Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below ChinkNasty
New member
keep postin man, we be lurkin
Creation of an Explosive Mofo - My Training Journal :)
- Thread starter coolcolj
- Start date
coolcolj
New member
Pretty much a continuous block of deep sleep, still feel tired though.
Upper body/back is beat from my part time job this morning.
weighed 95.2 kg 209.44lbs straight out of bed in underwear
Finally crack 210lbs!
what I ate yesterday - feel like I should pig out tonight, energy getting low
1) small apple + protein drink
2) white peach + protein drink
3) small apple + protein drink
4) 4 yeast free rye toast + margarine, 4 hard boiled eggs, small amount of broccoli/cauliflower/bean combo
5) steak + lots of corn/pea combo
Upper body/back is beat from my part time job this morning.
weighed 95.2 kg 209.44lbs straight out of bed in underwear
Finally crack 210lbs!
what I ate yesterday - feel like I should pig out tonight, energy getting low
1) small apple + protein drink
2) white peach + protein drink
3) small apple + protein drink
4) 4 yeast free rye toast + margarine, 4 hard boiled eggs, small amount of broccoli/cauliflower/bean combo
5) steak + lots of corn/pea combo
coolcolj
New member
I put my measurements into this calculator and it spat out my bodyweight pretty close!
http://www.weightrainer.net/bodypred.html
BF% is currently at 17% according to this http://home.fuse.net/clymer/bmi/
So I guess I'm pretty much at my "genetic" drug free musclemass limit
I have fairly small wrists, 6.75 inches, and they are smaller when I'm leaner. I think down as low as 6.25
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~17% bodyfat is: 209.9 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~15% bodyfat is: 203.3 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~12% bodyfat is: 193.8 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~10% bodyfat is: 187.9 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~8% bodyfat is: 182.3 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~6% bodyfat is: 176.9 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular measurements (@ ~8%-10% bodyfat) are:
Chest: 45.3 in Biceps: 16 in
Forearms: 12.7 in Neck: 15.5 in
Thighs: 24.2 in Calves: 16.3 in
My measurements can definitely get to those spat out by it too, they're all above em now, but I'm fat. Except maybe my legs which
will probbaly be above 25 inches, 28.5 now. And room for way more growth me thinks. We'll see
http://www.weightrainer.net/bodypred.html
BF% is currently at 17% according to this http://home.fuse.net/clymer/bmi/
So I guess I'm pretty much at my "genetic" drug free musclemass limit
I have fairly small wrists, 6.75 inches, and they are smaller when I'm leaner. I think down as low as 6.25
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~17% bodyfat is: 209.9 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~15% bodyfat is: 203.3 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~12% bodyfat is: 193.8 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~10% bodyfat is: 187.9 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~8% bodyfat is: 182.3 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular bodyweight at ~6% bodyfat is: 176.9 lbs
Your estimated maximum muscular measurements (@ ~8%-10% bodyfat) are:
Chest: 45.3 in Biceps: 16 in
Forearms: 12.7 in Neck: 15.5 in
Thighs: 24.2 in Calves: 16.3 in
My measurements can definitely get to those spat out by it too, they're all above em now, but I'm fat. Except maybe my legs which
will probbaly be above 25 inches, 28.5 now. And room for way more growth me thinks. We'll see
coolcolj
New member
some good stuff here - I like his idea of putting an E,M or H to denote effort next to each set, me being the detailed freak might just start doing that 
And what he said , where I underlined is so true for me too!!!!!!!!
http://explosivelyfit.blogspot.com/2005/12/periodization-training-question.html
copy and paste, but it reads better in the above link
---
Periodization training question
Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 7:55 AM
Subject: periodization ques.
Original question
Hi Danny,
I subscribe to your newsletters and they are a great source of information. I'm an ectomorph and very lean (hardgainer) and wanted to know your opinion on linear vs. non-linear (daily undulating) periodization. I've heard about it through Cosgrove's website. Right now I'm using a linear model keeping reps in the 6-10 rep range. I change the rep range every two weeks starting with 8-10, then 6-8, 5-8, 3-6. So, it's an 8 week mesocycle and I take one week to unload where I'm keeping reps in the 10-15 range. Can this lead to overtraining since I'm using linear progression and only taking one week to unload the body?
Also, Cosgrove is in favor of total body workouts because the body recovers as a unit. He suggests using only multi-joint movements which would mean eliminating any direct arm work or isolation exercises. He doesn't support split training. Given my body type, would this be a more sound approach?
Thanks for your help,
My answer
Good morning,
Thank you for the nice words I hope you are still able to say that with the next training news the first of January 2006. I am changing webhosts and am a bit unsure-well to tell the truth of the matter a LOT unsure of how the new program will work out. I am not a real talented computer person.
But onto your question: I think the term and the usage of 'hardgainer' is way overblown and in many cases misunderstood in its entirety. Stuart McRobert certainly made his mark with the Brawn book he wrote many years ago but I think he really did set back the strength training aspect for many enthusiasts with his term hardgainer. You didn't mention how many sets you do, the exercises you've selected, or your goal so I just have to guess that I am close to the mark with my response.
In all of my experience I have not had one person who was overtraining either in my gym or walking into the gym from off the street. Overtraining is problematic for the elite athlete pushing massive volumes and at high intensities otherwise, again in my opinion, its an excuse not to work out hard. I have trained world champions and high level athletes and not one has run into this problem. Admittedly I have not had the Olympic level competitor under my care as most are at the US Olympic training center.
I use undulating periodization with every one of my trainees regardless of age, skill level or strength training experience. The body reacts and adapts quicker to the repetitions than to the exercises so the reps are changed about every other day or at the most after three to four workouts. Then the exercises are changed around. The goal is to avoid accommodation. Once that happens then your body settles into the routine much like I suspect yours has with the two month schedule you describe. The unloading week is a week of no progress, unless you are really really pounding your body with extreme volumes and loads this is a week that you will never get back, like time, once it's gone it is nonrecoverable. A built in unload day does not mean a day off, it simple means you are giving your body a chance to recuperate from the typical work load it's been under for the preceding time span. Rest days on the other hand are just that-a rest day with no physical activity; just rest.
In many cases the problems I see with new trainees is they are over analyzing the situation, as Girogio from Forza Strength says 'just lift the weight'. The old timers didn't worry about overtraining even though they spent hard hours at their 'day job' before exercising. I realize that 'Listen to your body' is a overused term but is very applicable to a trainees situation, if they are astute enough to recognize the clues and heed them that is.
Alwyn and I share similar training theories and practices, however if you are training for a particular event i.e. a powerlifting competition then those lifts have to take priority over every other lift-period.
Generally the newbie's in my gym do overall body workouts rarely exceeding fifty to sixty minutes total including the warm up and cool down. These are more efficient and provide a quality result.
As they progress with their general physical fitness they are moved to a four day program and in some cases a five day set up. The days are divided into upper, lower day off upper, lower day off or upper, lower, upper, lower, upper and the next week it's lower, upper, lower, upper, lower.
I have had several athletes on a ten session plan for up to two months depending on the response, however these are exceptional young men and the second sessions are in some cases twenty to thirty minutes in duration. In and out. Others are able to lift up to four times a day at the high levels but this is a full time effort on their part as they prepare for contests.
Multi joint exercises demand more muscle recruitment and therefore produce better results for an individual. I do not recommend nor encourage many curls in my programs. You will get enough bicep work and receive better benefits with barbell rows, pull ups, chin ups, rope pulls, pull downs and the like. In short there are not very many isolated moves in any of my programs unless the person is recovering from an injury.
Here is a bit of information on overtraining and the signs of such. It was originally published in an earlier edition of the Explosivelyfit Training News.
Shameless plug coming up
The Explosivelyfit Training News is available if you sign up at www.Explosivelyfit.com
'Supercompensation' is the thin window of opportunity between overreaching and overtraining. It is the ideal goal in any well-designed exercise program, especially if you are contemplating a contest in the near future. But, how is it reached without overtraining and getting hurt?
The body’s adaptive mechanisms are wonderful and can do marvelous things to keep you healthy. However, you must pay attention to what it is saying about the evolution-taking place concerning your training loads, duration and intensity and the effects on you.
Background information
In 1954, Hans Selye came up with a description that described how an organism adapted to sources of stress in their environment. He called the model the “General Adaptation Syndrome” aka GAS. He further described two such stressors, one good and one bad. They are respectively,
Eustress or that which produces growth, performance enhancements and repair
Distress, which can cause decay, damage, death or disease in the living organism.
The General Adaptation Syndrome theory states there are three phases to an exposure to stress. Phase number one is the initial alarm, phase two is the resistance to the stress and the final phase is the adaptation to the stress (which Selye called exhaustion).
Breaking the three phases down into manageable bits of information one will find the first stage is the body’s initial response to the stress, i.e. flight, fright or freeze. (“Shock or alarm”, as it is described in the Essentials of Strength Training and Conditioning book by Baechle and Earle) The body at this point has a temporary inability to cope with the situation; however, it quickly calls on energy reserves and begins to function in a more appropriate manner.
This is the beginning of the resistance phase in which the body adapts to the stimulus and returns to a more normal state. The body is preparing itself for a continuation of similar stresses by growing stronger in response.
The final stage is exhaustion. If the organism does not have a pause in the constant stress, it begins to break down. Thus, overtraining has reared its ugly head and progress begins to “grind to a halt”. Minor injuries appear, desire diminishes, and working out is no longer enjoyable. The workout program has failed!
From this modest start, strength and conditioning specialists have come up with all sorts of training plans. A well-designed program will be characterized by a continuation of the Eustress processes. On the other hand, stagnation, soreness, minor injuries, and a lack of desire to exercise provide an early indication of distress that eventually leads to “Overtraining”. Leading into the overtraining is a condition called overreaching.
Overreaching is a desired effect that results from setting and achieving goals. It is the push to a higher plateau of ability. But if you remain in this zone too long, you soon reach the overtrained condition. Recovery from over reaching is easily accomplished with a few days active rest, a lighter than normal load, intensity and frequency of effort.
How do you know if you are entering the overtrained realm? Listen to your body. As an example, one of my personal “sure fire ways” of knowing I am entering this phase is illustrated in the following scenario.
In my training diary, I keep track of every set, every rep and every weight lifted in every session. I note how each set felt with an alpha character beside the log entry for that set. It is either an “E” for easy, an “M” for moderate or an “H” for hard.
If my training is going really well and I find myself writing down how much weight I will be lifting a month from now on the present program…I know it is time to change or one of two things will happen:
1. I will get hurt (more than likely I will be getting hurt)
2. I will not finish the program
Invariably, this is a major clue to me to change the intensity, load, duration, sets reps, or frequency of exercise. If I do not heed the obvious warning signs of my projected gains, I lose in the end.
This little secret has saved me many a time over the past ten to twelve years of developing an injury. Every now and then, I forget and keep pushing ahead anyway.
The last time I ignored it I ended up with a shoulder surgery. I was laid up unable to use it for over six weeks. Yeah I know what you are thinking; he could have done squats with a safety squat bar. I did and the pads on the par extensions hit RIGHT ON THE STITCHES. I kept up squatting. I was complaining (whining) to my doctor about the pads hurting the shoulder he had stitched up so recently. He looked directly at me and said very calmly “Don’t rip out my stitches”. I stopped doing them and went instead to the leg press machines in my gym.
Other clues to overtraining are more subtle. They include the following anaerobic indicators:
Stages of Overtraining
No effect on performance
Altered neural functions
Probably an effect on performance
Altered motor unit recruitment
Altered sympathetic activity and hypothalamic control
Probably decreased performance
Decreased motor coordination
Altered excitation contraction coupling
Decreased muscle glycogen
Increased resting heart rate and blood pressure
Altered immune function
Altered hormonal concentrations
Decreased performance
Decreased force production
Decreased glycolytic capacity
Sickness and infection
Emotional and sleep disturbances
From Essentials of Strength Training and Conditioning by Baechle and Earle
Other clues can be seen from reading the following chart reproduced from:
Avoid overtraining like the Plague.
Overreaching, however leads into the “Supercompensation” training effect. This is a good result from the effect of exercise. Supercompensation means the body has successfully weathered the stress of the previous program. It now prepares itself for the next time this stressful situation happens by getting stronger.
If I can be of any further help let me know.
Stay strong and committed to the path your heart has chosen for you.
Danny M. O’Dell, MA. CSCS*D
Answer continued after a new question was posed
Hi again,
I don't think you are working any of it too much and may not see the gains you are seeking because of the lack of intensity or volume. I would have you increase to four to six sets of eight to twelve with a work to rest ratio of 1:2-1:3 on a four to five day schedule. Unless you are really hitting the multijoint exercises with heavy weight I think you're probably eliminating the excess protein each time you go to the bathroom. If you think Berardi has high protein guidelines look at Bill Starr's... I have not looked at the book you mentioned. You are right about the muscle imbalances, each side of the joint needs to be stressed with appropriate weights to keep the integrity up to par and ward off injury.
But having said that:
In looking over your schedule it seems to me that you may be not allowing much rest for the shoulders, biceps, triceps, and upper back. You are hitting these areas on both days.
If you want to stay on this type of a schedule then consider this make up:
Legs, lower back, center, rest, chest, upper back, shoulders, center, rest, legs, calves, shoulders, chest, back, center and rest.
Have you considered these as options to your training schedule:
Warm up, dynamic lower body stretches, lower body, center, cool down and static stretches
Rest day-cardio
Warm up, upper body dynamic stretches, upper body, center, cool down and static stretches
Rest day-cardio
Warm up, full body dynamic stretches, lower body, center, upper body, cool down and static stretches.
Or lower, upper, day off, lower, upper, day off lower, upper, two days off and repeat
Or lower, upper, lower, upper, lower two days off then upper, lower, upper, lower, upper and two days off
Talk to you later
Answer continued
Hi Danny,
Your arrangements are better, it eliminates any crossover from one day to the next. How would a Cosgrove type arrangement using undulating periodization work? For example:
Workout A - Squat, T-pushup, Step-up, Row, Romanian Deadlift, Swiss ball crunch
Workout B- Deadlift, DB Shoulder Press, Lunge, Chin-up, Incline bench, center
Mon (A) 4-6 reps; Wed (B) 10-15 reps; Fri (A) 8-10 reps then the following week BAB.
Danny
Whoops, I forgot to tell you that Yes an overall body program will be of benefit to you depending once again on your goal. You will have to determine the best work to rest ratio, the intensity range, the exercises, an so on to set up your program.
See you later
Danny
Hi again, Are you eating enough to fuel your body with the workouts you are doing?
Talk to you later
Hi Danny, thanks so much for the great info. You're right, I forgot to mention the number of sets. I'm currently working three days a week. Legs, shoulders, biceps on Monday; Chest, back, triceps on Wednesday; and full body on Friday. Total number of sets per workout is about 10-15. I also include some rotator cuff work at the end as well as abs and lower back.
I'm trying to eat about every 3 to 3.5 hours and I've read Susan Kleiners book which recommends 1.6 grams of protein per kilogram of bodyweight. I've also skimmed over Scrawny to Brawny which is a book written for ectos. It pretty much emphasizes full body workouts, compound movements- although the protein recommendations by John Berardi are too high.
The programs are periodized but using linear progression. The book recommends training movements and not muscles. I would think that over the long run this could invite muscle imbalances and injury. For example squats (quad dominant) are included but there isn't any direct hamstring work; abs are only hit once a week; lower back work isn't even mentioned. It's only in the beginning of the book (corrective phase) where imbalances are mentioned and 2 to 3 week in that cycle wouldn't be enough time to correct an imbalance. What do you think about the book?
Answer continued
Alwyns rep scheme would work out just fine. Undulating is another name for avoiding accommodation and it is best accomplished by setting up your workouts on a the macro, meso and micro cycles. You can lift pretty hard and still put in your rest days by using dumbbells once or twice a month in place of the barbell workouts. It's a good change of pace but the intensity and the heavy loads aren't up to snuff as far as I am concerned for the heavy lifter.
I rarely utilize the stability ball for my competitive lifters so the ball crunches aren't in many of my programs unless I am specifically targeting balance issues or with one coming off a joint injury and needing proprioceptive readaptation reeducation.
Talk to you later, remember don't over analyze it, just lift and enjoy the ride. See what happens on the way, you will be surprised. Some of my very best work outs have been just doing it.
Danny
And what he said , where I underlined is so true for me too!!!!!!!!
http://explosivelyfit.blogspot.com/2005/12/periodization-training-question.html
copy and paste, but it reads better in the above link
---
Periodization training question
Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 7:55 AM
Subject: periodization ques.
Original question
Hi Danny,
I subscribe to your newsletters and they are a great source of information. I'm an ectomorph and very lean (hardgainer) and wanted to know your opinion on linear vs. non-linear (daily undulating) periodization. I've heard about it through Cosgrove's website. Right now I'm using a linear model keeping reps in the 6-10 rep range. I change the rep range every two weeks starting with 8-10, then 6-8, 5-8, 3-6. So, it's an 8 week mesocycle and I take one week to unload where I'm keeping reps in the 10-15 range. Can this lead to overtraining since I'm using linear progression and only taking one week to unload the body?
Also, Cosgrove is in favor of total body workouts because the body recovers as a unit. He suggests using only multi-joint movements which would mean eliminating any direct arm work or isolation exercises. He doesn't support split training. Given my body type, would this be a more sound approach?
Thanks for your help,
My answer
Good morning,
Thank you for the nice words I hope you are still able to say that with the next training news the first of January 2006. I am changing webhosts and am a bit unsure-well to tell the truth of the matter a LOT unsure of how the new program will work out. I am not a real talented computer person.
But onto your question: I think the term and the usage of 'hardgainer' is way overblown and in many cases misunderstood in its entirety. Stuart McRobert certainly made his mark with the Brawn book he wrote many years ago but I think he really did set back the strength training aspect for many enthusiasts with his term hardgainer. You didn't mention how many sets you do, the exercises you've selected, or your goal so I just have to guess that I am close to the mark with my response.
In all of my experience I have not had one person who was overtraining either in my gym or walking into the gym from off the street. Overtraining is problematic for the elite athlete pushing massive volumes and at high intensities otherwise, again in my opinion, its an excuse not to work out hard. I have trained world champions and high level athletes and not one has run into this problem. Admittedly I have not had the Olympic level competitor under my care as most are at the US Olympic training center.
I use undulating periodization with every one of my trainees regardless of age, skill level or strength training experience. The body reacts and adapts quicker to the repetitions than to the exercises so the reps are changed about every other day or at the most after three to four workouts. Then the exercises are changed around. The goal is to avoid accommodation. Once that happens then your body settles into the routine much like I suspect yours has with the two month schedule you describe. The unloading week is a week of no progress, unless you are really really pounding your body with extreme volumes and loads this is a week that you will never get back, like time, once it's gone it is nonrecoverable. A built in unload day does not mean a day off, it simple means you are giving your body a chance to recuperate from the typical work load it's been under for the preceding time span. Rest days on the other hand are just that-a rest day with no physical activity; just rest.
In many cases the problems I see with new trainees is they are over analyzing the situation, as Girogio from Forza Strength says 'just lift the weight'. The old timers didn't worry about overtraining even though they spent hard hours at their 'day job' before exercising. I realize that 'Listen to your body' is a overused term but is very applicable to a trainees situation, if they are astute enough to recognize the clues and heed them that is.
Alwyn and I share similar training theories and practices, however if you are training for a particular event i.e. a powerlifting competition then those lifts have to take priority over every other lift-period.
Generally the newbie's in my gym do overall body workouts rarely exceeding fifty to sixty minutes total including the warm up and cool down. These are more efficient and provide a quality result.
As they progress with their general physical fitness they are moved to a four day program and in some cases a five day set up. The days are divided into upper, lower day off upper, lower day off or upper, lower, upper, lower, upper and the next week it's lower, upper, lower, upper, lower.
I have had several athletes on a ten session plan for up to two months depending on the response, however these are exceptional young men and the second sessions are in some cases twenty to thirty minutes in duration. In and out. Others are able to lift up to four times a day at the high levels but this is a full time effort on their part as they prepare for contests.
Multi joint exercises demand more muscle recruitment and therefore produce better results for an individual. I do not recommend nor encourage many curls in my programs. You will get enough bicep work and receive better benefits with barbell rows, pull ups, chin ups, rope pulls, pull downs and the like. In short there are not very many isolated moves in any of my programs unless the person is recovering from an injury.
Here is a bit of information on overtraining and the signs of such. It was originally published in an earlier edition of the Explosivelyfit Training News.
Shameless plug coming up
The Explosivelyfit Training News is available if you sign up at www.Explosivelyfit.com
'Supercompensation' is the thin window of opportunity between overreaching and overtraining. It is the ideal goal in any well-designed exercise program, especially if you are contemplating a contest in the near future. But, how is it reached without overtraining and getting hurt?
The body’s adaptive mechanisms are wonderful and can do marvelous things to keep you healthy. However, you must pay attention to what it is saying about the evolution-taking place concerning your training loads, duration and intensity and the effects on you.
Background information
In 1954, Hans Selye came up with a description that described how an organism adapted to sources of stress in their environment. He called the model the “General Adaptation Syndrome” aka GAS. He further described two such stressors, one good and one bad. They are respectively,
Eustress or that which produces growth, performance enhancements and repair
Distress, which can cause decay, damage, death or disease in the living organism.
The General Adaptation Syndrome theory states there are three phases to an exposure to stress. Phase number one is the initial alarm, phase two is the resistance to the stress and the final phase is the adaptation to the stress (which Selye called exhaustion).
Breaking the three phases down into manageable bits of information one will find the first stage is the body’s initial response to the stress, i.e. flight, fright or freeze. (“Shock or alarm”, as it is described in the Essentials of Strength Training and Conditioning book by Baechle and Earle) The body at this point has a temporary inability to cope with the situation; however, it quickly calls on energy reserves and begins to function in a more appropriate manner.
This is the beginning of the resistance phase in which the body adapts to the stimulus and returns to a more normal state. The body is preparing itself for a continuation of similar stresses by growing stronger in response.
The final stage is exhaustion. If the organism does not have a pause in the constant stress, it begins to break down. Thus, overtraining has reared its ugly head and progress begins to “grind to a halt”. Minor injuries appear, desire diminishes, and working out is no longer enjoyable. The workout program has failed!
From this modest start, strength and conditioning specialists have come up with all sorts of training plans. A well-designed program will be characterized by a continuation of the Eustress processes. On the other hand, stagnation, soreness, minor injuries, and a lack of desire to exercise provide an early indication of distress that eventually leads to “Overtraining”. Leading into the overtraining is a condition called overreaching.
Overreaching is a desired effect that results from setting and achieving goals. It is the push to a higher plateau of ability. But if you remain in this zone too long, you soon reach the overtrained condition. Recovery from over reaching is easily accomplished with a few days active rest, a lighter than normal load, intensity and frequency of effort.
How do you know if you are entering the overtrained realm? Listen to your body. As an example, one of my personal “sure fire ways” of knowing I am entering this phase is illustrated in the following scenario.
In my training diary, I keep track of every set, every rep and every weight lifted in every session. I note how each set felt with an alpha character beside the log entry for that set. It is either an “E” for easy, an “M” for moderate or an “H” for hard.
If my training is going really well and I find myself writing down how much weight I will be lifting a month from now on the present program…I know it is time to change or one of two things will happen:
1. I will get hurt (more than likely I will be getting hurt)
2. I will not finish the program
Invariably, this is a major clue to me to change the intensity, load, duration, sets reps, or frequency of exercise. If I do not heed the obvious warning signs of my projected gains, I lose in the end.
This little secret has saved me many a time over the past ten to twelve years of developing an injury. Every now and then, I forget and keep pushing ahead anyway.
The last time I ignored it I ended up with a shoulder surgery. I was laid up unable to use it for over six weeks. Yeah I know what you are thinking; he could have done squats with a safety squat bar. I did and the pads on the par extensions hit RIGHT ON THE STITCHES. I kept up squatting. I was complaining (whining) to my doctor about the pads hurting the shoulder he had stitched up so recently. He looked directly at me and said very calmly “Don’t rip out my stitches”. I stopped doing them and went instead to the leg press machines in my gym.
Other clues to overtraining are more subtle. They include the following anaerobic indicators:
Stages of Overtraining
No effect on performance
Altered neural functions
Probably an effect on performance
Altered motor unit recruitment
Altered sympathetic activity and hypothalamic control
Probably decreased performance
Decreased motor coordination
Altered excitation contraction coupling
Decreased muscle glycogen
Increased resting heart rate and blood pressure
Altered immune function
Altered hormonal concentrations
Decreased performance
Decreased force production
Decreased glycolytic capacity
Sickness and infection
Emotional and sleep disturbances
From Essentials of Strength Training and Conditioning by Baechle and Earle
Other clues can be seen from reading the following chart reproduced from:
Avoid overtraining like the Plague.
Overreaching, however leads into the “Supercompensation” training effect. This is a good result from the effect of exercise. Supercompensation means the body has successfully weathered the stress of the previous program. It now prepares itself for the next time this stressful situation happens by getting stronger.
If I can be of any further help let me know.
Stay strong and committed to the path your heart has chosen for you.
Danny M. O’Dell, MA. CSCS*D
Answer continued after a new question was posed
Hi again,
I don't think you are working any of it too much and may not see the gains you are seeking because of the lack of intensity or volume. I would have you increase to four to six sets of eight to twelve with a work to rest ratio of 1:2-1:3 on a four to five day schedule. Unless you are really hitting the multijoint exercises with heavy weight I think you're probably eliminating the excess protein each time you go to the bathroom. If you think Berardi has high protein guidelines look at Bill Starr's... I have not looked at the book you mentioned. You are right about the muscle imbalances, each side of the joint needs to be stressed with appropriate weights to keep the integrity up to par and ward off injury.
But having said that:
In looking over your schedule it seems to me that you may be not allowing much rest for the shoulders, biceps, triceps, and upper back. You are hitting these areas on both days.
If you want to stay on this type of a schedule then consider this make up:
Legs, lower back, center, rest, chest, upper back, shoulders, center, rest, legs, calves, shoulders, chest, back, center and rest.
Have you considered these as options to your training schedule:
Warm up, dynamic lower body stretches, lower body, center, cool down and static stretches
Rest day-cardio
Warm up, upper body dynamic stretches, upper body, center, cool down and static stretches
Rest day-cardio
Warm up, full body dynamic stretches, lower body, center, upper body, cool down and static stretches.
Or lower, upper, day off, lower, upper, day off lower, upper, two days off and repeat
Or lower, upper, lower, upper, lower two days off then upper, lower, upper, lower, upper and two days off
Talk to you later
Answer continued
Hi Danny,
Your arrangements are better, it eliminates any crossover from one day to the next. How would a Cosgrove type arrangement using undulating periodization work? For example:
Workout A - Squat, T-pushup, Step-up, Row, Romanian Deadlift, Swiss ball crunch
Workout B- Deadlift, DB Shoulder Press, Lunge, Chin-up, Incline bench, center
Mon (A) 4-6 reps; Wed (B) 10-15 reps; Fri (A) 8-10 reps then the following week BAB.
Danny
Whoops, I forgot to tell you that Yes an overall body program will be of benefit to you depending once again on your goal. You will have to determine the best work to rest ratio, the intensity range, the exercises, an so on to set up your program.
See you later
Danny
Hi again, Are you eating enough to fuel your body with the workouts you are doing?
Talk to you later
Hi Danny, thanks so much for the great info. You're right, I forgot to mention the number of sets. I'm currently working three days a week. Legs, shoulders, biceps on Monday; Chest, back, triceps on Wednesday; and full body on Friday. Total number of sets per workout is about 10-15. I also include some rotator cuff work at the end as well as abs and lower back.
I'm trying to eat about every 3 to 3.5 hours and I've read Susan Kleiners book which recommends 1.6 grams of protein per kilogram of bodyweight. I've also skimmed over Scrawny to Brawny which is a book written for ectos. It pretty much emphasizes full body workouts, compound movements- although the protein recommendations by John Berardi are too high.
The programs are periodized but using linear progression. The book recommends training movements and not muscles. I would think that over the long run this could invite muscle imbalances and injury. For example squats (quad dominant) are included but there isn't any direct hamstring work; abs are only hit once a week; lower back work isn't even mentioned. It's only in the beginning of the book (corrective phase) where imbalances are mentioned and 2 to 3 week in that cycle wouldn't be enough time to correct an imbalance. What do you think about the book?
Answer continued
Alwyns rep scheme would work out just fine. Undulating is another name for avoiding accommodation and it is best accomplished by setting up your workouts on a the macro, meso and micro cycles. You can lift pretty hard and still put in your rest days by using dumbbells once or twice a month in place of the barbell workouts. It's a good change of pace but the intensity and the heavy loads aren't up to snuff as far as I am concerned for the heavy lifter.
I rarely utilize the stability ball for my competitive lifters so the ball crunches aren't in many of my programs unless I am specifically targeting balance issues or with one coming off a joint injury and needing proprioceptive readaptation reeducation.
Talk to you later, remember don't over analyze it, just lift and enjoy the ride. See what happens on the way, you will be surprised. Some of my very best work outs have been just doing it.
Danny
coolcolj
New member
good force absorbtion as befits a highjumper - I don't think I could rebound off those high boxes! Something to work on in the future once my strength levels are optimal...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcZ4GCEeHeg&NR
single leg jump tests - very cool measuring with that ball on rope, with head touch, adjustable I assume. Best accurate tool yet!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1L_NaJcis0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcZ4GCEeHeg&NR
single leg jump tests - very cool measuring with that ball on rope, with head touch, adjustable I assume. Best accurate tool yet!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1L_NaJcis0
coolcolj
New member
Good 9 hours total sleep, but I still look tired and feel groogy/sleepy....
Body feels ok overall. Starting new training cycle today. Itching to squat!
Will be changing things around a bit
weighed 95.6 kg 210.3lbs straight out of bed in underwear
what I ate yesterday - pigged out, and finally got rid of my spare change and shrapnel
1) small apple + protein drink
2) white peach + protein drink
3) small apple + protein drink
4) 3 x large fried fish + tartare sauce, 4 potatoe scallops, lots of chips + tomato sauce
still have lot of chips left...
Body feels ok overall. Starting new training cycle today. Itching to squat!
Will be changing things around a bit
weighed 95.6 kg 210.3lbs straight out of bed in underwear
what I ate yesterday - pigged out, and finally got rid of my spare change and shrapnel
1) small apple + protein drink
2) white peach + protein drink
3) small apple + protein drink
4) 3 x large fried fish + tartare sauce, 4 potatoe scallops, lots of chips + tomato sauce
still have lot of chips left...
coolcolj
New member
Sunday 18th February - Cycle 4 Get Lower Body Strong + Lean up - Week 1 - Day 1 - Lower Strength - Micro cycle 2
Starting a new training cycle today. Hmmm not really feeling that good either.... Strength seems to be still there despite the diet, but I want to keep getting stronger as I lean down.
Will be doing a lot more variation on this day than in the last training cycle and start putting more emphasis on pushing the bar as hard and fast as possible on the 2nd of the 2-3 variations.
Man this workout yoked me right out. Upper hammies are inflamed and achey as hell right now a couple of hours later!
Body weight at gym - 212lbs
Workout time - 1.25 hours
Workout rating - 7/10
General warm up -
15sec ISO holds - quarter squat, on toes, on heels (toes pulled up), hip back wide stance squat at parallel, on side of feet (for ankles), narrow full squat at bottom on toes
1) dynamic stretches and swings
2) back extension x 4 + 6 twisting to each side
3) sit up complex on swiss ball
4) standing side leg raise x 8
5) Prone Scorpion - x12 each leg alternating
6) Braced Scorpion under - x10 each leg alternating
7) hurdle over and unders x 5 each direction and type
8) various hops
9) 40lb bar complex - slow cleanpull, press, GM onto toes, partial snatch grip press, hang powerclean, power jerk - 5 reps each, 3 on the jerks
Rotating Sets between each exercise
Resting 2-3mins
Power Cleans
did these in between the warm up sets on squats from 95lbs to 285lbs
Powerclean + 2 x High Hang Powerclean - 89lbs, 119lbs,
Powerclean with a reset - 155lbs x 2, 175x 2, 195x2
did all of these in sneakers. Felt pretty hard in terms of the weight, power is there though, just not using it properly....
Just getting a feel for em, won't be doing these here next time, will move em to my other day when I do my jumping. Reserve this day for straining
Full Oly Squats - Sneakers - no Belt
warm ups - controlled down, semi-explosive up in sneakers - Bar x 8, 95x5, 135x5, 185x5, 225x4, 255x3, 285x2, 315x1, 345x1
2 sec pause at bottom
1) 365 x 1 ---> PR by default
rest 3 mins
with 5.5 to 6 mins rest
2) 315 x 3
3) 315 x 3
4) 315 x 2 --> failed on 3rd rep at sticking point 6 inches off the bottom
Pretty pleased with that paused 365 single, I didn't think I'd get it with sneakers on. Some room there, maybe I can get 375lbs paused.
The sets with 315lbs were damn hard though, every rep felt like a gut busting 1 rep max!! Lots of straining here, granted I'm not much of a grinder, so all ther reps where still not that slow. I guess squatting in flatter soggy sneakers really does make it a bit harder. It does hit my muscles differently though. And I figure when I go back to rock solid oly shoes, I will be stronger for it
Widened stance out an 1 inch on each side vs the last training cycle, pushed my ass back a bit more as well, but still pretty upright. Felt lots of hammie action at the bottom, plus glutes as per usual. Really pleased with my core, back and hammie strength I gained from the paused Good Mornings - there was zero hint of leaning forward and shaking when I strained hard through the sticking points, I stayed rock solid. Form at sticking point felt exactly liked it did at bottom in the pause. I was waiting for me to GM a few reps to cheat it up when it got real hard, but without even trying my body didn't even show a hint of doing so. Good stuff, as they say when the going gets tough the body follows the path of least resistance, and show your weakness
--------------------
split leg Good Mornings - narrow split - high bar - sneakers - no belt
warmups - bar x 5 each side
controlled, 2 sec pause at bottom, left side first
95lbs x 6 each side x 2 sets
I'll keep bumping these up slowly each workout like I did with the regular version.
Damn these really hammer the hamstrings a lot more than the normal version!
My spinal erectors, abs and quads were pretty pumped as well from the greater stabilization required. Posterior chain was so hammered after these that bending over to get a drink from the bubbler made me shake
Starting a new training cycle today. Hmmm not really feeling that good either.... Strength seems to be still there despite the diet, but I want to keep getting stronger as I lean down.
Will be doing a lot more variation on this day than in the last training cycle and start putting more emphasis on pushing the bar as hard and fast as possible on the 2nd of the 2-3 variations.
Man this workout yoked me right out. Upper hammies are inflamed and achey as hell right now a couple of hours later!
Body weight at gym - 212lbs
Workout time - 1.25 hours
Workout rating - 7/10
General warm up -
15sec ISO holds - quarter squat, on toes, on heels (toes pulled up), hip back wide stance squat at parallel, on side of feet (for ankles), narrow full squat at bottom on toes
1) dynamic stretches and swings
2) back extension x 4 + 6 twisting to each side
3) sit up complex on swiss ball
4) standing side leg raise x 8
5) Prone Scorpion - x12 each leg alternating
6) Braced Scorpion under - x10 each leg alternating
7) hurdle over and unders x 5 each direction and type
8) various hops
9) 40lb bar complex - slow cleanpull, press, GM onto toes, partial snatch grip press, hang powerclean, power jerk - 5 reps each, 3 on the jerks
Rotating Sets between each exercise
Resting 2-3mins
Power Cleans
did these in between the warm up sets on squats from 95lbs to 285lbs
Powerclean + 2 x High Hang Powerclean - 89lbs, 119lbs,
Powerclean with a reset - 155lbs x 2, 175x 2, 195x2
did all of these in sneakers. Felt pretty hard in terms of the weight, power is there though, just not using it properly....
Just getting a feel for em, won't be doing these here next time, will move em to my other day when I do my jumping. Reserve this day for straining
Full Oly Squats - Sneakers - no Belt
warm ups - controlled down, semi-explosive up in sneakers - Bar x 8, 95x5, 135x5, 185x5, 225x4, 255x3, 285x2, 315x1, 345x1
2 sec pause at bottom
1) 365 x 1 ---> PR by default
rest 3 mins
with 5.5 to 6 mins rest
2) 315 x 3
3) 315 x 3
4) 315 x 2 --> failed on 3rd rep at sticking point 6 inches off the bottom
Pretty pleased with that paused 365 single, I didn't think I'd get it with sneakers on. Some room there, maybe I can get 375lbs paused.
The sets with 315lbs were damn hard though, every rep felt like a gut busting 1 rep max!! Lots of straining here, granted I'm not much of a grinder, so all ther reps where still not that slow. I guess squatting in flatter soggy sneakers really does make it a bit harder. It does hit my muscles differently though. And I figure when I go back to rock solid oly shoes, I will be stronger for it
Widened stance out an 1 inch on each side vs the last training cycle, pushed my ass back a bit more as well, but still pretty upright. Felt lots of hammie action at the bottom, plus glutes as per usual. Really pleased with my core, back and hammie strength I gained from the paused Good Mornings - there was zero hint of leaning forward and shaking when I strained hard through the sticking points, I stayed rock solid. Form at sticking point felt exactly liked it did at bottom in the pause. I was waiting for me to GM a few reps to cheat it up when it got real hard, but without even trying my body didn't even show a hint of doing so. Good stuff, as they say when the going gets tough the body follows the path of least resistance, and show your weakness
--------------------
split leg Good Mornings - narrow split - high bar - sneakers - no belt
warmups - bar x 5 each side
controlled, 2 sec pause at bottom, left side first
95lbs x 6 each side x 2 sets
I'll keep bumping these up slowly each workout like I did with the regular version.
Damn these really hammer the hamstrings a lot more than the normal version!
My spinal erectors, abs and quads were pretty pumped as well from the greater stabilization required. Posterior chain was so hammered after these that bending over to get a drink from the bubbler made me shake
ChinkNasty
New member
its funny how 315 feels heavy and 365 feels good...I'm the same way, I will usually warm-up to 365 by way of 135, 225, 275, 315, 340 then 365 but inevitably 315 feels heavy but 340 on doesn't...
ChinkNasty
New member
You must spread some Karma around before giving it to coolcolj again.
the stages of overrtraining is a good reminder
also, do you feel that upper body strenght and muscle density helps squatting at all?
the stages of overrtraining is a good reminder
also, do you feel that upper body strenght and muscle density helps squatting at all?
coolcolj
New member
ChinkNasty said:
supposedly the lats help, and yeah you do need a strong upper back to support the load. Especially on frontsquats. But GMs work that aspect anyway and just plain squatting over time.
--
Late night, sleep not the best, look real tired. Feel sapped, wth that warm/fuzzy feeling in my head/neck - used my CNS pretty hard yesterday
posterior chain, quads and upper back sore. Hamstrings feel shredded from top to bottom!!
weighed 95.9 kg 211lbs straight out of bed in underwear
what I ate yesterday -
1) small apple + protein drink
2) white peach + protein drink
3) pre exercise - small apple + 2 hard boiled eggs + handful of raw almonds
4) post exercise - natural muesli + whey + oat milk, 4 yeast free rye toast + margarine, left over chips -quite a bit of it
5) steak + small amount of broccoli/cauliflower/bean
Similar threads
