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Can I Say Something? Again?

Nelson Montana

Nelson Montana

Chairman of Board
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I've been saying this for years and I know I'll be saying it for years to come. But maybe A gentle reminder every now and then will help.

Fast acting ester DO NOT grow muscle faster than long acting esters.

That's like saying that eating faster will make you run faster.

It just doesn't work that way.
 
O I don't know I think some some of my products like beastdrol or deiselbolan can pack on 20lb of muscle long before any amount of primo/deca could. I may have to disagree with you on this one bro. I have seen hundreds if not thousands of people use some of my products and or other orals and add upwards of 20lb or more in 4 weeks time.

Not once have I ever seen anyone add that much in that little time using primo or deca or even test-e for that matter. Maybe a few people with the test-e but its not common.
 
needtogetaas said:
O I don't know I think some some of my products like beastdrol or deiselbolan can pack on 20lb of muscle long before any amount of primo/deca could. I may have to disagree with you on this one bro. I have seen hundreds if not thousands of people use some of my products and or other orals and add upwards of 20lb or more in 4 weeks time.

Not once have I ever seen anyone add that much in that little time using primo or deca or even test-e for that matter. Maybe a few people with the test-e but its not common.
Click to expand...

I'd say that adding an oral like Beastdrol will show results faster, but after 8 weeks, the end result will be the same. I think Primo doesn't show results for a while because the gains are so clean.

I still have to try Deiselbolan.
 
Nelson Montana said:
I'd say that adding an oral like Beastdrol will show results faster, but after 8 weeks, the end result will be the same. I think Primo doesn't show results for a while because the gains are so clean.

I still have to try Deiselbolan.
Click to expand...

Well if I was to do a 12 week cycle of test-e and a 10 week cycle of test-prop then ya I could say the end results would end up being around the same. All things considered.
 
I think it's all about how you look at it.

Faster acting esters will get you gaining sooner. Longer esters do take more time to essentially kick in...

However if you were to look at the time where each compound has essentially kicked in and look at the gains from "Kick In" to "Drop Out" you'd find them to be the same...

Its just that shorter esters do kick in faster.


I guess what I mean to say is that short esters don't cause faster muscle growth, just sooner. Which is what Nelson is getting at and what Need2 said. You guys are both right.
 
Nelson Montana said:
I'd say that adding an oral like Beastdrol will show results faster, but after 8 weeks, the end result will be the same. I think Primo doesn't show results for a while because the gains are so clean.

I still have to try Deiselbolan.
Click to expand...

O.K. I agree here. Also along with an ester such as Propionate. It will give you results faster but the end result will be the same. Yes. In these words I agree.
 
Technically you're wrong

At all equal dose, you get more of the actual anabolic/andro compound in faster esters (prop/susp) than you do in longer ones (enat/cyp)
 
Lambruh said:
Technically you're wrong

At all equal dose, you get more of the actual anabolic/andro compound in faster esters (prop/susp) than you do in longer ones (enat/cyp)
Click to expand...

This is true... But let's say you took effectively equivalent amount of each... Things happen sooner, not faster.
 
Nelson Montana said:
I've been saying this for years and I know I'll be saying it for years to come. But maybe A gentle reminder every now and then will help.

Fast acting ester DO NOT grow muscle faster than long acting esters.

That's like saying that eating faster will make you run faster.

It just doesn't work that way.
Click to expand...

I've been wondering about something and Nelson and Needto are probably the guys to ask: what are the benefits or side-effects of intermittent use of something like 100mg's Prop., kind of like what Floyd Landis was accused of during the Tour de France.

I'm 57 and my last cycle was about a year ago. I've got everything but would a boost just once every week or two be worth trying? Are there protocols for this?

-crow
 
sonicwaste said:
This is true... But let's say you took effectively equivalent amount of each... Things happen sooner, not faster.
Click to expand...
I understand, my point is, if one person has 5g's of Test Prop and one person has 5g's of Test Enat, both using in a 2 months cycle, the guy using the prop will have more muscle growth, theoretically making his muscle grow the fastest because his blood is getting MORE Test with each inject.








.
 
Last edited:
Fast acting esters do have some advantages in terms of PCT and recovery so gains might be easier to hold.
 
Lambruh said:
Technically you're wrong

At all equal dose, you get more of the actual anabolic/andro compound in faster esters (prop/susp) than you do in longer ones (enat/cyp)
Click to expand...


That's actually a separate issue. Prop has a higher test % than enth. D-bol, mg per mg is stronger than most injectables.
 
Well, lets compare a 12 week cycle of Test E and Test Prop. Same dose, same length of time.

The Prop will kick in sooner and you will have more use of it, thus making the prop the superior steroid whereas the enanthanate will take longer to kick in so you miss out on that quick delivery. By week 12, they should both be giving you the same amounts of anabolism, but the prop acted early in the cycle so you have that advantage as well.

I use Enanthanate because of less injections.
 
needtogetaas said:
O I don't know I think some some of my products like beastdrol or deiselbolan can pack on 20lb of muscle long before any amount of primo/deca could. I may have to disagree with you on this one bro. I have seen hundreds if not thousands of people use some of my products and or other orals and add upwards of 20lb or more in 4 weeks time.

Not once have I ever seen anyone add that much in that little time using primo or deca or even test-e for that matter. Maybe a few people with the test-e but its not common.
Click to expand...

Another point (brought up in another post) is that orals tend to be stronger mg per mg. I disagree that a cycle of prop provides results much faster than a long acting ester (though it "hits" a bit harder) but as far as orals go ...yeah, you'll notice results quicker, but that isn't the "speed" as much as the strength.

Orals also tend to increase blood volume faster which equates to "quicker size." So, we may be stuck in "teminology-land" on this one! lol

This is also a reminder that Beastdrol is something to be taken seriously. It IS AN ORAL STEROID. AND IT"S STRONG! And it's the reason you can't pop the stuff non stop. It also has the same effect on the liver as any other oral steroid and should be used accordingly. Great for a short cycle, a pre workout boost or a kick start.
 
needtogetaas said:
by the horn? with your ass?


Just kidding but what is with the off the wall random comment?
Click to expand...
Sorry man, I'm random Rick O'Shea? Richochet...get it:) I have just got really bad ADHD, and had no Idea what they were talking about cause I'm not smart but wanted to be involved sorry everyone...
 
Nelson Montana said:
I've been saying this for years and I know I'll be saying it for years to come. But maybe A gentle reminder every now and then will help.

Fast acting ester DO NOT grow muscle faster than long acting esters.

That's like saying that eating faster will make you run faster.

It just doesn't work that way.
Click to expand...

lol
 
Nelson Montana said:
I'd say that adding an oral like Beastdrol will show results faster, but after 8 weeks, the end result will be the same. I think Primo doesn't show results for a while because the gains are so clean.

I still have to try Deiselbolan.
Click to expand...

orals always show results much faster than injectables. It's probably because of the water retention mostly.
 
the_alcatraz said:
orals always show results much faster than injectables. It's probably because of the water retention mostly.
Click to expand...

Yep, and increase in blood volume-- both elements in muscle growth, but ultimately with long cycles not much of a factor in the long term. Injectables are building muscle right from the start too, but that increase in weight makes the orals seems like they're working faster, whereas actual muscle growth takes some time to notice. That doesn't mean they haven't "kicked in."
 
Yull grow muscles faster off 4weeks of prop and suspenstion then you would off of 4 weeks of deca and test....So technically fast acting esters do grow muscle faster........Unless im missing something here?
 
2DIEZEL said:
Yull grow muscles faster off 4weeks of prop and suspenstion then you would off of 4 weeks of deca and test....So technically fast acting esters do grow muscle faster........Unless im missing something here?
Click to expand...

Well, this is the debate. I say it isn't the fact that the ester is fast, but the strength is more. That hard hit creates water retention which gives the impression that muscle has developed. But it's only the beginning stages and those changes can be seen with long esters after 10 days or so anyway.
 
You'll hit peak blood concentrations faster with a short acting ester...unless of course you front-load the long ester. Faster high blood level concentrations will result in faster gains, but at the end of the day the difference will be minimal.

10 week cycles with long esters are too short imo.
 
I usually cut using fast acting esters switching compounds every 4-6 weeks. When i bulk ill use long esters ranging from 12-16 weeks.
 
Is a guy doing short esters only going to win Nats faster than a guy doing only long esters? No. Slow and steady wins the race.
 
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