Mr. X - Letro question...

[jacshelb]

Oh, since it kinda got lost in the shuffle. I have a question for myself. I saw where you, Mr. X, said that taking nolva immediately after or during a cycle containing tren would upregulate the receptors and help cause gyno. Well, that is what I did, and get gyno I certainly did. I just want to know how long to wait after last shot of tren (8 weeks of tren/prop at 60/60mg. eod) where it will be safe to take the nolva again? I've been off for two weeks+ now and I was taking the nolva and wondering why the heck things were getting worse. I just plain didn't know about this.


Jacob

 

[Mr.X]

Oh, since it kinda got lost in the shuffle. I have a question for myself. I saw where you, Mr. X, said that taking nolva immediately after or during a cycle containing tren would upregulate the receptors and help cause gyno. Well, that is what I did, and get gyno I certainly did. I just want to know how long to wait after last shot of tren (8 weeks of tren/prop at 60/60mg. eod) where it will be safe to take the nolva again? I've been off for two weeks+ now and I was taking the nolva and wondering why the heck things were getting worse. I just plain didn't know about this.
Jacob

Tren acetate half life is 3 days, so I wouldn't take nolva for at least 7-10 days just to be safe. IMO, you don't need nolva. What do you need it for? If you want a gyno cure, go with letrozole

 

[jacshelb]

Thanks, that's what I'm doing now. I believe I read somewhere that Nolva can actually have estrogenic effects. Perhaps, though probably rare, this might be the reason it came on so suddenly- in addition to upregulating the receptors. i.e. The nolva mimicked the estrogen and the prolactin (? or is it progesterone- I'm really showing my ignorance here) really started to have its effect. Either way, no nolva for me for now. Just letro!

Much appreciated,

Jacob

 

[Mr.X]

Thanks, that's what I'm doing now. I believe I read somewhere that Nolva can actually have estrogenic effects. Perhaps, though probably rare, this might be the reason it came on so suddenly- in addition to upregulating the receptors. i.e. The nolva mimicked the estrogen and the prolactin (? or is it progesterone- I'm really showing my ignorance here) really started to have its effect. Either way, no nolva for me for now. Just letro!

Much appreciated,

Jacob

here
http://www.meso-rx.com/steroid-profiles/nolvadex.htm

 

[jacshelb]

Thanks again, I do understand that much about Nolva. And, I do believe that it reduces Igf-1, BUT I don't think it would cause any negative effect to a person on a cycle. It is said to reduce igf-1 by something like 24% which really is a small factor, imo, when the anabolics properties of test, tren or whatever are thrown into the mix. But, post cycle, that's one more reason to like letrozole as it is said to raise igf-1 by 24% or so- which could possibly come in handy when test and estrogen levels are basically knocked out and you are trying to hang onto gains.

I made some injectable formestane from powder- formed more of a gel. I know, stupid to inject such a mixture, but it is in a sterile solution and I have not had any problems using it many many times, so... Anyway, I'm taking two shots of this per week right now as I can't stand the low libido etc. As I understand it, formestane has a similar action as exemestane- which includes raising igf-1 levels 26%.

Anyway, I like to experiment and things seem to be getting on track now. I will probably phase out the formestane slowly over the next couple weeks. Thanks again for th advice on the letro, I believe it will be a huge improvement over what I was doing.


Jacob

 

[Mr.X]

Thanks again, I do understand that much about Nolva. And, I do believe that it reduces Igf-1,

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=6177278

 

[jacshelb]

Let me clarify something: I know that in the above post Mr. X wasn't proabably trying to say anything about igf-1, that was just something that caught my eye in the link and had been on my mind.


Jacob

Edit: Mr.X, you got to that while I was posting this! I really could go either way on the igf-1 thing. I'm not for certain that Nolva lowers it, but I wasn't basing that on Duchaine's findings, but on something I read by Author L. Rhea. Doesn't make much of a difference to me if it does a little or not. I'm sure it wouldn't make a big difference even if it did lower igf a little. Thank you for the info all the same, though.

 

[Mr.X]

Edit: Mr.X, you got to that while I was posting this! I really could go either way on the igf-1 thing. I'm not for certain that Nolva lowers it, but I wasn't basing that on Duchaine's findings, but on something I read by Author L. Rhea. Doesn't make much of a difference to me if it does a little or not. I'm sure it wouldn't make a big difference even if it did lower igf a little. Thank you for the info all the same, though.

L. Rhea parroted Dan Duchaine for the most part....

 

[Mr.X]

btw...jacshelb you have that profile by L. Rhea.?

 

[jacshelb]

Mr. X, sorry, I missed this. What I have from Author L. Rea is just an article in MD. I can't even remember if he backed up what he had to say. But, basically he was comparing the different anti-estrogens. He favored formestane, which I actually find useful (injectible form) during pct to get the boys working again- nothing to back this up, and even he doesn't go that far, that's just my experience. If you like I could try to scan the article sometime and email it or something.

Mostly, I just wanted to thank you again (and macro) for what you had to say about nolva and tren. The nolva apparently has cleared my system and I have been taking letro for 3 weeks now. My gyno, which had ballooned to the size of a stack of pennies 4 or 5 high is now 1/3 that size and seems to be decreasing every day! Now, to those reading, it is important to note that I had just removed the offending chemicals and was "striking while the iron was hot" by getting to this right away. Still, I am very very grateful for your help. And, I hope that the gyno completely dissapears.

The ironic thing is that I got this gyno from a cutting/ pre-contest cycle and really don't have any gains to show for at this point as I was dieting the whole time! Sucks to come out behind after a cycle. My sex drive is finally coming back online and my energy is getting better and I'm still on the 1.25 mg letro every day. So, I'm not doing too bad. In fact, not too much in the achy joint department either, just a tiny bit. Anyway, thanks again.

Jacob