disadvantages of juicing too early

[rickcorso]

well lets say that diet/training is all good. Now, my question is, how exactly does someone benefit by waiting and growing naturally as opposed to juicing early. It seems that most people are implying that steroid induced gains are harder to retain than natural gains even with proper diet. Does it take more work to support 20lbs of steroid muscle than it does to support 20lbs of natural muscle?

 

[Dr.M]

I think most people are talking out of thier ass, I'm not a doctor but that is my belief, that FAR TOO MANY PEOPLE on and off roids don't eat right and believe either that they are, or that somehow they are different.

Diet IMO is the toughest thing to stick too and get down right in the first place, for most people. You workout for mabye an hour a day, but you eat 6 or more times a day, every day, good food not shit. I like to have one day of the week where I can have ice cream, or whatever, or if your on a bulk and don't care you could make one meal of the day have some extra whatever that you like, so long as your getting your protein which is neccessary for sustained and/or growth of muscle.

 

[Dr.M]

When you come off roids, your coming from an environment with higher than normal hormone levels making you more of a man than you were before (to simplify things), when you come off you not only have to recoupe your natural levels, but your own full levels are not what your steroidal levels were either.

So when you come off its natural to lose some, if you do things right you will only lose a small percentage of what you gained, minus waterweight of course. You need to eat right, have a good cycle and good post cycle, screw one or more of those up and you have dismal results.

 

[rickcorso]

I understand what everyone is saying. However, the more I reserach, the more I feel that I would be doing myself a favor by juicing now. Like I said before, Im 19 years old and far from my genetic potential. Im 180lbs, 5'11" and maybe about 15%BF. Arms measure about 15.5". I bench about 220. Squat near 300. Ive been training very seriously for about a year and have my diet down completely. I consume around 4000 cals a day, 300grams of protein spread over 6 meals. Now, I really dont see any problem with me starting my cycle now as opposed to 2 years from now. Sure Ill have gained more muscle naturally by then...but how does that help me? I mean, wouldnt the juice have brought me there sooner? Its not like my roided gains are gonna be any different than natural gains are they? Will the roid gains require even more work to support than the equivalant natural gains?

 

[The Terminator]

Sure Ill have gained more muscle naturally by then...but how does that help me? I mean, wouldnt the juice have brought me there sooner? Its not like my roided gains are gonna be any different than natural gains are they?

You point is well understood here, its the discipline that most guys don't understand/have. The gear will get you there much faster but are you disciplined enough to keep those gains? It can be very consuming trying to gain and then keep that extra 20 lbs. of muscle around, you have to give up alot for this. Are you really willing to make it the forefront of your life for 10 weeks? Only you can answer that.

 

[rickcorso]

I understand the great effort it takes to keep gains...but one thing I dont understand is...why would it be easier to keep the same gains if they were natural? Lets just say, you suddenly gained 30lbs of muscle naturally. Now, wouldnt these gains be just as hard to keep?

 

[The Terminator]

I understand the great effort it takes to keep gains...but one thing I dont understand is...why would it be easier to keep the same gains if they were natural? Lets just say, you suddenly gained 30lbs of muscle naturally. Now, wouldnt these gains be just as hard to keep?

I would think so, but gaining 30 lbs. naturally takes alot of discipline, gaining 30 lbs on juice while below what you could gain natty is not too difficult (its commonly done on first cycles). I would think they would both be just as hard to keep, the difference is one way takes you 10 weeks to get, the other takes 2-3 years. Alot is learned in those years. But I think muscle is muscle, however you obtained it.

 

[rickcorso]

Ok, I think youve answered my question. Basically what I got out of this discussion was:

By training naturally, you gradually build up your diet/training to where it should have been, had you juiced earlier.

So in my case, I feel like my diet is sound and matches most hardcore bber diets. THerefore, do you suggest I start my cycle early even though Im not at my potential?

(btw, my diet has actually allowed me to gain 20lbs of muscle naturally in 3 months)

 

[gainerxxl]

You sound like you already made up your mind. So go ahead and juice, you´ll do it anyways. If I were you, I´d stick to non test cycles (Primobolan or Ox, maybe winny only).
I ran my first cycle when I was 21, it was Primo/d-bol. Post cycle, I couldn´t get it up for over a month (I did use clomid), my girlfriend was seriously pissed, I had no energy and felt a little depressed. I retained most of my gains, but didn´t improve my physique for half a year and working out seemed pointless.
Go ahead, but avoid strong androgens, you don´t know what your dealing with.

 

[rickcorso]

well I am going to juice eventually. Im just not sure whether itll be now or later. I was planning on doing a test/eq/dbol cycle w/ arimidex ED and clomid for post cycle.