*The Perpetual Muscle Mass EXPLOSION: Pre-PCT(Active Recovery), Bridging & Cruising*

[Ross]

so basically ross cant disprove anything sammoth is saying.. and has no medical proof that any of this is true..

id like to see the bloodwork you keep talking about that proves this whole theory

LOL

What exactly is Samoth SAYING?

200mgs of Primobolan is NOT as suppressive as 200mgs of DECA--plain and simple.

Secondly, if Samoth is debating that the HPTA can not begin to increase LH/FSH output while still on cycle, he obviously has never used steroids and/or never gotten bloodwork.

I don't even know WHAT I am defending.

 

[Anthony Roberts]

LOL

What exactly is Samoth SAYING?

He's saying that there's no support for your arguments, I think. In other words, you're saying "XYZ" will allow you to recover, but there's no avidence (studies, bloodwork, etc...) supporting the argument.

Thats what I'm reading, anyway....

 

[Ross]

He's saying that there's no support for your arguments, I think. In other words, you're saying "XYZ" will allow you to recover, but there's no avidence (studies, bloodwork, etc...) supporting the argument.

Thats what I'm reading, anyway....

Where are the studies showing that it CAN'T?

We INTERPRET the studies, that's all we can do.

The study's offer DATA and we extrapolate and synthesize that DATA.

We make our own INTERPRETATION of the DATA, and based on that EVIDENCE, form an HYPOTHESIS.

Active Recovery works, I have the bloodwork of countless indivuduals confirming. Am I an HRT Doc? LOL what is th epoint of me pusghing THIS?

 

[Anthony Roberts]

Where are the studies showing that it CAN'T?

We INTERPRET the studies, that's all we can do.

The study's offer DATA and we extrapolate and synthesize that DATA.

We make our own INTERPRETATION of the DATA, and based on that EVIDENCE, form an HYPOTHESIS.

Active Recovery works, I have the bloodwork of countless indivuduals confirming. Am I an HRT Doc? LOL what is th epoint of me pusghing THIS?

1. The burden of proof is on you to show your ideas have merit, not on others to show that they don't. That's kind of a silly statement. When I come out with a product, I don't ask people to prove it doesn't work, I am forced to provide the proof that it does.

2. Just post the bloodwork, then. I'm sure Samoth will take your word that the bloodwork you are posting is from people who have used this method.

 

[Ross]

1. The burden of proof is on you to show your ideas have merit, not on others to show that they don't. That's kind of a silly statement. When I come out with a product, I don't ask people to prove it doesn't work, I am forced to provide the proof that it does.

2. Just post the bloodwork, then. I'm sure Samoth will take your word that the bloodwork you are posting is from people who have used this method.

I agree, and I have carried that burden with me to EVERY forum I have adventured to.

I do not have PROOF, I have EVIDENCE.

Proof would require that I conduct a large scientific study.

 

[Anthony Roberts]

I agree, and I have carried that burden with me to EVERY forum I have adventured to.

I do not have PROOF, I have EVIDENCE.

Proof would require that I conduct a large scientific study.

But you really haven't posted any evidence, from what I see. Most of the stuff you're posting has nothing to do with the claims, or if it does, it's not only far from conclusive, but really doesn't support the claims.

As an example, you posted some studies showing prolactin has an effect on HPTA sensitivity. Your conclusion is that it's the greatest determining factor in HPTA sensitivity. Nowhere in the literature you've posted is that either supported or even suggested.

 

[Ross]

But you really haven't posted any evidence, from what I see. Most of the stuff you're posting has nothing to do with the claims, or if it does, it's not only far from conclusive, but really doesn't support the claims.

As an example, you posted some studies showing prolactin has an effect on HPTA sensitivity. Your conclusion is that it's the greatest determining factor in HPTA sensitivity. Nowhere in the literature you've posted is that either supported or even suggested.

So do you disagree with my assessment of utilizing certain AAS before going directly into PCT?

Do you disagree that normal levels of testosterone can be maintained on 200mgs of Primobolan?

Do you disagree that Prolactin is a LARGE DETERMINANT in HPTA "sensitivity", thus, Deca and Tren cause PROFOUND HPTA detriment?

I don't quite understand where this is going.

In your steroid profiles on A-R, you SUGGEST USING DIANABOL AS A BRIDGE:

"In order to successfully bridge between cycles (and this means using a low dose of AAS, in this case dbol), you need to recover your natural hormonal levels to pre-cycle levels or to within acceptable parameters, and then you start your next cycle. The idea here is that you won´t lose any gains, but rather a low dose of an AAS will help you maintain them. Typically, you´d use around 10mgs/day of dbol and combine it with an aggressive Post-Cycle Therapy (PCT) course of Nolvadex (and/or Clomid) and HCG. This would give you full androgen replacement from the Dbol and a shot at recovering your natural hormonal levels via the other stuff you are taking. Remember, the 100mg/day dose of dbol in the study we looked at earlier did not suppress Test, LH, or FSH to a degree that would make recovery impossible and certainly not with 1/10th that dose in conjunction with an aggressive PCT."

 

[Anthony Roberts]

So do you disagree with my assessment of utilizing certain AAS before going directly into PCT?

I think it's more important not to use the wrong ones, honestly.

Do you disagree that normal levels of testosterone can be maintained on 200mgs of Primobolan?

Yes.

Do you disagree that Prolactin is a LARGE DETERMINANT in HPTA "sensitivity", thus, Deca and Tren cause PROFOUND HPTA detriment?

Prolactin in important. Not to the degree you're saying it is, though.

In your steroid profiles on A-R, you SUGGEST USING DIANABOL AS A BRIDGE:

"In order to successfully bridge between cycles (and this means using a low dose of AAS, in this case dbol), you need to recover your natural hormonal levels to pre-cycle levels or to within acceptable parameters, and then you start your next cycle. The idea here is that you won´t lose any gains, but rather a low dose of an AAS will help you maintain them. Typically, you´d use around 10mgs/day of dbol and combine it with an aggressive Post-Cycle Therapy (PCT) course of Nolvadex (and/or Clomid) and HCG. This would give you full androgen replacement from the Dbol and a shot at recovering your natural hormonal levels via the other stuff you are taking. Remember, the 100mg/day dose of dbol in the study we looked at earlier did not suppress Test, LH, or FSH to a degree that would make recovery impossible and certainly not with 1/10th that dose in conjunction with an aggressive PCT."

I think a small amount of dbol can be used between cycles and you can still (probably) get your HPTA to low/normal range...not baseline though...and that's with an aggressive PCT. In my own case, within 3 weeks after cessation of a 3 year cycle, I was almost at low/normal range for the HPTA with NO PCT at all. I coulda probably used some Dbol and still gotten there I think....and if I used a PCT, then I'm sure I could. I couldn't get back to normal though...not where I was.

Remember, I wrote that profile almost 2 years ago, and I've learned a lot since then and changed my thinking quite a bit.

Notice, in that profile, I say you have " a shot" at recovery on 10mgs of dbol...nothing more. I say it's not "impossible"...that's a huge difference from what you're claiming...

It's unlikely that you can recover on an injectable like primo at 200mgs/week...nothing in literature supports it, nor any bloodwork I've ever seen.