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Census data: Half of U.S. poor or low income

Barry is the food stamp president.

We better start sucking-up to job creators, but I suspect it's even too late for that.
 
mrplunkey said:
Barry is the food stamp president.

We better start sucking-up to job creators, but I suspect it's even too late for that.
Click to expand...

Entrepreneurs get jack from Barry, i really fuggin' hate that guy.
Romney had good points about Barry not letting the markets dictate things.
 
lartinos said:
Entrepreneurs get jack from Barry, i really fuggin' hate that guy.
Romney had good points about Barry not letting the markets dictate things.
Click to expand...

Barry has done for entrepreneurs what the Jonestown kool-aid did for kids' drinks.
 
mrplunkey said:
Barry has done for entrepreneurs what the Jonestown kool-aid did for kids' drinks.
Click to expand...

Barry has done for entrepreneurs what Cutter's has done for my 0-ring stability

Barry has done for entrepreneurs what the Edsel did for domestic automakers quality control image

Barry has done for entrepreneurs what David Duke has done for promoting equal rights
 
PICK3 said:
butt both are really nice guys :confused:
Click to expand...

I have no doubt.

Maybe Barry could rededicate his life to reading interesting anecdotes from a teleprompter to the millions of people whose jobs he has destroyed.

At least Jimmy builds a few houses every now and then.
 
The struggling Americans include Zenobia Bechtol, 18, in Austin, Texas, who earns minimum wage as a part-time pizza delivery driver. Bechtol and her 7-month-old baby were recently evicted from their bedbug-infested apartment after her boyfriend, an electrician, lost his job in the sluggish economy.

After an 18-month job search, Bechtol's boyfriend now works as a waiter and the family of three is temporarily living with her mother.

"We're paying my mom $200 a month for rent, and after diapers and formula and gas for work, we barely have enough money to spend," said Bechtol, a high school graduate who wants to go to college. "If it weren't for food stamps and other government money for families who need help, we wouldn't have been able to survive."

Pretty poor example to use for the "Struggling Americans" IMO. An 18 year old who *surprise* makes minimum wage delivering pizzas because she only has a high school education. What the hell do they expect? And why isn't she going to college? Well, she got pregnant about 16-17 months ago. Ever heard of birth control? At least she finished high school. Wonder how old the baby daddy is?
 
Stats can be changed reflect various things some of it is changed how and what collecting so better reflect realistically what income is. Its like unemployment rates are technically higher than listed. Obama was thinking bout changing it so be more accurate but rate would go up
 
lartinos said:
Entrepreneurs get jack from Barry, i really fuggin' hate that guy.
Romney had good points about Barry not letting the markets dictate things.
Click to expand...

and you voted for him bro!
got caught up in hope and change, i can't blame you though millions of others did too...and are now regretting their infatuation
 
duh rules...

1) you can't be poor and fat. real poor people can't afford enough calories to be fat.

2) if you find a skinny poor person in the u.s., they're on crack/meth/heroin.

3) you can't be poor and addicted to drugs. drugs are expensive.

4) you can't be poor and drink beer. beer is expensive.

5) you can't be poor and smoke cigarettes. cigarettes are expensive

6) you can't be poor and have a cell phone w/data plan, a flat screen tv, computers and internet access. people in bangladesh are poor...and they don't have any of that shit.

go ahead plunkster, add a few more...

7)
 
digimon7068 said:
duh rules...

1) you can't be poor and fat. real poor people can't afford enough calories to be fat.

2) if you find a skinny poor person in the u.s., they're on crack/meth/heroin.

3) you can't be poor and addicted to drugs. drugs are expensive.

4) you can't be poor and drink beer. beer is expensive.

5) you can't be poor and smoke cigarettes. cigarettes are expensive

6) you can't be poor and have a cell phone w/data plan, a flat screen tv, computers and internet access. people in bangladesh are poor...and they don't have any of that shit.

go ahead plunkster, add a few more...

7)
Click to expand...

7) you can't be poor and pay taxes
 
lartinos said:
Entrepreneurs get jack from Barry, i really fuggin' hate that guy.
Romney had good points about Barry not letting the markets dictate things.
Click to expand...

Payroll tax cut helps entrepreneurs. Republicans still fighting it.

Tax credits for employers hiring vets - Repubs shot it down.

Tax cuts for new hiring - repubs shot it down

Tax cuts for raising salarys - repubs shot it down

Now you have to be honest and admit, these are mostly Republican type ideas, and you have to be honest and admit, that republicans want the economy to fail. They would rather watch children cry and women shiver in the cold then actually do something that would help this country.
Wanna be pissed? There's plenty to be pissed about.
 
mrplunkey said:
Barry is the food stamp president.

We better start sucking-up to job creators, but I suspect it's even too late for that.
Click to expand...

The "job creators" don't exist. No one hires, in any economy, unless there is enough business coming in that the present work force can't handle it. It's a total lie that changes in business and corporate taxes or the regulatory environment will magically increase or decrease demand for employees.
 
Mr. dB said:
The "job creators" don't exist. No one hires, in any economy, unless there is enough business coming in that the present work force can't handle it. It's a total lie that changes in business and corporate taxes or the regulatory environment will magically increase or decrease demand for employees.
Click to expand...

I have a room filled with Negative Pressure Wound Therapy machines that have been commercially available for over six years (we essentially bought the company). They are awaiting FDA re-approval (long story) over a home usability study. Yes, we have to do a home usability study on a machine that has one (1) power cord and one (1) on/off switch. And these are units that have been in patients' homes since 2005.

I've got six open recs we haven't filled since the FDA delay hit back in October.

How's your theory on "a total lie" coming? I bet the six people we haven't hired due to silly FDA delays would differ with your assertion.
 
Mr. dB said:
The "job creators" don't exist. No one hires, in any economy, unless there is enough business coming in that the present work force can't handle it. It's a total lie that changes in business and corporate taxes or the regulatory environment will magically increase or decrease demand for employees.
Click to expand...

BINGO!!!

John Boner sounds like a complete drunken moron every time he uses that phrase.

Do billionaires not have enough money to create a job?
Do people hire when there's no demand?

Fuck trickle down lies.

I don't even know how to use this stupid Karma system, but dB you deserve some for that simple truth.

The job creators are the middle class. When they have money to buy shit, jobs are created.

Millionaires make money buy doing trades, buying and selling, and they pay 15% capital gains tax on their income.

The capital gains tax is another problem, but the idea that the 1% aren't creating jobs because they need a tax cut is like the most retarded propaganda out there right now. :laugh2:

Who believes it? Come on righties, fess up.
 
mrplunkey said:
I have a room filled with Negative Pressure Wound Therapy machines that have been commercially available for over six years (we essentially bought the company). They are awaiting FDA re-approval (long story) over a home usability study. Yes, we have to do a home usability study on a machine that has one (1) power cord and one (1) on/off switch. And these are units that have been in patients' homes since 2005.

I've got six open recs we haven't filled since the FDA delay hit back in October.

How's your theory on "a total lie" coming? I bet the six people we haven't hired due to silly FDA delays would differ with your assertion.
Click to expand...


Since there are guys as bright as you are out their trying to peddle medical devices, thank God for the FDA! :laugh2:

Now quit fuckin around on web forums and go do your home usability study.

I'm sure you agree with Herman Cain, right?

"If yo not rich, blame yo-sef" :p
 
Headholio said:
Payroll tax cut helps entrepreneurs. Republicans still fighting it.

Tax credits for employers hiring vets - Repubs shot it down.

Tax cuts for new hiring - repubs shot it down

Tax cuts for raising salarys - repubs shot it down

Now you have to be honest and admit, these are mostly Republican type ideas, and you have to be honest and admit, that republicans want the economy to fail. They would rather watch children cry and women shiver in the cold then actually do something that would help this country.
Wanna be pissed? There's plenty to be pissed about.
Click to expand...
reps have offered all those things and more but the senate shoots down their bills everytime and reid brags about being "DOA"
and loololll and wanting to keep wemmin cold and make children cry hahhahaha...just like they want dirty water and air!
 
binö said:
reps have offered all those things and more but the senate shoots down their bills everytime and reid brags about being "DOA"
and loololll and wanting to keep wemmin cold and make children cry hahhahaha...just like they want dirty water and air!
Click to expand...

LOL at hungry children all you want. Maybe you need a youtube video help understand the reality of it?

The point is that The jobs bill would have created jobs, helped businesses and middle class Americans, and Republicans shot it down to save millionaires from a very small and reasonable tax increase.

The choice is real. Save a few bucks for a guy who drinks a $100 bottle of wine with dinner every night, or do something that actually would help the kids who ARE hungry, and the women who ARE cold.
Republicans pick the guy with the good wine every time. (And by the way his wine habit wouldn't change after the tax hike).
 
Headholio said:
LOL at hungry children all you want. Maybe you need a youtube video help understand the reality of it?

The point is that The jobs bill would have created jobs, helped businesses and middle class Americans, and Republicans shot it down to save millionaires from a very small and reasonable tax increase.

The choice is real. Save a few bucks for a guy who drinks a $100 bottle of wine with dinner every night, or do something that actually would help the kids who ARE hungry, and the women who ARE cold.
Republicans pick the guy with the good wine every time. (And by the way his wine habit wouldn't change after the tax hike).
Click to expand...

1) I'm drinking Aneline Pinot Noir this evening. Online price: $8.19 (if you get the case discount).

2) We have turned job creators off in this country. And I honestly don't know how to get them back. They may be too far gone.

3) Do you for an instant think it's acceptable to confiscate 1/3 of what a person makes?
 
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Headholio said:
LOL at hungry children all you want. Maybe you need a youtube video help understand the reality of it?

The point is that The jobs bill would have created jobs, helped businesses and middle class Americans, and Republicans shot it down to save millionaires from a very small and reasonable tax increase.

The choice is real. Save a few bucks for a guy who drinks a $100 bottle of wine with dinner every night, or do something that actually would help the kids who ARE hungry, and the women who ARE cold.
Republicans pick the guy with the good wine every time. (And by the way his wine habit wouldn't change after the tax hike).
Click to expand...

believe me i don't need to see your youtube videos to buy what you are trying to sell...the jobs bill wasn't well recieved by democrats and the public at large, and people across the board question its vitality and ability to do much aside from saddle us with more debt...if you are not liking the republicans attitude then check your own party and it's arrogance (reps are enemies/DOA/back of the bus/etc) cause it is piss poor and not conducive to reaching across the asile.
now what would create jobs and provide us energy is the payroll tax bill passed in the house recently, including a provision for Obama to act on a decision about the Keystone pipeline...of course reid has threatened DOA and what message will that send to americans without work? I'm guessing not a good one, it's obvious Obama doesn't want to offend the hippies with flowers in their hair (his base).
Dems want everyone to drink good wine, and the small portion of high end earners to fit the bill
 
Headholio said:
BINGO!!!

John Boner sounds like a complete drunken moron every time he uses that phrase.

Do billionaires not have enough money to create a job?
Do people hire when there's no demand?

Fuck trickle down lies.

I don't even know how to use this stupid Karma system, but dB you deserve some for that simple truth.

The job creators are the middle class. When they have money to buy shit, jobs are created.

Millionaires make money buy doing trades, buying and selling, and they pay 15% capital gains tax on their income.

The capital gains tax is another problem, but the idea that the 1% aren't creating jobs because they need a tax cut is like the most retarded propaganda out there right now. :laugh2:

Who believes it? Come on righties, fess up.
Click to expand...

so only millionaires make enjoy a resonable capital gains tax?? not the middle class? what in your eyes is a fair capital gains tax percentage give us some numbers
 
mrplunkey said:
1) I'm drinking Aneline Pinot Noir this evening. Online price: $8.19 (if you get the case discount).

2) We have turned job creators off in this country. And I honestly don't know how to get them back. They may be too far gone.

3) Do you for an instant think it's acceptable to confiscate 1/3 of what a person makes?
Click to expand...

I'll check out that wine. I'm a cheap wine drinker too, but usually more of a cab guy. I never accused you of being a 1 percenter. Unfortunately though, too many righties have been brainwashed to believe that we need to help the super elite in order to help ourselves.

What job creators? Who are they and why are they turned off? I'm not buying it.
 
digimon7068 said:
duh rules...

1) you can't be poor and fat. real poor people can't afford enough calories to be fat.

2) if you find a skinny poor person in the u.s., they're on crack/meth/heroin.

3) you can't be poor and addicted to drugs. drugs are expensive.

4) you can't be poor and drink beer. beer is expensive.

5) you can't be poor and smoke cigarettes. cigarettes are expensive

6) you can't be poor and have a cell phone w/data plan, a flat screen tv, computers and internet access. people in bangladesh are poor...and they don't have any of that shit.

go ahead plunkster, add a few more...

7)
Click to expand...

Fuck you, I'm poor!
 
Headholio said:
I'll check out that wine. I'm a cheap wine drinker too, but usually more of a cab guy. I never accused you of being a 1 percenter. Unfortunately though, too many righties have been brainwashed to believe that we need to help the super elite in order to help ourselves.

What job creators? Who are they and why are they turned off? I'm not buying it.
Click to expand...

I won't deny being a 1%. Don't take my original response as being any sort of diversion. But I still like cheap wine. Want to know what's worse? I'll even blend my cheap red wine with cheap tawney ports so I don't need to drink as much of the $8 stuff to feel a little buzz (but I virtually never get drunk... that's another story).

Job creators don't like being vilified, threatened with higher taxes or hit with higher regulation. Picture this: You're confronted every day with where to make your next big bet (investment). Right now, the smart money just isn't betting on the US.
 
mrplunkey said:
1) I'm drinking Aneline Pinot Noir this evening. Online price: $8.19 (if you get the case discount).
Click to expand...

I wood recommend you switch to a Oregon Pinot Noir.

Pinot noir - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Willamette Valley of Oregon is at the same latitude as the Burgundy region of France, and has a similar climate in which the finicky Pinot noir grapes thrive.

The Wine List HEALTHY PINOT NOIR - November 1, 2003

Oregon Pinot Noir Wine: Top Rated Oregon Pinot Noir

Rainy places like the Finger Lakes region of upstate New York and Oregon’s Willamette Valley. (In fact, the highest resveratrol content found in a wine was in Vinifera’s Fleur de Pinot Noir, with four times as much as the nearest California pinot noir tested). Long sown in France’s cool Burgundy region, pinot noir is considered a finicky grape to grow, in part because it is susceptible to rot, which may be the reason it produces more resveratrol than other grapes–up to 40 times as much resveratrol as grapes such as merlot and cabernet sauvignon.


just thinkin' of your :heart:


no homo though!
 
mrplunkey said:
I won't deny being a 1%. Don't take my original response as being any sort of diversion. But I still like cheap wine. Want to know what's worse? I'll even blend my cheap red wine with cheap tawney ports so I don't need to drink as much of the $8 stuff to feel a little buzz (but I virtually never get drunk... that's another story).

Job creators don't like being vilified, threatened with higher taxes or hit with higher regulation. Picture this: You're confronted every day with where to make your next big bet (investment). Right now, the smart money just isn't betting on the US.
Click to expand...

You cut your wine like dealers cut cocaine lolol
 
superdave said:
You cut your wine like dealers cut cocaine lolol
Click to expand...

Probably true.

I'm cursed with very insensitive tastes. I can't tell the difference between a merlot and a cabernet.

It really comes in handy though, since the way I travel is excruciatingly brutal. I was way in the boonies about two weeks ago, and the manager was embarrassed that a "Chester Fried Chicken" was the only place we could eat between meetings. I was in heaven.
 
Mr. dB said:
Consumer spending is 70% of the total US economy.
Click to expand...

Don't fall into the consumer-driven recession trap.

If that were the case, starvation wouldn't be an issue because people could just eat their own body parts.

The truth (liberal or conservative) is that the only real advancement comes from gains in productivity. And that can be the result of new technology, less regulation, innovative trade relationships, etc. etc.). And in the absence of those real gains, progress is made through people working harder for less money -- which is very unfortunate.
 
mrplunkey said:
And that can be the result of new technology, less regulation, innovative trade relationships, etc. etc.). And in the absence of those real gains, progress is made through people working harder for less money -- which is very unfortunate.
Click to expand...

that's just crazy talk :rolleyes:
 
fuck em all. I will say I do like the idea of a part time legislature (like Texas has). I mean these stupid politicians can't get a damn thing done anyway, so why pay them for full time work? Make them part time, take away all benefits, retirement, healthcare, etc. and they can go out and get real jobs to take care of all that. Then we'd actually get people who really do care and want to make positive changes rather than greedy lifetime career politicians trying to line their own pockets and gain political and social power.

Term limits too. Time to make them pay like they've been making us pay for the last couple hundred years. Fuck I hate politicians.
 
ceo said:
fuck em all. I will say I do like the idea of a part time legislature (like Texas has). I mean these stupid politicians can't get a damn thing done anyway, so why pay them for full time work? Make them part time, take away all benefits, retirement, healthcare, etc. and they can go out and get real jobs to take care of all that. Then we'd actually get people who really do care and want to make positive changes rather than greedy lifetime career politicians trying to line their own pockets and gain political and social power.

Term limits too. Time to make them pay like they've been making us pay for the last couple hundred years. Fuck I hate politicians.
Click to expand...

I do too.

It must be the economy, but I've never asked for less from them and been hit up for more over the last 3-6 months.
 
mrplunkey said:
Don't fall into the consumer-driven recession trap.

If that were the case, starvation wouldn't be an issue because people could just eat their own body parts.

The truth (liberal or conservative) is that the only real advancement comes from gains in productivity. And that can be the result of new technology, less regulation, innovative trade relationships, etc. etc.). And in the absence of those real gains, progress is made through people working harder for less money -- which is very unfortunate.
Click to expand...
1960 -1980 Consumer spending % of GDP stayed at 61-64% , as the Boomers entered their 30's the Consumer spending surged to from 62-70% over the next decades.

Although wages had stayed stagnant (Alan Greenspan years) the Middle Class spending held that percentage of the GDP.
A recent report by the Financial Times states that the Consumer Spending percentage is at 58%.
It's lowest in 50+ years. And guess what? The economy has stayed stagnant.
All efforts by the current adminstration (Excluding the stimulus) to boost the economy has been blocked by the Gop with a historic number of Filibusters (most silent).
The current adminstration isn't trying to do anything not tried before (during the Depression) and has worked. The only thing it hasnt proposed is the WPA.
The WPA is what brought us the America we have today. Roads, rual electricity, dams, parks, fire stations, ect.

In any case. Consumer spending is at it's lowest and STILL is well over 50% of GDP.
It's not Progressive or Regressive talk. It's proven Economics.
GDP PPP map
gdp_nominal_per_capita_world_map_imf_2007.PNG

source: IMF Map from GDP per Capita Statistics | Economics Blog
 
mrplunkey said:
So if we gave the wall street types bigger salaries and bonuses, they'd commit less fraud and white collar crime?

Madoff wasn't a ponzi scheme -- he was just underpaid!
Click to expand...

Instead of fucking re-asking me what I answered, Read the Report from the WorldBank.
 
brownbrown said:
Instead of fucking re-asking me what I answered, Read the Report from the WorldBank.
Click to expand...

Crime rates and inequality are positively correlated within countries and, particularly, between countries, and this correlation reflects causation from inequality to crime rates, even after controlling for other crime determinants.
Click to expand...

1) Let's not argue causality here.

2) Let's not argue spurious correlations here.

3) Let's not even argue the underlying weakness of linear regression.

The argument still hinges on the idea that we should pay-off one group of people so they don't attack another group of people.

Isn't the flaw in that logic obvious to you?
 
mrplunkey said:
Don't fall into the consumer-driven recession trap.

If that were the case, starvation wouldn't be an issue because people could just eat their own body parts.

The truth (liberal or conservative) is that the only real advancement comes from gains in productivity. And that can be the result of new technology, less regulation, innovative trade relationships, etc. etc.). And in the absence of those real gains, progress is made through people working harder for less money -- which is very unfortunate.
Click to expand...
The Truth GDP mainly is Consumer driven. Where's your backing behind your "hypothesis"?
Less regulation and Shit trade relationships has made 10 of millions of Jobs........Overseas
Your spouting Rhetoric again.
 
brownbrown said:
The Truth GDP mainly is Consumer driven. Where's your backing behind your "hypothesis"?
Less regulation and Shit trade relationships has made 10 of millions of Jobs........Overseas
Your spouting Rhetoric again.
Click to expand...

Are you trying to argue that productivity gains aren't the basis of all real advancements in civilization?

According to your "consumer-driven" approach, we'd be done with this crisis if every american would just take out a new credit card and rack-up an additional $2,000 of debt.
 
mrplunkey said:
Are you trying to argue that productivity gains aren't the basis of all real advancements in civilization?

According to your "consumer-driven" approach, we'd be done with this crisis if every american would just take out a new credit card and rack-up an additional $2,000 of debt.
Click to expand...
Not argue. 58% (normally over 60%) of GDP is Consumer driven.
Productivity = People FUCKING WORKING IN THEIR COUNTRY.
people working = Consumer's making money = Consumers buying = GDP increasing = Economy increasing.

Anything else?
 
brownbrown said:
Not argue. 58% (normally over 60%) of GDP is Consumer driven.
Productivity = People FUCKING WORKING IN THEIR COUNTRY.
people working = Consumer's making money = Consumers buying = GDP increasing = Economy increasing.

Anything else?
Click to expand...

So if we could just get every unemployed American to work full time rolling grapes with their nose, our productivity would soar!

If you don't know what productivity is, why would you even engage in a productivity discussion?

That's very Redsam of you -- any by that I mean amusing.
 
mrplunkey said:
So if we could just get every unemployed American to work full time rolling grapes with their nose, our productivity would soar!

If you don't know what productivity is, why would you even engage in a productivity discussion?

That's very Redsam of you -- any by that I mean amusing.
Click to expand...
Holy shit you go into left field.
Manufacturing ya fucking douche.

We dont produce products anymore.
LOLOLOLOLOL, your dense as lead.
 
brownbrown said:
Holy shit you go into left field.
Manufacturing ya fucking douche.

We dont produce products anymore.
LOLOLOLOLOL, your dense as lead.
Click to expand...

Yeah! Manufacturing opportunities are great here.

Except for regulation, taxes, torts and a failed nationalized educational system.

Of course people aren't going to manufacture here. Our government has practically dared them to do otherwise.

Is any of this news to you?
 
mrplunkey said:
Yeah! Manufacturing opportunities are great here.

Except for regulation, taxes, torts and a failed nationalized educational system.

Of course people aren't going to manufacture here. Our government has practically dared them to do otherwise.

Is any of this news to you?
Click to expand...
WTF America do you live in?
If manufacturing was great here then unemployment wouldn't be at 8+%. All the Jobs went to China, India, Korea ect. And their education systems are worse than ours. So instead of changing the subject to shit you usually bitch about, how about staying on subject.
Most of the GDP is consumer driven. The Jobs are shipped Overseas.

Please prove where the Manufacturing jobs are. Because I can post economic links of where Our Companies are manufacturing their goods instead of here.
 
mrplunkey said:
Yeah! Manufacturing opportunities are great here.

Except for regulation, taxes, torts and a failed nationalized educational system.

Of course people aren't going to manufacture here. Our government has practically dared them to do otherwise.

Is any of this news to you?
Click to expand...
Contradict your self much?
Our government has passed legislation over the past 15+ years that make it easier to make $ by manufacturing overseas. And that was done by crooked politicians bought by lobbyist, Mostly GOP, but not all.
 
brownbrown said:
Contradict your self much?
Our government has passed legislation over the past 15+ years that make it easier to make $ by manufacturing overseas. And that was done by crooked politicians bought by lobbyist, Mostly GOP, but not all.
Click to expand...

Do you not understand the concept of sarcasm?

Hint: If someone makes a statement followed by an exclamation point, and then makes several comments 180 degrees from the original statement, they are being sarcastic.

I can't figure-out if you're just drunk or stupid.
 
brownbrown said:
WTF America do you live in?
If manufacturing was great here then unemployment wouldn't be at 8+%. All the Jobs went to China, India, Korea ect. And their education systems are worse than ours. So instead of changing the subject to shit you usually bitch about, how about staying on subject.
Most of the GDP is consumer driven. The Jobs are shipped Overseas.

Please prove where the Manufacturing jobs are. Because I can post economic links of where Our Companies are manufacturing their goods instead of here.
Click to expand...

O'Rlly?

219-o-rly.jpg


Most manufacturing jobs need a high school education. Do you really think our high school education is better than China, India, Korea, etc. etc.?
 
mrplunkey said:
I won't deny being a 1%. Don't take my original response as being any sort of diversion. But I still like cheap wine. Want to know what's worse? I'll even blend my cheap red wine with cheap tawney ports so I don't need to drink as much of the $8 stuff to feel a little buzz (but I virtually never get drunk... that's another story).

Job creators don't like being vilified, threatened with higher taxes or hit with higher regulation. Picture this: You're confronted every day with where to make your next big bet (investment). Right now, the smart money just isn't betting on the US.
Click to expand...

Now that I know your taste in wine, I think I will not take your recommendations. :)

Just to be clear, in 2009, the top 1% had an income around $345,000/yr. If you are truly are one of those, good for you.

For a person making $345,000, Obama's plan to increase taxes to where they were before GW dropped them, your income over 250k would be taxed at 39% instead of 35%. So in this example, 95k taxed at 4% higher would mean a tax increase of $3800.
 
brownbrown said:
WTF America do you live in?
If manufacturing was great here then unemployment wouldn't be at 8+%. All the Jobs went to China, India, Korea ect. And their education systems are worse than ours. So instead of changing the subject to shit you usually bitch about, how about staying on subject.
Most of the GDP is consumer driven. The Jobs are shipped Overseas.

Please prove where the Manufacturing jobs are. Because I can post economic links of where Our Companies are manufacturing their goods instead of here.
Click to expand...

you don't catch sarcasm too well do ya?
 
brownbrown said:
The Truth GDP mainly is Consumer driven. Where's your backing behind your "hypothesis"?
Less regulation and Shit trade relationships has made 10 of millions of Jobs........Overseas
Your spouting Rhetoric again.
Click to expand...

brownbrown said:
Contradict your self much?
Our government has passed legislation over the past 15+ years that make it easier to make $ by manufacturing overseas. And that was done by crooked politicians bought by lobbyist, Mostly GOP, but not all.
Click to expand...

First you blame jobs going overseas on less regulation, then you turn around and say they passed legislation (implying more regulation) and cite that as the cause of jobs going overseas.

Which is it? We've established that more jobs appear to be going overseas, you just seem confused as to why.
 
miplank said:
That's a lie!
Click to expand...

no it's not...i could show you tax returns with household incomes well above the poverty level where with the refundable credits (e.g., earned income credit, additional child tax credit, etc.), the people got back more than what was withheld from their wages...there's actually a LOT of people like that out there...and those are george bush's (the guy who only cared about the rich) tax laws...do a little research...you'll find out i'm right...this whole "republicans only care about the rich" bullshit???? it's commie propoganda, and anyone that believes it is just drinking the kool-aid...probably outta cups.
 
digimon7068 said:
no it's not...i could show you tax returns with household incomes well above the poverty level where with the refundable credits (e.g., earned income credit, additional child tax credit, etc.), the people got back more than what was withheld from their wages...there's actually a LOT of people like that out there...and those are george bush's (the guy who only cared about the rich) tax laws...do a little research...you'll find out i'm right...this whole "republicans only care about the rich" bullshit???? it's commie propoganda, and anyone that believes it is just drinking the kool-aid...probably outta cups.
Click to expand...

uhh...I have child, own home, where are my refunds? :mad:
 
miplank said:
uhh...I have child, own home, where are my refunds? :mad:
Click to expand...

clearly you need a better Accountant. You should have digi look over your shit.
 
mrplunkey said:
Yeah! Manufacturing opportunities are great here.

Except for regulation, taxes, torts and a failed nationalized educational system.

Of course people aren't going to manufacture here. Our government has practically dared them to do otherwise.

Is any of this news to you?
Click to expand...

Businesses are going to continue to export jobs because it's possible. Bad economy or good, they'll look for the least expensive way to do business, and as emerging and developing nations continue to emerge and develop, it becomes increasingly possible to export jobs there. The reason it wasn't done sooner
was because the 3rd world countries weren't ready.

There are two ways out of this cycle - wait for the standard of living in the developing nations to rise up to our own thereby removing the economic advantage to export jobs there, or reduce the US to the status of a 3rd world country. The latter seems to be the goal of the GOP.
 
miplank said:
uhh...I have child, own home, where are my refunds? :mad:
Click to expand...

you're a ballah...and you are a perfect example of one of those people that the liberal commies believe isn't paying his fair share...you should show these fucking nudniks how much tax you paid last year...and you should also remind them that you were the one that led the "save nev's kid" fund drive...and that you were also it's largest contributor...the commie bastards think that you don't pay enough tax and that you're selfish.
 
brownbrown said:
Not argue. 58% (normally over 60%) of GDP is Consumer driven.
Productivity = People FUCKING WORKING IN THEIR COUNTRY.
people working = Consumer's making money = Consumers buying = GDP increasing = Economy increasing.

Anything else?
Click to expand...

consumers having too much access to cheap credit = consumers paying too much for everything they buy = driving up prices = devaluing the american dollar = destabilizing the housing market and the financial sector = a couple of years of economic disaster, followed by probably a dozen years of lack-luster economic results...i could go on...but i digress.
 
Last edited:
ceo said:
clearly you need a better Accountant. You should have digi look over your shit.
Click to expand...

oh, i'll bet i could probably make some recommendations that might result in more money in his pocket at the end of the day (i use a global approach to help people try to maximize the use of their money...taxes only being one piece of the puzzle) but, generally speaking, for the plankster, the only way he's going to get a refund is if his business(es) make less money than they did the year before (which i'm sure he's not interested in) or he pays in too much estimated taxes (which i'm sure he's not interested in).
 
Mr. dB said:
Businesses are going to continue to export jobs because it's possible. Bad economy or good, they'll look for the least expensive way to do business, and as emerging and developing nations continue to emerge and develop, it becomes increasingly possible to export jobs there. The reason it wasn't done sooner
was because the 3rd world countries weren't ready.

There are two ways out of this cycle - wait for the standard of living in the developing nations to rise up to our own thereby removing the economic advantage to export jobs there, or reduce the US to the status of a 3rd world country. The latter seems to be the goal of the GOP.
Click to expand...

Or there is option 3: Slash regulation, reduce tax rates and get torts under control so at least some products can affordably made here.

But that would mean a handful of greedy capitalists would get rich, and we simply can't have that. The left's ideological war on the 1% must be pursued, even if it means burning the middle class down to the ground in the process.
 
Give me opinions, all you smarty-pants bros....:artist:

So, you all know I'm an artist not making a living with this vocation. I was just laid off from regular job, but, because my employer out-sourced these positions, I am now eligible for re-training under the Trade Act. I was thinking of three different avenues; 1) Machine tool technology (this may be best option as I was contacted for a production job with potential advancement), 2) Nursing (would be able to get position in a geographical area I'd love), 3) Commercial Pilot (seriously, as I am close to 4 centers with such programs and this would be the highest entry level wage). What say yous? :D
 
BlueBird said:
Give me opinions, all you smarty-pants bros....:artist:

So, you all know I'm an artist not making a living with this vocation. I was just laid off from regular job, but, because my employer out-sourced these positions, I am now eligible for re-training under the Trade Act. I was thinking of three different avenues; 1) Machine tool technology (this may be best option as I was contacted for a production job with potential advancement), 2) Nursing (would be able to get position in a geographical area I'd love), 3) Commercial Pilot (seriously, as I am close to 4 centers with such programs and this would be the highest entry level wage). What say yous? :D
Click to expand...

If you think nursing is a job opposed to a calling you probably should stay far away from it.
 
PICK3 said:
If you think nursing is a job opposed to a calling you probably should stay far away from it.
Click to expand...

I appreciate what you're saying. While my *calling* has always been as an artist, I did work for 3 years as a nursing assistant, enjoyed the work, and was always asked if I would consider continuing in the field....but I fully understand your post. Thanks Pick.

Have to say I'm leaning towards commercial pilot, but if I were to receive the production job offer, I would most definitely go for the tool program.
 
BlueBird said:
I appreciate what you're saying. While my *calling* has always been as an artist, I did work for 3 years as a nursing assistant, enjoyed the work, and was always asked if I would consider continuing in the field....but I fully understand your post. Thanks Pick.

Have to say I'm leaning towards commercial pilot, but if I were to receive the production job offer, I would most definitely go for the tool program.
Click to expand...

Learning to be a commercial pilot with the requisite flight hours including multi-engine is quite pricey. If someone else is picking up the tab it would be a chance of a lifetime.
 
PICK3 said:
If you think nursing is a job opposed to a calling you probably should stay far away from it.
Click to expand...

I agree about nursing. Either you feel it or you don't.

The machine tools job sounds great (to me, at least).

Let me bounce one other thing off you: There's a huge gap out there between people who have artistic skills, can get those designs into SolidWorks/Pro-E, can transfer those models into a computer-aided manufacturing (CAM) system and then actually generate the CNC code to make the part.

Right now, they are split into three groups: 1) Artists, 2) CAD engineers and 3) CAM/Machinists.

Is there any way you could bridge all three? You'd be a unique bird for sure.
 
ceo said:
First you blame jobs going overseas on less regulation, then you turn around and say they passed legislation (implying more regulation) and cite that as the cause of jobs going overseas.

Which is it? We've established that more jobs appear to be going overseas, you just seem confused as to why.
Click to expand...

Passing legislation does not mean "More Regulation".
Passing legislation means "NEW Laws".
That can be laws that deregulate, or regulate.
There's no Implying shit. It was a cut and dry statement.
 
PICK3 said:
Learning to be a commercial pilot with the requisite flight hours including multi-engine is quite pricey. If someone else is picking up the tab it would be a chance of a lifetime.
Click to expand...

If you aspire to fly jets like my grandmother. You have to realize you'll be competing with ex-military pilots your entire career.
 
BlueBird said:
Give me opinions, all you smarty-pants bros....:artist:

So, you all know I'm an artist not making a living with this vocation. I was just laid off from regular job, but, because my employer out-sourced these positions, I am now eligible for re-training under the Trade Act. I was thinking of three different avenues; 1) Machine tool technology (this may be best option as I was contacted for a production job with potential advancement), 2) Nursing (would be able to get position in a geographical area I'd love), 3) Commercial Pilot (seriously, as I am close to 4 centers with such programs and this would be the highest entry level wage). What say yous? :D
Click to expand...

I wood recommend option

4) a career in GIS

 
brownbrown said:
Passing legislation does not mean "More Regulation".
Passing legislation means "NEW Laws".
That can be laws that deregulate, or regulate.
There's no Implying shit. It was a cut and dry statement.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure jobs weren't deregulated out of the US.
 
BlueBird said:
I appreciate what you're saying. While my *calling* has always been as an artist, I did work for 3 years as a nursing assistant, enjoyed the work, and was always asked if I would consider continuing in the field....but I fully understand your post. Thanks Pick.

Have to say I'm leaning towards commercial pilot, but if I were to receive the production job offer, I would most definitely go for the tool program.
Click to expand...

i'd say nursing, my coworker was a commercial pilot for quite a few years, he quit and does my job now.
he said the money was shit, under 30k to start (mid 90s)...and you are never home, constantly staying in shitty hotels, and constantly having to deal with airport stress...he made it seem like the worse job ever, apparently the better money is flying parcels for fedx or usps but harder jobs to get.
 
binö said:
i'd say nursing, my coworker was a commercial pilot for quite a few years, he quit and does my job now.
he said the money was shit, under 30k to start (mid 90s)...and you are never home, constantly staying in shitty hotels, and constantly having to deal with airport stress...he made it seem like the worse job ever, apparently the better money is flying parcels for fedx or usps but harder jobs to get.
Click to expand...

Commercial Pilots

Aircraft Pilots and Flight Engineers

Median annual wages of commercial pilots were $65,340 in May 2008. The middle 50 percent earned between $45,680 and $89,540. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $32,020, and the highest 10 percent earned more than $129,580.

Job Outlook

Aircraft pilots and flight engineers are expected to grow about as fast as the average for all occupations. Regional airlines and low-cost carriers will present the best opportunities; pilots attempting to get jobs at the major airlines will face strong competition.

Registered Nurses

Registered Nurses

Median annual wages of registered nurses were $62,450 in May 2008. The middle 50 percent earned between $51,640 and $76,570. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $43,410, and the highest 10 percent earned more than $92,240.

Job Outlook

Employment of RNs is expected to grow much faster than the average and, because the occupation is very large, 581,500 new jobs will result, among the largest number of new jobs for any occupation.

Machine Tool Operators

Computer Control Programmers and Operators

Median hourly wages of computer-controlled machine tool operators, metal and plastic, were $16.03 in May 2008. The middle 50 percent earned between $12.83 and $19.45. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $10.49, whereas the top 10 percent earned more than $23.84.

Job Outlook

Overall employment of computer control programmers and operators is expected to increase by 4 percent over the 2008–18 period, which is slower than average for all occupations. Employment of computer controlled machine tool operators, metal and plastic is expected to increase by 7 percent, which is about as fast as the average for all occupations.
 
digimon7068 said:
true dat! in fact, i can show you a bunch of middle class people that (legally) haven't had to pay any taxes the last couple/few years too!!
Click to expand...

I'm so poor that last year I got back more than I paid in (because of Q). I doubt this year will be much different. I had to take out a goddamn student loan during our slow season just so I could pay rent and keep the lights on. I hate my life.
 
PICK3 said:
Machine Tool Operators

Computer Control Programmers and Operators

Median hourly wages of computer-controlled machine tool operators, metal and plastic, were $16.03 in May 2008. The middle 50 percent earned between $12.83 and $19.45. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $10.49, whereas the top 10 percent earned more than $23.84.

Job Outlook

Overall employment of computer control programmers and operators is expected to increase by 4 percent over the 2008–18 period, which is slower than average for all occupations. Employment of computer controlled machine tool operators, metal and plastic is expected to increase by 7 percent, which is about as fast as the average for all occupations.
Click to expand...

That's very good data -- but that's also the job description for the guy who essentially just pushes the big green button when it blinks.

I do wonder what design/programmers make for more complex parts.
 
mrplunkey said:
I agree about nursing. Either you feel it or you don't.

The machine tools job sounds great (to me, at least).

Let me bounce one other thing off you: There's a huge gap out there between people who have artistic skills, can get those designs into SolidWorks/Pro-E, can transfer those models into a computer-aided manufacturing (CAM) system and then actually generate the CNC code to make the part.

Right now, they are split into three groups: 1) Artists, 2) CAD engineers and 3) CAM/Machinists.

Is there any way you could bridge all three? You'd be a unique bird for sure.
Click to expand...


Interesting, Plunkey, thank you for this suggestion! Not sure I could patch all three, but it is a fascinating proposal. The arts angle would be a breeze, I know I'd have no problem imagining and building tangible prototypes (did a few architectural models), but I've only written (very simple)code for an animation project in college. Hmm, maybe?

I know I have some aptitude for machining~my supervisor, on my final review, admitted he was hesitant about hiring an artist for an engine line but was very pleasantly surprised at my performance (our whole line was laid-off, btw) he even suggested the machine tool tech program.
 
mrplunkey said:
That's very good data -- but that's also the job description for the guy who essentially just pushes the big green button when it blinks.
Click to expand...

Yes, I agree. My beginning wage for this entry-level position in production would already be in the middle 50% quoted in the link.
 
binö said:
i'd say nursing, my coworker was a commercial pilot for quite a few years, he quit and does my job now.
he said the money was shit, under 30k to start (mid 90s)...and you are never home, constantly staying in shitty hotels, and constantly having to deal with airport stress...he made it seem like the worse job ever, apparently the better money is flying parcels for fedx or usps but harder jobs to get.
Click to expand...


Yes, but being Johnny Depp's personal pilot would probably have other perks.:evil:
 
BlueBird said:
Yes, but being Johnny Depp's personal pilot would probably have other perks.:evil:
Click to expand...

one of my clients is a private pilot...flys a gulfstream or something like that...he flys letterman, springsteen, robert deniro and others...loves his job...makes nice coin too!
 
BlueBird said:
Interesting, Plunkey, thank you for this suggestion! Not sure I could patch all three, but it is a fascinating proposal. The arts angle would be a breeze, I know I'd have no problem imagining and building tangible prototypes (did a few architectural models), but I've only written (very simple)code for an animation project in college. Hmm, maybe?

I know I have some aptitude for machining~my supervisor, on my final review, admitted he was hesitant about hiring an artist for an engine line but was very pleasantly surprised at my performance (our whole line was laid-off, btw) he even suggested the machine tool tech program.
Click to expand...

Got to admit Plunkey gave you some good advice

architectural metal work. These guys do everything from little wall hangings to giant mining structures:

CAID Home Page/WebGallery/Architectural
 
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