The Vick Case

[Lestat]

honestly, five minutes with me. give me 5 minutes with mr vick......he wouldnt think about hurting another animal. we could argue moral relativism all day long and we would get no where.......just read this thread. however, i do know how this story makes me FEEL. he should pick on someone who can fight back, like me. people that hurt animals are bullies and this cant be argued. bullies are cowards.

So you are saying that physical violence against another human is justified if this person is harming another animal? Does it matter the type of animal, or just any that you really care about or like? What if the person owns the animal, you can still assault them or no?

 

[Lestat]

I wonder how Lestat felt about Paris being jailed for all those days.

I felt she totally deserved it.

 

[Lestat]

If I come kill your dog will you call the cops on me?

yes.

I love dogs, grew up with them, and will one day own a pair of Rotties myself. Will not be trained to be aggressive or exploit their protective nature.

 

[layinback]

So you are saying that physical violence against another human is justified if this person is harming another animal? Does it matter the type of animal, or just any that you really care about or like? What if the person owns the animal, you can still assault them or no?

i am darwinian so i am very objective concerning "fitness" and its ancillaries. domestic animals are akin to children, very reliant on us. NO sentient being should be abused. what he did was wrong and cant be justified. as far as his punishment, i dont know. i only know how it makes me feel......ANGRY! i have been in prison and have confronted bullies. a peculiar personality type, bullies. boilerplate fuckers.... absolutely will not fight anybody or anything that will fight back. most bullies share "animal abuse" histories. not all sociopaths abuse animals, only a very sick subtype. trust me lestat, you would not want to spend any quality time with this fucker. morality is a tricky arm of philosophy and formal arguments are lengthy and time consuming. we could toss around examples all night. i know how this makes me feel and it aint good.

 

[Lestat]

i am darwinian so i am very objective concerning "fitness" and its ancillaries. domestic animals are akin to children, very reliant on us. NO sentient being should be abused. what he did was wrong and cant be justified. as far as his punishment, i dont know. i only know how it makes me feel......ANGRY! i have been in prison and have confronted bullies. a peculiar personality type, bullies. boilerplate fuckers.... absolutely will not fight anybody or anything that will fight back. most bullies share "animal abuse" histories. not all sociopaths abuse animals, only a very sick subtype. trust me lestat, you would not want to spend any quality time with this fucker. morality is a tricky arm of philosophy and formal arguments are lengthy and time consuming. we could toss around examples all night. i know how this makes me feel and it aint good.

I understand how it makes you feel, I feel angry about what he did as well.

I still think at the end of the day though, it was only dogs. And I love dogs. But this is Vick's life, and millions of dollars. Over some dogs?

I think he saw it as sport, just as a hunter views a hunt as sport. ITS NOT A SPORT AND SHOULD BE BANNED. But Vick saw it as a sport, nothing more, I wouldn't read into it any more than that.

 

[layinback]

btw, animals do not possess qualities such as "good" and "bad". ergo they do not need to be punished. man, on the other hand, cursed with consciousness, own these in spades and with that ownership comes responsibility and consequences.( sorry couldnt help but get a little philosophical.)

 

[Lestat]

btw, animals do not possess qualities such as "good" and "bad". ergo they do not need to be punished. man, on the other hand, cursed with consciousness, own these in spades and with that ownership comes responsibility and consequences.( sorry couldnt help but get a little philosophical.)

i agree with you there bro.

punishing and rewarding animals is done primarly to train. To reinfoce desireable (good) behaviors your reward, to eliminate unwanted behavior (bad) you negatively reinforce or punish. Personally I NEVER use violence against a domesticated animal to train, and I wouldn't againt any human children either, they lack the same sort of reasoning that dogs do. It grows as the brain matures.

I'd say animals are conscious though, all of them, including humans. Different ones have different levels of pain they can feel due to how complicated their brains are. I believe dogs experience consciousness in a way very similar to humans on the most basic levels, but lack higher reasoning.

 

[FISHTALES]

steroids are illeagal

 

[Lestat]

steroids are illeagal

haha yeah no shit, hypocrisy alert! I bet a lot of people on here beat their kids too, but fuck, gotta throw Vick in jail for fucking up a dog!

 

[layinback]

I understand how it makes you feel, I feel angry about what he did as well.

I still think at the end of the day though, it was only dogs. And I love dogs. But this is Vick's life, and millions of dollars. Over some dogs?

I think he saw it as sport, just as a hunter views a hunt as sport. ITS NOT A SPORT AND SHOULD BE BANNED. But Vick saw it as a sport, nothing more, I wouldn't read into it any more than that.

reductio ad absurdum: i love old ppl with organic damage. these folk no longer serve any purpose and they cost money.....lets givem hatchets and place our bets. (the ambulatory ones of course) lol. vick should have thought of that beforehand. dog fighting is a felony and is repulsive to most. btw, its terrible pr for a pro ballplayer and not good for ones career in general. he has some consequences and the 24 hr cable news are milkin it for what its worth. hey, they got bills to pay. i just like to give him a good ole fashion aikido wake up call. trust me that all he needs....gave out a few of those in my time and it straightened up some otherwise hardheaded bullies. and yes , sometimes violence is needed...even begged for.