When was it official that Dbol was only to be used to "jumpstart" a cycle?

[Jenetic]

?

I believe you have a few things mixed up.

HDL or high density lipoprotein is the cholesterol carried by the alpha lipoproteins. A high level of HDL is an indication of a healthy metabolic system if there is no sign of liver disease or intoxication. The two mechanisms that explain how HDL offers protection against chronic heart disease are that HDL inhibits cellular uptake of LDL and serves as a carrier that removes cholesterol from the peripheral tissues and transports it back to the liver for catabolism and excretion

The most commonly used markers of hepatocyte injury are aspartate aminotransferase (AST/SGOT) and alanine aminotransferase (ALT/SGPT). While ALT is cytosolic, AST has both cytosolic and mitochondrial forms. Also, another important marker is Gamma Glutamyl Transpeptidase (GGT)

ALT

The enzyme appears in liver cells, with lesser amounts in the kidneys, heart, and skeletal muscles, and is a relatively specific indicator of acute liver cell damage. When such damage occurs, ALT is released from the liver cells into the bloodstream, often before jaundice appears, resulting in abnormally high serum levels that may not return to normal for days or weeks. The purpose of this blood serum test is to help detect and evaluate treatment of acute hepatic disease, especially hepatitis, and cirrhosis without jaundice

AST

The purpose of this blood test is to detect a recent myocardial infarction (heart attack) and to aid detection and differential diagnosis of acute hepatic disease and to monitor patient progress and prognosis in cardiac and hepatic diseases. AST levels fluctuate in response to the extent of cellular necrosis (cell death) and therefore may be temporarily and minimally elevated early in the disease process, and extremely elevated during the most acute phase. Depending on when the initial sample was drawn, AST levels can rise indicating increasing disease severity and tissue damage or fall indicating disease resolution and tissue repair. Thus, the relative change in AST values serves as a reliable monitoring mechanism.

GGT

This is involved in the transport of amino acids and peptides into cells as well as glutithione metabolism, Gamma Glutamyl Transpeptidase is mainly found in liver cells and as such is extremely sensitive to alcohol use. Elevated levels may be found in liver disease, alcoholism, bileduct obstruction, cholangitis, drug abuse, and in some cases excessive magnesium ingestion.

Jenetic

 

[Jenetic]

Thanks Jenetic, and K to you. Soooo, It would be a good idea to run 500mg of omna for 10 wks and the dbol at say 30 mg daily for say the first 8 wks? I had originally intended to run the dbol(30mg) for the first 4 weeks. I was gonna run 50mg winny from wks 8-12 and then start pct. I know you dont like ?s not about the thread but can you answer this one for me. Thanks SBWOI

That sounds fine. Use 4-6 tabs of Tyler's Liver Detox ED and 600-1000 mgs Glucorell R (R-ALA) ED. If possible, have blood work performed during and after your cycle and you will have proof that there is nothing wrong.

Jenetic

 

[Deleted member 33117]

I would also have to agree with Jenetic here on teh dbol/deca stack. I've met older guys who were quite large back in the day have hear reports of cycles such as 200 mg deca a week/ 25-30 mg of dbol a day for 20-30 weeks, and have seen old pictures of the guys who used these stacks, and was quite surprised to see lean 19" arms on them. Who btw they were still alive and healthy.

 

[Dieharder]

dbol only might be my next cycle in a few months, considering i have 100ml of it

 

[Texas Ranger]

The answer is simple. He stopped using it.

Internet paranoia is a disease these days. A perfect example in regards to lack of eduaction and experience.

Jenetic

I too bought into the orals for only 4 weeks club. Until I started to research more and spoke to alot of guys that have gone beyond what would be considered the norm with oral use. I plan on running a 16 week cycle with Dbol being used for the first 8 weeks and Winstrol being used the last 4 weeks. R-ALA & Milk Thistle will be used ED. So, I'm not too concerned because there's NOTHING wrong with my liver in the first place. Thanks Jenetic for opening everyone's eyes!!

 

[strongsmartsexy]

I would also have to agree with Jenetic here on teh dbol/deca stack. I've met older guys who were quite large back in the day have hear reports of cycles such as 200 mg deca a week/ 25-30 mg of dbol a day for 20-30 weeks, and have seen old pictures of the guys who used these stacks, and was quite surprised to see lean 19" arms on them. Who btw they were still alive and healthy.

Hot DAMN! 20 - 30 weeks of dbol gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

 

[Texas Ranger]

Hot DAMN! 20 - 30 weeks of dbol gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

LOL!!!!!

 

[Juice Authority]

Instant gains in water. These are the same people that claim to lose a considerable ammount of muscle post cycle.

Androgenic stimulus to the CNS in regards to strength is evident but subsides shortly after discontinuation. Neuromusclar adapatation to the training load and stimulus would not likely occur in the commonly recomended 4 weeks.

Other than a psychological comfort, the most common reason is safety and health. Why even run it for such a short period of time when the rewards are minimal.

Jenetic

It's called the law of diminishing returns. I usually run dbol longer (6 weeks). After 6 weeks the gains made are significantly less with the same strain on your liver. Plus, running a 17AA for long periods of time is bound to greatly skew your lipid profile, especially shutting down your hdl to the single digit range. This is well documented.

 

[small but working on it]

bump for more info, this is a good thread!

 

[Jenetic]

It's called the law of diminishing returns. I usually run dbol longer (6 weeks). After 6 weeks the gains made are significantly less with the same strain on your liver. Plus, running a 17AA for long periods of time is bound to greatly skew your lipid profile, especially shutting down your hdl to the single digit range. This is well documented.

Law of diminishing returns? Why?

The majority of people with problems don't incoporate the proper supplements amongst many other things.

The lipid profile is affected regardless which AAS you use. This is to be expected. Your cholesterol can easily be maintained with a combination of OTC supplements such as Policosanol, a clean diet, a realistic cycle duration of 8 weeks and ancilliary drugs such as nolvadex. Glucophage is also a possibility.

Most people have a problem with thier lipids already and they don't even know it. It's called a poor diet and it's evident with majority of users no matter how much the try to deny it. This is specifically in regards to people with a body fat percentage of approximately >15%. Most people with cholesterol issues are in that range and it's primarily diet related.

You will encounter some side effects regardless of AAS choice which are not life threatening. To what degree depends on your preparation.

Jenetic