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noob cycle

axismundi

New member
Alright, after trolling here a few weeks, and reading, and reading, and reading... I still can't even begin to come up with a nice cycle for a noob, me. As I'm not maxed out without anything other than protein supplementation, and still get small gains every month... could anyone take a minute (and not flame me) and maybe point me to some threads I may have missed, or even just recommend something on the lighter end that I might give a shot as a new guy?
 
Some people would want your stats to give you advice. Me I'm a week in on my first cycle and its just a simple first one.

week 1-10 Test E 500mg/wk
I have proviron and aromasin on hand if needed for sides. not taking either until then.

PCT
Phytoserms-347
Sustain Alpha
Attack for bridge while off.


But look at some of the threads that say first cycle stuff like that and you'll find your way just keep reading.
 
Quite honestly, a few weeks of research isn't going to be enough to fully understand how these compounds affect your body. That being said, your in the right place, and asking the right people. What are your stats?

Age
BF %
Weight
# of years training (consistently)

From there, people will be more inclined to offer you more input. Goodluck, and keep digging through the forum, check the "Stickies" on the top.. you should find the most valuable information there.

-EYE
 
I don't want to say my stats as sadly compared to the lot of you I'd probably be the guy getting kicked to the ground in the old charles atlas advertisements haha. Let's just say my muscle mass is by no means great, and even in a competition with the most pitiful specimens I'd still be low in rankings. My body fat % is higher than I'd like, about 15-17% depending on how you go about measuring but it's not for the lack (years) of trying to change that, just the way my body wants to be I guess but I'm not going for a cut figure anyway, I just want strength gains.

Age 26
Weight: 230lbs
Height: 6'1
Body fat: 15-17%

Training: I've never been a weight machine guy. Most of my weights are either made out of ammo cans, or I do have a nice arsenal of kettlebells... I'm not going for eye bulging muscle and what not, I'm going for general overall strength. I have no intention of ever competing or anything, I simply have to deal with heavy and awkward loads quite often and am always looking to make them more manageable.



Also Let me say I have no desire for injections, I know that might not be ideal but if you could keep availability of oral in mind when recommending I'd appreciate it... I'm just not down with the idea of injecting stuff, I don't hate needles just not comfortable with the idea.
 
Sounds like your diet and you training need work...if you're
6'1/230 then either you BF % is a lot higher or you're in better shape that you think..

Can you post your diet and how you train?

~EZ
 
Sounds like your diet and you training need work...if you're
6'1/230 then either you BF % is a lot higher or you're in better shape that you think..

Can you post your diet and how you train?

~EZ

My weight is coming down but ever so slowly, I'm down from about 290 a year ago... I just come from traditionally large people...

As far as diet, I average less than 150 carbs in a day, less than 50g of fat, and between 100g-130gish of protein a day... then I supplement omega-3, vitamins e,d,c, optimum nutrtions opti-men multi-vitamin 3x a day, extra biotin, creatine, calcium, garlic, cinnamon, tumeric, chlorophyll, and a multi-enzyme. Calorie intake varies from around 1300-1800 a day (as I'm trying to lose) and once every 15th day I'll eat whatever I want for the day and hit around 3-5k calories (do this as a way to treat myself, and to stave off starvation mode).

As far as training, I could probably use considerable improvement there as I have no real set anything but It's mostly kettbelell stuff... I hit every muscle group 1-3x a week, I space my sets out throughout the evening and end up doing 100-120 reps of any given movement per muscle group I'm working that day then the next day other muscle groups and when soreness is mostly gone I hit the first muscle groups again.
 
Bro an oral only cycle really for the most part isnt even worth the money. Without the test in there you not gonna keep anything from your orals that is gonna amount to much.
Sure you will get more muscular as long as you are on the orals but after a few months the large % of it will all be gone.
 
Bro an oral only cycle really for the most part isnt even worth the money. Without the test in there you not gonna keep anything from your orals that is gonna amount to much.
Sure you will get more muscular as long as you are on the orals but after a few months the large % of it will all be gone.


Alright I'll take that into consideration but let me ask this...

Oral will actually increase muscle though, yes? If so then I don't mind after a few months the large % being gone, as I do mostly kettlebell so if I can move into being able to do higher weight... then I still have room to DOUBLE the weight of my kettlebell yet... so as I get strength gain I can move up to a heavier ball and in theory not lose it... see I'm not actually going for like super-human, olympia/atlas muscle, I just need help moving on to more weight... mainly I just want to move up to a much heavier kettlebell by the end of the year, ideally get close to double the weight I"m doing now.
 
My weight is coming down but ever so slowly, I'm down from about 290 a year ago... I just come from traditionally large people...

As far as diet, I average less than 150 carbs in a day, less than 50g of fat, and between 100g-130gish of protein a day... then I supplement omega-3, vitamins e,d,c, optimum nutrtions opti-men multi-vitamin 3x a day, extra biotin, creatine, calcium, garlic, cinnamon, tumeric, chlorophyll, and a multi-enzyme. Calorie intake varies from around 1300-1800 a day (as I'm trying to lose) and once every 15th day I'll eat whatever I want for the day and hit around 3-5k calories (do this as a way to treat myself, and to stave off starvation mode).

As far as training, I could probably use considerable improvement there as I have no real set anything but It's mostly kettbelell stuff... I hit every muscle group 1-3x a week, I space my sets out throughout the evening and end up doing 100-120 reps of any given movement per muscle group I'm working that day then the next day other muscle groups and when soreness is mostly gone I hit the first muscle groups again.


I mean POST you diet....take a day and type what you eat from getting up to going to bed, times/portion size/how it's cooked, etc

~EZ
 
I mean POST you diet....take a day and type what you eat from getting up to going to bed, times/portion size/how it's cooked, etc

~EZ

Oh that's easy as I track EVERYTHING

2-18-11

Breakfast

Healthy Choice - Beef Pot Roast W/ Gravy - Apple Cranberry Crisp - Roasted Potatoes -Carrots. 280 calories, 41 carbs, 5 fat, 17 protein

Optimum Nutrition Gold Standard 100% Whey Protein - Strawberry Banana, 1 rounded sccop (30g) 120 calories, 3 carbs, 1 fat, 24 protein

Lunch
Promax - German Chocolate Cake Energy Bar, 1 bar (75g) 280 calories, 41 carbs, 5 fat, 20 protein

Snack
Optimum Nutrition - Fudge Truffle Protein Diet Bar, 50 grams 180 calories, 19 carbs, 3 fat, 20 protein


Dinner
Bob Evan's - Wrappers Smoked Sausage, 1 piece 390 calories, 34 carbs, 21 fat, 16 protein



2-19-11

Breakfast

Weight Watchers Smart Ones - Breakfast Quesadilla- 4 Points, 1 piece (113g) 230 calories, 2+ carbs, 7 fat, 12 protein

Optimum Nutrition Gold Standard 100% Whey Protein - Strawberry Banana, 1 rounded sccop (30g) 120 calories, 3 carbs, 1 fat, 24 protein

Lunch
Promax - German Chocolate Cake Energy Bar, 1 bar (75g) 280 calories, 41 carbs, 5 fat, 20 protein

Snack
Optimum Nutrition - Fudge Truffle Protein Diet Bar, 50 grams 180 calories, 19 carbs, 3 fat, 20 protein


Dinner
Applebee's - Asiago Peppercorn Steak Dinner W/New Potato and Steamed Vegitables, 7 oz steak AND sides 390 calories, 26 carbs, 14 fat, 43 protein



Etc.
 
Oh that's easy as I track EVERYTHING

2-18-11

Breakfast

Healthy Choice - Beef Pot Roast W/ Gravy - Apple Cranberry Crisp - Roasted Potatoes -Carrots. 280 calories, 41 carbs, 5 fat, 17 protein

Optimum Nutrition Gold Standard 100% Whey Protein - Strawberry Banana, 1 rounded sccop (30g) 120 calories, 3 carbs, 1 fat, 24 protein

Lunch
Promax - German Chocolate Cake Energy Bar, 1 bar (75g) 280 calories, 41 carbs, 5 fat, 20 protein

Snack
Optimum Nutrition - Fudge Truffle Protein Diet Bar, 50 grams 180 calories, 19 carbs, 3 fat, 20 protein


Dinner
Bob Evan's - Wrappers Smoked Sausage, 1 piece 390 calories, 34 carbs, 21 fat, 16 protein



2-19-11

Breakfast

Weight Watchers Smart Ones - Breakfast Quesadilla- 4 Points, 1 piece (113g) 230 calories, 2+ carbs, 7 fat, 12 protein

Optimum Nutrition Gold Standard 100% Whey Protein - Strawberry Banana, 1 rounded sccop (30g) 120 calories, 3 carbs, 1 fat, 24 protein

Lunch
Promax - German Chocolate Cake Energy Bar, 1 bar (75g) 280 calories, 41 carbs, 5 fat, 20 protein

Snack
Optimum Nutrition - Fudge Truffle Protein Diet Bar, 50 grams 180 calories, 19 carbs, 3 fat, 20 protein


Dinner
Applebee's - Asiago Peppercorn Steak Dinner W/New Potato and Steamed Vegitables, 7 oz steak AND sides 390 calories, 26 carbs, 14 fat, 43 protein



Etc.
your diet need alot of work, it looks very short on calories and everything is from a package and the macros are way off. Do yourself a favor and stock up on salmon, chicken breast, lean steak, eggs,egg whites, 2% milk, oatmeal, brown rice, sweet potatoes, whole wheat bread, all natural pb, spinach an brocolli. There's your grocery list all you need to do is the math on the calories and macros. calculate your bmr and add at least 500 calories to that and keep your P/C/F ration around 40/30/30. I would recommend spending your time in the diet section for now:chomp:
 
Some people would want your stats to give you advice. Me I'm a week in on my first cycle and its just a simple first one.

week 1-10 Test E 500mg/wk
I have proviron and aromasin on hand if needed for sides. not taking either until then.

PCT
Phytoserms-347
Sustain Alpha
Attack for bridge while off.


But look at some of the threads that say first cycle stuff like that and you'll find your way just keep reading.
addin the proviron atg 50mg/ed throughout cycle will only help imo:evil:
 
your diet need alot of work, it looks very short on calories and everything is from a package and the macros are way off. Do yourself a favor and stock up on salmon, chicken breast, lean steak, eggs,egg whites, 2% milk, oatmeal, brown rice, sweet potatoes, whole wheat bread, all natural pb, spinach an brocolli. There's your grocery list all you need to do is the math on the calories and macros. calculate your bmr and add at least 500 calories to that and keep your P/C/F ration around 40/30/30. I would recommend spending your time in the diet section for now:chomp:

Yeah well in the perfect world that would be nice... oatmeal and rice make me violently gag from the texture, don't eat spinach, don't eat broccoli, bread is a giant waste of calories... and I'm trying to lose weight (like 20lbs), not gain it so having 500 calories more than my BMR... wouldn't thatbe counter-productive?
 
Also, don't get me wrong... I will tweak my diet when I go to a cycle, but right now I'm just gathering intel so I can plan one, track down a source, obtain them, then start. For the time being though my diet is mainly to get these last 20ish lbs of blubber off of me that I want to
 
Yeah well in the perfect world that would be nice... oatmeal and rice make me violently gag from the texture, don't eat spinach, don't eat broccoli, bread is a giant waste of calories... and I'm trying to lose weight (like 20lbs), not gain it so having 500 calories more than my BMR... wouldn't thatbe counter-productive?
Why tweek your diet only when on a cycle? Your diet should be your focus "ON" and "OFF" . And you said you were making gains in your original post so that's why i thought you were bulking:confused: Either way your diet needs a lot of work, i wouldn't exactly call beef pot roast with gravy and apple cranberry crisp a healthy choice for breakfast lol. And those energy bars you are eating are probably full of sugar, check out the nutrition facts on the back of the wrapper, there's a lot of different diets to choose from if you're looking to drop weight. Grab a fat burner from needtobuildmuscle and hit the diet section, steriods are not the answer for your goals imo:verygood:
 
And those energy bars you are eating are probably full of sugar, check out the nutrition facts on the back of the wrapper,

0g of sugar. They aren't energy bars, that's just what they are called.. It's Optimal's protein bars...

steriods are not the answer for your goals imo
I don't want steroids to lose weight, I'm planning their use for when I've lost the fat I want to... I'm not made of money, I have to figure out what they are going to cost me now, so I can plan money out of the budget for them and see where I need to sacrifice money wise to afford them.
 
microwavable dinners are NOT bodybuilder food. I know, because I tried to build muscle for years eating them. "Healthy Choice" is a Brand name.. you got sold. Listen to these guys! They are healthy compared to McDonalds.... =\ actually.. id rather just go with mcdonalds .. lol. It sorta looks like every meal you have is processed, pre-cooked, packaged. You ARE wwhat you EAT.. and nobody wants to be a "Bob Evans Wrappers Smoked Sausage" .... hmm..actually that sounds kinda sexy.. ANYWAYS.. learn to cook real meals, It will greatly improve your fitness gains, and YOUR LIFE! vivaaaaa EF'
 
microwavable dinners are NOT bodybuilder food. I know, because I tried to build muscle for years eating them. "Healthy Choice" is a Brand name.. you got sold. Listen to these guys! They are healthy compared to McDonalds.... =\ actually.. id rather just go with mcdonalds .. lol. It sorta looks like every meal you have is processed, pre-cooked, packaged. You ARE wwhat you EAT.. and nobody wants to be a "Bob Evans Wrappers Smoked Sausage" .... hmm..actually that sounds kinda sexy.. ANYWAYS.. learn to cook real meals, It will greatly improve your fitness goals, and YOUR LIFE! vivaaaaa EF'


This thread isn't about my diet, I didn't ask for diet advice, while I appreciate it that wasn't the point of this thread. The point of this thread is to help me determine a steroid stack for a couple of months down the road. I'll worry about body-building diet, when I'm trying to make gains. Right now I'm trying to work out my stack so I can make room for it in the budget as it'll take me a couple of months to find the money... let's just try to keep it to that for now. I ate the lean cuisine for breakfast that day because It's the only thing I had in the damn house. Usually I'll have one of those as my dinner, not my breakfast... and who says I've got a kitchen to cook in?
 
It's always about diet, AAS doesn't work without diet; bottom line...

None of us live in a perfect world and most of us eat this way 365..

If you don't like spinach and broccoli you can substitute other green veggies, the whole wheat bread was a suggestion as a replacement for white bread....if you don't wanna eat oatmeal or brown rice you can substitute yams, sweet potato, or red potato...

We know you're trying to lose FAT...the reason you're not losing it is because you're eating too little and your body is "thinking" it won't get food again so it's holding onto what you put into it....by tool ittle I mean frequency, you need to increase to about 7 meals a day (small ones) and condition your body to burn off excess cuz it will know more food is coming....also you seem to be eating a ton of processed foods, which equals a lot of sodium, which is just as bad as the sugar...

~EZ
 
It's always about diet, AAS doesn't work without diet; bottom line...

None of us live in a perfect world and most of us eat this way 365..

If you don't like spinach and broccoli you can substitute other green veggies, the whole wheat bread was a suggestion as a replacement for white bread....if you don't wanna eat oatmeal or brown rice you can substitute yams, sweet potato, or red potato...

We know you're trying to lose FAT...the reason you're not losing it is because you're eating too little and your body is "thinking" it won't get food again so it's holding onto what you put into it....by tool ittle I mean frequency, you need to increase to about 7 meals a day (small ones) and condition your body to burn off excess cuz it will know more food is coming....also you seem to be eating a ton of processed foods, which equals a lot of sodium, which is just as bad as the sugar...

~EZ

I AM losing weight, like I said back toward the beginning of the thread down 60lbs in a year... down to 230 from 360 3 years ago... I think I'm doing pretty damn good... and I'm eating 4-7 meals a day now, just because breakfast says breakfast, doesn't mean it is one meal, I should have been more clear about that.
 
This thread isn't about my diet, I didn't ask for diet advice, while I appreciate it that wasn't the point of this thread. The point of this thread is to help me determine a steroid stack for a couple of months down the road. I'll worry about body-building diet, when I'm trying to make gains. Right now I'm trying to work out my stack so I can make room for it in the budget as it'll take me a couple of months to find the money... let's just try to keep it to that for now. I ate the lean cuisine for breakfast that day because It's the only thing I had in the damn house. Usually I'll have one of those as my dinner, not my breakfast... and who says I've got a kitchen to cook in?

Sir. You do realize that Diet is far more superior to your fitness goals than a "steroid stack" right? A few months down the road might be a little too soon judging from the looks of how your mentality on diet & fitness is in a whole, I am not trying to downgrade or make you look or feel stupid. I realize you are wanting more information on steroids and which ones that will benefit you, the fact of the matter is.. there are no steroids that will benefit you without proper nutrition. It just doesnt work that way unfortunately :( .. BUT having said all that, you are in the right place to learn more about the subject, the key is to learn first, then aask questions! Best O' Luck Chappyyy'
 
Lunch
Promax - German Chocolate Cake Energy Bar, 1 bar (75g) 280 calories, 41 carbs, 5 fat, 20 protein
that's why i said energy bar.........but obviously you don't wanna take any advice so go aheand and eat applebees, healthy choice dinners for breakfast, and bullshit fake ass weight loss bars for lunch and think steroids are the answer and let me know how that works out for you:splat:
 
Sir. You do realize that Diet is far more superior to your fitness goals than a "steroid stack" right? A few months down the road might be a little too soon judging from the looks of how your mentality on diet & fitness is in a whole, I am not trying to downgrade or make you look or feel stupid. I realize you are wanting more information on steroids and which ones that will benefit you, the fact of the matter is.. there are no steroids that will benefit you without proper nutrition. It just doesnt work that way unfortunately :( .. BUT having said all that, you are in the right place to learn more about the subject, the key is to learn first, then aask questions! Best O' Luck Chappyyy'


I get that diet is extremely important, don't get me wrong... but the purpose of this thread is to know what a good, preferably non injectable, stack would be so I can start finding a source, and get the money for the stack... then when I have the money and can afford it, I'll ask about diet help so I'm not just wasting my money when the nutrition isn't there to help the stack. I have a lot of financial responsibilities... I need months to siphon money for my stack, but before I can do that I need to know what sort of money I'm going to need, and how often I'm going to need it so I can decide if it's realistic to mess with roids, and to have the time to actually afford them.

Right now I'm just trying to gather data on what is a good beginner stack, and figure out what it's going to cost me.
 
that's why i said energy bar.........but obviously you don't wanna take any advice so go aheand and eat applebees, healthy choice dinners for breakfast, and bullshit fake ass weight loss bars for lunch and think steroids are the answer and let me know how that works out for you:splat:
It's NOT A WEIGHTLOSS BAR it's a protein bar, you know protein... the stuff that builds muscle. Aside from what little ingredients it takes to make it have some sort of taste, it's pure protein. I can't cook at work, I can't have refrigerated food at work, we can't even have metal utensils at work, the option is eat crap out of the vending machine, fried food from the company cafeteria, or protein bars... so I pick the healthiest choice.
 
that's why i said energy bar.........but obviously you don't wanna take any advice so go aheand and eat applebees, healthy choice dinners for breakfast, and bullshit fake ass weight loss bars for lunch and think steroids are the answer and let me know how that works out for you:splat:

:sulk: ..........
 
I AM losing weight, like I said back toward the beginning of the thread down 60lbs in a year... down to 230 from 360 3 years ago... I think I'm doing pretty damn good... and I'm eating 4-7 meals a day now, just because breakfast says breakfast, doesn't mean it is one meal, I should have been more clear about that.

130 pounds is freakin' tremendous & you should be proud of that....but that doesn't mean you (or me, or anyone) can't do things a a little better....

You lost me on what's in red ^^


~EZ
 
130 pounds is freakin' tremendous & you should be proud of that....but that doesn't mean you (or me, or anyone) can't do things a a little better....

You lost me on what's in red ^^


~EZ

When I gave 2 days of meals as an example, I lumped 2 breakfast items together, I didn't eat them at the same time though, they were 2 hours apart.
 
It's NOT A WEIGHTLOSS BAR it's a protein bar, you know protein... the stuff that builds muscle. Aside from what little ingredients it takes to make it have some sort of taste, it's pure protein. I can't cook at work, I can't have refrigerated food at work, we can't even have metal utensils at work, the option is eat crap out of the vending machine, fried food from the company cafeteria, or protein bars... so I pick the healthiest choice.

Hey bro, Canned tuna/chicken with a few slices of bread, handful of walnuts.. almonds... would beat the mess out of those protein bars, just gotta read a little more on options, the guys here know ALOTTT about what foods to eat and when, hop over into the diet forum and just read a little, ask advice, i promise after a few weeks of reading on diet and also reading on here about stacks, you will get a more clear picture on how this game is played. :beer:
 
Hey bro, Canned tuna/chicken with a few slices of bread, handful of walnuts.. almonds... would beat the mess out of those protein bars, just gotta read a little more on options, the guys here know ALOTTT about what foods to eat and when, hop over into the diet forum and just read a little, ask advice, i promise after a few weeks of reading no diet and also reading on here about stacks, you will get a more clear picture on how this game is played. :beer:

Haha I was eating chicken and tuna before the protein, I had to stop for a bit though, you can only eat canned tuna and chicken so many days in a row before you don't want to even hear the word canned/pouched meat. I actually bought some more the other day when I did my groceries as it's been a couple of months but I'm not brave enough to open the cans again haha. Had that as my work snack and meal for like 2 years straight, got burnt out... plus the promax bars have the added benefit of about 1/5 of a good multi-vitamin in them. When I get brave enough to crack open one of those cans again I'll probably alternate every day between bars and meats, and I tried doing nuts late last year but man it's like chewing on wood chips.
 
Grab a fat burner from needtobuildmuscle and hit the diet section, steriods are not the answer for your goals imo:verygood:

As far as that, I just came off an oxyelite cycle couple of weeks ago, and am now a week or so from finishing a lipo-6 black cycle... in the past I did clen but the sides were too much for me (mainly the absurd sweating, everyone would be wearing sweaters at work, and I'd be in a short sleeved shirt with 70% of my shirt soaked with sweat)... I saw the needtobuildmuscle site yesterday, but their thermogenics kinda sounded blah, but after you mentioned it I searched the forum for their different products and saw a few people liking forged burner way better than things like oxy and lipo so I've got some OT money on my check at the end of the month and am going to run Forged Burner & Adderlin next, so thanks for suggesting it otherwise I'd have never given them a second look.
 
Haha I was eating chicken and tuna before the protein, I had to stop for a bit though, you can only eat canned tuna and chicken so many days in a row before you don't want to even hear the word canned/pouched meat. I actually bought some more the other day when I did my groceries as it's been a couple of months but I'm not brave enough to open the cans again haha. Had that as my work snack and meal for like 2 years straight, got burnt out... plus the promax bars have the added benefit of about 1/5 of a good multi-vitamin in them. When I get brave enough to crack open one of those cans again I'll probably alternate every day between bars and meats, and I tried doing nuts late last year but man it's like chewing on wood chips.
there's gonna come a time when you have to decide what's more important.....the taste of your food or your goals. It take time to adjust, but oatmeal, almonds, brown rice, spinach and brocolli are foundations food for bodybuilding.
 
there's gonna come a time when you have to decide what's more important.....the taste of your food or your goals. It take time to adjust, but oatmeal, almonds, brown rice, spinach and brocolli are foundations food for bodybuilding.

I have hyperactive tastebuds and texture issues, I wasn't joking when I said oatmeal and rice make my vomit... I"m talking I put them in my mouth, move them to chew/swallow, and projectile vomit, yogurt too although yogurt just started doing that to me last year which sucks as I love yogurt. When I was little I used to eat tons of spinach and broccoli but as an adult I just can't stand the taste, I'd rather drink turpentine... although from time to time I will give the veggies I can't do another shot hoping to reclaim them...

I used to be the same with carrots, they'd gag me... but past month or so I've been taking in a lot of carrots steamed and boiled, also used to eat a ton of potatoes, but removed regular potatoes completely and switch to red potatoes and cut back on their intake too. I'll keep broccoli and spinach in mind and try them more often, I read somewhere once in a study you acquire a taste for things after 20-30x eating them so maybe I can retrain myself to tolerate them. That's the real reason I supplement so much stuff like I posted back towards the beginning, because I don't get the nutrients in my diet, I know taking them as pills isn't the best but it's better than not at all I figure even though I once saw a Russian scientist quoted as saying American's have the most expensive urine haha.
 
I have hyperactive tastebuds and texture issues, I wasn't joking when I said oatmeal and rice make my vomit... I"m talking I put them in my mouth, move them to chew/swallow, and projectile vomit, yogurt too although yogurt just started doing that to me last year which sucks as I love yogurt. When I was little I used to eat tons of spinach and broccoli but as an adult I just can't stand the taste, I'd rather drink turpentine... although from time to time I will give the veggies I can't do another shot hoping to reclaim them...

I used to be the same with carrots, they'd gag me... but past month or so I've been taking in a lot of carrots steamed and boiled, also used to eat a ton of potatoes, but removed regular potatoes completely and switch to red potatoes and cut back on their intake too. I'll keep broccoli and spinach in mind and try them more often, I read somewhere once in a study you acquire a taste for things after 20-30x eating them so maybe I can retrain myself to tolerate them. That's the real reason I supplement so much stuff like I posted back towards the beginning, because I don't get the nutrients in my diet, I know taking them as pills isn't the best but it's better than not at all I figure even though I once saw a Russian scientist quoted as saying American's have the most expensive urine haha.
well what about green beans and asparigus? I don't believe carrots have a lot of nutrional value from a bodybuilders standpoint. As far as carbs go what about sweet potatos? if you can eat those then that would be a solid choice
 
well what about green beans and asparigus? I don't believe carrots have a lot of nutrional value from a bodybuilders standpoint. As far as carbs go what about sweet potatos? if you can eat those then that would be a solid choice

Pretty much corn, potatoes, and carrots are all I can stand, but like I said I keep working at that, I haven't had green beans in ages I'll have to give them a go again next time I go to the grocery.
 
Alright I'll take that into consideration but let me ask this...

Oral will actually increase muscle though, yes?
Correct it will.
If so then I don't mind after a few months the large % being gone, as I do mostly kettlebell so if I can move into being able to do higher weight... then I still have room to DOUBLE the weight of my kettlebell yet... so as I get strength gain I can move up to a heavier ball and in theory not lose it...
Ok, here is how it plays out.
Yes you will move up to a heaiver ball pretty dam fast too, while you are on. When you go off, you will maintain this for a short period of time and then your strength will decrease rapidly to a point. So what you will be left with is, yes your ball weight will go up but in the end I dont think you will maintain/be working out with dbl the the ball weigtht.
see I'm not actually going for like super-human, olympia/atlas muscle, I just need help moving on to more weight... mainly I just want to move up to a much heavier kettlebell by the end of the year, ideally get close to double the weight I"m doing now.
I do understand that you simply wanna increase your workout weights (primarily) and secondarily gain a little bit of mucsle mass maybe.

Now I know that you are sick and tired of hearing diet but honestly bro I feel that is where you should be looking.
Heres why.
With any steroid, even orals you are introducing a chemical into your body. When you do this you get side effects. Remember your sweating experience.....

Now for what you are saying you want to achieve you can very easily do the very same and more simply with diet.
Then you have no possibe side effects to mess around with. You dont need to spend the money and take the associated risks of obtaining illegal steroids.

You dont need to spend the time educating yourself on the steroids, protocol and recovery.
Even with orals you also need to consider PCT, yet another added expense that could easily turn into something long term. Also there are the blood tests expenses to deal with. On orals espicially you really need to do these cuz orals are hard on your liver and can really fuck with its function.

You have done well with your diet and weight loss.:)
But we are all telling you that for what you say you are wanting, really and truely diet is the way to go, its just so much easier in the long run, and much much less expensive. No crappy sides to deal with that could possible turn in something long term....

Not what you wanna hear I know that. But there you have it.
Actually it would not really take that much change in your diet to see some quick but very noticalbe improvements. In fact prolly faster then the time frame that you have laid out.

Good luck on whatever you decide bro. And for you and all of us Keep reading on here and keep posting too!:):evil:
 
With any steroid, even orals you are introducing a chemical into your body. When you do this you get side effects. Remember your sweating experience.....

The sides don't scare me, but I'd like to leave sticking needles in my skin to medical professionals that know what the hell they are doing haha.... plus I"d be paranoid a needle wasn't sterile, so I'd have to buy my own autoclave to keep my paranoia down, and I figure if something is bogus, swallowing it gives me that much longer to live if someone put something to kill me in the liquid because their dog died and their wife left them for their brother so they snapped and decided to kill anyone trying to get bigger muscle because the brother was a bodybuilder hahah. My mind is a fracked up world...


Now, after reading the rest of your post... perhaps non steroid supplements? Instead of starting a second thread, lets pretend my diet is fine now (I'll start tearing through other bits of the forum for diet/nutrition here in a few minutes), would there be any non anabolic things I should look at picking up?
 
The sides don't scare me, but I'd like to leave sticking needles in my skin to medical professionals that know what the hell they are doing haha.... plus I"d be paranoid a needle wasn't sterile, so I'd have to buy my own autoclave to keep my paranoia down, and I figure if something is bogus, swallowing it gives me that much longer to live if someone put something to kill me in the liquid because their dog died and their wife left them for their brother so they snapped and decided to kill anyone trying to get bigger muscle because the brother was a bodybuilder hahah. My mind is a fracked up world...


Now, after reading the rest of your post... perhaps non steroid supplements? Instead of starting a second thread, lets pretend my diet is fine now (I'll start tearing through other bits of the forum for diet/nutrition here in a few minutes), would there be any non anabolic things I should look at picking up?
If you insist on going with something I would grab some katana or hella from mrsupps before they are out of stock. There being banned and taken off the market so grab them while you can. And when you diet is in check run a 4 week katana cycle:evil: but I would wait until your bf% is under 15% which will give you time to dial in your diet and training in the meantime
 
Alright there, I posted a weeks worth of my food intake, and my weird experience eating plants, and my supplements over in the diet thread, now all of you insisting I work on my diet hahaha you can be happy :)
 
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