Guys, help me out, are tricep kickbacks definately a waste?

[bignate73]

every muscle involved in a squat or deadlift is the muscles that women always claim to want "firmed up". glutes, inner thigh, outer thigh, quads, hams. to break it apart and work each one may be good for someone who wants to really nitpick their physique. but in general, if someone is getting "wider" its because they are adding muscle and not dropping fat. ive not seen too many ladies gain an appreciable amount of muscle in their lower body if you keep them in the 10-15 rep range, especially if they are in a calorie deficit. the building blocks just arent there.

 

[Veretta9]

I think they are good if you superset with them. I superset them with bench dips and get a great pump in my tri's. I like them a lot, just my two cents.

 

[Nonerz]

I don't make these claims without knowing what I'm saying... I have what i have SEEN in the gym and have discussed with other females who train. -- I'm not saying that every female will get wider doing those exercises... but that is what they do... Hell, even I have gotten wider doing deadlifts and squats.

I guess I'm just getting some contradicting & confusing verbage from you and I tend to question just about everything.

Also, I don't think I am doing any of my client's a disservice. They walk out of the gym with their asses kicked. On leg day... they can't walk without some good old fashioned pain for several days later... I blast them on arms, back, shoulders the works... all of the females I train tell me they feel like thier ass was kicked.

In my opinion, the disservice is omitting them altogether. Not sharing some of the very best exercises with them.

Getting your ass kicked is a good thing...not being able to walk without pain for several days is not. That tells me that I won't be able to (productively) work legs for a longer time...until I'm recovered.

I'd say if you are doing deadlifts with any effectiveness... you SHOULD be getting wider -- maybe you should talk to your trainer about correct form on the deadlift?

I never resigned with my trainer (thank god) but I've got a lot of help with my DL from the boards and bf. My form doesn't seem to be a problem.

Like I said, this is just my opinion and what do I know anyway.

I'm still not convinced.

 

[kronk]

Well just for the record, tricep kickbacks are NOT a mass building exercises in females or males. They are simply not a compound movement like lets say "skull crushers, close grip bench, etc). They are more of an isolation movement and are great for bringing out muscle definition, striations, etc. Bottom line is that you are not going to gain a lot of mass on your tris by doing them.

That does not mean however, that you should NOT do them. I do not think that is what was being said here. Some of you got hung up on the semantics of the situation. Kickbacks are great, I usually will end my tri days with cable kickbacks, real slow etc, to fill my tris with blood. But they are certainly not a mass building exercises.

As for the squats, deads and all of that for females, that is a totally different point. Some females do very well with heavy squats and deads, and many others do not. I have witnessed several females that have stopped doing squats as it indeed "widened" their hips and or glutes to beyond what they wanted. Thats not to say that power-lifters and hardcore female athletes don't do them, cause they do, and they love them. I think the point here is that the average female client may not want to be a person like that if that makes sense.

I think there is way to much taken personal on this thread and everyone should just chill. I love training women and I do everyday, I also train my wife lil k, (or she trains me, LOL) and she max squats 250lbs at 120 4'11, however she has stopped squatting as well (for back reasons as well as physical appearance), she now concentrates on leg presses, quad curls, ham curls, frogs (cheese toasters) etc. She will do light weight front squats though, as she cant break the habit.

Bottom line is that everyones body and goals are different. Every trainer and every person on this board is going to tell you a different story, and give you different advice. Best advice is do what works for you, lil k and I do and we are happy as hell.

 

[bignate73]

maybe we should discern between dbell kickbacks and other forms (cable) since a cable kickback...is a horizontal tricep pressdown and the stress is fairly uniform throughout, whereas a dbell kickback is completely different.

as for the comment about a resistance exercise bringing out definition/striations.....isnt that spot reduction or muscle shaping? those are 2 very common myths.

 

[kronk]

maybe we should discern between dbell kickbacks and other forms (cable) since a cable kickback...is a horizontal tricep pressdown and the stress is fairly uniform throughout, whereas a dbell kickback is completely different.

Just to clarify, I do cable kickbacks just like you would do a dumbbell kickback. I take all attachments off of the cable machine and grasp my hand around the little ball stopper, put the cable at a length for my size, bend over and do them just as I would with a dumbbell. I do kickbacks, but on the cables as I like the resistance a lot better.

I believe you were referring to cable press-downs and/or reverse cable press-downs. A cable kickback is done completely differently, its unusual but really works wonders for my shoes..

 

[bignate73]

kronk, what direction is the resistance (cable line) coming from in relation to your upper arm?

 

[JoNeS]

Kick backs are money. I swear buy them and almost always do them or a variation of them (just holding the ball on the cable crossover). I get a great burn when doing kickbacks and I feel that it isolates the triceps more than a pressdown, because it can be easy to use forearms during a press down. Kick backs are all triceps and I love them.

 

[JOKER47]

I know. I tell them "Shit, what the hell have I been doing for all these years then?!?" LOL I mean, people think they will lift some weights and accidentially stumble onto the Mr.O stage...

C-ditty

I hear ya.

I wonder where this "Incredible Hulk" gene is that everyone seems t have that causes them to get so big so quick. When they find it, I sure hope they tell me how to utilize it.


Joker

 

[Nonerz]

Some of you got hung up on the semantics of the situation.

I think there is way to much taken personal on this thread and everyone should just chill.

Sorry if I came across abrasive as that was certainly not my intent...I just didn't like what I was hearing because I hired a trainer who failed to show me the basic building blocks of lifting (DL, squats, bench, etc.). I don't think he knew any better but the people who frequent this board, frankly, should know better! That was my point.

I'm sure kickbacks are great for those who want a "pump" -- are they definitely a waste?...depends on your goals. Maybe the question wasn't as crystal clear as it could have been. Personally, I don't do them anymore because I'm not interested in getting a burn or pump at the end of my workout. My goals aren't in line with that. Perhaps some one could benefit from it, after all there are those who swear that the Smith machine is THE only way to do squats. That's great for them.

All in all, your goals determine your training. Now let's kiss and make up!