My Training Journal - Bill Starr's Single Factor 5 x 5

[Jim Ouini]

Congrats on the PR's, nice work.

I personally use straps on my heavy sets since I have a lot on my mind without worrying about my grip

Still, most guys here seem to eschew the straps in favor of working grip and forearms.

I've never worn a belt while deadlifting, though, even for max attempts. Maybe I should try it.

 

[blut wump]

Congrats on your slew of PRs.

Given the choice between using straps and missing the lift, take the straps. I think it's worthwhile to use a double-overhand grip while you can and then be strap-free while you can.

 

[anotherbutters]

Congrats on the new PRs! Out of curiosity, do you do your pullups with a wide or narrow grip? Palms in or out?

I think it's worthwhile to use a double-overhand grip while you can and then be strap-free while you can.

Any particular reason on not mentioning mixed grip? I try for double-overhand for as much as I can (although I admit I don't know why), then switch to mixed, where everything suddenly becomes a lot easier. I'm sure mixed grip will work your grip strength as much as overhand, so try that if you're not already trying it before resorting to straps.

I occasionally use straps, but only as a last resort if I know my grip's going. And if memory serves correct, I find those lifts particularly hard. It's probably something to do with something Blut Wump mentioned yesterday - about you not being able to lift something that you know your grip won't hold on to. I think straps get round a grip problem, but you still have that reflex.

I also used chalk for the first time yesterday and that made a lot of difference. I usually get sweaty palms during a set, even if I wipe them thoroughly beforehand. Chalk eliminated that.

Try to do them without gloves. Gloves are another layer of movement between your hand and the bar. Try to hold the bar low in your hand, which is where it's trying to go during the set, not in the middle of your palm.

Sorry, I'm rambling a bit tonight. I'm tired and I just got in from yet another leaving do. Hope some of that helped.

Good luck with the cricket

 

[|D_J^B_J|]

Thanks for the positive feedback.

BW: Are double-overhand-grip deads really that much better than mixed-grip deads? I've never really tried them with a double-overhand-grip.

AB: My pull-ups are done slightly wider than shoulder width, with palms out.

One other thing: I find that the day after I do deads, I get quite an irritating pain in my mid-lower back (not excruciating), and it usually goes away in a couple of days. Today, it seems to be much worse than usual.

Is this pain normal? It's kind of like a strain in my back, but I'm not sure whether it's good or bad. Perhaps wearing a belt for extra back support would help?

 

[blut wump]

The double overhand is harder on the grip due to having to control the bar more. I also find it a more natural grip since it doesn't provoke a spinal rotation and it takes less out of my shins.

I think fighting that tendency of the bar to open your fingers as it tries to roll in your hand is an excellent grip-strengthener. I do all my warmups with a double-overhand grip and stick with it until I think it's likely to fail or I just don't want the hassle of thinking about whether it will fail as I'm going for a particularly heavy lift or set.

I just took a look in Rippetoe's 'Starting Strength' (Page 108). I quote:
"The lift is famous for is alternate grip, but the use of the double-overhand grip as much as possible makes for stronger hands"

I use the double-overhand as much as I can and my grip has improved steadily all year.

I don't know about the pain. I always do some hamstring stretches after deadlifting. I find that the stretch goes right into the lower back.

 

[|D_J^B_J|]

I don't know about the pain. I always do some hamstring stretches after deadlifting. I find that the stretch goes right into the lower back.

Hamstring stretches certainly seemed to help as the pain has subsided a bit now. I still think I'll use a belt next time I deadlift, though. I only get the pain from deadlifting and although I would like to be bigger and stronger, I don't want to have arthritus in my back by the time I'm 30, and then not be able to lift again.

 

[blut wump]

Maybe your spinal erectors are feeling overworked or maybe your form is slightly out. I'd recommend doing hamstring stretches after every workout for a while and maybe you should also drop the volume on the deadlifts. Perhaps drop down to 3x3 rather than 5x5 at your current lift. If the problem is just fatigue in those muscles then that should help noticably within a couple of weeks and then you can work the volume back up.

 

[Jim Ouini]

I need to do these hammie stretches after deadlifting. Lately my back has been really sore upon waking and then as it loosens up it feels better.

|D_J^B_J|: Like BW said, just to be safe you may want to check your form or have someone watch you dead and see if you have rounded back.

 

[61stude]

i've read that when doing the bent over rows, you should'nt go past 70 degree's from vertical, so you would'nt be cheating if go past 90. Seen some builders doing it that way. Just a thought

 

[anotherbutters]

madcow recommended 90 degrees for maximum recruitment of the lats. You can do them higher, but you won't hit the lats as much. The subject was deadlifts though, not rows.