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started TRT today with test cyp

augor

augor

New member
44 yrs old, 180 lbs decent shape

Blood test results came back
I'm in canada so my numbers look very different

Total testosterone scale 8.0-12.8. I was 7.0
Free test range was 25-40. I was 25.8

Doc says to me today "your not that low" !
I'm like what? Your kidding right?

Anywayz started my first shot today 200mg test cyp
He wants to give that to me once a month!
I told him all the research I've done, but he insists its a slow release test and 1 month will be fine.

I told him I want another blood test in 3 weeks, and then he'll see its not such a great starting point afterall.

I told him there are many men who are getting 100mg a week, he says 200 a month should be more then enough, and that he may consider every 2 weeks, but at 100mg .

Don't know what estrogen levels were, apperantly canada doesn't check that.

Any suggestions would be great
Thanx
Steve
 
I should also add, as for my symptoms, I've been going through the lethargy, no sex drive, basic halt to what used to make me happy and such.

And when I suggested to at least do 50mg a week, he says that's no good, then u might get the ladder effect.
As though 50mg a week was a lot of test!

The part that bugs me the most, is when we looked at the numbers and I said, I should be on the high end,and he said no way.
I said to him, the range your showing me is meant to be what a man my age should have, now if my body hadn't failed me, I might be producing those levels.
So why would u dent me the level at what I should be?
 
I should also add, as for my symptoms, I've been going through the lethargy, no sex drive, basic halt to what used to make me happy and such.

And when I suggested to at least do 50mg a week, he says that's no good, then u might get the ladder effect.
As though 50mg a week was a lot of test!

The part that bugs me the most, is when we looked at the numbers and I said, I should be on the high end,and he said no way.
I said to him, the range your showing me is meant to be what a man my age should have, now if my body hadn't failed me, I might be producing those levels.
So why would u dent me the level at what I should be?
 
Its not as easy in canada.
With out health care, u can't just shop around for another doc.
And family doctors are rarely taking new patients.
My only hope will be to get a referral to an endo
 
Good luck with your HRT. I just switched from test cyp to bioidentical cream. 100 mg test cyp every 5 days is what i did and worked well for me!
 
change ur doc ASAP
u should get at least 100mg of test per week and pin at least once a week (if not twice which is better)
standard TRT dose worldwide is 100-200mg/week
leave this fucking ignorant and look for another , even if u have to self medicate for a while , and do ur blood test on ur own.
just keep posting here.
good luck
 
Thanx for the replies,

It sucks that I might just feel better for a few days, and then drift back again.

My doc told me he has other trt patients on the same monthly dose, and there fine, if so there's no way there levels are very low then.

Hell even the manufacturer of the test cyp says the recommended dose is 200 weekly
 
Something I can't seem to find a clear answer on....
The doc gave me a 200mg shot, now I know the half life is 8 days, and day 8 is when the shot will raise the levels to the max (the max the dose can raise)
And after that levels fall back to where they were.
and by day 14-18 levels will be where u started correct?
What I need to know is will this one shot and any effect it may cause be done by 21 days?
Or does the slow ether actually last longer?
I know in terms of guys who use test in a cycle, they always say its 4-5 weeks before u see or feel benifits.

My doc has me going for blood tests again exactly 21 days after the shot, so he can show me it has improved my test levels, what do u think it will show?
Will my levels be different 21 days after a single shot, or will they be somewhat where they were when I started?
This is the wrong way to say it, but I'm hoping the levels are the same or worse, just so he can maybe stop being so condisending , and do a proper TRT dosage.

Thanx
 
augor said:
Something I can't seem to find a clear answer on....
The doc gave me a 200mg shot, now I know the half life is 8 days, and day 8 is when the shot will raise the levels to the max (the max the dose can raise)
And after that levels fall back to where they were.
and by day 14-18 levels will be where u started correct?
What I need to know is will this one shot and any effect it may cause be done by 21 days?
Or does the slow ether actually last longer?
I know in terms of guys who use test in a cycle, they always say its 4-5 weeks before u see or feel benifits.

My doc has me going for blood tests again exactly 21 days after the shot, so he can show me it has improved my test levels, what do u think it will show?
Will my levels be different 21 days after a single shot, or will they be somewhat where they were when I started?
This is the wrong way to say it, but I'm hoping the levels are the same or worse, just so he can maybe stop being so condisending , and do a proper TRT dosage.

Thanx
Click to expand...

first there's a big misunderstanding about esters half life, cypionate and enanthate have a half life of about 10 days (it varies a little upon individuals and injection site) but what does that means ? it means that if u inject 200mg of test cyp it will take about 10 days for ur body to metabolize the first half of it wich means ur body will use 100mg of it and exert it, then the next 10 days ur body will metabolize the half of the rest which is 50mg and it goes on and on until total exertion from the body.
for example Test cyp 200mg is divided like this:
day 1-10 : 100mg
day 11-20: 50mg
day 21-30: 25mg
day 31-40: 12.5mg
day 41-50: 6.25mg
day 51-60: 3.125mg
day 61-70: 1.562mg keep dividing by 2 each 10 days until total exertion and that's y it is detectable by urine tests after 3 months from the last shot.

another thing is that the half used in a half life is not evenly divided throughout the 10 days, it peaks after injection and keep declining to it's end.
as for cypionate and enanthate they peak arround 24-36 hours after injection and start a slow decline since.

the issue here is even if there's some detectable levels of exogenous test after 21 days but the question is , is it enough to put u on a good normal range? my guess is absolutely not.
 
augor said:
My doc told me he has other trt patients on the same monthly dose, and there fine, if so there's no way there levels are very low then.
Click to expand...

Chances are there natty test is lower than yours not higher.

A single 100mg shot is going to suppress natural production so for people to feel fine on it they must have naturally low test to begin with.

Id also find a new doc.
 
Thanx for the replies

So then I guess the way the test slowly releases by the time I do my blood tests at 21 days, the bulk of the potency of that shot will have passed through, and should result in a low level still.
Great explantion on how long it takes to do its thing, now I see why the dosing every week would be important, and I also get why after about 6 weeks it will kick in more, by then u would have the smaller accumulations adding up together.

To the guy who said a single 100mg shot would feel it more if his natural test was low.
My natural test is low and got a 200mg shot.

I guess everyone is different, I guess I shouldn't have got myself eager to feel something.
Its been 7 days now, and I've actually felt worse the last couple of days.
 
augor said:
Thanx for the replies

So then I guess the way the test slowly releases by the time I do my blood tests at 21 days, the bulk of the potency of that shot will have passed through, and should result in a low level still.
Great explantion on how long it takes to do its thing, now I see why the dosing every week would be important, and I also get why after about 6 weeks it will kick in more, by then u would have the smaller accumulations adding up together.

To the guy who said a single 100mg shot would feel it more if his natural test was low.
My natural test is low and got a 200mg shot.

I guess everyone is different, I guess I shouldn't have got myself eager to feel something.
Its been 7 days now, and I've actually felt worse the last couple of days.
Click to expand...

ur welcome bro and good luck :)
 
I like to have complete control of my applications or injections. You can sense peaks and valleys after some experience and different tests have different effects.

The smoothest ride is bio applied every day. You get 10-15 mg each day absorbed for about 100 total per week.

Next is 50 mg Thursday am and Sunday pm of any test, even susp. My fav is sust or test p. Right now I'm doing 100 mg primo twice a week as an experiment. It is so gentle, I moved up to 200 mg p/w. Normally I'd call this a stack and a cycle. Not for primo.

Maybe your Dr will allow you to inject yourself. Mine does.

Or move to the dark side and do your own. Add HGH to it too.
 
I think its gonna be tough just to get him to prescribe 200 every 2 weeks, but if he does, then I plan to convince him to let me self inject, then I'll change it myself to 100 a week.
My plan was after dosgae and levels are stabilized I was add to it.

My big concern now, after doing so much reading is this...
I just went in, he showed me the results, and offered the possible treatment. It was me that insisted on shots.
But he didn't even do any further tests to find out these few things...
1. Why did this happen
2. Am I secondary or primary and why.
3.Check to see my prostate is healthy before beginning TRT

Another question...
Everything I read says free test is the important one.
For my test it was total test 7.0 with a range of 8.0-12.8
Free test was 25.8 with range of 25-60 I believe
Sorry I can't remember what they measure in, I'm in canada so it would be a metric number.
So my total test is well below the range, while free is hanging at the bottom of there so called "normal" ranges.
 
augor said:
I think its gonna be tough just to get him to prescribe 200 every 2 weeks, but if he does, then I plan to convince him to let me self inject, then I'll change it myself to 100 a week.
My plan was after dosgae and levels are stabilized I was add to it.

My big concern now, after doing so much reading is this...
I just went in, he showed me the results, and offered the possible treatment. It was me that insisted on shots.
But he didn't even do any further tests to find out these few things...
1. Why did this happen
2. Am I secondary or primary and why.
3.Check to see my prostate is healthy before beginning TRT

Another question...
Everything I read says free test is the important one.
For my test it was total test 7.0 with a range of 8.0-12.8
Free test was 25.8 with range of 25-60 I believe
Sorry I can't remember what they measure in, I'm in canada so it would be a metric number.
So my total test is well below the range, while free is hanging at the bottom of there so called "normal" ranges.
Click to expand...

talk to him about these issues and let him check ur psa level, if this doctor continues to ignore the standard protocols for trt leave him and start searching for another.
 
I will press him to check that.
Changing doctors here isn't the same as in US , the best I can do is have him refer me to an endo, and even at that I'm limited to a few
Canadas health care has some plus's but when it comes to this type of thing it sucks.
Hard to get a family doctor
 
augor said:
I will press him to check that.
Changing doctors here isn't the same as in US , the best I can do is have him refer me to an endo, and even at that I'm limited to a few
Canadas health care has some plus's but when it comes to this type of thing it sucks.
Hard to get a family doctor
Click to expand...

ok u keep insisting on the things we talk about, dosing protocols and regular tests, but try to let him refer u to an endo anyway, remember this is for life, u want a specialist to monitor u all that time.
 
I read somewhere that TRT can take awhile (even if the dosage is proper)
It said if your levels are low and have been for awhile it takes time for your body to sense the test and work with it.
So....Is it safe to say "it'll get worse before it gets better" ?
For me this is day 7 since my first shot, and honestly I feel worse
I've had 1 day that I've felt like I could have a decent workout, and I kinda did.
But the next few days after I felt sore and weak more then I ever did when I first started exercising (wich was only 2 yrs ago)
 
augor said:
I read somewhere that TRT can take awhile (even if the dosage is proper)
It said if your levels are low and have been for awhile it takes time for your body to sense the test and work with it.
So....Is it safe to say "it'll get worse before it gets better" ?
For me this is day 7 since my first shot, and honestly I feel worse
I've had 1 day that I've felt like I could have a decent workout, and I kinda did.
But the next few days after I felt sore and weak more then I ever did when I first started exercising (wich was only 2 yrs ago)
Click to expand...

actually it's a mental thing , ur just eager to feel some results and impatience specially after long time suffering can worsen things but remember ur building up slowly so in time u r having more test day by day of course with proper dosing and frequency,
but in ur case with the distant shots ur going in a roller coaster so ur gonna feel something after injection but 3-4 days later u will start to feel the drop specially with a low initial dose, aim at least for a 100mg weekly (better divided to two 50mg/week) and after about 6 weeks ur goin to love it.

P.S: if ur doc accept the give u 200mg every 2 weeks , try to take it home and pin urself so u can divide it into multiple shots, and if i were u i would add an additional 50mg per week even if i had to buy it from black market, 150mg/week is better considering ur low natural test in the beginning , after all 100mg/week is the lowest dose to start with but most ppl eventually increase it to 150 or even 200mg/week later on (always keep an AI on hand in case estro. build up)
 
Sorry to hear about your doctor's reluctance to provide good TRT therapy.
I am in my mid-60's and felt the way you did prior to your therapy. I went to a local anti-aging clinic here in the U.S. in late June and they checked my total test level and found it to be 281 ng/dl (9.8 nmol/L, using the Canadian units). They were very kind and did not hesitate to get me started on 200 mg of test cyp per week. (I inject 100 mg twice a week to get the total dosage of 200 mg/week). Giving it in two shots a week instead of one keeps the test levels high and steady.
Other than getting sudden erections nothing happened for about four weeks, then dramatic changes occurred. I suddenly gained nearly ten pounds of muscle, and my strength levels shot up. My appetite increased a alot. Belly fat disappeared. When I went to the gym to do my regular workout, the other guys at the gym started commenting on the increased size of my arms and noticed I was lifting much heavier weights. My new energy level was so much that I had to reign myself in to keep from injuring myself when lifting weights, as it was so much easier now than before I could have gone much higher in the amount of weight I was lifting.
It has been four months since I began the test cyp shots and some of the initial
changes have leveled off, but still are good. I am scheduled for a follow up blood test next month. They told me when were were going over the results of my first blood test that I needed to get my test level up in the 1000-2000 ng/dl range!
(34.7-69.4 nmol/L Canadian measurment!!!)
So great has been my energy increase that I did a 23-mile hike across the Grand Canyon last month at age 65.
Here's hoping you get similar results.
 
Thanx guys for the great info.

Yeah I am impatient, and I wasn't expecting to feel alittle worse, that one took me by suprise!
I just thought I'd feel something positive on the first shot.
I'll have to wait till the dosage is regular and then time after that
 
lorelle said:
Sorry to hear about your doctor's reluctance to provide good TRT therapy.
I am in my mid-60's and felt the way you did prior to your therapy. I went to a local anti-aging clinic here in the U.S. in late June and they checked my total test level and found it to be 281 ng/dl (9.8 nmol/L, using the Canadian units). They were very kind and did not hesitate to get me started on 200 mg of test cyp per week. (I inject 100 mg twice a week to get the total dosage of 200 mg/week). Giving it in two shots a week instead of one keeps the test levels high and steady.
Other than getting sudden erections nothing happened for about four weeks, then dramatic changes occurred. I suddenly gained nearly ten pounds of muscle, and my strength levels shot up. My appetite increased a alot. Belly fat disappeared. When I went to the gym to do my regular workout, the other guys at the gym started commenting on the increased size of my arms and noticed I was lifting much heavier weights. My new energy level was so much that I had to reign myself in to keep from injuring myself when lifting weights, as it was so much easier now than before I could have gone much higher in the amount of weight I was lifting.
It has been four months since I began the test cyp shots and some of the initial
changes have leveled off, but still are good. I am scheduled for a follow up blood test next month. They told me when were were going over the results of my first blood test that I needed to get my test level up in the 1000-2000 ng/dl range!
(34.7-69.4 nmol/L Canadian measurment!!!)
So great has been my energy increase that I did a 23-mile hike across the Grand Canyon last month at age 65.
Here's hoping you get similar results.
Click to expand...

hey bro r u sure it's 1000-2000 ng/dl range? isn't it too high as a range , i know that anything above 1200 ng/dl is considered supraphysiological level, is that what ur doc is aiming to, can u be close to 2000 ng/dl and still be considered safe?
interested to know what protocols are the doctors nowadays following, cuz it seems the old conventional methods of the lowest dose with the distant shot frequency is fading.
 
I guess I should be happy I got nothing from the first shot, then I woulda just been disapointed in the roller coaster feeling
 
I know that its common for men in early 40's to have elevated estrogen levels, and then being on TRT injections the chances are greater but....
Can you really get conversion of estrogen from a single 200mg shot?

The last 2 days I've had sensitive nipples, somewhat sore.
That's usually the first sign of elevated estrogen.

This makes me even more disappointed in my doc, since he's said they don't check estrogen levels in men (in canada)
Sounds like he's just lazy
If I have one of those bodies that easily converts test to estrogen, then my test shots aren't gonna be as effective, since elevated estrogen has similar symptoms to low test.
My hormones are gonna be running around in circles here!
 
u need an AI bro , Adex , Aromasin or Femara. at least have some proviron from time to time it's cheap and easy to get if these options aren't available.
 
I have to find out wich ones are available for prescription where I live.
When I see the doc next, I have a few things to talk about.
My dosage
What he prescribes for high estro
Have my estro levels checked
Is HCG available in canada
 
Yes, xman, a test level much above 1000 ng/dl does seem high. I will be interested to see what my test level is after this first 6 months of TRT, and see how much it has gone up. I doubt the clinic will shoot for any test level too far over 1000 ng/dl.
I will try to keep you informed. Blood test is next month.
 
augor said:
Something I can't seem to find a clear answer on....
The doc gave me a 200mg shot, now I know the half life is 8 days, and day 8 is when the shot will raise the levels to the max (the max the dose can raise)
And after that levels fall back to where they were.
and by day 14-18 levels will be where u started correct?
What I need to know is will this one shot and any effect it may cause be done by 21 days?
Or does the slow ether actually last longer?
I know in terms of guys who use test in a cycle, they always say its 4-5 weeks before u see or feel benifits.

My doc has me going for blood tests again exactly 21 days after the shot, so he can show me it has improved my test levels, what do u think it will show?
Will my levels be different 21 days after a single shot, or will they be somewhat where they were when I started?
This is the wrong way to say it, but I'm hoping the levels are the same or worse, just so he can maybe stop being so condisending , and do a proper TRT dosage.

Thanx
Click to expand...

Let me take a shot at this. According to the package insert, the half-life for Cyp and Enanth is 8 days but the effective half-life is usually considered to be 12 days for Cyp and 10.5 days for Enan. What this means is that after the half-life period, you have metabolized half of the dose. After another half-life period, it is halved again (see picture).

My opinion is that when you are tested after 21 days, not only will most of the injections be gone from your system, but your natural production, as low as it may be, will be suppressed. The use of exogenous testosterone will shut down the HPTA (hypothalamus-pituitary-testes axis) which should finish off whatever low production you did have and leave you lower than you started.

It may take more than one shot to shut you down completely but that's how it works. I take my injections twice a week because I found that I have fewer sides from estrogen aromatization when I split the dose that way. my dose is 200 mg/week.

The reason why guys say it takes a few weeks to kick in is that the levels increase over time. (See Pic 2)
 
Thanx for the reply.
Makes sense.
See the way the doc explained it to me was it was slow acting and would last a month.
His knowledge is obviously not very good, cause he was right and wrong.
He's not realizing that as the 2nd life of the shot breaks down the pieces are smaller and smaller right?
This doesn't do the patient any good.
And like u said, that one shot may have already begun my natrual production shutdown.
One things for sure, as of tommorow it'll be 2 weeks since the shot, I've felt nothing improved, only thing I got was sore nipples (went away after 2 days)
And it'll be 2 more weeks till I get another shot, this waiting sucks!
As I type this I'm sitting at my gym, I thought I might be able to do a workout, but I can't find the energy or motivation to even begin.
Seems hard to believe it was only a couple months ago, my working out was still strong, my exercising is a very important part of my life, and its been stolen from just as a robber would steal my wallet.

Thanx guys
 
lorelle said:
Yes, xman, a test level much above 1000 ng/dl does seem high. I will be interested to see what my test level is after this first 6 months of TRT, and see how much it has gone up. I doubt the clinic will shoot for any test level too far over 1000 ng/dl.
I will try to keep you informed. Blood test is next month.
Click to expand...

yes plz do
 
augor said:
Thanx for the reply.
Makes sense.
See the way the doc explained it to me was it was slow acting and would last a month.
His knowledge is obviously not very good, cause he was right and wrong.
He's not realizing that as the 2nd life of the shot breaks down the pieces are smaller and smaller right?
This doesn't do the patient any good.
And like u said, that one shot may have already begun my natrual production shutdown.
One things for sure, as of tommorow it'll be 2 weeks since the shot, I've felt nothing improved, only thing I got was sore nipples (went away after 2 days)
And it'll be 2 more weeks till I get another shot, this waiting sucks!
As I type this I'm sitting at my gym, I thought I might be able to do a workout, but I can't find the energy or motivation to even begin.
Seems hard to believe it was only a couple months ago, my working out was still strong, my exercising is a very important part of my life, and its been stolen from just as a robber would steal my wallet.

Thanx guys
Click to expand...

eventually ur doc will realize that it's not working and he'll have to increase dosage and frequency so hang on bro :)
 
As I'm still waiting till next monday for my next doc visit and next shot ( had blood tests again today)
I actually feel worse then before the shot.

Anywayz, I meant to ask a question here. (Another symptom, trailing off topic of what I'm doing) lol

Does anyone else when they have low T (guys who work out) experience a feeling in your muscles like the soreness u get a couple days after a workout? Only without having worked out those muscles for a week.

Its kinda odd, for example I worked out my biceps and back last tuesday, and it wasn't even a great workout compared to the past, but yesterday and today, my lats are sore like I worked em hard!
Not a pain, just soreness.
I guess lack of test in the body, the muscles are feeling like a drunk without a drink!
 
augor said:
Does anyone else when they have low T (guys who work out) experience a feeling in your muscles like the soreness u get a couple days after a workout? Only without having worked out those muscles for a week.

Its kinda odd, for example I worked out my biceps and back last tuesday, and it wasn't even a great workout compared to the past, but yesterday and today, my lats are sore like I worked em hard!
Not a pain, just soreness.
I guess lack of test in the body, the muscles are feeling like a drunk without a drink!
Click to expand...

Some folks get flu like symptoms from gear but not terribly common with pharm grade stuff. Also on rare occasions some people react poorly to specific esters. Or it could just be coincidence and your coming down with something.

200mg once a month is ridiculous, your never going to stabilize and feel good like that. The problem with normal docs is that they take the slow methodical approach, add a little, wait, blood test, add a little wait, blood test. It can take literally months and months for them to figure out where you should be. The one nice thing about TRT docs is they have treated hundreds of patience and have solid empirical evidence based on the dosing they prescribe and blood work they see.

The know that as the exo test kicks in and the ester is removed and it becomes available for use in your body, your body will be at a test high level, then your body will scale back on its own production and total T levels will go down. Having a once a month injection means you will likely be shut down by the end of the month and a large part of the exo test will have been bound to the receptor leaving you with nothing. After the second injection total T should be lower than right after the first because your own production is low at best and they wait another month, test again to find out your low.

They may even just up your once a month dose making the peaks and valleys in the roller coaster even worse.

Empirical evidence has shown that having T levels over lab norms for aging men is not a bad thing. With a little E control and careful monitoring it has shown that most people can have T levels of 1100-1500 and still have good blood work. But once again the typical doc treats patients to get them in the "normal" range of T, they arent treating you for the mental aspects of low T which for many have a huge impact on life. I bet most middle aged men on drugs for depression could more safely and effectively be treated with TRT but the stigma is holding back the medical community.
 
Hey guys,
Went for my 2nd visit to the doc today to get latest blood results.
Just to recap....
4 weeks ago had one shot of test cyp 200mg

First test results:
Total test: 7.0 nmol/L. Range 8.4-28.7 nmol/L
Free test: 25.8 pmol/L. Range 25.0-80.0 pmol/L

Todays test results:
Total test: 2.9 nmol/L. Range 8.4-28.7 nmol/L
Free test: 4.9 pmol/L. Range 25.0-80.0 pmol/L

All the rest of the results appear to be in range.but I also don't see a lot of stuff checked that other guys in here have listed.

Doc says he hasn't seen this happen before, looks like I'm turning into a primary, and he thought it was odd that even if my natural production is failing more, the one shot I got should have at least helped some, but its alomost as though my body didn't respond at all to the shot.
So he's sending me to an endo, could take a few weeks, in the meantime I'll be getting 100mg test cyp a week till I see the new doc.

He asked if I had any pain in the testicles, as he was thinking maybe some kind of infection is interfering with the production.

Guess I have to just wait now, cross my fingers that while I'm waiting the weekly shots have some positive effects.

Any ideas as to why my test production would be that much lower 3 weeks after a shot?
Seems unlikely one 200mg shot would shut me down, and I've noticed no testicle shrinkage.
 
the thing is like u r on a cycle every month on and off u get the shot ur ok the first week high exo test level the next week ur feeling the drop the 3rd week very low leftovers from exo test and normal production suppressed so ur body is at it's lowest from both sources endogenous and exogenous 4th week ur in hell :) no exo test (maybe some traces) and normal production still low cuz it needs time to restart 5th week time for ur next shot b4 u recovered normal production then goin into that roller coaster again and again and again....... ur on hrt u r counting on exo test all ur life so u need to divide ur dose to be covered all the days in the month , once a week is the minimum frequency , twice would be better.
as for normal production ur goin to need some hcg and hmg to keep it at minimum just for fertility u wont count on it to add to ur exo totals.
 
it was changed yesterday to weekly shots

I should also ask, seeing as I'm goin to an endo now, what specific blood tests do u think I should ask for?
 
Last edited:
augor said:
Any ideas as to why my test production would be that much lower 3 weeks after a shot?
Seems unlikely one 200mg shot would shut me down, and I've noticed no testicle shrinkage.
Click to expand...

200mh can shut you down and 4 weeks after the shot there wont be much of it left in your system to be of any use hence the low numbers.

The basic principle is if there is exo test in your system the body cuts back on its own, with naturally low test and the half life of the test you got, the exo levels could have been high enough to suppress natural production for a couple weeks. Then it wouldnt surprise me, since your naturally low to begin with that you wouldnt bounce back very fast.

Testicular atrophy often takes more than a singe shot and a few weeks.
 
Hi, and thanx for the reply.
I figured it would take more then 1 shot to shut me down, but wanted to ask anywayz.
I wasn't thinking about the fact that the one shot would make the system cut back on production.

Got bad news that my appointment with the endo won't be till march 7th !

I'm gonna tell my doctor he's gonna have to help me with this thing until that time.

I know now after mondays visit that he's really only got experience with guys who have been ok with just minor doses of test, cause once I mentioned needing HCG and something to control estrogen, that's when he said, we better get u into an endo.
But there's no way I can go 3 1/2 months of 100mg a week with no AI or HCG in the mix.
If I can at least get him to approve the blood work for the estrogen check, and thenm prescribe what I need, I'll figure out the dosages for myself just from I've learned from all the great people on this board.
 
augor said:
If I can at least get him to approve the blood work for the estrogen check, and thenm prescribe what I need, I'll figure out the dosages for myself just from I've learned from all the great people on this board.
Click to expand...

The main benefit of HCG is it prevent/reduces testicular atrophy while on HRT and gives a little added natural test boost, which it sound like you may not have much of anyway. on 100mg a week an AI likely isnt needed unless your E levels are already at the high end of the range which isnt likely unless you are carrying a LOT of fat.
 
This is my impatience talking, so bare with me.....

I've had a couple guys say, that if your levels are really low, you'll feel something on a 100mg shot

I had a 200mg shot, 3 weeks later levels went much lower.
1 week ago I had a 100 mg shot (will get 100 weekly)
And felt nothing.

This got me to wondering.....
Are there guys who don't respond to test cyp injections?
Or if they don't respond is it a signal something else is at play?

Sorry if it sounds like a silly question, still learning all this
 
On HRT dosages, you really need to give it 10 weeks of consistent treatment to judge the effects it will have on you mentally. Your 200mg injection 3 weeks ago, likely faded long before the followup 100 so you havent had anything resembling a steady dose at all. Get on a steady dose and give it 10 weeks.

If your doc is just trying to bring you to mid normal range you very well may not readily "feel" anything but over time if you pay attention you will likely start to pick out things where you are benefiting from it.

For example, when I was younger I had killer focus and drive, I could work through complex scenarios and juggle a ton of things at once. Over the last few years I would easily become overwhelmed and have to step back, break things down and come at it again, things took much longer to do that way. Since being on TRT I got back that focus, clarity and intensity which is paying dividends at work, back in the gym and in my personal life. Biggest drawback is I have the libido of a 25 year old again.
 
If u have gyno sensitive symptoms coming on, would u have sore or tender spots at the bottom of your pec?
Today it's been so sore on both sides and sensitive nipples

Thanx for all the replies
 
Tenderness at and slightly around the nipple is a sign you may be suffering from high E, but gyno can come on for many reasons and sore/puffy nips could just be your body reacting to fluctuating hormonal levels. 100mg a week is pretty low to actually cause gyno but I suppose its not unheard of. Tell you doc of your symptoms and see what he says.
 
Hi
Just thought I'd give an update to how things are going.
I've had 4 weeks of test cyp 100 mg a week.
This Monday I get blood tests again before the 5th shot to see what the levels
Are like now.
I figured 4 weeks should give a good indication of how this dosage is doing.

So far I can see I'm seeing and feeling a difference, energy levels have
Improved, I can actually lift weights again 3 times a week for about 30
Mins , not as heavy as before, but 1 step at a time right?
Libido is coming back as well, at times alittle too much!
Not knocking sex at all, but I really don't need to be like a teenager thinkin
Bout sex all day with surprise hardons. Lol

If I had to self diagnose I'd say I'm on the right track, but I think my dose needs to
Upped to 125 mg next.
I don't get to see my endo till march, so when I get my new results, I'm
Gonna try to convince the doc to get me going on HCG
I know he doesn't know much about the drug cause when I mentioned it
Before, that was what made him say "let's get u to an endo"
But I don't wanna wait till march to get started with it.

Sure does feel good having life slowly coming back to me

I'll post another update when I know more
 
I just got the results of my first blood test done six months after starting TRT (200 mg test cyp per wk). I have always been borderline low on RBC, HGB, and HCT. Well, they are all back well into a normal range, which is good. The TRT was very helpful there. My total testosterone has gone from a low of 281 ng/dL when I started in June to 1084 ng/dL, a jump of over 800 ng/dL!! I feel great, but my sex drive is off the wall, and I struggle to keep the cravings it induces under control. If there is any drawback to my TRT it is that!!! I find I am ready to go for sex in any way, shape or form. One reason is probably that I am single (widower), and, with no wife, my problem is heightened. Oh well, I guess if there has to be a drawback to TRT this is the best one to have?
 
lorelle said:
I just got the results of my first blood test done six months after starting TRT (200 mg test cyp per wk). I have always been borderline low on RBC, HGB, and HCT. Well, they are all back well into a normal range, which is good. The TRT was very helpful there. My total testosterone has gone from a low of 281 ng/dL when I started in June to 1084 ng/dL, a jump of over 800 ng/dL!! I feel great, but my sex drive is off the wall, and I struggle to keep the cravings it induces under control. If there is any drawback to my TRT it is that!!! I find I am ready to go for sex in any way, shape or form. One reason is probably that I am single (widower), and, with no wife, my problem is heightened. Oh well, I guess if there has to be a drawback to TRT this is the best one to have?
Click to expand...

hey bro can u plz post ur stats, just to compare it with ur results
 
lorelle said:
I feel great, but my sex drive is off the wall, and I struggle to keep the cravings it induces under control. If there is any drawback to my TRT it is that!!! I find I am ready to go for sex in any way, shape or form.
Click to expand...

LOL, I feel your pain and I am married, its starting to drive the wife nuts.
 
I started my first round of TRT today. Pinned with 100 mg Test-Cyp which I will repeat every 5 days. I also started on sublingual HCG formulated at a local compound pharmacy which I will take 1 and 2 days prior to my next schedule Test dose. As a physician I have the luxury of self prescribing the HCG, however I left the test to my endocrinologist. Previous total test levels which were repeated twice showed total test levels in the 230s. As a 34 year old, that is pretty low.
 
So I go in today for more blood tests, and my weekly shot.
I asked the doc, how long are we gonna do this before you show me how to
Self inject?
He says...... In Canada your not allowed to self inject due to laws with testosterone.
I know this is crap. As I know a couple guy in my city even who self inject there TRT
I said that's crazy, I'm not goin to the doctors every week for forever!
Any way, this screws up my plan, I wanted to get on self inject, and then when my levels were
Good and I was at the right dosage, I wanted to try a cycle.

Now with me having to see the doc every week it won't work out so well.

I have to hope when I see this endo in march, that she's cool with self injecting
 
getzone said:
I started my first round of TRT today. Pinned with 100 mg Test-Cyp which I will repeat every 5 days. I also started on sublingual HCG formulated at a local compound pharmacy which I will take 1 and 2 days prior to my next schedule Test dose. As a physician I have the luxury of self prescribing the HCG, however I left the test to my endocrinologist. Previous total test levels which were repeated twice showed total test levels in the 230s. As a 34 year old, that is pretty low.
Click to expand...

maybe u should start a thread urself and keep a log on everything.
can u plz post ur stats , and if u were juicing in the past or what's the reason for ur hypogonadism?
 
XMAN. said:
maybe u should start a thread urself and keep a log on everything.
can u plz post ur stats , and if u were juicing in the past or what's the reason for ur hypogonadism?
Click to expand...


Will do. I did not intended to thread jack, I just figured it would become a nuisance if everyone who starts TRT made their own thread.
 
getzone said:
Will do. I did not intended to thread jack, I just figured it would become a nuisance if everyone who starts TRT made their own thread.
Click to expand...

that's not what i meant bro ur free to post wherever u want but i meant that it would be clearer if u start ur own thread cuz there's so many ppl posting in this one and things ccan get confusing following every one's info.
 
Xman,
Here are my before and after stats. The 6-month blood test only covered the following:

6/25/10 11/24/10
WBC 6.2 6.8
RBC 4.36 5.08
HGB 13.6 16.0
HCT 40.7 47.3
MCV 93.4 93.1
MCH 31.1 31.5
MCHC 33.3 33.8
RDW 13.3 13.9
Platelet Count 213 231

Testosterone 280.90 1084.20
 
lorelle, how much do you weigh and whats your approx body fat?
 
Anyone else go through a period of feeling a bit better, then kinda crashing back to the beginning?

Ive had 5 shits at 100 mg a week now
Weeks 3 and 4 I felt improvement, thought wow here we go it's getting better.
But since last week after the 5 th shit, Ive gone back to feeling like crap.

Guess I gotta hope when I find out the results of my latest blood work this
Tuesday that the levels are still low enough to justify upping the dose.

I know I gotta try to stay positive, but there are times when I can't help
Thinking how much this sucks, and wonder if I'm gonna find that sweet spot,
Or will it be a roller coaster for months till it's better.

I've read how some guys burn through test faster then others and require a higher
Them normal dose, maybe I'm that way as well

Anyway, just wanted to share that and get some opinions

Thanx guys
 
lorelle said:
Xman,
Here are my before and after stats. The 6-month blood test only covered the following:

6/25/10 11/24/10
WBC 6.2 6.8
RBC 4.36 5.08
HGB 13.6 16.0
HCT 40.7 47.3
MCV 93.4 93.1
MCH 31.1 31.5
MCHC 33.3 33.8
RDW 13.3 13.9
Platelet Count 213 231

Testosterone 280.90 1084.20
Click to expand...

thx for sharing, how often do u test for a full hormone panel(free T, BioAv., E2, Prog, Prolac, TSH....)? is it once a year?
 
augor said:
Anyone else go through a period of feeling a bit better, then kinda crashing back to the beginning?

Ive had 5 shits at 100 mg a week now
Weeks 3 and 4 I felt improvement, thought wow here we go it's getting better.
But since last week after the 5 th shit, Ive gone back to feeling like crap.

Guess I gotta hope when I find out the results of my latest blood work this
Tuesday that the levels are still low enough to justify upping the dose.

I know I gotta try to stay positive, but there are times when I can't help
Thinking how much this sucks, and wonder if I'm gonna find that sweet spot,
Or will it be a roller coaster for months till it's better.

I've read how some guys burn through test faster then others and require a higher
Them normal dose, maybe I'm that way as well

Anyway, just wanted to share that and get some opinions

Thanx guys
Click to expand...
most ppl need more than a 100mg/w dose , most probably ur doc is going to increase ur dosage at ur next scheduled visit.
 
Yeah that's what I've been reading as well.
I've even said that my doc , I knew right away he knew nothing about this stuff
Cause he looked at me and said, oh u would never get more then a 100 a week
Got my fingers crossed that the endo I see in March knows her stuff
 
Hey guy
Got my latest results today
Total T 15.2. Range 8.4 to 28.7
Free T. 40.3. Range 25.0 to 80.0
Estradiol 156. Range 43 to 151

The numbers have gone up, but I still think he's a quak!
The numbers are barely mid range and he was all excited.
Never even asked me how I actually feel , he just looks at numbers.
Estrogen was high according to the lab, all he said was were not gonna
Do anything when it's just 5 points over!
Give me a break over is over.
I'm gonna call the specialist and tell them to try to squeeze me in sooner
I can't wait till march under my regular docs care!
 
augor said:
hey guy
got my latest results today
total t 15.2. Range 8.4 to 28.7
free t. 40.3. Range 25.0 to 80.0
estradiol 156. Range 43 to 151

the numbers have gone up, but i still think he's a quak!
The numbers are barely mid range and he was all excited.
Never even asked me how i actually feel , he just looks at numbers.
Estrogen was high according to the lab, all he said was were not gonna
do anything when it's just 5 points over!
Give me a break over is over.
i'm gonna call the specialist and tell them to try to squeeze me in sooner
i can't wait till march under my regular docs care!
Click to expand...

asap
 
Hey guys
Got another new set of results today

Total T 17.9 Range 8.4 to 28.7
Free T. 49.5 Range 25.0 to 80.0
Estradiol 149 Range 43 to 151

Doc was unwilling to think I need an increase, or in need of something to
Bring estrogen down.
When I said I still feel terrible all he offered was "maybe it's something else"

This got me to thinking, maybe so, I'm inclined to believe the estrogen is causing issues
Just because around week 3 I started to feel a bit better, then it quickly went away.

So I'm asking all u more experienced guys, what else do u think could be happening here?
I know the adrenals could have issues, do adrenal glands interfere with the testosterone
Doing it's job?
My numbers are far from great , but it's odd that since I had very low numbers
To now with the numbers higher, not much in the way of improvement has been seen.

I so badly want to start self meditating just based on what I've learned so far.
But if I do that I'll screw myself. Cause I see the endo march 7 th and she'll want
To run her own tests.
It's just really getting to me now that's it's 10 weeks in and I'm still not really
Different then week 1 .
And the more I read online about other guys stories, and there are so many
Guys who say they've had 2 or 3 shots of the same amount as me, and
There feeling great, it's great for them, but depressing for me, I'm feeling
As thought something else is wrong with me.

Thanx guys
 
Have bloodwork done in order to determine your insulin status...

The reason I mentioned it is purely because I am also on TRT for close to 7 weeks now and no improvement has been had ito energy, weight loss, fatigue etc despite all my figures indicating a need for TRT. After discussing this with my Doc, and my symptoms after eating carbs I had my glucose profile done, she suspects insulin resistance. Perhaps you are suffering from the same...

H
 
Insulin resistance comes from long periods of poor dietary choices. Low test can aggravate and make the condition easier to come by as well. In terms of feeling like shit after eating carbs, especially grains you could have gluten problems. One easy way to find out how food affects you is simply commit to 4 weeks of the paleo diet. Do a google on it, its not calorie restricted at all but your food choices are limited.
 
augor said:
Hey guys
Got another new set of results today

Total T 17.9 Range 8.4 to 28.7
Free T. 49.5 Range 25.0 to 80.0
Estradiol 149 Range 43 to 151

Doc was unwilling to think I need an increase, or in need of something to
Bring estrogen down.
When I said I still feel terrible all he offered was "maybe it's something else"

This got me to thinking, maybe so, I'm inclined to believe the estrogen is causing issues
Just because around week 3 I started to feel a bit better, then it quickly went away.

So I'm asking all u more experienced guys, what else do u think could be happening here?
I know the adrenals could have issues, do adrenal glands interfere with the testosterone
Doing it's job?
My numbers are far from great , but it's odd that since I had very low numbers
To now with the numbers higher, not much in the way of improvement has been seen.

I so badly want to start self meditating just based on what I've learned so far.
But if I do that I'll screw myself. Cause I see the endo march 7 th and she'll want
To run her own tests.
It's just really getting to me now that's it's 10 weeks in and I'm still not really
Different then week 1 .
And the more I read online about other guys stories, and there are so many
Guys who say they've had 2 or 3 shots of the same amount as me, and
There feeling great, it's great for them, but depressing for me, I'm feeling
As thought something else is wrong with me.

Thanx guys
Click to expand...
i personally suggests that u buy online an AI and start taking it and tell ur new doc u really felt like shit and had a high estro count she'll understand , keep the same test dose but have an AI asap, i suggests Aromasin about 12.5mg eod (my estimation for ur case u may need more)
plus it'll lower ur SHBG and free up more test then u'll notice a big change in ur mood, ur numbers are still in the mid ranges , means not hat much , for ur symptoms u may eventually later increase ur test dose with ur new doc, but meanwhile what u can do is start an AI now.
good luck bro
 
Thanx for the reply

That's actually what I've done.
I got some arimidex .5mg tabs
I was told by a friend who's had experience with this stuff, to take 1 a day for a week
Then switch to 1 every 2 days

Does that sound about right?

Been taking it for 3 days now, no noticeable difference.
 
augor said:
Thanx for the reply

That's actually what I've done.
I got some arimidex .5mg tabs
I was told by a friend who's had experience with this stuff, to take 1 a day for a week
Then switch to 1 every 2 days

Does that sound about right?

Been taking it for 3 days now, no noticeable difference.
Click to expand...

sounds good , good luck
 
Hey all
Been awhile since I updated, got my shot increased to 125 a week about 3 weeks ago, feeling better.
Latest blood test results show my numbers are slightly above mid-range.
Finally had my appointment with the endo today.
Sadly I'm not feeling better about this whole journey.
The endo tells me right off, she wants me off the injections, and in 4 weeks to get more blood tests dome to see where I'm at
But.... This is after she's already told me that after this many weeks of being on injections my natural production will be shut down
So i say, what exactly are you gonna see on this blood test that will help you?
My body won't be making test, and the injection test will be fading away from my system.
The results will be low, your not gonna get a clear picture of what I can produce if I'm shut down.
I tell her i would need to be on something like HCG to kick start my natural production.
She tells me ,no I don't do that.
I'm like WTF? It doesn't start back up by itself.

I believe she's probably a good endo for other areas, but not TRT
Many things she had to say go against what most of know are truths about how things really work.

She tells me 125mg a week is way to high, I'm gonna lose my hair.....well that's a yes and no, if I'm predisposed and have elevated levels of test, then yes.
Then she went on to say , are u feeling better? I say yes it's getting there, she tells me , well of course u are, any man taking injections will have more energy and feel better.
She basically said that the injections will make me feel better then the same amount of natural would.
Again WTF ? If test cyp is meant to be 96% same as what a man can produce , then why would she think the injections would give me more of a good feeling, as though it was just a feel good drug.
I understand if taken in very high doses, this would be true, but not when your only taking enough to get your numbers slightly above mid range.

One more thing too, when she looked at my original blood results, she told me, I don't know why your doctor even started injections, your results were normal. But they clearly werent.
She says free test is not the important one, and that I should have had the bio-available testosterone test done...... Any truth to that part?

Anyways sorry for the extra long post, and I didn't even type all I wanted to say!
Lol

Thanx
 
I wish I could, for Canada its different, I have to referred by my family doc
And we don't have alot of endos
And sadly there all a 3-4 month waiting period
 
Thought I'd update my original thread, it's been awhile.
Been on 125 from the doc since around feb , felt good.
Did a cycle in April with 450 test a week, got some good results.
Now I'm just leaning out, and have an appoint with a new endo in november.

Had been cursing for the last 9 weeks at 250 a week (125 extra I give myself)
Feels great , 250 for sure keeps my levels where they should be, from looking at the blood work on 125 a week
My levels were alittle bit over mid range, so for at least 250 isn't a high number.
 
So, what is your range at right now with that dose of 250mgs a week for 9 weeks you been under on the scale for men??
 
Have no idea what my levels are on 250 a week, I can't ask the doc for a blood test while I'm taking extra he'd freak!
 
my doc (who's my friend too) tells me there's no need to do more than 150mg /w , but i still cruise on 250mg it puts me somewhere around 1200 or 1300 ng/dl and i like it and fine with it, just need to take more AI's i now take letro 1.25mg (half tab) eod, but been a while since the last time i checked my bloods and see my estro level, cuz i'm feeling a bit dry now, specially in my elbows (and of course my old AC joint problem is aggrevating)
 
Hey
Thanx for the reply

For me I had to stop taking the extra T , I have an appointment with a new endo beginning of nov.
And he wants blood tests done.
Plus my body was telling me it needed a break.

But mud November I'm gonna start a new cycle, and fix he mistakes I made on the first one.
For one, my body fat % was higher then it should have been,it didn't really cause more sides, possibly higher blood pressure, but I won't know that for sure till next time.
But because my metabolism gets so high, I was having to take in so many calories just to maintain my weight.
It sucks the body won't just use new calories to build muscle, it wants to maintain your weight first, even if it's fat!
Lol
But the lower I get my weight , and lean out, I'll have more calories to go towards building muscle
 
When I was cruising at 250 a week, I was taking arimidex .5 once a week.
That kept me good, only once I had to stop for a couple weeks, cause I could feel my joints drying up
 
Well finally have another appoint with a new endo coming up this Monday nov 7
Hopefully this guy is better, at this point I don't need an endo to get me better, but he can at least order some tests that the reg doc can't.
And with any luck he will take over giving me the scrip for the test, and let me do it on my own.
Going every week to the doc for a shot has gotten real old after a year!
 
Endo appointment went well, numbers look good, but the best part was he told me , it's not about just numbers, he said I want to know how u feel.
In the end, he's happy wih my current dose, and said as long as I'm feeing good on, let's keep it there.
He's going to suggest to my family doc that I start doing injections myself, and he doesn't want to comply, to come back and he will take over that part of my treatment.
He also suprized me by talking about soft tissue injection instead of intramuscular injection.
He says, all the tests they've done show the oil is absorbed into the body at the same rate.
So I thought that was cool that he into new ways of doing things.
 
congrats bro ur finally on the right track.
and btw ur doc is right u can inject in fat deposits and have a normal absorption but i think it will have a small delay then injecting directly in the muscle, and it should be limited to small quantities like 0.5 ml or 1 ml per injection or else u gona have a big lump under ur skin and it'll take time to disolve, of course we're talking about areas surrounding the glutes the hips and the abdomen.
drawing the oil with a slin pin will take forever (u may heat the solution a bit b4 doing that) and it's irritating after injection but still doable.
 
Cool, thanx for the info.
According to the endo , he says the main study they did in Canada , confirmed that a regular TRT does of 100 mg could be injected into the fatty tissue.

Got a question for u, I'm starting another cycle shortly, since I'm on TRT, I'm not go an go crazy with the doses.
I know I can gain on smaller amounts, so I'm just sticking to 300 a week.
Now since at the moment , my TRT injections are still being given by my doc, he gives me 125 on a wed, and I was thinking just give myself 175 on a sat.
I know the 2 injections should be even, but for convenience sake, will it make a big difference to have one shot 50 mg larger?
Until he gets me going doing my TRT myself I have to make these changes.

Thanx
 
Last edited:
augor said:
Cool, thanx for the info.
According to the endo , he says the main study they did in Canada , confirmed that a regular TRT does of 100 mg could be injected into the fatty tissue.

Got a question for u, I'm starting another cycle shortly, since I'm on TRT, I'm not go an go crazy with the doses.
I know I can gain on smaller amounts, so I'm just sticking to 300 a week.
Now since at the moment , my TRT injections are still being given by my doc, he gives me 125 on a wed, and I was thinking just give myself 175 on a sat.
I know the 2 injections should be even, but for convenience sake, will it make a big difference to have one shot 50 mg larger?
Until he gets me going doing my TRT myself I have to make these changes.

Thanx
Click to expand...

don't worry u'll be fine with that, and maybe u can do another 2 125 mg shots means ur doc does one 125mg shot and u do the other 2 a total of 3 125mg shots (375mg test). if ur doc pins u on wed. u do mon. and fri.
 
Hey
Got a question
I prefer to do my injections in the leg, and was using 25g 5/8 inch
And it was perfect .
Most drug stores where I live , are now telling me that size is discontinued
What other size is good for leg injections?
Our popular drug store here seems to carry alot of 26g 3/8 inch
But I haven't used it before and wanted to ask first

Thanx
 
i do quad injections all the time too but in my case i prefer to stick with 23 g 1" not too big and still easy to push the oil with, i even draw with a 21 g pin as it's a lot easier and faster with oil solutions then replace it with the 23 g when injecting, and it's a lot easier to find 23 g in the drug stores.
with a 26 g syringe i think it's gona be a little hard injecting the oil but still doable it'll take some time.
 
Cool thanx
I also use 21 g for drawing
I'll have to try the 23
U think there's a big difference with 23 compared to 25?
 
not a big difference but a little wider so it'll be easier when injecting and it's still small enough and painless (at least for me), i use it for oil and suspension very practical and for a lean person like it can be used for all sites in ur body as it's long enough (mostly comes in 1 inch long or 1 and 1/4 of an inch)
 
U ever get issues with higher blood pressure when on juice?
For me, last time around it was kinda weird.
It would happen about once a week, and it would be late at night, like after 11pm
I started to think it was more a reaction to the type of testosterone I was on.
Otherwise , why not get uncomfortable high blood pressure early in the day as well?
 
augor said:
U ever get issues with higher blood pressure when on juice?
For me, last time around it was kinda weird.
It would happen about once a week, and it would be late at night, like after 11pm
I started to think it was more a reaction to the type of testosterone I was on.
Otherwise , why not get uncomfortable high blood pressure early in the day as well?
Click to expand...

yes my BP is higher when on juice specially if i pass the 1 gram but still manageable , but sometimes it's scary i get headaches and my face looks dark, so i eleminate as much as possible my sodium intake caffeine alcohol nicotine (cigarettes).
about the timing it depends on what ester ur using, if u inject always the same time then ur hormone levels will peak at the same time too (specially estro the main culprit) it's when sometimes u feel a little anxious too, i feel that when i inject HCG in the morning i feel it the same day at night , but not that much but feel the difference, for test let's say it's enanthate or cypionate it will peak after 36 hours so if u inject it on monday morning then ur gona feel something on tuesday mid day or evening. in small doses like on HRT i personally love the peak cuz it really boosts my dopamine and motivates me, but in high dosages it may make me anxious specially if i didn't start an AI with it. Timing AI is cruicial too cuz if ur using letro which have a 2-4 days half life then u need a day at least in advance b4 ur test shot to have enough letro in ur blood stream to fight against estro peak, or taking it several time a week in small doses to maintain. sometimes this thing is there in ur body during the day but u won't notice it if ur active during the day but when u lay down at night u feel it cuz it's calm and ur more concentrated on urself , u can hear ur heart beat or have some thoughts that makes u anxious cuz u think too much at night, it can be psycological.

most important thing in this case is to divide ur dose as much as u can during the week to minimize peaks and valleys, speciially high doses.
 
Hey
Thanx

For me I was starting to think it was me being anxious at night.
But I've had a few nights ( last time around ) where I couldn't get to sleep for hours, cause I just felt weird, heart racing, breathing was off.
Last time I took arimidex and it worked good, this time around i got some nolvedex .

My peaks and valeys shouldn't be too bad this time around since I'm doing 3x125 spaced out well.
 
augor said:
Hey
Thanx

For me I was starting to think it was me being anxious at night.
But I've had a few nights ( last time around ) where I couldn't get to sleep for hours, cause I just felt weird, heart racing, breathing was off.
Last time I took arimidex and it worked good, this time around i got some nolvedex .

My peaks and valeys shouldn't be too bad this time around since I'm doing 3x125 spaced out well.
Click to expand...

nolva won't do anything to minimize estro, it'll just block the receptors on skeletal muscles and in hypotalamus u need an AI not a serm.
 
Ok
I'll let my buddy know I need arimidex instead.

I'd be intresred to hear what u do during those difficult times of higher blood pressure and anxiety.
For me it's kinda weird it's almost more of a sinking feeling I get, and I believe it's actually more anxiety then blood pressure.
 
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