what's up with the ANTI clomid attitude

[blut wump]

what's wrong with nolvadex? is this blurred vision temporary?

The blurred vision should be temporary. Tracers are also possible. If you get visual sides with clomid, you're advised to discontinue and find another option. Some guys have persevered at high doses and still have effects months later.

Even at 50mg ED it's still possible to be affected if you're particularly sensitive although very few will be at that dose. As with any drug, there's always a slew of side-effects to watch out for and if you're prone then try something else. Raloxifene and Toremifene are the new kids on the block for SERMs. I keep meaning to do some research on them. I can't recall which but one of them is reputed to be about as effective as clomid for stimulating LH and FSH release.

I gleamed from several extracts that Macro posted that Nolva is still considered effective for priming the system prior to running clomid. The reservations with running Nolva during or after a cycle containing progestins have limited it's use for me these days, though. Nolva has been associated with libido loss, too, which is another reason not to rely on it for PCT. On a test-only cycle, I'll use it during the week before running clomid at 50mg ED for 2-4 weeks, depending on the cycle and how I'm feeling.

 

[Triple J]

doesn't the resvertarol in the dermacrine products also acts a SERM? so locking onto the estrogen receptor does not always have to be a bad thing ...

 

[JeremyD]

Clomid is a horrible drug. Sure, it helps me recover but the sides are not worth it. The vision and emotional sides are enough to keep me away from it.

 

[solidspine]

2 things,

people are trying to sell there own products and secondly,

People that do not use gear and have never used Clomid, are criticizing it,


Oh and I hate Clomid, but use it anyway, because it works



Blurred vision, never happed here, and I have been taking nolvedex, for 10 years including this week.

 

[JeremyD]

Nelson, what do you advocate for PCT these days? I'm curious.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Nelson, what do you advocate for PCT these days? I'm curious.

First off, no one should listen to solidspine. He's a fool and a liar and doesn't know what he's talking about. He's a 5'4" 57 year old guy who takes 2 grams of gear a week trying to compensate for his small size and small intellect. (Maybe a small dick too. Who knows?) He does nothing but upset threads by bashing. Ignore him if you're smart.

Okay, PCT.

PCT is more a matter of procedure than a set drug protocol.

Nolva is good for gyno but only if you're predesposed to it. 99% of gyno can be prevented by avoiding certain gear and taking the right dosages. Nolva also can have a "rebound" effect. You're doing great and then a month later you're like WTF?!??! It kills libido in many cases, lowers IGF-1. It sucks. It will reduce bloat somewhat but that isn't necessarily a good thing. I hate it.

I do like HCG to get things up and moving but that's about all it does. Using a-dex along with HCG is imperative. The boost in LH will raise estro. By using a-dex, you accomplish two things -- protection against gyno and re-establishing your HPTA.

Proviron is great because it lowers SHBG, thus prventing the estro from forming. A very overlooked technique. But proviron must eventually be stopped. If ever there was a legitimate "bridge" drug, it's Proviron.

Of course, I think certian supps will help things along.

MyogenX can help increase natural LH.

POST CYCLE will help detox liver, prevent ED and give extra estro ellimination.

Dermacrine may lower e as may CytogenX. I have no personal experience with them but feedback looks good.

UNLEASHED lowers SHBG (like Proviron) which increases free test and prevents estro from forming. VERY valuable PC.

If clomid works, use it. But don;t use it for too long. And as I've said a thousand times (and had so many people bite my head off for it) you do not need more than 50 mgs a day. And even if you do, adding some supps can't hurt.

 

[njmuscleguy]

I've used Clomid many times before, in various PCT scenarios.... not only was it not effective for me, I hated the side effects (mood swings, floaters, severe abdominal cramps). Nolvadex didn't help much either, and it killed my libido.

I've also tried various OTC products proported to help recover... tribulus, maca, catuaba... I've tried "Post-Cycle" and "Unleashed" from Protein Factory... none of them were remarkable, IMO, for recovery.

So this is why I don't like clomid, and I don't have much faith in many supplements.

 

[blut wump]

From what I can gather, Solidspine, in common with many pros, is very fortunate in that he seems almost immune to sides from gear. He seems to have either very low aromatase activity or a very low density of oestrogen receptors or both or more. He's definitely out there on the end of the curve.

Solid is very much worth listening to even if only to remind oneself of the variation and variety of responses across aas users. He seems to write from personal experience and that's always valuable.

 

[Nelson Montana]

From what I can gather, Solidspine, in common with many pros, is very fortunate in that he seems almost immune to sides from gear. He seems to have either very low aromatase activity or a very low density of oestrogen receptors or both or more. He's definitely out there on the end of the curve.

Solid is very much worth listening to even if only to remind oneself of the variation and variety of responses across aas users. He seems to write from personal experience and that's always valuable.

Yeah, so did Juice Authority. Remember him?

njmuscleguy. Did you use anything else along with POST CYCLE and UNLEASHED? Because if you recovered (albeit slowly) and didn't get gyno, I'd say they did their job, but of course, so much of this is contingent on how hard of a cycle you did. I'm curious.

 

[Ross]

Cabergoline should be included in ALL PCT REGIMENS!

Prolactin is usually the cause of so many issues that are often mistaken for estrogen or cortisol.

ELIMINATE PROLACTIN!

Great sex too...

Aside from saying that Proviron is the "only legit bridge drug", nelson was pretty much accurate in his assessment of PCT ancillaries. Proviron should be used in every bridge, but in conjunction with either low dose Dianabol or Primobolan. Proviron ALONE, will produce no distinct anabolic effect.