CNN has crossed the line into propaganda-machine

[HansNZ]

What is new zealand like enviromental-wise hanz?

Well New Zealand has a "clean, green" image. This is used to market ourselves as a tourist destination and to promote our agricultural products overseas. Sadly our clean green environment is more the result of having a country with a land area much bigger than Great Britain, but with less than 4 million people living in it. This is probably basically why it is so clean, rather than any outstanding effort on our part to make it so.

However, we are a world leader in protecting endangered species. This is largely because our country is so isolated, so contact with outside pests has been that much more damaging requiring a world leading effort to mitigate the problem. Most of our native birds, such as the kiwi, can't fly. With no predators they foraged for food on the ground. Humans came along with their exotic animals - rats, cats, etc., bringing about disasterous results.

My friend from California that I mentioned in my previous posts works for our conservation department. He moved here a year ago and so far he has been very impressed with what he sees. I do think we could do better though - but like everywhere, there aways has to be a compromise between preservation and economic activity.

 

[HansNZ]

It must suck to be a Turkish politician right now.
On the one hand , 90% of the population are opposed to the war and they want to join the EU with France, Germany, Austria and some other countries opposed to the war.
On the other hand, they are financially dependant on the US.
That´s a really tough decision.

Yes, I agree. It would be a terrorfying situation. They're damned if they do, damned if they don't.

If they do, they'll get US compensation, but they'll alienate public opinion. The government could potentially fall and they'll definitely strengthen the hand of religious parties. They will also be futher alienated from Germany and France who they need on their side if they want to join the EU.

If they don't support the US, the war will happen anyway. They'll be left with a massive refugee problem and billions of dollars of damage to their economy without US compensation. I'm glad I don't live in Turkey right now! In fact I am glad I don't live anywhere but right where I am at the moment. It is kind of comforting at times to have Antarctica as one of our closest neighbours, lol. Penguins don't pose as much of a threat

 

[minion]

The thing is that I meet plenty of Americans who know all this already. But sadly there seems to be a monolithic mass of Americans programmed with all these wierd attitudes.

I'll often be watching a US movie or TV programme with my friend from California. He regularly flinches with embarrassment when he hears Americans parrot the wierd ideas that I have mentioned.

What kind of wierd ideas?

 

[2Thick]

What kind of wierd ideas?

It was a polite way of describing ignorance...

You would know...you live in bliss.

 

[minion]

It was a polite way of describing ignorance...

You would know...you live in bliss.

Nice try Tooty, but there is no sense in me pointing out the obvious. You do an excellent job on your own.

 

[anythingbutsane]

I had routine surgery for a busted jaw in the USA performed by one of Texas's "best" plastic surgeons after I was involved in a bus accident there. To cut a long story short - it was a disaster. When I got back to my inferior country of New Zealand, our inferior doctors had to reoperate to fix the mess that your superior medical practitioners caused.

After stripping out all of your sarcasm, there is a huge logical "WTF?" left in the wake.

Your single experience aside, are you disagreeing that the American medical system is inundated with specialists and talented surgeons specifically because it is our system that allows them to reap huge rewards for their talents?

BTW... please do not assume I am in support of our current government simply because i used the term "our."

Also, It is likely that American sentiment towards pseudo-communist states is a direct result of government propaganda during the cold war era.... We were programmed to equate communism with the soviet union, and by extension, the soviet union with Satan himself. (Personally, i think the soviet government was even more atrocious than our own, btw).

I wonder though, how much of the rhetoric spewed by the US haters is a result of propaganda forming opinion which leads them to seek out sources with negative spin to justify their opinions?

HansNZ is OBVIOUSLY winning the arguments on this thread, but I believe that is more a result of his erudition than it is some kind of a universal superiority in what he is saying.

Now, on to a bit of a personal note, I wonder how some of these euro companies even survive. Those I have worked in have had a piss poor work ethic. They thought a 6 hour work day was good enough, and they took 6 weeks vacation per year. They were ALL in a union which prevented them from being terminated, and if they were, they received an entire year of severance pay. And, on top of that, they never got anything accomplished because they spent so much time delineating the task that they passed the deadline before even beginning.

 

[musclebrains]

HansNZ is OBVIOUSLY winning the arguments on this thread, but I believe that is more a result of his erudition than it is some kind of a universal superiority in what he is saying.

He's stating facts. Your only dispute was with his one anecdotal account. What's "superiority" got to do with it?

 

[HansNZ]

What kind of wierd ideas?

Read the thread.

 

[HansNZ]

After stripping out all of your sarcasm, there is a huge logical "WTF?" left in the wake.

Your single experience aside, are you disagreeing that the American medical system is inundated with specialists and talented surgeons specifically because it is our system that allows them to reap huge rewards for their talents?

Basically my point is this: You can get the same quality of healthcare for half the price if your healthcare system is structured right. In my opinion, the evidence overwhelmingly teaches us that this is best achieved in a state system where medicine is delivered as a social service rather than profit-making enterprise.

BTW... please do not assume I am in support of our current government simply because i used the term "our."

Also, It is likely that American sentiment towards pseudo-communist states is a direct result of government propaganda during the cold war era.... We were programmed to equate communism with the soviet union, and by extension, the soviet union with Satan himself. (Personally, i think the soviet government was even more atrocious than our own, btw).[/B]

Amen. I agree with you totally. What I am battling against is americans who parrot the attitudes and ideas they have been programmed with, believing these notions are accurate, without recognising that they are propaganda.

I wonder though, how much of the rhetoric spewed by the US haters is a result of propaganda forming opinion which leads them to seek out sources with negative spin to justify their opinions?

HansNZ is OBVIOUSLY winning the arguments on this thread, but I believe that is more a result of his erudition than it is some kind of a universal superiority in what he is saying.[/B]

Well I have been to countries with controlled media and some of their anti-americanism is the product of propaganda. I live in a country which is dominated by US media and has a tendency towards being pro-US. I don't take at face value what I see in any media and form my own opinions, which are frequently at odds with dominant attitudes.

Now, on to a bit of a personal note, I wonder how some of these euro companies even survive. Those I have worked in have had a piss poor work ethic. They thought a 6 hour work day was good enough, and they took 6 weeks vacation per year. They were ALL in a union which prevented them from being terminated, and if they were, they received an entire year of severance pay. And, on top of that, they never got anything accomplished because they spent so much time delineating the task that they passed the deadline before even beginning. [/B]

Well if we are talking about a European work-ethic then that is a different story. I too share your observation. But I don't believe that this was being debated. I suppose what the Euro experience does show is that you don't need to run your workplace like a sweatshop to remain productive.

 

[anythingbutsane]

Basically my point is this: You can get the same quality of healthcare for half the price if your healthcare system is structured right. In my opinion, the evidence overwhelmingly teaches us that this is best achieved in a state system where medicine is delivered as a social service rather than profit-making enterprise.

on the whole, i agree. I find it likely, however, that a system which financially rewards doctors as much as capitalism does would attract the most talented specialists. Thus, for high end procedures you would be better of there.