this can be debated til the cows come home though. lol.

 

[Izzman]

Eh bro ... This is something that you are just honestly going to have to experiment with bro, until you find out what works for you. I am personally not a big fan of Ketos, but then again, I have never ran one strictly for an extended period of time. I really see no need to. I have always ate a very low carb diet before, not full out keto, but still very low carbs. I started cutting recently, and have actually ADDED carbs into my diet, and have lost about 4 lbs in two weeks so far (also taking clen). Workouts are going great, and I feel great, compared to the times I tried to illimanate carbs.

I personally feel that a lot of people have to get it out of their heads that carbs are the enemy, especially with this whole Atkins fad going on right now. You can go Keto for a long time, then eat a plate of pancakes, drink a liter of gatorade and gain all your weight back! lol. I would personally pass on going keto. Carbs are good for you, you just need to eat the right ones. The only carbs in my diet right now are sweet potatoes, brown rice, oatmeal, multigrain toast, and black beans. Then, I eat a bunch of fibrous "carbless carbs" as well, mainly spinach and brocoli. I eat the fibrous carbs on non-training days, and the grainier carbs on training days. Fast carbs that I use (usually "around" my workouts) are dextrose and honey. I also drink prune juice in the morning for fibre (its grouse). Again though, you are not going to know what foods really work well for you, until you give em a shot. Different somatotypes different chemical makeup, different stats, and different metabolisms in different people are all going to play a huge role, which is obviously why Bills diet dosnet work worth a shit for Jim etc... If you are trying to build mass, I really wouldnt go with a Keto diet. If you are cutting and want to try it .. give it a shot. My personal recomendation is to go with a full balanced diet of protiens, fats and carbs everyday. Keeping the foods clean, will allow you to still lean gain. My 2ccs.

Mavy

Great Post Bro, I would give K but I need to spread around 1st! Keto actually cuts me up damn good! (am In my second keto right now, always seems to spare more mass than a low carb cutter) I can achieve fat loss at 2-3 lbs a week with the aid of clen while on keto, however I want to see how good the diet is for bulking. Then again insulin is vital for muscle growth so it seems to be a double edged sword.