Pizza parlor beating caught on tape

[Lumberg]

Then let's start with a pho house, I have a few in mind.

LORM

I meant to tell you, there are several very large, muscular black guys who work at the York warehouse.

 

[FreeballinDC]

LORM

I meant to tell you, there are several very large, muscular black guys who work at the York warehouse.

Totally off topic, but what the hell. My roommates condo deal went through, so he will be moving out sometime late spring or summer, which means his stuff will move out of the basement. Which means there will be room for some weights, associated equipment and muscular black men.

No, not the fatty that's shown in this video.

 

[madbomber31]

do you actually believe that?

if someone called your girl a fat whore would you just say "dude, leave her alone"???

someone stated he said something along the lines of 'it's gonna take longer some fat whore just stepped in front of me'

thats grounds for an issue... if he didnt say anything like that then the black dude is just an asshole.

two sides to every story... maybe a BIT extreme, i guess the dude could have just fucked him up with 3 or 4 shots instead of going on... but my point is if you are going to call someone a fat whore you are going to get beat shitless by the 300lb guy next to her.

like i said, i was just saying IF (notice, it's a big if) he called her a fat whore like someone else stated earlier in the thread.

 

[Lumberg]

Totally off topic, but what the hell. My roommates condo deal went through, so he will be moving out sometime late spring or summer, which means his stuff will move out of the basement. Which means there will be room for some weights, associated equipment and muscular black men.

No, not the fatty that's shown in this video.

Road trip tp York!

I have some cigar friends that live near there so we could also do some herfing (AFTER we load the equipment in the truck!).

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

Wondering what you all are getting worked up for....

People get thier ass whooped all the time because someone feels like it. That's just life on the street. If you got no street smarts , then yo azz is gonna get kicked.

4 years and the dude wasn't hurt seriously

Hi.

Life "on the street" does not include getting a pizza. "The street" usually does not include standing in line at a place of business, when a fat whiny black woman inconsiderately cuts in front of you. I thought fat black women were supposed to be causing traffic accidents in Atlanta through incompetent driving...you like stereotypes?

These are not "the streets". This was "a pizzeria", where people go to buy stuff in a civilized fashion.

It is sheer irrationality to identify this episode with some kind of "law of the jungle" behavior. This was an assault by a stupid, fat, short sighted black guy who will now be imprisoned, costing the taxpayers a ton of money, and adding a big fat nothing to society.

He got jail. Congrats, he showed us how street smart he was.

 

[Razorguns]

Bet ya 10 bucks even if he politely said "Um, excuse me -- i was in front of you in the line ma'am" -- fat 5-kids-on-welfare bitch would've popped a scene, and big ugly black man would've still sucker-punched him.

 

[Judo Tom]

if someone called your girl a fat whore would you just say "dude, leave her alone"???

i would never start a fight over a verbal insult.. never and i sure as shit wouldnt put someone in the hospital for something they said.

someone has to put me in physical danger before i even think of hurting that person

starting fights over words and insults is a huge waste and just leads to problems..

thanks

 

[Ish]

Since when did Dominos start accepting food stamps?

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

Bet ya 10 bucks even if he politely said "Um, excuse me -- i was in front of you in the line ma'am" -- fat 5-kids-on-welfare bitch would've popped a scene, and big ugly black man would've still sucker-punched him.

BINGO!

Thank you for stating the obvious. It wasn't about what whitey said...not even a little bit. It wasn't about "the street" or any of that shit. it wasn;t even about Andre Agassi, who never would have let this happen on his watch.

It was about this piece of ass-shit attacking whitey over nothing. And now, his obese black ass will sit in taxpayer funded prison for 4 years.

Lovely.

 

[Dial_tone]

I proclaim the video (which I have yet to watch) to be racially biased therefore it should be thrown out.

 

[Sean Scott]

I just got a chance to read the srticle... Tha black dude is an asshole, I hope he does the full 4 years. The black lady cutting people in line is typical ghetto bullshit...

I agree

 

[BlkDragon]

if someone called your girl a fat whore would you just say "dude, leave her alone"???

someone stated he said something along the lines of 'it's gonna take longer some fat whore just stepped in front of me'

thats grounds for an issue... if he didnt say anything like that then the black dude is just an asshole.

two sides to every story... maybe a BIT extreme, i guess the dude could have just fucked him up with 3 or 4 shots instead of going on... but my point is if you are going to call someone a fat whore you are going to get beat shitless by the 300lb guy next to her.

like i said, i was just saying IF (notice, it's a big if) he called her a fat whore like someone else stated earlier in the thread.

I agree with you; however, that "300lb guy next her" better be prepared to go to jail.

 

[Dial_tone]

He musta ordered the Rodney King special.

 

[DJ_UFO]

-Edit-


I just got a chance to read the srticle... Tha black dude is an asshole, I hope he does the full 4 years. The black lady cutting people in line is typical ghetto bullshit...




-BRR

Word. The dude should get 8 years and the girl 4. Whithout parole.

 

[Spartacus]

what does Agassi have to do with any of this shit?
am I out of the loop?

 

[madbomber31]

dont get me wrong when i say the dude may have gotten what he deserved... the black guy still shouldnt have done it... and i never would do something like that over a verbal assault (not even an assault)... i'm just saying that if you talk shit you better be fully prepared to back it up, even in line at a pizzeria.

i do not condone what big homey did, but watch your mouth around people... he's lucky homey just gave him a beat down and not a .45

 

[gjohnson5]

Hi.

Life "on the street" does not include getting a pizza. "The street" usually does not include standing in line at a place of business, when a fat whiny black woman inconsiderately cuts in front of you. I thought fat black women were supposed to be causing traffic accidents in Atlanta through incompetent driving...you like stereotypes?

These are not "the streets". This was "a pizzeria", where people go to buy stuff in a civilized fashion.

It is sheer irrationality to identify this episode with some kind of "law of the jungle" behavior. This was an assault by a stupid, fat, short sighted black guy who will now be imprisoned, costing the taxpayers a ton of money, and adding a big fat nothing to society.

He got jail. Congrats, he showed us how street smart he was.

Hi

1. The little dude was running his mouth. He got popped. Makes no differnce if it were insode the pizzeria door or outside
2. No, I don't like stereotypes , but considering where most of them come from, no wonder the little dude got a busted face...

Until police work turns into that Tom Cruise movie with "precrime" Law of the Jungle will always be there. There is no solution for random acts of violence. White people commit such acts of violence too , but you may be stuck in that stereotypical world you were speaking of. It's just a matter of not being the little caribu that becomes dinner for the lion and get his carcass picked by vultures.

 

[Guvna]

Bet ya 10 bucks even if he politely said "Um, excuse me -- i was in front of you in the line ma'am" -- fat 5-kids-on-welfare bitch would've popped a scene, and big ugly black man would've still sucker-punched him.

1)Correct. These fat welfare bitches are worthless scum. She shouldnt have fucking cut in line. Is anyone else missing this? If she wouldnt have been a cunt, the whole thing would have been avoided.

2) Anyone that starts a fight over pretty much any verbal insult is a fucking idiot. starting a fight for "talking shit" is the most pathetic of them all.

3) I wouldnt have helped either. The guy was a gangster thug dickhead (N word would have worked better). He might have had a gun/knife. Even if i didnt like what was happening, its not worth putting my life at risk.

4) Agreed, and people wonder where sterotypes come from. Oh, wait, oops, its not a sterotype when most crimes ARE commited by blacks/hispanics, even though they are the minority; it turns into FACT.

 

[Razorguns]

4) Agreed, and people wonder where sterotypes come from. Oh, wait, oops, its not a sterotype when most crimes ARE commited by blacks/hispanics, even though they are the minority; it turns into FACT.

Psstt. Never say that publicly -- you'll be immediately branded as a racist.

It's pathetic even black "leaders" are in denial are more focused on what's on tv and out of the mouths of white people, then violence and crime in their neighbourhoods. Reeks of laziness and denial.

If someone says native americans are all alcoholics, unemployed, and go to jail a lot -- i'd agree with them. I'm not in denial and try my best to support changes and social improvements on rez's.

It's a shame what happens 15 miles north of me here in la. Yet no one really cares or wants to do anything about it. Show a video exposing the truth, and unless you're Spike Lee -- you're a racist.

Sad really.

 

[Guvna]

Psstt. Never say that publicly -- you'll be immediately branded as a racist.

It's pathetic even black "leaders" are in denial are more focused on what's on tv and out of the mouths of white people, then violence and crime in their neighbourhoods. Reeks of laziness and denial.

If someone says native americans are all alcoholics, unemployed, and go to jail a lot -- i'd agree with them. I'm not in denial and try my best to support changes and social improvements on rez's.

It's a shame what happens 15 miles north of me here in la. Yet no one really cares or wants to do anything about it. Show a video exposing the truth, and unless you're Spike Lee -- you're a racist.

Sad really.

agreed.

 

[Phaded]

1)Correct. These fat welfare bitches are worthless scum. She shouldnt have fucking cut in line. Is anyone else missing this? If she wouldnt have been a cunt, the whole thing would have been avoided.

2) Anyone that starts a fight over pretty much any verbal insult is a fucking idiot. starting a fight for "talking shit" is the most pathetic of them all.

3) I wouldnt have helped either. The guy was a gangster thug dickhead (N word would have worked better). He might have had a gun/knife. Even if i didnt like what was happening, its not worth putting my life at risk.

4) Agreed, and people wonder where sterotypes come from. Oh, wait, oops, its not a sterotype when most crimes ARE commited by blacks/hispanics, even though they are the minority; it turns into FACT.

you are only allowed to think stuff like that buddy .. however i'm sure alot of people agree with you..


heres a video for everyone who doesn't use quicktime and all that gay active x shit you have to have installed to view newsroom videos..



http://wm.gannett.speedera.net/wm.gannett/wkyc/050219pizzaassault.wmv

 

[biteme]

i love how everyone just stands there and watched....fags

Probably untrained pussies. That's why I love being trained. I have stoppped possible carnage a time or two.

 

[gjohnson5]

Psstt. Never say that publicly -- you'll be immediately branded as a racist.

It's pathetic even black "leaders" are in denial are more focused on what's on tv and out of the mouths of white people, then violence and crime in their neighbourhoods. Reeks of laziness and denial.

If someone says native americans are all alcoholics, unemployed, and go to jail a lot -- i'd agree with them. I'm not in denial and try my best to support changes and social improvements on rez's.

It's a shame what happens 15 miles north of me here in la. Yet no one really cares or wants to do anything about it. Show a video exposing the truth, and unless you're Spike Lee -- you're a racist.

Sad really.

What sad are these stereotypes that you believe when you probably don't know any native americans ant can't name the platform of any black "leaders"

I wonder if I posted a video of police brutality by white officers, I bet I'd hear cheers from some of you...

If you wanna see a racist , maybe you should look in the mirror

 

[Spartacus]

the black chic also spit in the pizza emplyee's face when he tried to calm her down

 

[Spartacus]

Probably untrained pussies. That's why I love being trained. I have stoppped possible carnage a time or two.

one guy to the far right is a big dude too
at least a couple other of the 7 had decent size

black dude was already on probation
35 stuck on 15

 

[Guvna]

What sad are these stereotypes that you believe when you probably don't know any native americans ant can't name the platform of any black "leaders"

I wonder if I posted a video of police brutality by white officers, I bet I'd hear cheers from some of you...

If you wanna see a racist , maybe you should look in the mirror

and you have the first one.

 

[biteme]

the black chic also spit in the pizza emplyee's face when he tried to calm her down

I'd have probably kicked her ass if she did that to me. I can take a lot, but spitting in the face would probably make me snap.

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

Hi

1. The little dude was running his mouth. He got popped. Makes no differnce if it were insode the pizzeria door or outside

Bor - what planet are you from where it is OK for people to get popped when someone says something to you? People get mad at me all the time, they say shit, they get angry. I was an Army Ranger and I know how to fight, (Ok I might be rusty now) but I just walk away. Like Judo Tom said, best way to not lose a fight is not be there.

This black guy just got 4 years in prison! . Who is really street smart in this situation? Nobody? Nobody! Nobody is ever street smart, sir. "Street smart" is a myth that has been adopted largely by a poorly educated African American population to legitimize a culture of self-destruction. Suburban white kids who lack stimulation from a failing school system and materialistically preoccuiped (yet underachieving) parents often turn to and embrace this culture as well - how else to explain the hip-hop culture among upper middle class whites?

Where, tell me, where, is the glory in imprisonment?

2. No, I don't like stereotypes , but considering where most of them come from, no wonder the little dude got a busted face...

Yep, no wonder. And no wonder there are more blacks in jail than college. Must be all that "street smarts".

Until police work turns into that Tom Cruise movie with "precrime" Law of the Jungle will always be there. There is no solution for random acts of violence. White people commit such acts of violence too , but you may be stuck in that stereotypical world you were speaking of. It's just a matter of not being the little caribu that becomes dinner for the lion and get his carcass picked by vultures.

Whites do it, blacks do it, everyone does it, no kidding. Crime is mainly economic, not racial.

But what you seem to be missing is the guy who is going to jail for 4 years was 100% wrong here. 100%! Yet you try and use some weird Law of the Jungle reasoning to justify this crime. That sort of thinking is why too many whites think that the best form of "precrime" would be to imprison blacks at age 5.

why do you try to justify random acts of violence? because the criminal was black? Do you identify with that type of behavior? Are you swept up in a culture of "street smarts" rather than intellectual / academic achievement?

Are you afraid you will be turning your back on something if you try to embrace "whitey's world?

Oh, the movie was "minority report". And precrime only worked for murders.

 

[split endz]

Thanks for the video link Phaded. Stop trying to defend this beating guys. What he did was wrong & what she did was wrong. The idea that the guy who took the beating called her any kind of name was started on this thread... not a fact. When the big guy came out of the back, he was ready to hit someone. It would have been the guy behind the counter if he didn't walk away. Then big guy just unloaded on the victim. It was wrong & he got what he deserved irregardless of race.

 

[biteme]

I have shitty dial up so all I could do was hear the video, but they kept mentioning how surprising it was that 7 men just stood and watched and did nothing. The average person is terrified of physical conflict. That's just one more reason that I work out. No way I would have stood and watched that. ANd that stupid bitch should go to jail too.

 

[gjohnson5]

Bor - what planet are you from where it is OK for people to get popped when someone says something to you?

Quote where is used the word OK. You'll find that I never used the word OK. I do not think it's OK not do I condone it, but I some thing are avoidable and some thing are unavoidable. This situation was totally avoidable if the dude didn't run his mouth.

People get mad at me all the time, they say shit, they get angry. I was an Army Ranger and I know how to fight, (Ok I might be rusty now) but I just walk away. Like Judo Tom said, best way to not lose a fight is not be there.

This black guy just got 4 years in prison! . Who is really street smart in this situation? Nobody? Nobody! Nobody is ever street smart, sir. "Street smart" is a myth that has been adopted largely by a poorly educated African American population to legitimize a culture of self-destruction. Suburban white kids who lack stimulation from a failing school system and materialistically preoccuiped (yet underachieving) parents often turn to and embrace this culture as well - how else to explain the hip-hop culture among upper middle class whites?

I feel that punishments in America are racially biased. If the races were reversed in this case , would a white guy get 4 years for beating up a black guy?? http://www.aclu.org/DeathPenalty/DeathPenalty.cfm?ID=9312&c=62
As we have statistics on this of blacks who kill white disproportionately get the death penalty in comparison to white who kill blacks.

Where, tell me, where, is the glory in imprisonment?

Please quote where I used the word glory... I never said the word glory. You are misinterpreting my words.

Yep, no wonder. And no wonder there are more blacks in jail than college. Must be all that "street smarts".

Once again you use blanket stereotypes. Give me figures on how many blacks are enrolled in higher education and how many blacks are incarcerated. I guarantee you do NOT know any figures of this sort.

Whites do it, blacks do it, everyone does it, no kidding. Crime is mainly economic, not racial.

Then why do you keep using blanket stereotypes???

But what you seem to be missing is the guy who is going to jail for 4 years was 100% wrong here. 100%! Yet you try and use some weird Law of the Jungle reasoning to justify this crime. That sort of thinking is why too many whites think that the best form of "precrime" would be to imprison blacks at age 5.

why do you try to justify random acts of violence? because the criminal was black? Do you identify with that type of behavior? Are you swept up in a culture of "street smarts" rather than intellectual / academic achievement?

You have completely missed my point. I did not say the guy was right. I did not say he was justified for hitting him. I said that the guy could have avoided the situation by not creating a situation. if you create a situation you must reap the consequences of that situation, and yes the guys actions where totall uncalled for and stupid. He is in jail for it. He is paying a very high price for striking that young man , but I feel that he could have not gotten into the situation by keeping his mough shut and not making an issue of if it. This is where street smarts comes in. If you recognize that you are in a confined area with several people and you create an issue with one of them , the dude could have been a relative or a close friend of the woman and attacked the guy due to disrespect. You don't know who's around you and how they are related. You also don't know the mindset of the people in the room , so creating a situation with a guy who is obviously not all there may not be the smartest thing to do. This is what I mean by street smarts.

Are you afraid you will be turning your back on something if you try to embrace "whitey's world?

I have no idea what that comment is about so I don't know how to respond. You don't know mw where I work or what I do for a living. Drawing conclusions without piece of information number one is called prejudgement.

Oh, the movie was "minority report". And precrime only worked for murders.

Thanks for the movie name and yes it only work for murders but my point is still the same , a random act of violence wheather is an armed robery or a murder is still a random act of violence and there's no way of stopping it before it happens without preknowledge that it is going to happen.

 

[Lumberg]

Once again you use blanket stereotypes. Give me figures on how many blacks are enrolled in higher education and how many blacks are incarcerated. I guarantee you do NOT know any figures of this sort.

Did someone just call out MTSW...?

You also mentioned "there is no solution for random acts of violence." I'm gonna have to say this wasn't random; the white guy made some kind of snide remark and the bitch went off. Not saying it was right, but the guy didn't walk into a random pizzeria where there were no problems going on and start swinging wildly at anyone within reach.

 

[Razorguns]

Not saying it was right, but the guy didn't walk into a random pizzeria where there were no problems going on and start swinging wildly at anyone within reach.

It must be niave day on EF today.

You and I both know, that if the white guy simply said "Excuse me, but I was in front of you" -- the end result would've been the same.

I doubt mr tough guy gangsta black boy would've merely said "Oh i'm sorry sir. Latifah, let's stand over here".

And why are we assuming the white guy made some insulting snide crass remark? Where was that stated? There is more of a probability he merely said "I'm gonna be late, someone just cut in front of me" than a highly unplausible "I'm gonna be late, some fat bitch snuck in front of me" especially with her and her big black bf in ear shot of him.

I'm just gonna assume black boy's fans are just making up this fact for lack of any other defense arguments.

 

[gjohnson5]

Did someone just call out MTSW...?

You also mentioned "there is no solution for random acts of violence." I'm gonna have to say this wasn't random; the white guy made some kind of snide remark and the bitch went off. Not saying it was right, but the guy didn't walk into a random pizzeria where there were no problems going on and start swinging wildly at anyone within reach.

If you're wrong you're wrong . It makes no difference what your karmic power is or if you are a moderator or not...

Your interpretation is just as good as mine. It may have provoked. The dude may have known the woman or related to her. Maybe the guy is that quick to swing at people. From my point of view, I call it random because It was unprovoked. If the woman beat his ass , then it's provoked.

From my point of view , the location of the violence is irrevelant. Violence can happen anywhere , makes no difference if the spot if heavily frequented.

 

[Spartacus]

"I feel that punishments in America are racially biased. If the races were reversed in this case , would a white guy get 4 years for beating up a black guy?? http://www.aclu.org/DeathPenalty/De...fm?ID=9312&c=62
As we have statistics on this of blacks who kill white disproportionately get the death penalty in comparison to white who kill blacks." -gjohnson5

dude was already on probation,hence the stiffer penalty

 

[gjohnson5]

"I feel that punishments in America are racially biased. If the races were reversed in this case , would a white guy get 4 years for beating up a black guy?? http://www.aclu.org/DeathPenalty/De...fm?ID=9312&c=62
As we have statistics on this of blacks who kill white disproportionately get the death penalty in comparison to white who kill blacks." -gjohnson5

dude was already on probation,hence the stiffer penalty

Thanks, I did not know that. violating your probabion will cause you a stiffer sentance, so that is explained

 

[wtlftr]

typical of a ..never mind

 

[Spartacus]

typical of a ..never mind

no it's as matt has said
it's typical of a low socio-economic status
I live in red neck/white trash land and there are plenty of red trash boyz with the same behavior

 

[wtlftr]

that was my point...

 

[Gambino]

damn. that's why i live in the country, fuck that city nonsense

 

[Judo Tom]

here is an unedited view of the tape

http://www.big-boys.com/articles/officebrawl.html

 

[Razorguns]

i knew that RACIST ghetto trash bitch was the instigator of all that crap.

Now why did i have a realistic hunch about that???

If you ask me -- SHE should be locked up for 4 years, and all her welfare crack money taken away from her.

 

[danielson]

i hope she gets as severe a sentence....both those dont derserve their passports, maybe you should deport them to mexico and take some actual hard working people in exchange

 

[Spartacus]

here is an unedited view of the tape

http://www.big-boys.com/articles/officebrawl.html

that's quite different from the other

 

[Ish]

Did the black guy steal his cell phone too?

 

[Phaded]

what a dumb ass black bitch..

 

[Razorguns]

what a dumb ass black bitch..

Was wondering. What IS the rule with annoying ghetto trashy fat black women when they get in your face? (espeically if you shop at kmart).

Cuz you know they are very prone to getting violent (especially when they travel in packs).

I think it's a lose lose situation if you're a whitey:

1) They start punching, hitting you -- you take it and get assaulted and beat up pretty good.

2) You punch back, hit 'em -- and if you win and successfully defend yourself -- it looks like you beat up a chick. You'll have every black man in the area come to defend them and beat YOU up.

Personally -- i think i would just run. I'm sure i could outrun a lot of these fatties. If i'm in a lose-lose situation -- what's the purpose of staying?

 

[Ulcasterdropout]

I like how this thread is turning out

 

[Phaded]

Was wondering. What IS the rule with annoying ghetto trashy fat black women when they get in your face? (espeically if you shop at kmart).

Cuz you know they are very prone to getting violent (especially when they travel in packs).

I think it's a lose lose situation if you're a whitey:

1) They start punching, hitting you -- you take it and get assaulted and beat up pretty good.

2) You punch back, hit 'em -- and if you win and successfully defend yourself -- it looks like you beat up a chick. You'll have every black man in the area come to defend them and beat YOU up.

Personally -- i think i would just run. I'm sure i could outrun a lot of these fatties. If i'm in a lose-lose situation -- what's the purpose of staying?

or you can give em some crack or any type of handout because handouts is what they are known for..

 

[deltreefitness]

Loud obnoxious ghetto chicks scare me so bad. You'd be damned to ask them to keep it down.

 

[samoth]

Did the black guy steal his cell phone too?

LOL, that's what I thought, too.

Am I the only person not shocked by this video? The behavior, the actions, the consequences, how things turned out... what's new and shocking here? I can't find a single thing myself.

 

[Phaded]

LOL, that's what I thought, too.

Am I the only person not shocked by this video? The behavior, the actions, the consequences, how things turned out... what's new and shocking here? I can't find a single thing myself.

LMAO

 

[Big Rick Rock]

Check you! check You muddafukar. Check you, check you muddafuka.



-BRR

 

[wtlftr]

God dman, in the video, the big balck guy beats him and then robs him. Typical. But if he would have been shot he would have wanted to sue.

 

[Spartacus]

GUEST POST

actually, there is a housing project at the very corner/border of bensonhurst called Marlboro Houses.. it was low income, populated by pretty much all blacks.. but the Italians really locked shit down over there, literally across the street from the projects is italian restaurants and stores and it was really quiet there usually.

There were several high publicity cases in Bensonhurst/Bay Ridge where black people would get beat down and even killed by mobs of locals for random bullshit.. All neighborhoods in Brooklyn are racially divided and I'd say italians were very protective of theirs and having other people step in there, especially certain minorities..


but this was in the early/mid 90s, crime was high, italian mob was still kind of running shit but the area really changed since.. it's very diverse and cops really shut shit down now..

back then, all the cops in bensonhurst were italians too.. racist ones lol... i remember i got robbed for my bike by a couple of black kids and within seconds someone called the cops.. 2 Italian cops in plain clothes in a mitsu eclipse picked me up and drove me to the projects where they had several cop cars already with like 10 black kids with bicycles lined up against the wall.. they were like "which one is it??!!? just pick one"

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

Quote where is used the word OK. You'll find that I never used the word OK. I do not think it's OK not do I condone it, but I some thing are avoidable and some thing are unavoidable. This situation was totally avoidable if the dude didn't run his mouth.

You ever heard that one about "sticks and stones may break my bones..."?

I feel that punishments in America are racially biased. If the races were reversed in this case , would a white guy get 4 years for beating up a black guy?? http://www.aclu.org/DeathPenalty/DeathPenalty.cfm?ID=9312&c=62
As we have statistics on this of blacks who kill white disproportionately get the death penalty in comparison to white who kill blacks.

It is hard to address your "racially biased" statement. I don't have the stats off hand, however it is equally likely that a zealous prosecutor would have brought "hate crime" charges if the races were reversed, no?

As to the death penalty...Different states apply the death penalty differently. That is sort of off-topic, but if you want to read more about it, one of the best resources I have found is the Northwestern University law school web site, (there is a link to the anti-DP site, very informative).

Also, might want to do a google search on a judge named "M. Daniel Futch" - and you'll see why I think it is hard to use statistics to evaluate racial bias in the application of the death penalty.

I tend to think in general, blacks are punished more harshly, but the circumstances surrounding sentencing are so varied (statutory, plea bargaining, etc) that assembling an objective data set might be tough.

Please quote where I used the word glory... I never said the word glory. You are misinterpreting my words.

True, I put words in your mouth, sorry.

Once again you use blanket stereotypes. Give me figures on how many blacks are enrolled in higher education and how many blacks are incarcerated. I guarantee you do NOT know any figures of this sort.

If you do have relevant stats, post up, I would find it informative, last I read there were more blacks in prison, or on parole / probation than enrolled in higher education, hope I am wrong though bor.

Then why do you keep using blanket stereotypes???

To show how dumb they (stereotypes) are.

You have completely missed my point. I did not say the guy was right. I did not say he was justified for hitting him. I said that the guy could have avoided the situation by not creating a situation.

I spend a lot of time in NY city, jacksonville, and between Palm Beach and Miami, FL. In these locales I encounter some of the worst drivers you can imagine. Old people, foreigners, NYC cabbies, etc. I get really fired up behind the wheel sometimes. For a moment I want to shoot some of these SUV driving soccer mommies in Jax or 94 year olds in Fort lauderdale.

But I don't. Violence is never a valid course of action for private citizens, and only the black guy escalated this to a violent situation, after the black woman REALLY started it all.

if you create a situation you must reap the consequences of that situation, and yes the guys actions where totall uncalled for and stupid. He is in jail for it. He is paying a very high price for striking that young man , but I feel that he could have not gotten into the situation by keeping his mouth shut and not making an issue of if it.

Black guy = criminal
White guy = idiot

But there's nothing wrong / illegal about being an idiot.

As for the price the black guy is paying, yes, 4 years in prison, deserves every day of it, hopefully a civil judgment too and i would love to see him have to reimburse the state for his imprisonment.

This is where street smarts comes in. If you recognize that you are in a confined area with several people and you create an issue with one of them , the dude could have been a relative or a close friend of the woman and attacked the guy due to disrespect.

Unless someone is in imminent physical danger (self defense) there is NO grounds for attacking another person. The idea that it is OK to attack someone due to disrespect is just plain wrong.

If someone calls my sister a bitch, I can live with that. It doesn't do any god for me to get arrested after breaking some guy's jaw to prove a point. I'm no pacifist - but you don't get anywhere with violence....ever.

You don't know who's around you and how they are related. You also don't know the mindset of the people in the room , so creating a situation with a guy who is obviously not all there may not be the smartest thing to do. This is what I mean by street smarts.

This is worthless. I really can't accept even a word of an argument that places any fault with the white guy here.



Thanks for the discussion...if you want to post more or some stats I would welcome that.

 

[gjohnson5]

I just wanna respond to you Matt. I don't think anyone was "smart" in this whole thing. I think the nigga was REALLY fuckin stupid for violating his probation for nothing. The hood rat is stupid for carrying on like that over some little shit. And the white boy is stupid for not examining the situation he was getting himself into further. Obviously he didn't think what he said would be made a big deal of.

I used racial epithets for a reason. This is not a racial issue even though from the responses from this it seems like it. It only becomes racial when you apply color to the situation meaning that you allow your racial biases to the skin color of the people in the video. If the situation is deemed as stupid people getting into an argument that ended up into a violent crime, then I think that has no labels applied to it and is seen for what it really is.

I made some jokes in the beginning when I noticed the white guy get beat down and I want to apologize for that. But I would like to be the first to apologize for my insensitivity to the white guy. This is why my racial biases were applied and therefore I ignored the situation that he is now in , meaning he has some recovery to do from a vicous beating.

Anyway I got no beef with U Matt or anyone else here, it's kewl!

 

[Razorguns]

This is not a racial issue even though from the responses from this it seems like it.

The black beast made it racial the moment she opened her mouth. View the video again and hear what she was saying.

If the white boy had said what she said -- it would be all over the news as "Black man defends gf against racist white man in pizza store".

The color of your skin does not excuse your actions. Racism is racism.

 

[Lumberg]

Violence is never a valid course of action for private citizens

That's the moral of this story and something every person should life by.

 

[gjohnson5]

The black beast made it racial the moment she opened her mouth. View the video again and hear what she was saying.

If the white boy had said what she said -- it would be all over the news as "Black man defends gf against racist white man in pizza store".

The color of your skin does not excuse your actions. Racism is racism.

You are making an assumption that she attacked him because he was white...
I've had sistas attack me the same way. I kinda enjoy that
But anyway, That is not an assumption that you have information or cause to make.

Do more of you really believe that reverse racism stuff???

 

[Razorguns]

You are making an assumption that she attacked him because he was white...

You do not necessarily need to attack someone because of race for it to be a hate crime. Using racial terms and insults can elevate it to that status.

If those Rodney King cops had said "Come on you black piece of shit, get up" -- the jury outcome would've been drastically different (well, probably).

 

[manny78]

Bottom line: big black dumb fucktard is in jail for that crap. So who owned who ? lol....

 

[gjohnson5]

You do not necessarily need to attack someone because of race for it to be a hate crime. Using racial terms and insults can elevate it to that status.

If those Rodney King cops had said "Come on you black piece of shit, get up" -- the jury outcome would've been drastically different (well, probably).

You do not understand what a hate crime is , so I'll define it for you

Hate Crimes Statistics Act (1990): "crimes that manifest evidence of prejudice based on race, religion, sexual orientation, or ethnicity, including where appropriate the crimes of murder, non-negligent manslaughter, forcible rape, aggravated assault, simple assault, intimidation, arson, and destruction, damage or vandalism of property." ( Public Law 101-275)

Bureau of Justice Administration (BJA; 1997): "hate crimes--or bias-motivated crimes--are defined as offenses motivated by hatred against a victim based on his or her race, religion, sexual orientation, ethnicity, or national origin."

Anti-Defamation League (ADL): A hate crime is "any crime committed because of the victim’s actual or perceived race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, disability, gender [male or female] or sexual orientation."

National Education Association (NEA): "Hate crimes and violent acts are defined as offenses motivated by hatred against a victim based on his or her beliefs or mental or physical characteristics, including race, ethnicity, and sexual orientation."

Unless you can show that the crime was racailly motivated , you cannot call it a hate crime.

 

[bible51isonya]

Do more of you really believe that reverse racism stuff? Damn straight I believe it. I see it every day.

 

[Razorguns]

You do not understand what a hate crime is , so I'll define it for you

Hate Crimes Statistics Act (1990): "crimes that manifest evidence of prejudice based on race, religion, sexual orientation, or ethnicity, including where appropriate the crimes of murder, non-negligent manslaughter, forcible rape, aggravated assault, simple assault, intimidation, arson, and destruction, damage or vandalism of property." ( Public Law 101-275)

Bureau of Justice Administration (BJA; 1997): "hate crimes--or bias-motivated crimes--are defined as offenses motivated by hatred against a victim based on his or her race, religion, sexual orientation, ethnicity, or national origin."

Anti-Defamation League (ADL): A hate crime is "any crime committed because of the victim’s actual or perceived race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, disability, gender [male or female] or sexual orientation."

National Education Association (NEA): "Hate crimes and violent acts are defined as offenses motivated by hatred against a victim based on his or her beliefs or mental or physical characteristics, including race, ethnicity, and sexual orientation."

Unless you can show that the crime was racailly motivated , you cannot call it a hate crime.

Yep. And racist terms using during the violent encounter can indicate the person attacked the person _purely_ because of their hatred of their race.

Meaning..

if the other person was black -- chances are they wouldn't have struck them.

Therefore, with a good lawyer -- that argument can still be made.

For example: I know if i hate black people and some black person steps on my toe -- i'd probably beat the crap out of him.

If it was a white person -- i wouldn't have even cared.

It was hatred of race which was the instigating factor in me carrying out my actions which normally would not have been carried out. Fact that i used racial insults during my tirade, could be used as proof in such an argument.

It's not a cookie-cutter open-and-closed case such as a cross-burning on a lawn -- but it can still be open for debate.

Lawyers live off this shit.

 

[gjohnson5]

Yep. And racist terms using during the violent encounter can indicate the person attacked the person _purely_ because of their hatred of their race.

Meaning..

if the other person was black -- chances are they wouldn't have struck them.

Therefore, with a good lawyer -- that argument can still be made.

For example: I know if i hate black people and some black person steps on my toe -- i'd probably beat the crap out of him.

If it was a white person -- i wouldn't have even cared.

It was hatred of race which was the instigating factor in me carrying out my actions which normally would not have been carried out. Fact that i used racial insults during my tirade, could be used as proof in such an argument.

It's not a cookie-cutter open-and-closed case such as a cross-burning on a lawn -- but it can still be open for debate.

Lawyers live off this shit.

You're reaching...

 

[gjohnson5]

Do more of you really believe that reverse racism stuff? Damn straight I believe it. I see it every day.

What exactly is it that you think your seeing? Just one specific example

 

[biteme]

Good discussion. Blacks and whites still distrust each other much. Most whites feel that most blacks hate them. I wonder if if that is really true. First thing I think when a black person is rude to me is, "That racist piece of shit." When in fact, they may not be racist at all. Some people are just assholes period.

 

[biteme]

Probably most of you are offended because you think the bitch cut in line to be disrespectful to whites. That pisses me off as well. If she had cut in front of other black people, probably wouldn't anger us as much, which she may have?

 

[RaZor Ramon]

I saw almost the same thing happen in Walmart a few months ago. I dunno what happened exactly to start it. I think they were fighting over a shopping cart I'm not sure but some ghetto bitch looking like the one from this like was trying to fight this white lady who looked like she was at least 50 years old. Hell she could have been 60 but 3 security guards came in real quick and broke it up. Shit like that really pissed me off.

The ghetto thing is like this I think. With ghettofied assholes like this their lives are shit so they think they can make themselves feel big by pushing around weaker people, white people especially. If the white dude in the pizza place was over 200lbs of solid muscle I bet none of this would have even happened unless he called her a N*****.

 

[Razorguns]

If she had cut in front of other black people, probably wouldn't anger us as much, which she may have?

Cuz if it was another black person -- it's very unlikely she'd spout off "your sorry black ass".

 

[CFZB]

Dude wanted a Fuckin Slice.

 

[CFZB]

Ohio ?

arent People Supposed To Be all Kind and Helping And Shit?

See How everyone Just Watches and Looks around?

Welcome to The New America Folks.

 

[BrothaBill]

All crimes are hate crimes regardless of race. Lets not have the thought police, its a slippery slope endeavor.

 

[bible51isonya]

Every trainer in my companys diversity class for the past 6 years has either been black or hispanic. Black guys I work with use the word nigger all the time because it is part of their slang and isnt a problem. I do also and it is a problem with them. I know a few white guys who were trying to get jobs at the same co. in my dept. who were very qualified for the job get past over and some black guys hired who in no way were qualified and ended up quitting within a year. Gjohnson5 you are well spoken but do not think racism does not exist in every race of people.

 

[gjohnson5]

Every trainer in my companys diversity class for the past 6 years has either been black or hispanic. Black guys I work with use the word nigger all the time because it is part of their slang and isnt a problem. I do also and it is a problem with them. I know a few white guys who were trying to get jobs at the same co. in my dept. who were very qualified for the job get past over and some black guys hired who in no way were qualified and ended up quitting within a year. Gjohnson5 you are well spoken but do not think racism does not exist in every race of people.

Once again , these types of issue like this person got hires whereas this person did nor , means that you know the qualification of the person that did not get hired , the person that did get hired and the requirements of the job. You did not list all 3 so this is once again another generality. How many jobs have a minority person not gotten because they are minority??? Probably alot 500X then the reverse situation so I can't see your side of things.

Racism implies that something negative happened to you from a person or people WHO HAVE POWER OVER YOU such as your boss or police or govt agency. Saying "nigger" to coworkers has no negative implications because they have no POWER over you. You didn't get fired for saying "nigger" in front of them did you???

 

[gjohnson5]

Once again , these types of issue like this person got hires whereas this person did nor , means that you know the qualification of the person that did not get hired , the person that did get hired and the requirements of the job. You did not list all 3 so this is once again another generality. How many jobs have a minority person not gotten because they are minority??? Probably alot 500X then the reverse situation so I can't see your side of things.

Racism implies that something negative happened to you from a person or people WHO HAVE POWER OVER YOU such as your boss or police or govt agency. Saying "nigger" to coworkers has no negative implications because they have no POWER over you. You didn't get fired for saying "nigger" in front of them did you???

Lemme clear that up. Here's one definition of racism

Human beings are members of the same species. The term 'racism' is useful as a shorthand way of categorizing the systematic mistreatment experienced by people of color and Third world people both in the United States and in many other parts of the world. But this term should not mislead us into supposing that human beings belong to biologically different species. We all belong to one race, the human race.

You were not "mistreated" in any way by saying "nigger" to black coworkers. They might not have liked it , but there was nothing they could do about it because they had no POWER over you.

 

[Lumberg]

How many jobs have a minority person not gotten because they are minority??? Probably alot 500X then the reverse situation so I can't see your side of things.

Racism implies that something negative happened to you from a person or people WHO HAVE POWER OVER YOU such as your boss or police or govt agency. Saying "nigger" to coworkers has no negative implications because they have no POWER over you. You didn't get fired for saying "nigger" in front of them did you???

Point #1. I dont care if one trillion minorities have been passed over. Passing over qualified candidates of any race is wrong. So passing over whites in response is just as wrong. "2 wrongs don't make a right"

Point #2 Of course his coworkers have power over him. They have the power to make his life miserable. More importantly they have the power to go to HR and say so-and-so used the word nigger around me and it made me uncomfortable. They have witnesses. bye-bye

 

[Lumberg]

Lemme clear that up. Here's one definition of racism

Human beings are members of the same species. The term 'racism' is useful as a shorthand way of categorizing the systematic mistreatment experienced by people of color and Third world people both in the United States and in many other parts of the world. But this term should not mislead us into supposing that human beings belong to biologically different species. We all belong to one race, the human race.

You were not "mistreated" in any way by saying "nigger" to black coworkers. They might not have liked it , but there was nothing they could do about it because they had no POWER over you.

gj you got some wack posts going on here. That definition uses the words race and species interchangeably. They are not synonymous. A race is actually a subclassification of a species and in this case the negroid race for example is distinct from the caucasian race, even though they are the same species.

 

[Hengst]

Lemme clear that up. Here's one definition of racism

Human beings are members of the same species. The term 'racism' is useful as a shorthand way of categorizing the systematic mistreatment experienced by people of color and Third world people both in the United States and in many other parts of the world. But this term should not mislead us into supposing that human beings belong to biologically different species. We all belong to one race, the human race.

You were not "mistreated" in any way by saying "nigger" to black coworkers. They might not have liked it , but there was nothing they could do about it because they had no POWER over you.

I need to gather my thoughts before I respond to this drivel...........

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

I need to gather my thoughts before I respond to this drivel...........

I was wondering where you were on this.

 

[XBiker]

You know the truth on this one.

Had any of the white folk standing around jumped in to intervene on this large black guy beating a small white guy it would have turned in to a "Hate crime"

The black guy should be shot at close range with a large caliber firearm, preferrably in the cranial area.

 

[samoth]

We all belong to one race, the human race.

This is why I have always had conceptual problems with racism.

 

[Razorguns]

This is why I have always had conceptual problems with racism.

Tell that to Hollywood which likes to flood everything with beautiful WHITE people even though 70% of the people around it are black asian or hispanic.

 

[gjohnson5]

Point #1. I dont care if one trillion minorities have been passed over. Passing over qualified candidates of any race is wrong. So passing over whites in response is just as wrong. "2 wrongs don't make a right"

I can't believe that I'm hearing this. The only qualified applicants in your mind are white. This is totally rediculous

Point #2 Of course his coworkers have power over him. They have the power to make his life miserable. More importantly they have the power to go to HR and say so-and-so used the word nigger around me and it made me uncomfortable. They have witnesses. bye-bye

The HR department is the only organization that can "punish" him and if they were to do so without hearing both parties , then maybe I would agree. The coworkers themselves have no power.

 

[gjohnson5]

gj you got some wack posts going on here. That definition uses the words race and species interchangeably. They are not synonymous. A race is actually a subclassification of a species and in this case the negroid race for example is distinct from the caucasian race, even though they are the same species.

If you believe the human race = the species homo sapia , then yes they are interchangable. Negroid , caucasoid are races defined in anthropology. The only thing "whacked" are you interpretations

 

[gjohnson5]

I need to gather my thoughts before I respond to this drivel...........

Hopefully it does take several hours getting your thoughts together normally...

 

[Lumberg]

I can't believe that I'm hearing this. The only qualified applicants in your mind are white. This is totally rediculous

Haha good one. Go ahead, infer something from what I said that has no basis in reality. Did I mention that I that I think Adolf Hitler had a lot of charisma? Take that and run with it!

The HR department is the only organization that can "punish" him and if they were to do so without hearing both parties , then maybe I would agree. The coworkers themselves have no power.

The simple accusation can ruin careers and make life miserable. Everyone has a measure of power over everyone else.

 

[Lumberg]

If you believe the human race = the species homo sapia , then yes they are interchangable. Negroid , caucasoid are races defined in anthropology.

Wait let me guess...evolution is also a fiction? You can believe whatever you want. It's a free country. But the FACT is species != race.

And, by the way, it's homo sapiens.

 

[gjohnson5]

Haha good one. Go ahead, infer something from what I said that has no basis in reality. Did I mention that I that I think Adolf Hitler had a lot of charisma? Take that and run with it!


The simple accusation can ruin careers and make life miserable. Everyone has a measure of power over everyone else.

You did say this right???

So passing over whites in response is just as wrong. "2 wrongs don't make a right"

So more or less you have a blind eye at the original problem but yet passing over the white candidates , qualified or not , is wrong. This is how I read your post. After rereading it I see that you recognize the original problem and admit that it's wrong. I take my statement back. Nowhere did I say that whites should be denied jobs because of past racism. To be honest I am not a supporter of Affirmative Action.

 

[gjohnson5]

Wait let me guess...evolution is also a fiction? You can believe whatever you want. It's a free country. But the FACT is species != race.

And, by the way, it's homo sapiens.

Well tell me where your facts come from and we'll debate it.
The singular is homo sapein , so I did misspell the species

 

[Lumberg]

Well tell me where your facts come from and we'll debate it.
The singular is homo sapein , so I did misspell the species

I refer you to Merriam Webster:

Main Entry: 3race
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle French, generation, from Old Italian razza
1 : a breeding stock of animals
2 a : a family, tribe, people, or nation belonging to the same stock b : a class or kind of people unified by community of interests, habits, or characteristics <the English race>
3 a : an actually or potentially interbreeding group within a species; also : a taxonomic category (as a subspecies) representing such a group b : BREED c : a division of mankind possessing traits that are transmissible by descent and sufficient to characterize it as a distinct human type
4 obsolete : inherited temperament or disposition
5 : distinctive flavor, taste, or strength


Pay special attention to #3, please. Note the phrase "within a species" and the word "subspecies."

species != race. species > race.

 

[bible51isonya]

GJ I did not say there were no qualified black applicants. I said the ones hired were unqualified over a few guys who were doing the same job for another co. . You stated I did not know their qualifications. You seem to be very sure of yourself and what I did or in this case did not know. You do not have to have power over someone to be a racist. Liberal ideaology wants me as a white male to feel I owe something to blacks for the sins of slavery. Slaves have existed since the beginning of time and cover all races and colors. Me calling my boys niggah is no different than a black person doing the same. 12 Percent of the population where I live is black and hold 20 Percent of the jobs at my company. It is a good paying public job trying to promote cultural diversity. All things being even blacks should hold about 12 percent of the jobs. If the company was 80% above census #s for white employees I belive there would be a problem. You can believe there is no such thing as reverse racism if you choose. As I stated before I see it every day. Peace I'm out.

 

[gjohnson5]

I refer you to Merriam Webster:

Main Entry: 3race
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle French, generation, from Old Italian razza
1 : a breeding stock of animals
2 a : a family, tribe, people, or nation belonging to the same stock b : a class or kind of people unified by community of interests, habits, or characteristics <the English race>
3 a : an actually or potentially interbreeding group within a species; also : a taxonomic category (as a subspecies) representing such a group b : BREED c : a division of mankind possessing traits that are transmissible by descent and sufficient to characterize it as a distinct human type
4 obsolete : inherited temperament or disposition
5 : distinctive flavor, taste, or strength


Pay special attention to #3, please. Note the phrase "within a species" and the word "subspecies."

species != race. species > race.

Could you refer to something scientific or educational based. A dictionary is no place to look up scientific evidence

Excerpt of cultural anthropology

What is race?
The textbook distinguishes between two kinds of race: biological and social. A biological race is a geographically isolated subsdivision of a species that will eventually evolve into a new species if it remains isolated long enough. Some biologists use the term race to refer to breeds of domesticated species like dogs, cattle, corn, wheat, etc. In this sense, a single species will consist of a series of different breeds that have been carefully selected, bred, and maintained by humans for generations. Human populations have not been isolated long enough to develop races, nor have we ever experienced the controlled breeding like that which has created the various dogs, horses, corn, etc. As a result, human physical and genetic variation is not distributed into discrete populations marked by abrupt shifts in gene frequencies. Rather, human physical and genetic variation is distributed along gradual shifts or clines. This means that there are no human races. A social race is a group that is assumed to have a biological basis but is actually defined in a culturally arbitrary manner. This means that each culture has its own concepts of what race is as demonstrated in the textbook's discussion of race in the U.S., Japan, and Brazil.

...

Are all systems of human racial classification around the world the same?
No, because human racial classification is a cultural construction; there is no universal system of classifying race. Rather, each culture has its own way of determining race. Some systems are very similar, like the racial classification systems used in the U.S. and Japan, while others are different, like the one used in Brazil. For example, concepts of race in the U.S. and Japan are very rigid and fixed from birth. In contrast, race in Brazil is fluid and flexible. Race in Brazil is determined in part by an individual's parents, in part by an individual's phenotype, and in part by an individual's socioeconomic status. As result, a person's race in Brazil can change as they become wealthier or poorer. In the U.S. or Japan, a person's socioeconomic status does not affect their race.

Face it , you are WRONG

 

[CFZB]

Ok Lets Race.....GO!

 

[gjohnson5]

GJ I did not say there were no qualified black applicants. I said the ones hired were unqualified over a few guys who were doing the same job for another co. . You stated I did not know their qualifications. You seem to be very sure of yourself and what I did or in this case did not know. You do not have to have power over someone to be a racist. Liberal ideaology wants me as a white male to feel I owe something to blacks for the sins of slavery.

I deleted the part below as I didn't want to read and completely disagree with your version of Liberal politics...

Anyway , I asked for specific examples. Since you gave no specific information this implies to me that you either do not know it or it contradicts your point. The idea was to give specific examples so they could be analyzed by the people reading here.

I defind the word racism earlier. There has to be a mistreatment or a punishment or a consequence by people who did the mistreatment because of you skin color.. Yes a person can make a statement that another person can interpret as racist, but there is no punishment. There were plenty of racist remarks in this thread but as one person said , "sticks and stones"

I got arrested because I'm ...
I got fired becuase I'm...
I had to drink out this water fountain because I'm...
I had to move onto the back of the bus because I'm...
U couldn't vote because I'm...
I'm incarcerated in this concentration camp because I'm...

A statement can only be interpreted as racist if the people listening see it that way. There were plenty of racist statements made about the incident in the video , but that is my interpretation.

In general with this thread I've been very disappointed. People have been using terms like "racism" and "hate crime" and they don't even know what they mean and cannot accuratly apply the terms into a sentance. This seems to indicate that these haven't been experienced. It's like sex to a virgin. if you've never had sex , you can't talk about experiences with another partner, or describe what that's like in a sentance. This has really be my viewpoint all throughout grade school and listening to the people here only confirms my belief that most of you have never experienced real racism.

 

[Hengst]

If race is only a social construct and a tool invented by the White man to keep the black man down, then......

1. How is it possible for forensic scientists to determine the race of a totally desicated skelton?
2. Why do we have affirmative action?
3. How come race-specific clubs can be established except for whites? (e.g. Black Student Union but no European-American Student Union)

 

[Hengst]

What Is Racism?
The 'racist' double standard: how Whites are made to feel guilty and "hateful" for loving their own people and culture.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

by Thomas Jackson
There is surely no nation in the world that holds "racism" in greater horror than does the United States. Compared to other kinds of offenses, it is thought to be somehow more reprehensible. The press and public have become so used to tales of murder, rape, robbery, and arson, that any but the most spectacular crimes are shrugged off as part of the inevitable texture of American life. "Racism" is never shrugged off. For example, when a White Georgetown Law School student reported earlier this year that black students are not as qualified as White students, it set off a booming, national controversy about "racism." If the student had merely murdered someone he would have attracted far less attention and criticism.

Racism is, indeed, the national obsession. Universities are on full alert for it, newspapers and politicians denounce it, churches preach against it, America is said to be racked with it, but just what is racism?

Dictionaries are not much help in understanding what is meant by the word. They usually define it as the belief that one's own ethnic stock is superior to others, or as the belief that culture and behavior are rooted in race. When Americans speak of racism they mean a great deal more than this. Nevertheless, the dictionary definition of racism is a clue to understanding what Americans do mean. A peculiarly American meaning derives from the current dogma that all ethnic stocks are equal. Despite clear evidence to the contrary, all races have been declared to be equally talented and hard- working, and anyone who questions the dogma is thought to be not merely wrong but evil.

The dogma has logical consequences that are profoundly important. If blacks, for example, are equal to Whites in every way, what accounts for their poverty, criminality, and dissipation? Since any theory of racial differences has been outlawed, the only possible explanation for black failure is White racism. And since blacks are markedly poor, crime-prone, and dissipated, America must be racked with pervasive racism. Nothing else could be keeping them in such an abject state.

All public discourse on race today is locked into this rigid logic. Any explanation for black failure that does not depend on White wickedness threatens to veer off into the forbidden territory of racial differences. Thus, even if today's Whites can find in their hearts no desire to oppress blacks, yesterday's Whites must have oppressed them. If Whites do not consciously oppress blacks, they must oppress them Unconsciously. If no obviously racist individuals can be identified, then societal institutions must be racist. Or, since blacks are failing so terribly in America, there simply must be millions of White people we do not know about, who are working day and night to keep blacks in misery. The dogma of racial equality leaves no room for an explanation of black failure that is not, in some fashion, an indictment of White people.

The logical consequences of this are clear. Since we are required to believe that the only explanation for non-White failure is White racism, every time a non-White is poor, commits a crime, goes on welfare, or takes drugs, White society stands accused of yet another act of racism. All failure or misbehavior by non-Whites is standing proof that White society is riddled with hatred and bigotry. For precisely so long as non-Whites fail to succeed in life at exactly the same level as Whites, Whites will be, by definition, thwarting and oppressing them. This obligatory pattern of thinking leads to strange conclusions. First of all, racism is a sin that is thought to be committed almost exclusively by White people. Indeed, a black congressman from Chicago, Gus Savage, and Coleman Young, the black mayor of Detroit, have argued that only White people can be racist. Likewise, in 1987, the affirmative action officer of the State Insurance Fund of New York issued a company pamphlet in which she explained that all Whites are racist and that only Whites can be racist. How else could the plight of blacks be explained without flirting with the possibility of racial inequality?

Although some blacks and liberal Whites concede that non-Whites can, perhaps, be racist, they invariably add that non-Whites have been forced into it as self-defense because of centuries of White oppression. What appears to be non-White racism is so understandable and forgivable that it hardly deserves the name. Thus, whether or not an act is called racism depends on the race of the racist. What would surely be called racism when done by Whites is thought to be normal when done by anyone else. The reverse is also true.

Examples of this sort of double standard are so common, it is almost tedious to list them: When a White man kills a black man and uses the word "nigger" while doing so, there is an enormous media uproar and the nation beats its collective breast; when members of the black Yahweh cult carry out ritual murders of random Whites, the media are silent (see AR of March, 1991). College campuses forbid pejorative statements about non-Whites as "racist," but ignore scurrilous attacks on Whites.

At election time, if 60 percent of the White voters vote for a White candidate, and 95 percent of the black voters vote for the black opponent, it is Whites who are accused of racial bias. There are 107 "historically black" colleges, whose fundamental blackness must be preserved in the name of diversity, but all historically White colleges must be forcibly integrated in the name of... the same thing. To resist would be racist.

"Black pride" is said to be a wonderful and worthy thing, but anything that could be construed as an expression of White pride is a form of hatred. It is perfectly natural for third-world immigrants to expect school instruction and driver's tests in their own languages, whereas for native Americans to ask them to learn English is racist.

Blatant anti-White prejudice, in the form of affirmative action, is now the law of the land. Anything remotely like affirmative action, if practiced in favor of Whites, would be attacked as despicable favoritism.

All across the country, black, Hispanic, and Asian clubs and caucuses are thought to be fine expressions of ethnic solidarity, but any club or association expressly for Whites is by definition racist. The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP) campaigns openly for black advantage but is a respected "civil rights" organization. The National Association for the Advancement of White People (NAAWP) campaigns merely for equal treatment of all races, but is said to be viciously racist.

At a few college campuses, students opposed to affirmative action have set up student unions for Whites, analogous to those for blacks, Hispanics, etc, and have been roundly condemned as racists. Recently, when the White students at Lowell High School in San Francisco found themselves to be a minority, they asked for a racially exclusive club like the ones that non-Whites have. They were turned down in horror. Indeed, in America today, any club not specifically formed to be a White enclave but whose members simply happen all to be White is branded as racist.

Today, one of the favorite slogans that define the asymmetric quality of American racism is "celebration of diversity." It has begun to dawn on a few people that "diversity" is always achieved at the expense of Whites (and sometimes men), and never the other way around. No one proposes that Howard University be made more diverse by admitting Whites, Hispanics, or Asians. No one ever suggests that National Hispanic University in San Jose (CA) would benefit from the diversity of having non-Hispanics on campus. No one suggests that the Black Congressional Caucus or the executive ranks of the NAACP or the Mexican-American Legal Defense and Educational Fund suffer from a lack of diversity. Somehow, it is perfectly legitimate for them to celebrate homogeneity. And yet any all-White group - a company, a town, a school, a club, a neighborhood - is thought to suffer from a crippling lack of diversity that must be remedied as quickly as possible. Only when Whites have been reduced to a minority has "diversity" been achieved.

Let us put it bluntly: To "celebrate" or "embrace" diversity, as we are so often asked to do, is no different from deploring an excess of Whites. In fact, the entire nation is thought to suffer from an excess of Whites. Our current immigration policies are structured so that approximately 90 percent of our annual 800,000 legal immigrants are non-White. The several million illegal immigrants that enter the country every year are virtually all non-White. It would be racist not to be grateful for this laudable contribution to "diversity." It is, of course, only White nations that are called upon to practice this kind of "diversity." It is almost criminal to imagine a nation of any other race countenancing blatant dispossession of this kind.

What if the United States were pouring its poorest, least educated citizens across the border into Mexico? Could anyone be fooled into thinking that Mexico was being "culturally enriched?" What if the state of Chihuahua were losing its majority population to poor Whites who demanded that schools be taught in English, who insisted on celebrating the Fourth of July, who demanded the right to vote even if they weren't citizens, who clamored for "affirmative action" in jobs and schooling?

Would Mexico - or any other non-White nation - tolerate this kind of cultural and demographic depredation? Of course not. Yet White Americans are supposed to look upon the flood of Hispanics and Asians entering their country as a priceless cultural gift. They are supposed to "celebrate" their own loss of influence, their own dwindling numbers, their own dispossession, for to do otherwise would be hopelessly racist.

There is another curious asymmetry about American racism. When non- Whites advance their own racial purposes, no one ever accuses them of "hating" another group. Blacks can join "civil rights" groups and Hispanics can be activists without fear of being branded as bigots and hate mongers. They can agitate openly for racial preferences that can come only at the expense of whites. They can demand preferential treatment of all kinds without anyone ever suggesting that they are "anti-white."

Whites, on the other hand, need only express their opposition to affirmative action to be called haters. They need only subject racial policies that are clearly prejudicial to themselves to be called racists. Should they actually go so far as to say that they prefer the company of their own kind, that they wish to be left alone to enjoy the fruits of their European heritage, they are irredeemably wicked and hateful.

Here, then is the final, baffling inconsistency about American race relations. All non-whites are allowed to prefer the company of their own kind, to think of themselves as groups with interests distinct from those of the whole, and to work openly for group advantage. None of this is thought to be racist. At the same time, whites must also champion the racial interests of non-whites. They must sacrifice their own future on the altar of "diversity" and cooperate in their own dispossession. They are to encourage, even to subsidize, the displacement of a European people and culture by alien peoples and cultures. To put it in the simplest possible terms, White people are cheerfully to slaughter their own society, to commit racial and cultural suicide. To refuse to do so would be racism.

Of course, the entire non-white enterprise in the United States is perfectly natural and healthy. Nothing could be more natural than to love one's people and to hope that it should flourish. Filipinos and El Salvadorans are doubtless astonished to discover that simply by setting foot in the United States they are entitled to affirmative action preferences over native-born whites, but can they be blamed for accepting them? Is it surprising that they should want their languages, their cultures, their brothers and sisters to take possession and put their mark indelibly on the land? If the once-great people of a once-great nation is bent upon self-destruction and is prepared to hand over land and power to whomever shows up and asks for it, why should Mexicans and Cambodians complain?

No, it is the White enterprise in the United States that is unnatural, unhealthy, and without historical precedent. Whites have let themselves be convinced that it is racist merely to object to dispossession, much less to work for their own interests. Never in the history of the world has a dominant people thrown open the gates to strangers, and poured out its wealth to aliens. Never before has a people been fooled into thinking that there was virtue or nobility in surrendering its heritage, and giving away to others its place in history. Of all the races in America, only whites have been tricked into thinking that a preference for one's own kind is racism. Only whites are ever told that a love for their own people is somehow "hatred" of others. All healthy people prefer the company of their own kind, and it has nothing to do with hatred. All men love their families more than their neighbors, but this does not mean that they hate their neighbors. Whites who love their racial family need bear no ill will towards non-whites. They only wish to be left alone to participate in the unfolding of their racial and cultural destinies.

What whites in America are being asked to do is therefore utterly unnatural. They are being asked to devote themselves to the interests of other races and to ignore the interests of their own. This is like asking a man to forsake his own children and love the children of his neighbors, since to do otherwise would be "racist."

What then, is "racism?" It is considerably more than any dictionary is likely to say. It is any opposition by whites to official policies of racial preference for non-whites. It is any preference by whites for their own people and culture. It is any resistance by whites to the idea of becoming a minority people. It is any unwillingness to be pushed aside. It is, in short, any of the normal aspirations of people-hood that have defined nations since the beginning of history - but only so long as the aspirations are those of whites.


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"What Is Racism?" was originally published in American Renaissance, Vol 2, No. 8., P.O. Box 527, Oakton, VA 22124 Sample issue $2.

 

[Hengst]

Black History Month's Lessons Lost on Some Whites

A Black columnist is enraged that Whites refuse to recognize how evil they are.

http://www.suntimes.com/output/mitchell/cst-nws-mitch27.html
quote:
"Why we won't just move on

If I thought that the majority of white people in America were huddled in front of the TV sets during Black History Month, horrified by this chapter of American history and vowing a change, I'd say it was worth it.

But the majority of white people in this country don't understand why black people won't move on. They simply don't get it. "

You know what I say????
It's a white thing.

 

[Lumberg]

Could you refer to something scientific or educational based. A dictionary is no place to look up scientific evidence

God forbid we use a DICTIONARY to look up a concise definition of a WORD.

I'm done with you jackass.