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Why Keto?
- Thread starter Grizzly
- Start date
sixtythirtyten
New member
cackerot, since you know so much answer me these questions?
how is it possible to put on muscle w/o insulin?
how do ketones not drain your potassium and glycogen storage?
and how does eating carbs such as brown rice and oats keep my insulin levels high all day as you have previously stated?
and last but not least answer me this, how have I gone from 175 to 190 lbs and actually lost bf while on this diet and how come when I tried keto( only once) I went from 170 to about 160 in a week and I started to look like a skinny bitch and my breath stunk and I felt like shit? I am really curious about this?
how is it possible to put on muscle w/o insulin?
how do ketones not drain your potassium and glycogen storage?
and how does eating carbs such as brown rice and oats keep my insulin levels high all day as you have previously stated?
and last but not least answer me this, how have I gone from 175 to 190 lbs and actually lost bf while on this diet and how come when I tried keto( only once) I went from 170 to about 160 in a week and I started to look like a skinny bitch and my breath stunk and I felt like shit? I am really curious about this?
Whoa, dude, were you trying to body build while on a keto diet? No wonder you lost BF, thats the point of being on a keto diet. Sounds like it worked well too. Your body shouldn't be in ketosis if your trying to body build. As i stated above, the only people who should be on keto diets are those who are overweight/obesis, and need to get their weight under control.
I take things one step at a time. I'm dropping weight, then i'm going to bulk up a little and try to gain some muscle without losing to much flexibility.
The bad breath is caused by your body producing ketones. Its pretty much a good sign that your burning fat. Drinking more water, and eating parsley and green leafy vegetables are suppose to help control the bad breath. I have it too, but its not that its bad breath, its just different in a sense. Mine is sweetish more than stinky.
I take things one step at a time. I'm dropping weight, then i'm going to bulk up a little and try to gain some muscle without losing to much flexibility.
The bad breath is caused by your body producing ketones. Its pretty much a good sign that your burning fat. Drinking more water, and eating parsley and green leafy vegetables are suppose to help control the bad breath. I have it too, but its not that its bad breath, its just different in a sense. Mine is sweetish more than stinky.
Cackerot69
New member
"cackerot, since you know so much answer me these questions?"
OK.
"how is it possible to put on muscle w/o insulin?"
I wouldn't recommend the diet for muscle gain, but it will work. The diet isn't *always* less than 30g of carbs. There are periodic carb-loads (or you can just eat carbs before or after anaerobic workouts, but that would be terrible for muscle growth). So, to tailor the diet for muscle growth you'd play around with the carb load. Rather than 5 days of low carbs and 2 day carb load, maybe 3 days of low carb and a 4 day carb load. Something such as:
Day 1-4: ketogenic diet with roughly maintenance cals or slightly above/below depending on your goals. If you want to use the diet to stay lean I would actually use this period as a kind of fat loss period and put cals 150-250 below maintenance. The purpose it would serve is to burn off any fat gained during the bulking period (carb load).
day 5-7: carb load with 1000 cals above maintenance.
So, say your maintenance level is 2500 cals per day (probably way off but this is just to make a point). That means your weekly maintenance is 17, 500 cals. During the carb load you eat 10, 500 cals and during the "fat loss" (in actuality fat maintenance) phase you eat 2250 cals per day and end up with a total of 19,500 cals and a surplus of 2000 per week and 285 per day. Which is about good for a lean mass gain.
You could screw around with this to have more cals or less depending on how fast you need to gain or whatever, of course.
Basically the same idea as the cyclical approach to dieting but it's made for bulking with the complete opposite purpose.
"how do ketones not drain your potassium and glycogen storage?"
Glycogen, yes. Potassium, maybe. You should supplement with potassium.
"and how does eating carbs such as brown rice and oats keep my insulin levels high all day as you have previously stated?"
If you eat every 3 hours like a lot of us, then insulin simply won't go down in time for your next meal. Or maybe it would depending on how much you eat or whatever, but you're still spiking insulin often which turns off fat burning and turns on fat storing.
"and last but not least answer me this, how have I gone from 175 to 190 lbs and actually lost bf while on this diet and how come when I tried keto( only once) I went from 170 to about 160 in a week and I started to look like a skinny bitch and my breath stunk and I felt like shit? I am really curious about this?"
Prolly cuz you did it wrong, lol. You will lose some water at first, and a lot of it will be intra-muscular water. This is only temporary and will go away after the carb load. I've found creatine helps with this, as well as supplementing with potassium. When you breath out ketones it makes your breath smelly (though for some reason this never happened to me). So chew on some sugarless gum and drinking lots of water helps.
OK.
"how is it possible to put on muscle w/o insulin?"
I wouldn't recommend the diet for muscle gain, but it will work. The diet isn't *always* less than 30g of carbs. There are periodic carb-loads (or you can just eat carbs before or after anaerobic workouts, but that would be terrible for muscle growth). So, to tailor the diet for muscle growth you'd play around with the carb load. Rather than 5 days of low carbs and 2 day carb load, maybe 3 days of low carb and a 4 day carb load. Something such as:
Day 1-4: ketogenic diet with roughly maintenance cals or slightly above/below depending on your goals. If you want to use the diet to stay lean I would actually use this period as a kind of fat loss period and put cals 150-250 below maintenance. The purpose it would serve is to burn off any fat gained during the bulking period (carb load).
day 5-7: carb load with 1000 cals above maintenance.
So, say your maintenance level is 2500 cals per day (probably way off but this is just to make a point). That means your weekly maintenance is 17, 500 cals. During the carb load you eat 10, 500 cals and during the "fat loss" (in actuality fat maintenance) phase you eat 2250 cals per day and end up with a total of 19,500 cals and a surplus of 2000 per week and 285 per day. Which is about good for a lean mass gain.
You could screw around with this to have more cals or less depending on how fast you need to gain or whatever, of course.
Basically the same idea as the cyclical approach to dieting but it's made for bulking with the complete opposite purpose.
"how do ketones not drain your potassium and glycogen storage?"
Glycogen, yes. Potassium, maybe. You should supplement with potassium.
"and how does eating carbs such as brown rice and oats keep my insulin levels high all day as you have previously stated?"
If you eat every 3 hours like a lot of us, then insulin simply won't go down in time for your next meal. Or maybe it would depending on how much you eat or whatever, but you're still spiking insulin often which turns off fat burning and turns on fat storing.
"and last but not least answer me this, how have I gone from 175 to 190 lbs and actually lost bf while on this diet and how come when I tried keto( only once) I went from 170 to about 160 in a week and I started to look like a skinny bitch and my breath stunk and I felt like shit? I am really curious about this?"
Prolly cuz you did it wrong, lol. You will lose some water at first, and a lot of it will be intra-muscular water. This is only temporary and will go away after the carb load. I've found creatine helps with this, as well as supplementing with potassium. When you breath out ketones it makes your breath smelly (though for some reason this never happened to me). So chew on some sugarless gum and drinking lots of water helps.
Darn it I've missed the boat again. I am merely an idealist who believes that bodybuilding can and should be a healthy undertaking. But when I look at some of the other boards on this site I always go into despair because I see folks wanting to gain mucle or lose fat in the short term at any long term cost. I feel the same despair when I see a "pro" bodybuilder being idolized by millons of people when to me it is wholly grotesque to see what drugs and fad diets can do to a mind/body that is focused on short term goals.
I come from a culture that says "start as you mean to continue"
I come from a culture that says "start as you mean to continue"
Cackerot69
New member
Actually, no.
Honestly, I was going to say the same thing Omega said regarding the Atkins garbage.
I dont think there is any disagreement in keeping Low Carbs, but the Atkins Diet sucks. Eating low Carbs is the only thing good about Keto. Frequent eating small amounts of clean foods and working out daily is the best.
chaste
I dont think there is any disagreement in keeping Low Carbs, but the Atkins Diet sucks. Eating low Carbs is the only thing good about Keto. Frequent eating small amounts of clean foods and working out daily is the best.
chaste
Grizzly you are correct. Unless you are an obese NIDDM sufferer with poor diet control then a moderate carb/high protein diet is fine. Are you a bodybuilder or just an average guy that wants to drop a little fat for a special occasion? If you're a bodybuilder you might want to check out WarLobo's thread
http://209.11.101.244/forum/showthread.php?threadid=64969
http://209.11.101.244/forum/showthread.php?threadid=64969
OMEGA said:
kETO DIETS ARE HORRIBLE!!!!!!!!!!
DANGEROUS FOR SKELETAL STRUSTRE, AND FILTERING SYSTEMS OF THE BODY.
BAD FOR THE BRAIN ALSO.
IF YOU WANT TO GET CUT....
GET 1.3 GRAMS OF CARBS PER PUND OF LEAN BODY WEIGHT, AND .8 GRAMS OF PROTIN PER POUND OF BODY WEIGHT.
Have you read NOTHING in this thread? Didn't think so. $20 says that you have never tried Atkins, or if you have, you didn't do it properly. You have never researched what your spewing, and you have no concept of what we're talking about.
I work out cardio, i do NOT lift weights, nor is it my goal at this time to lift weights. My goal is simply to lose weight and get my heart under control, and avoid diabeties. NEVER have Cackerot69 or i EVER said that you should be in ketosis if you want to body build. I don't see that stated anywhere because its not stated anywhere.
I don't see how anyone can look at my good health improvements, my increased energy level, low cholesterol, low blood pressure, etc. and still say that its bad for me. Jesus Christ, if i can do something bad for me that increases my health, than so be it. Obviously its impossible to have a conversation with half of you people because you refuse to except the fact that your wrong. 10's of thousands of people are healthy due to Atkins. Atkin's is the oldest Keto diet (30 years old) it has the largest test group (from the 70's-early 90's there were over 15,000 patients treated at the Atkins clinic, on top of those using other doctors, yet people will still look at a diet that is 99% effective and say that it is unhealthy. Liberals, everyone of you must be bleeding heart liberals who think we shouln't retaliate against the taliban
