Should I train abs while bulking?

[cgrayx]

Hi,

I have recently started taking training seriously and am currently on a clean bulk and doing 6 reps x 5 sets of most excercises. What I want to know is: Should I train my abs now and build the muscle under the fat (~8.2% BF) for the time being and when I start cutting I assume they will start showing... or do I not bother for the time being at all and only start training ABS when I am cutting?

Probably the former, I know it's a really idiotic question but I am new and wanna be sure

 

[_cato_]

Your abs should already be showing quite a bit if you're 8% BF. In my opinion, in general you don't need to train your abs, particularly if you're doing heavy compounds, unless you notice that a core related weakness is holding you back (some people might disagree with this). But, if you choose to do so, which is also an acceptable choice, then there's no reason to wait until you are cutting to do so. Doing abs work won't help you cut. Working your abs just makes them bigger and/or stronger. Being cut is a function of diet.

If you do want to start training them, weighted sit-ups on a decline bench, hanging leg raises bringing your shins all the way up to the bar you're hanging from, and prone bridges/planks are probably your best bet.

Does that answer your question?

 

[cgrayx]

Yes, that does answer my question, cheers mate. I didn't mean to imply that doing abs will make you cut, my bad.

In regards to the bodyfat - I simply don't understand it... I got my BF measured twice by a machine which is worth £500+ (think its Bodystat 5000) and I went from 7% to 8.2% in a few months, which is understandable as I was scarcely training. However, I don't LOOK like someone who has 8.2% BF so it makes me think it's wrong.... I dunno.You can't really see my abs at all.

Take a look at the pictures: bare in mind the tits are a product of pubertal gyno and I have ate a full days worth of food and just came back from the gym (water etc) but apart from being more flat in the morning it doesn't differ too much.

Perhaps I'd be better off uploading morning photos for you to judge whether I look 8.2% BF. Dunno how such expensive kit could be wrong tho.

 

[_cato_]

Hard to say from your pics, plus I wouldn't consider myself a pro at judging bodyfat by looking at a pic. How vascular are you in other areas of your body besides your midsection? There's two possibilities. Bodystat devices are bio-electrical impedance devices. Those types of devices tend to be somewhat inaccurate and are severely affected by hydration level and other factors, such as whether you crapped before hand etc. They can be 5% or more inaccurate. The other possibility is that you could be genetically predisposed toward carrying a lot of fat in your midsection/on your abs. In that case you should be quite vascular in other areas of your body. Keep in mind pro bodybuilders compete in the 3-5% range.

In any event, I wouldn't worry too much about the exact number. It's pretty meaningless. I'd say throw some abs work in if you have the time/energy. You don't need to go too crazy though. Something like 3 sets of 10 twice a week is fine.

 

[cgrayx]

Ok, cool. Yeah, I ended up training abs shortly after I made my first post (along with legs). I am quite vascular on my arms, etc., I guess.

I'll just have to wait and see when I start loosing fat in the future.

Thanks for your help bro, I gave you some Karma.

 

[alvin3176]

Ok I agree and disagree on the abs! Just because your trying to bulk up. Doesn't mean it's ok to skip it. That's like guys that work out there upper body, but not there legs. Look great on the top half, but look like there going to break if you add anymore weight to them. Abs are part of your body too. So you would definitely want to work them out, especially if your trying to improve in that area. As far as burning fat and bulking. All you have to do my man is eat clean. What you consume is very important on how your going to look. You can still bulk up and have abs. Bulking up on a cycle doesn't mean to get fat. I would research a little more my friend before you take the first persons advice.

 

[alvin3176]

Oh by the way! a little low intensity cardio 30 min after your work out will help get the abs to show, but at a reasonable pace are you could lose your gains. You don't need to run a 2 miles to burn fat. I also seen that you ate 19. I wouldn't advice you to do steroids at your age yet. You could stunt your growth, and cause alot of other problems i'n the future. I would read a little more info bud before you start anything heavy, and get some advice.

 

[cgrayx]

Thanks for your advice, Alvin. Even know I am here on the forum, I have no intention of doing steroids at all, lol.

The problem is I'd have to lose EXISTING fat to get my abs showing, which is hard while bulking, as you said you can lose gains etc if you're not careful

 

[cgrayx]

Ok. Take a look at this pic bro - when I took the pic last night I had all days food and water in me and the massive amount of water just consumed at the gym after taking the pic (it was night time in UK). I've looked at other pictures of 13% BF online, and I don't look like that , I don't think

I've uploaded loads of pictures from this morning (11am after eating brekfast) - I have virtually no fat on my legs or back:

 

[ExtraMile]

I would say you are 13%

at 8% you would have clear ab visibility, seperation between delt heads, delt insertion would be raised out from the arms giving them that "popping" look, you would have seperation between the differant heads of your quads. You would also probably have some veins showing in your arms.

You can use this as a reference: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=117891901

 

[cgrayx]

Hmm... It's weird how the machine is so wrong, but meh. I trust your judgement on that. I better get losing my fat then!!! And I do have veins showing in my arms Cheers bro

 

[kx250rider]

I train abs 365 days/year, and that works well for me.

Your abs should already be showing quite a bit if you're 8% BF.

YES. If they're not already well-defined, then you either have a problem with the calculation of the body fat, or you might have an unusual proportion of body fat on the ab area and be very lean elsewhere. If that's the case, unfortunately, liposuction might be the only answer. But if I were you, I'd question the body fat measurement first. The only true measurement that I know of, as of 2011, is still the bathtub method. The electrical current resistance method (where you stand barefoot on a special scales, or hold onto metal handlebars, etc etc), is only a rough guess. I had a new experimental type of calculation done in January, with a CT scan. They were unable to give a number, as it was experimental, but it might be available later this year if it proves out with the AMA.

For reference, here's me at 5.6% last year (age 43). Below 6, not only should you see a 6-pack, but also the veins start showing. http://www.efbodybuildinggallery.com/showphoto.php?photo=51015&title=abs11-2010&cat=500

Charles

 

[cgrayx]

Ah, cool. Mine was a weird one where they stick kinda small gel pads on your body. And that's not very reassuring, lipsuction?!?!?

And how can you train Abs 365 days a year? You couldn't do that with legs, arms, etc., because it wouldn't give your muscles time to repair from hypertrophy

 

[cgrayx]

Ah. Cheers buddy. I better get smashing the cardio out then

 

[cgrayx]

Yeah, when I found out my estimated bodyfat from you the plan was: 'fuck it, i'll start cutting so I can get lean etc.' I'ma have to think about which option I take carefully, that is a very good point mate, cheers

 

[kx250rider]

Ah, cool. Mine was a weird one where they stick kinda small gel pads on your body. And that's not very reassuring, lipsuction?!?!?

And how can you train Abs 365 days a year? You couldn't do that with legs, arms, etc., because it wouldn't give your muscles time to repair from hypertrophy

Reason for 365 days on abs for me, is that I don't want size as much as tone. I do 150 standard crunches + 100 each side for obliques. 1 set each. I do weighted abs (on a machine) 2 days/week or so, just to fool them and keep them ready. But I tend to get a larger overall torso if I get bigger abs, and I have small legs, which look even smaller if my torso is bigger.

Don't jump to the lipo thing yet... My wife, who is in excellent shape Karate brown belt, and a retired motocross stunt girl, has 8-9% body fat, (about perfect for her), but had to get lipo about 10 years ago because she had a layer of fat on the abs that just wouldn't go away, even when she was down to 98 lbs at 5'7" tall. Of course we men have a hormone advantage over women with body fat loss ability, as long as our hormones are working right, so it's much more likely that you wouldn't need to go the liposuction route.

Charles

 

[cgrayx]

Ah, lol, each to their own I suppose. I guess my hormones are not working right, hence the gyno, but we will see when I start losing more weight!! Cheers bro

 

[C.K.]

everyday is ab day... whether working em out directly cardio or in the kitchen get it right!

 

[ExtraMile]

Ah, lol, each to their own I suppose. I guess my hormones are not working right, hence the gyno, but we will see when I start losing more weight!! Cheers bro

I wouldn't recomend cutting for you just yet. No offence but you just don't carry enough muscle mass to look the way you probably want to while lean.

I also wouldn't recomend "bulking", yes your goal may be to gain muscle but instead of taking the typical bulking idea of shovelling lots of (usually bad) food down to push your daily cals high enough to gain weight, I would say you should eat a clean realistic diet (nothing too crazy) and do some hard cardio once or twice a week. Tweak your food intake if your not gaining size after 4 weeks or so. I don't mean to eat like a girl but don't go crazy force feeding yourself because you will end up getting fat and be back at square 1. 2500-3000kcal could be a good place to start.

I also wouldn't recomend training abs (or any muscle) every day.

 

[DaBangEm]

Despite bulking or cutting I think you should train your abs. They are apart of your core. Would you ask the same question about your chest, biceps, quads etc? No, cutting or bulking they are a muscle group that needs attention. And an important one at that.

 

[jcool20]

you're jacked brooo