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PICK3
New member
*shakes head*
here we go!
FOXNews.com - Obama Comes Out in Favor of Allowing Mosque Near Ground Zero
here we go!
FOXNews.com - Obama Comes Out in Favor of Allowing Mosque Near Ground Zero
Obama Comes Out in Favor of Allowing Mosque Near Ground Zero
- Thread starter PICK3
- Start date
Of course he did, ever since his campaign he's tried to "bridge the gap" between US and middle eastern territory... even bowed to a prince somewhere around there and the media threw a fit.....
cryptosporidium
New member
i dont think "the people" realize that to militant islam, this is a show of prostration.
WRONG. the militants want the US to be divided. this is a show of unity and that we are a strong country and stick to our ideals. there were plenty of muslims who were in those buildings on 9/11. I know cause one of our offices was in there at the time when my company was called Momentum.
the militants dont give a damn about your religion, they just want to destroy our ideals. if we let them then they WIN.
"Let me be clear: as a citizen, and as president, I believe that Muslims have the same right to practice their religion as anyone else in this country. That includes the right to build a place of worship and a community center on private property in Lower Manhattan, in accordance with local laws and ordinances. This is America, and our commitment to religious freedom must be unshakeable."
and he is right.
and he is right.
bakemeacookie
New member
Obama Hussein, like he's gonna say anything to the contrary.
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PICK3
New member
And in the spirit of entrepreneurship a jooou has the right to build a gay pr0n peep show video store on one side of it and a sausage deli on the other
lolol
depends on the zoning but i would see no problem with that lol.
i've seen churches next to all kinds of weird things. I used to own a lot that was zoned for strip clubs AND churches near an exec. airport. which one do u think would of made me more money to build?
Give me a break, that's like expecting a block party to appreciate the nuance of a Jackson Pollock stroke, or thinking the Cardinal College really does believe in transubstantiation. However it's spun, to most people it's an affront rather than a gesture of reconciliation, and it's definitely not viewed as one of prostration.
bw1
Banned
No you are wrong...don't give me this fuckin bullshit...this is a slap in our face by these fucks and you know it...
bw1
Banned
lol
The America that you're talking about died along time ago by the so called patriots of today.
cryptosporidium
New member
cryptosporidium
New member
i dont think what i said could be any more misinterpreted than what yur sayin here. sure, to you (and other americans) it may be a show of unity, but to jihadists it isnt... and that is the context of my statement, which you seem to have missed.
aside from that, i think its going to sharply divide american opinion and where is unity in that.
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gorillahung
New member
The US Constitution states that there be no laws restricting religion. Obama has a duty to uphold the Constitution.
How would it be legal to deny Muslims the right to have a building for worship? This is yet another example of FOX news making up a bullshit story. They aren't even building it in the same spot where the Wrold Trade Center was. This is 2 blocks away. Why do right wing nuts get angry over things like this?
How would it be legal to deny Muslims the right to have a building for worship? This is yet another example of FOX news making up a bullshit story. They aren't even building it in the same spot where the Wrold Trade Center was. This is 2 blocks away. Why do right wing nuts get angry over things like this?
polls indicate 65-70% of voters against this.
obama is making his dem bros squirm like a mofo, he
shoulda kept quiet.
fun november
The same number or more most likely think pot should be legalized, but it won't happen any time soon.
Whiskey
gorillahung
New member
My parents have a Muslim neighbor. He's a psychiatrist that treats drug addicts. He is normal and has a perfectly normal family. Why should he be denied a place to worship as he pleases? The Christians in this country have gone far to demonize Muslims. As an atheist I think all religions are wacky but that's beside the point.
It's a sad day when the President is criticized for supporting the US Constitution.
It's a sad day when the President is criticized for supporting the US Constitution.
PICK3
New member
So you're suggesting we should wall off the perimeter of ground zero with mosque?
we don't have to explain shit to you!
lololo
Not at all. And I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that there aren't any plans for a wall-o-mosque. I just don't understand why anyone would be opposed to 1 mosque 2 blocks away from ground zero. I used to live about 2 blocks away from a mosque, never really noticed it. Why are we against it? Just need some clarification.
PICK3
New member
correct
if it's made privately and 2 blocks away i really dont care then... just keep it away from the actual site
PICK3
New member
how about 1.5 blocks? 800 feet?
DannoMight
New member
the more of a big deal this is and the more it's plastered over the news and everywhere else the lass of a shit i give. it just like a sog that gets overplayed on the radio. kinda like the new eminem/rhianna song.
PICK3
New member
It actually is a local issue. No need for him or anyone at the fed level to weigh in on it.
In light of his recent approval rating I'd have to think his advisors aren't a bright group either.
Um, First Amendment = Federal issue. (And to get technical, the 1st Amendment has been incorporated by the 14th Amendment to be applicable to the states.)
He can't come out in favor of a constitutional violation, even if it will negatively impact his approval ratings.
And why won't anyone explain to me why a mosque two blocks away from ground zero is such a big deal?
PICK3
New member
It's not a Federal issue nor is building a Starbucks.
It's a go ... if they are zoned correctly and pass applicable building codes there will be a mosque erected there.
No, but he can keep his mouth shut.
His advisors must be jobless executives that got offered a sweetheart deal after their bailout plan failed.
It's an emotional issue. You can draw an analogy to floating a ring of Rising Sun buoys around the USS Arizona...maybe not the best analogy, but the sentiment is the same.
gorillahung
New member
It boils down to a lot of Americans hating all Muslims. That's the same type of thinking that the Al Qaeda terrorists use against Americans. I think this is a good opportunity to show moral superiority.
cryptosporidium
New member
it boils down to a lot of lulz
mrplunkey
New member
Naaah. If he can force Americans to buy a commercial product (health insurance) under penalty of law, surely he can bend a few freedom of religion rules too.
I think people are taking out their frustration and anger with the 9/11 events on innocent muslims who want to pray...
P.S. That building was a praying place for muslims BEFORE the 9/11 event
P.S. That building was a praying place for muslims BEFORE the 9/11 event
That analogy suggests they shouldnt be allowed to build a mosque anywhere in New York.
That is my point. While I am all for religious freedom, etc and the principles of this country I have sworn to defend at the same time, where is the "sensitivity" of the so called followers of Allah? What if we wanted to build that cultural awareness center say in the middle of Baghdad or Hiroshima, etc. The entire world would be screaming at us for our insensitivity.
However, I do believe the ulterior motive is to recruit more hatred, etc and to use the skyline, absent the Twin Towers to show the followers of Islam that America is vulnerable and can be taken down from within its own borders.
However, I do believe the ulterior motive is to recruit more hatred, etc and to use the skyline, absent the Twin Towers to show the followers of Islam that America is vulnerable and can be taken down from within its own borders.
gorillahung
New member
This is only an issue because FOX news says it is.
http://i33.tinypic.com/334snc0.jpg
Hmm, wonder why they hide their faces? Could it be they are cowards?
Hmm, wonder why they hide their faces? Could it be they are cowards?
mrplunkey
New member
Lots of ignorance in this thread. Lots of hypocrisy too. Americans disarming nuclear bombs from the world yet they've used nuclear bombs...Americans preaching freedom of choice and religion and all values and the right to happiness, yet they prosecute muslims because they do not share their views on culture, politics and religion....Americans...particularly 53 % of New Yorkers are scared, ignorant people who would suggest their president is a muslim because he is following constitution.
Quite frankly, your post is as bigoted. I'm personally insulted that they want to build ANYTHING on Ground Zero. WTF is wrong with good old fashioned mourning and commemoration? Let the National Park Service annex the whole site for a National Monument.
mrplunkey
New member
When America starts referring to its neighbors as "rotting corpses" and advocating their complete extermination, it will be time to take every nuclear device from us as well.
Freedom of religion shouldn't included building an ugly reminder of a relatively recent terrorist attack. When it comes to religion, we are and remain incredibly tolerant. After all, it's not like we're bludgeoning women to death with big rocks, sawing-off the heads of journalists, intentionally blowing-up crowded markets or killing our daughters because they date outside our faith.
sooooooooo...you're condemning the entire faith because of the actions of a few? nice...very tolerant.
It's not ON ground zero. It's an actual building more than a block or two away that was a prayer place for muslims even before ground zero.
cryptosporidium
New member
lol @ there being persecution in the states
bw1
Banned
Mosque Moves Forward, Yet Church in Limbo
by Mark Impomeni
08/09/2010
The battle raging over the Ground Zero mosque is bringing new attention to another, less publicized controversy involving a house of worship in Lower Manhattan.
St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church, which once sat right across the street from the World Trade Center, was crushed under the weight of the collapse of Tower Two on September 11, 2001. St. Nicholas was the only church to be lost in the attacks, and nine years later, while City of New York officials are busy removing every impediment to the building of the Cordoba mosque two blocks from the site, St. Nicholas’ future remains unclear.
The last bit of hopeful news for St. Nicholas came two years ago, in July 2008, when church officials and the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey announced a deal which would have allowed the church to be rebuilt about two blocks from its original location.
The Port Authority agreed to give the church a parcel of land at Liberty and Greenwich Streets, and contribute $20 million toward construction of a new sanctuary. The Port Authority also agreed to build an explosion-proof platform and foundation for the new church building, which would sit on top of a screening area for cars and trucks entering the underground garages at the new World Trade Center.
Trouble emerged after St. Nicholas announced its plans to build a traditional Greek Orthodox church building, 24,000 square feet in size, topped with a grand dome. Port Authority officials told the church to cut back the size of the building and the height of the proposed dome, limiting it to rising no higher than the World Trade Center memorial. The deal fell apart for goodin March 2009, when the Port Authority abruptly ended the talks after refusing to allow church officials to review plans for the garage and screening area underneath. Sixteen months later, the two sides have still not met to resume negotiations.
St. Nicholas Church’s difficulty in getting approvals to rebuild stands in stark contrast to the treatment that the developers of the proposed Cordoba mosque have received. New York City Mayor Mike Bloomberg, state Atty. Gen. Andrew Cuomo, and a raft of city officials have all come out publicly in favor of building the mosque, and the city’s Landmarks and Preservation Commission recently voted unanimously to deny protection to the building currently occupying the site where the mosque is to be built.
The mosque is proposed to rise 13 stories, far above the height of the World Trade Center memorial, with no height restrictions imposed.
olololololololololo
My mistake in not seperating two points into two paragraphs.
Your post is bigoted.
I'm personally insulted that they want to build ANYTHING on Ground Zero. WTF is wrong with good old fashioned mourning and commemoration? Let the National Park Service annex the whole site for a National Monument.
And I shall reiterate another of my past posts'. Give Manhatten back to it's rightful owners.
while we're at it, why dont we give the enire US back to the natives...lol
Aww, I'm sure they'll settle for the Louisiana Purchase territory.
BTW, there are some quite pivotal land masses that the US Government, itself, has legally contracted to give back to indigenous Peoples, but haven't, and are in breach.
mrplunkey
New member
When those few happen to be running entire countries, with at least enough support to maintain power for decades then yes. Yes I am.
I gather you were a Bush fan?
bakemeacookie
New member
The day the state starts telling religion what to do -- is the day the constitution has officially been ripped to shreds.
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there ya go!
People who believe the drivel you do scare me more than Muslims do. More people have died in the name of Christianity than anything else. If he did destroy the U.S. WTF would he do after that? Build a mansion in Kenya? They got dirt roads for chrissakes. He'd have to wash the cars every damn day!!!
(Kenya is nearly 70% Christian, btw)
mrplunkey
New member
There would be no need to move. The political class (and the upper elite) will do just fine even after the middle class is destroyed.
mrplunkey
New member
I miss Bush deficits.
cryptosporidium
New member
while it is true that there are multitudes of deaths attributed to christianity, the same can be said for islam, judaism and a variety of atheistic movements.
politics, religion and abortion, people will never see eye to eye in these things, personally as long as it is not in ACTUAL ground zero and they have their own permits and all, there shouldn't be a problem? do I like it, do I think it's tasteful? that's a whole different story that has NOTHING to do with this....
I think that's his point. Every religion has its fanaticism and intolerance.
DannoMight
New member
i can see that happening.
canadianhitman
Well-known member
They do have the right to put it there, on private land that they have purchased or leased, given local approval for zoning and such.
Should they CHOOSE to build it there? Fuck no, it's offensive to a lot of people and it's highly antagonistic...it practically BEGS for a retaliatory bombing of some kind by some fanatical nutjob.
But they do have the right, given the laws and ordinances on the books in NYC right now. You can't deny them that right as it would be blatant discrimination...this much is true. If they are not smart enough to realize that doing so is a very bad idea, then so be it.
Should they CHOOSE to build it there? Fuck no, it's offensive to a lot of people and it's highly antagonistic...it practically BEGS for a retaliatory bombing of some kind by some fanatical nutjob.
But they do have the right, given the laws and ordinances on the books in NYC right now. You can't deny them that right as it would be blatant discrimination...this much is true. If they are not smart enough to realize that doing so is a very bad idea, then so be it.
cryptosporidium
New member
i dont think either statement is accurate. atheism is not a religion and there are other wisdom traditions (that are considered religions) that are peaceful and amicable; other than the occidental ones that have shown a tendency toward intolerance, fanaticism and violence.
violence is part of the human condition and certain ideologies lend themselves to encouraging it.
The damned thing is headed by a known terrorist who advocates the destruction of the US. Hmmm, some tolerance. What I can't figure out is where is the muslim sensitivity, I don't think anyone in the US would deny them building their church/mosk, but again, why do they have to build it at ground zero? That would be like building a Japanese cultural awareness center next to the USS Arizona Memorial or us as I stated earlier building an American cultural awareness center in the middle of Hiroshima or Nagasaki.
Come on, you can't have religious tolerance and sympathy that only benefits one side. It has to be equal for all sides or none at all.
tyft
*lands ship in new land*
*claims christianity is the one true religion*
*brutally slaughters any native man, woman or child who opposes*
*burns native temples and builds christian churches*
*emphasizes christianity is a religion of PEACE*
So muslims are just doing the same things that christians did 500+ years ago, only killing fewer people in the process.
I don't see the big deal here. Who says the christian god is the one true god? For all we know, it could be the muslim god. Enjoy rotting in HELL for worshipping a false god, christians!
I don't see the big deal here. Who says the christian god is the one true god? For all we know, it could be the muslim god. Enjoy rotting in HELL for worshipping a false god, christians!
cryptosporidium
New member
islam is also guilty of killing people 500+ years ago 
islam is also guilty of killing people 500+ years ago
I couldn't point to israel on a world map, let alone know what they were doing 500 years ago.
How old is their religion? Were they warring back when the bastard christian "son" was walking around and stuff?
The Jewish people of which I am part of, were some of the most brutal people in history in biblical times. We annihilated every living thing when we went to war against someone. The adults, children, pets, etc. We left nothing alive. As did the Muslims, the Christians, etc. No one is innocent in this respect. But we are not 2000 years ago. We are here and now. If they truly believe in tolerance etc, then kick out the west hating leader, show respect for those killed in the name of Allah and move the damned thing elsewhere. Otherwise, they are begging for trouble. But I suspect that is what they truly want. To incite violence against them so they can cry wolf and the wo is poor me foul. That is the only reason I can see for not thinking about what the building of the mosk at ground zero truly means.
cryptosporidium
New member
I couldn't point to israel on a world map, let alone know what they were doing 500 years ago.
How old is their religion? Were they warring back when the bastard christian "son" was walking around and stuff?
islam is around 1400 years old and their militarism started around the year 622, so pretty much from the get-go.
my point was that we shouldnt split hairs when it comes to violent conduct on a large scale. i see a lot of selective attention and finger pointing when it comes to this.
on my psychosis scale, christianity ranks below islam and judaism.. but thats a worthy of a whole new thread.
where's the jesus fucking christ pic?
I never understood how every religion has claimed their one god (or many gods, whatever) was the only god, and all non-believers will rot in hell. It seems every religion in history claims this. There seems to exist a logical problem here that is constantly ignored.
Christians preach forgiveness? Then live by your fucking beliefs.
This country stands on religious freedom? Then stand by your fucking country.
Any argument touching religion or politics seems to attract the prolish of insufferable proles, like moths to a flame.
... in the age of a once beautiful country, now destroyed by the money-hungry jews of wall street.
mrplunkey
New member
I never understood how every religion has claimed their one god (or many gods, whatever) was the only god, and all non-believers will rot in hell. It seems every religion in history claims this. There seems to exist a logical problem here that is constantly ignored.
Christians preach forgiveness? Then live by your fucking beliefs.
This country stands on religious freedom? Then stand by your fucking country.
Any argument touching religion or politics seems to attract the prolish of insufferable proles, like moths to a flame.
I never got the exclusivity thing on religion either. I'm willing to bet it's an evolutionary feature designed to kill-off would be competitors.
Now on this founding of religious freedom thing... that was a part of a larger freedom package. The package included freedom of speech, expression, religion, firearms, opportunity, etc. etc. The entire idea was to limit government. But now, just like fat around the straps of a BBW's pumps, government has oozed around the limitations. We've undermined that completely.
cryptosporidium
New member
sorry, but that is grossly inaccurate dude. however, it is not a simple matter and imo, its rarely discussed properly.
you got that part dead on
mrplunkey
New member
I'd argue this, but I think you politicking.
Not really. The original idea was to severely constrain the government and let the people thrive. Remember how bold these ideas were. Everyone was to be treated under the law. Through reinterpretation of the commerce clause and believe that the constitution is a living document, we've already blown many if not most of those restraints away.
islam is also guilty of killing people 500+ years ago
I'm all for supporting the party who manages to kill the most people.
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