Dermacrine !??

[macrophage69alpha]

Ulter,

For the record: We had several [private] testers perform blood and saliva testing during product development. This allowed us to tweak the formula before releasing it to the public. Analyzing anecdotal reports of “nipple sensitivity” is not what we call “data collection.”

Based on your reply, you have not performed blood or saliva tests on individuals. That is negligent at best.

AIFM was tested prior to above mentioned 50 member board release testing. All testers had blood work done, though all testers were also on cycle. Since the "test" of an AI is its performance on cycle. AI's are typically reccomended as an adjunct to SERM based PCT.

I have no doubt AIFM is “strong shit” and I’m sure plenty of bros here stand behind it. I simply doubt that it is the ideal product to use for PCT.

AIFM is potent, though its dosing is quite adjustable. AI's alone of any kind are not "ideal" for PCT. Though with your doubts, you have presented no evidence that any of the ingredients you champion increase Lh or LhRh or have SERM like activity. AIFM is generally not reccomended for PCT alone. Like most reccomendations, from the people who have actual knowledge of steroids and PCT, the use of SERMs is almost always indicated.

If you have any pertinent argument here please post it. Otherwise, no more desperate counterfactual statements. M’kay?

-Pp

you are the one that brought up libido, fertility, joint pain etc. Ulter merely posted user feedback countering those claims.

 

[Ulter]

I posted, as Macrophage did, evidence in the form of user data and clinical research showing your posts, theories, and understanding of these drugs on the endocrine system is sorely lacking. M'kay?
You have posted nothing to support your claims and what you did post was totally irrelevant. You're ignoring all the evidence and then laughingly calling me desperate. You're getting your ass kicked here.

Recap:
We don't recommend AIFM as a total solution for PCT. When I joined this thread I suggested your product is being sold for PCT and AIFM is mainly sold as an AI. You came on telling me that AI's will not increase test, LH, FSH for PCT making our product a poor choice. I posted the studies showing you're wrong. AI's are an excellent choice as a component of PCT. Have been for many years. Then you posted that people doing test cycles don't need to control estrogen. I won't even get back to that it's so silly.
We are all still waiting for your clinical research showing your ingredients are the best solution, or even any hint of a solution, to someone's PCT needs.

M'kay

 

[Primordial Performance]

AIFM is potent, though its dosing is quite adjustable. AI's alone of any kind are not "ideal" for PCT. Though with your doubts, you have presented no evidence that any of the ingredients you champion increase Lh or LhRh or have SERM like activity. AIFM is generally not reccomended for PCT alone. Like most reccomendations, from the people who have actual knowledge of steroids and PCT, the use of SERMs is almost always indicated..

I guess we are back to square one then.

Ive explained my view on SERMs here >

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?t=531614

I certainly hope Dermacrine does not posses any of the SERM characterizes …yikes.

BTW, I suggest you take a moment to visit our well referenced website. You will see there are multiple mechanisms in which Dermacrine can increase LH & FSH as well as enhance activity of the steroidogenic enzymes.

www.dermacrine.com

-Pp

 

[njmuscleguy]

AIFM makes you GAY??? Is THAT why I've been looking at all these Brad Pitt pics lately???


All kidding aside, why are these two products (and their makers) clashing like this? AIFM is an AI and Dermacrine is a "testosterone booster", essentially two different products. Or am I misunderstanding here?

 

[D_Mac]

I love forum fights, better than reality TV IMO.

Sounds to me like AIFM has a very strong AI mechanism ideal for during cycle use, where Derma has a more mild mechanism better for stand alone PCT or as a stand alone supplement separate from riod cycles. Maybe you could cycle derma and roids back to back over and over. Hell you could take AIFM and Roids for 4 weeks then Derma for 4 weeks and repeat...............
............................................................................................................................................................................................FOREVER!!!

D_Mac

 

[Primordial Performance]

I posted, as Macrophage did, evidence in the form of user data and clinical research showing your posts, theories, and understanding of these drugs on the endocrine system is sorely lacking. M'kay?
You have posted nothing to support your claims and what you did post was totally irrelevant. You're ignoring all the evidence and then laughingly calling me desperate. You're getting your ass kicked here.

Recap:
We don't recommend AIFM as a total solution for PCT. When I joined this thread I suggested your product is being sold for PCT and AIFM is mainly sold as an AI. You came on telling me that AI's will not increase test, LH, FSH for PCT making our product a poor choice. I posted the studies showing you're wrong. AI's are an excellent choice as a component of PCT. Have been for many years. Then you posted that people doing test cycles don't need to control estrogen. I won't even get back to that it's so silly.
We are all still waiting for your clinical research showing your ingredients are the best solution, or even any hint of a solution, to someone's PCT needs.

Ulter,

Your twisting of my views and juvenile tactics truly shows your desperation to discredit our product. God forbid you jump on our thread when we release our topical fat burner.

I never said “AI’s” would decrease test, ect, ect. I simply explained the differences in the action of the “AI's” and that unless your estrogens are through the roof, Dermacrine contains the superior AI’s for PCT.

Let me ask-

Whos product do you believe better for PCT?

-Pp

 

[needtogetaas]

Normally I'd just post a couple but I was trying to make the point. It's ridiculous at this point for ANYONE (anthony) to make a claim that AIFM isn't a great product, or doesn't work. Next week they'll be trying to disprove gravity.

so
Primordial Performance= anthony

or has anthony made post of his own that I have missed.

 

[Big Rick Rock]

This is a good debate by knowledgeable people. I like the science and arguments being put forth. Very informative and a great way to add content to the forum.

I'm a bit disappointed at some of the insults though. There is no need for any of that. It takes away from the thread.




-BRR

 

[needtogetaas]

This is a good debate by knowledgeable people. I like the science and arguments being put forth. Very informative and a great way to add content to the forum.

I'm a bit disappointed at some of the insults though. There is no need for any of that. It takes away from the thread.




-BRR

good post.I like it to.

 

[Ulter]

I never said “AI’s” would decrease test, ect, ect.

Posted by Primordial Performance:
Since ATD resembles testosterone’s structure, it competes for the aromatase enzyme, only it cannot be converted to estrogen like testosterone can. However, all steroidal based inhibitors tend to mimic the action of there parent compound, which means they can inhibit steroidogenesis from the hypothalamus and testis by directly interacting with the androgen receptor (AR) and lowering LH & FSH release.

Your twisting of my views and juvenile tactics truly shows your desperation to discredit our product

Your juvenile tactics of denying what you've posted shows your desperation in the face of hard evidence.


Bro I don't care if make every product in our store and try to sell it. When we introduced Glucorell there were 50+ competitors within a year. There are 3 left. Knock yourself out. You're already in way over your head making a product that has so many flaws we aren't even going to list them all. We'll just let the marketplace decide.


Do you know I was one of the original authors of modern day PCT 5 years ago? Do you know I've been doing this for over 20 years?
As far as which product is better for PCT...

Neither product is any more than a component of PCT. There may be some value to your product. We examined the clinical research on your ingredients in 2003 and found it lacking. This is why we asked you to post it. There simply isn't any and we know that already. But just because no one has laid out the cash for clinical research doesn't mean a product is no good or doesn't do what it says. So until I see a couple hundred men posting it's the end all to PCT, I'll reserve judgment.