what size arms do you think those calvin Klein models have, the ones that do the boxer underwear modeling? Or how about Stallone in Rambo II or Rocky III IV? I would say under 16 inches (or there about)and look how good they look. It is because of the hardness, definition, low body fat, symetry etc.... I would say 17 inch arms with no flab and hard , defined are the ideal IMO. Not everyone wants to be 6'4 250 lbs with 19 inch guns and a 400 pound bench, give me 6'2 210 pounds ripped with fighting skills and health and speed and that is my ideal.