Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below
WHOA! Be Careful With HCG!!!
- Thread starter Nelson Montana
- Start date
Citruscide said:I think it's been covered alot on here that HCG shouldn't just be used without discretion... thanks for the imput, it always does help.
C-ditty
What was indiscrete?
Also, I'm not sure what that has to do with my T levels not being elevated. But okay. Thanks!
zziggzzigg
New member
I have been suspicious of 6-oxo for a while now but kept it to myself, so it was interesting to read your post.
I haven't done extensive blood testing, just one that showed low normal free test a month or so after a 6-oxo 'recovery' protocal, but I didn't get e-levels tested. I believe this to be my worst recovery by far and am very skeptical of 6-oxo use as a pct. I believe I had more success using no pct in the past.
I guess the moral of the story is one should include estrogen levels in blood testing. Other than LH and FSH would there be any other testable hormones that might be affected by aas that might shed light on the total picture? ie. prolactin, progesterone etc. Unfortunately hrt and aas usage is more complicated than many people realize.
You mention that libido was improved on hcg (attributing that to e and test)... do you mean improved compared to no hrt or improved compared to your 'normal hrt' levels? ... and if so, do you have any theories? ... is LH itself involved in libido, as test levels on hrt should provide enough 'fuel' for aromatization and elevated estrogen levels... or does lh also influence other hormonal factors other than t and e?
I'm also wondering why 200 mg/week of test prop might cause extremely high libido at one stage of ones life, yet not so much at another stage of ones life... obviously test alone is only a small part of the libido picture....
I haven't done extensive blood testing, just one that showed low normal free test a month or so after a 6-oxo 'recovery' protocal, but I didn't get e-levels tested. I believe this to be my worst recovery by far and am very skeptical of 6-oxo use as a pct. I believe I had more success using no pct in the past.
I guess the moral of the story is one should include estrogen levels in blood testing. Other than LH and FSH would there be any other testable hormones that might be affected by aas that might shed light on the total picture? ie. prolactin, progesterone etc. Unfortunately hrt and aas usage is more complicated than many people realize.
You mention that libido was improved on hcg (attributing that to e and test)... do you mean improved compared to no hrt or improved compared to your 'normal hrt' levels? ... and if so, do you have any theories? ... is LH itself involved in libido, as test levels on hrt should provide enough 'fuel' for aromatization and elevated estrogen levels... or does lh also influence other hormonal factors other than t and e?
I'm also wondering why 200 mg/week of test prop might cause extremely high libido at one stage of ones life, yet not so much at another stage of ones life... obviously test alone is only a small part of the libido picture....
zziggzzigg
New member
I thought about this some more and remembered the fact that DHT plays a strong role in libido, therefore it could have something to do with the 5ar pathway... perhaps lh has an influence (or the testicles themselves) on the enzyme levels that dictate this? ...also this might be why trenbolone has such negative (even longterm) effects on libido as it can be 5ar reduced and maybe the dh-trenbolone has an unwanted effect on the receptors governing libido in the brain? Anyone with more knowledge on this subject please enlighten us....
zig: I think you're on the right track. Libido is tough to figure, but I think the reason it's higher when on HCG might very well have to do with testicles working "in full force." It can also be the elevation in e, or simply the spike in T. Toooo many variables to say for sure.
Jim: You must be new if you're asking me about Clomid. I think it's safe to say I was the first (staunch) anti-clomid advocate.
Clobro: Judging frommy results, I'd say that the standard Proviron/Chrysin post-cycle proticol should be mandatory while on HCG. I'd also go right into the herbal therepy (Unleahed, etc) instead of waiting . And I'd even throw in a little A-dex but you have to be careful with that stuff. A little goes a long way. (Incidentally, I would never use liquidex, but that's me).
But what is most disturbing is the lack of T elevation. If anything, HCG may supress you further. IT IS NOT A RECOVERY DRUG.
Clo, let us know your numbers after the HCG. I'm curious.
Jim: You must be new if you're asking me about Clomid. I think it's safe to say I was the first (staunch) anti-clomid advocate.
Clobro: Judging frommy results, I'd say that the standard Proviron/Chrysin post-cycle proticol should be mandatory while on HCG. I'd also go right into the herbal therepy (Unleahed, etc) instead of waiting . And I'd even throw in a little A-dex but you have to be careful with that stuff. A little goes a long way. (Incidentally, I would never use liquidex, but that's me).
But what is most disturbing is the lack of T elevation. If anything, HCG may supress you further. IT IS NOT A RECOVERY DRUG.
Clo, let us know your numbers after the HCG. I'm curious.
Nelson, I am looking everywhere for your Nolvadex dosage and I didn't see one. 1,000U of HCG, IM, three times weekly for a total of three weeks with 20mg nolvadex daily, for a total of six weeks is the way to go. HCG alone is not a smart way to recover. If has to be taken with Nolvadex to avoid the problems you discovered.
DrJMW said:
I gotta disagree with you on this one doc.
First of all, I think 3 weeks is way too long for HCG.
Secondly, Nolva never did a damn thing for my recovery, and had some negitive sides.
Nolva is mainly for preventing gyno but I didn't have any symptoms of gyno.
