Why I don't believe in God. Those who believe, please help me understand...

[musclebrains]

If ya'll want an interesting take on the Christian god, read "God's Gym" by Stephen Moore. He is a biblical scholar -- a major one -- and this text looks at the divine body (of Yaweh, Jesus, etc.) and compares it to the bodybuilder's quest for male perfection. No pain, no gain. No torture on the cross, no resurrection in a perfect body.

Moore demonstrates how torture, the will to power and male narcissism are central to Christianity.

 

[OMEGA]

why I believe in GOD

I woke up one morning quite normally did not party the night before or anything......

I was sitting at the coffee table, and drinking.
I picked up a photo album and proceeded to look through the pictures of my family.

I then proceeded to weap....i started feeling very emotional and feeling of guilt and the impression of selfishness proceeded to invade the deepist recesses of my mind.....I began to weap more......

and then I realized that I was unhappy, and the root of my unhappiness was in my selfishness....then I glanced back at the photos in the album and i realized a paradox.....

I was most happy when I was with people I loved.....and I asked my self why was i happy with these people....and the answer is cuase I made them happy , by doing things for them, and caring for them, and they inturn did the same for me....

..so I realized the more each of us gave the more their was for everyone to recieve....and I cried because as I became older I began to take more than I gave, I was decieved by myself, and I feel by todays society, that taking is the root to happiness, wether through consumer products of by using people.........and the more I took the less happy I was...till i reached the point I am discussing with you...

I was spiritually and morally banrupt, I hand been duped in to a viciuos game that not omly harmed my self, and my family, but also the family of humanity as a whole....

at that moment I then felt an undeniable presence over my head and body, I began uncontrollable crying, and felt over come with a with feelings of grief, misspent youth, love, fear...everything.....

and this presence wich I thought was only a fleeting feeling of magnified emotion, went into the recesses of my mind and told me to start giving, instead of taking....

I then said..."but if I do no one will care".....and the presence answered "it does not matter, the point is that you gave, and if you give someone out there will be better cause of it."

I tried several times to push this force a way whatever it was..but it stayed and persisted, I felt love, I felt pain, grief, and joy all in one.

and this experirnce ehatever it was( I say GOD) help me realize that giving is the true answer to happiness not taking...... this presence also told me that we are not perfect and that the road that I now chose would be difficult, and that I may never see the fruits of the seeds I sow,and may indeed never directly benifit from my action, and the truth is it does not matter,and its not the point of giving.........

the idea me benifitting from positive actions would just be another form of taking...the point is to give truly with your heart for the sake of giving, for givings sake. Because there is a little bit of creation or GOD in all of us or whatever you want to call it ..I can say for certain that GOD Exists

and that we all need each other

 

[dude]

Why would you thank God for the talents he's given you? Did you learn anything spontaneously? Did you wake up one morning, and realize you could play the guitar?

Did you pray, and then suddenly meet your fitness goals the next half hour?

No. What you know, and what you do, you have chosen for yourself.

I totally respect your belief in God, please don't get me wrong.

But when someone earns something for themselves, and thank God for what they earned... makes me wonder if the guy who beats his kid thanks God that he not only gave him the ability to beat his kid, but to not get caught in doing so, and not serving jail time.

You can't earn talent. It is God given. Two people can work equally as much at practicing football, yet one will make it to the NFL and the other will not no matter how hard he tries. I give myself the credit of working hard to maximize my talent but I did not create my own talent.

 

[dude]

God may or may not "exist" ("existence" is not a term to be taken lightly, but that's a whole other argument. For the sake of this one, I won't pursue the issue any further), but even if he does exist, why would you believe in him with unquestioning faith? Think really hard about this question and give me a well articulated answer. Why give God your loyalty? Because he can send you to heaven or hell? Because of his awesome power? Because he is supposedly ultimately responsible for your creation? Who says you have to be loyal to your creator, no matter what? If you worship God, that's fine. Just admit that it's as arbitrary a decision as any.

I am sorry that I did not distinguish this before. I do question the existence of God and whether or not I am worshipping the one and only true God. How do I really know that I am right? I want to be able to just accept Him but like I said before, I think it is only human nature to question His existence. I do a lot of reading from the creationist point of view and the evolutionist point of view so I feel that I have equal exposure to both sides of the coin. It is an arbitrary decision because there really is no positve 100% proof that God does exist so I choose it on my own.

 

[dude]

I think this is a better answer

I did not write this but I feel it is a better answer to the question that I may have not answered too well.


Since "all have sinned and come short of the glory of God" (Romans 3:23), there is no one who has the right to freedom from God's wrath on the basis of his own innocence.

As far as babies are concerned, and others who may be incompetent mentally to distinguish right and wrong, it is clear from both Scripture and universal experience that they are sinners by nature and thus will inevitably become sinners by choice as soon as they are able to do so.

The world is now under God's Curse (Genesis 3:17) because of man's rebellion against God's Word.

This "bondage of corruption," with the "whole world groaning and travailing together in pain" (Romans 8:21, 22), is universal, affecting all men and women and children everywhere. God did not create the world this way, and one day will set all things right again. In that day, "God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain" (Revelation 21:4).



Learn about how much Jesus Christ suffered

The Lord Jesus Christ, who was the only truly "innocent" and "righteous" man in all history, nevertheless has suffered more than anyone else who ever lived.

And this He did for us! "Christ died for our sins" (I Corinthians 15:3). He suffered and died, in order that ultimately He might deliver the world from the Curse, and that, even now, He can deliver from sin and its bondage anyone who will receive Him in faith as personal Lord and Savior. This great deliverance from the penalty of inherent sin, as well as of overt sins, very possibly also assures the salvation of those who have died before reaching an age of conscious choice of wrong over right.

With our full faith in God's goodness and in Christ's redemption, we can recognize that our present sufferings can be turned to His glory and our good.

The sufferings of unsaved men are often used by the Holy Spirit to cause them to realize their needs of salvation and to turn to Christ in repentance and faith. The sufferings of Christians should always be the means of developing a stronger dependence on God and a more Christ-like character, if they are properly "exercised thereby" (Hebrews 12:11).

Thus, God is loving and merciful even when, "for the present," He allows trials and sufferings to come in our lives.

"For we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are called according to His purpose" (Romans 8:28).

 

[Island Son]

"The rash assertion that 'God made man in His own image' is ticking like a time bomb at the foundation of many faiths," [Arthur C Clarke] writes in 1965, "and as the hierarchy of the universe is disclosed to us, we may have to recognize this chilling truth: if there are any gods whose chief concern is man, they cannot be very important gods."

Prayer is like rubbing a scratch n win lottery ticket with a quarter instead of a penny; doesn't do any harm, and if it makes you feel better, go right ahead. I'm not fully towards thinking like that, but that's the way I'm growing.

 

[uNOwho]

Here's my opinion's and I hope you all follow this:

God is not a living person, there is no proof of life. The meer thought of Him is enough for some people to go on day to day. God is more of a Faith Icon than anything. I have 12 years of Catholic education underneath me, I do not question for one minute that God exists. I do not believe that He is or was an actual human. I do believe that He had a Son named Jesus who was His Divine Interperator for those who had no Faith.

In order for you to understand the "concept" of God, you must first ask yourself how open you are to believing in what is not there. Are you the type of person who needs actualy physical proof or are you the type of person that can believe someone based solely upon their word. If you cannot believe in someone's word, then how can you say that you have any faith in that person's ability? Faith is a topic that has been argued, debated, written about, and studied for thousand's of years. All the answer's are the same. If you want to believe you have to open your heart to the idea of God. You, BigBrotherVal, made reference to the movie "End of Days." Well if you also note that in the end of the movie, his agnostic views had to change in order for him to rid the devil. He had to open his heart to the thought that God wasn't there in physical form, He was there in ANY form. God is not just a person, I believe that God can take any form or shape that He deems appropriate. He can take the shape of a flower on a sunny day as you walk down the park holding your kids' hands, and your kids look at the flower and say "Daddy! Look at that pretty flower!" That is God reaching out to you and saying, "Look I am all around you. You need to open your eyes and heart and take Me in for what I am, I am Faith."

When people say that God is Love, it's because they feel His presnce in their heart and they know that God won't just magically appear, He's not the Lucky Charm's guy. He will make His presence known when YOU are ready to open your heart.

It takes a strong person to have faith in something that isn't there. It takes a certain amount of something to believe. It isn't for everyone, and I'm in no way saying this in a negative connotation. But, if you question the very existence of God, in thought alone, then how do you expect Him to show himself? Do you want a bolt of lightening to strike down your door? Do you want the dead to live or the blind to see? Those are stories that have been exaggerated, in my opinon, to get the major thoughts across. It takes the strong to believe and the weak to cast stones.

I'm not intending any of this to be a flame to you and I apologize if you take it that way. But I firmly believe that God allows us to see the beauty in all things great and small and realize that He is the one who put them there.

I understand your point about the abuse that goes on in this world, ask yourself this. If all things were perfect, what would life be worth living for? Hollywood is so overraught with drugs, sex, scandals, and lie's it's sickening. They have more money than I can fathom, yet they are so unhappy. Why? They lost the focus for their lives. Money can't buy everything. Those who abuse this life do so because they are waiting for God to come down and say to them "Hey you can't do that! That's not what I intended for human's." I understand where you are coming from when you say "How can a Father let this happen." He allows it to happen because it is a lesson that one must learn and take from life on how NOT to live your life. Those who abuse and vandalize are those who have no faith in anything. They feel that they are owed something because they chose early on to live their life without faith and without meaning.

I challenge you to open your heart and mind and find the beauty in the world and not the hatred that you seem to only see. Let yourself forget all the agony in this life and try to find the simplicity that is God's Grace.

I hope this made sense, I've been reading this from the start and decided to enter my $.02

~p~

 

[SSAlexSS]

Children.

We are all God's "children".

Isn't that what we're told? That he is our "eternal Father"? Our "Father who art in Heaven"?

Am I wrong?

So let me ask you this...

Why is it that if something wonderful in life happens, it's God's will, yet... if something terrible happens, then God works in mysterious ways? (watch End of Days... they make a good point on this)

He's covered no matter what happens.

Why is it that some prayers are "answered"... while others go unnoticed?

Why is it that if my daughter pulls through and lives after being born at 1 lb. 4 oz, it's because God intended her to live.... but if there's a two year old girl who gets raped and then beaten to death... then it's not God's doing... but it's a consequence of "free agency", or what not... that we all make decisions?

Why is there a child at this very moment, locked in a closet with no food, no water, no clothes... wondering when the next time the door will open for his next beating?

But that's okay... because "God has a plan for all of us." right?

Why do people pray? Does something come of it?

No.

And if some prayers are answered, why not all of them? How can our "Father" be selective on who he answers, and who he does not?

A 3 year old girl was kidnapped about 10 miles from where I live... she was murdered, and dumped on the side of a road. I can guaran-fucking-tee that her mama was praying on a daily basis.. they are a mormon family... and yet... did that little girl come home safely?

No.

Was she scared? Hurt? Killed?

Yes.

Yet... my daughter pulls through... and it was "God's will."

Huh?

Did I miss something here?

They say God loves us more than we will ever comprehend... that this life is like the blink of an eye to him...

So when we suffer... he suffers.

So what the fuck was the point of putting us here?

I can tell you one thing... I love my children more than anything I have ever known... so does that mean I have to let them be stabbed to death, or starve, or freeze to death to prove I love them? To show them they're on their own... and if someone kills them, well... don't worry about it because that person will pay in the end?

Children are suffering. God's children are suffering. And his back is turned.

Is that a "father"?

Do you think I'd EVER let my kids be hurt, knowing I could stop it, but letting it happen anyway, because that's a consequence of life? Or that was my PLAN for them?

Sorry... but if that's God's plan for ANYONE... then I look forward to meeting him in the Parking Lot after I punch out on the clock of life.

A real "father"... a loving "father", would NEVER do that to their children.

Back in the day he'd command people to do things, he'd part the sea, he gave his son who walked on water to die for us...

He just can't seem to do that anymore... maybe it's because we could catch him on video, and actually PROVE he exists.. rather than rely on "faith" and reading the great fiction novel known as the "Bible".

Those who believe, please give me some sort of insight here.... and I wasn't trying to piss anyone off.

Maybe GOD doesnt interfere with peoples lives so you cant say "he did that".

Plus, all bad deeds are KARMA.... Those people who suffered probably did something bad, either in this life or the next... That was their lesson, that they have learned.

 

[Taps]

I have no real opinion on God. I will read the book HS suggested, as it sounds quite interesting.

Another book to consider reading is "Memnoch the Devil" by Ann Rice. It's fiction, but gives a very interesting perspective on God and His motivations. I'm too tired to write a summary here, but I will tomorrow if anyone wants me to.

Val, you also may want to look into alternative religions for your answers. Budhism (which I follow, or try to anyway), Hinduism, etc. Most eastern religions provide a far more realistic approach to God than so-called Catholic dogma.

 

[uNOwho]

I have no real opinion on God.

Then how can you follow it up and say that Eastern Religions give a more realistic view of God? I'm curious no flame, just looking for reasoning is all


Val, you also may want to look into alternative religions for your answers. Budhism (which I follow, or try to anyway), Hinduism, etc. Most eastern religions provide a far more realistic approach to God than so-called Catholic dogma.

There is nothing in the world that states that one religion is better than another. One may have more simple methods of devising Faith, that does not make it better than the next. In all religion's the main underlying theme is to accept all those who are different as one. I for one don't feel that one religion is better than another. I personally like to adapt the thoughts of one religion and meld them into my own Faith. I'm Catholic as are most Italians in the world, "Our" Faith may not be of the Earthy variety, however, I feel that it is right for me. I do not agree with all teachings, yet I will always be Catholic.

No flames here at all.

~p~