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Kwanzaa... Your Opinion's Please.

Crazier

New member
Bitch please. Just another form of "reverse" racism.

Kwanzaa, (matunda ya kwanza, Swahili for "first fruits"), an African American holiday observed by African communities throughout the world that celebrates family, community, and culture. It is a seven-day holiday that begins December 26 and continues through January 1. Kwanzaa has its roots in the ancient African first-fruit harvest celebrations from which it takes its name. However, its modern history begins in 1966 when it was developed by African American scholar and activist Maulana Karenga.

Kwanzaa is organized around five fundamental activities common to other African first-fruit celebrations: (1) the ingathering of family, friends, and community; (2) reverence for the creator and creation (including thanksgiving and recommitment to respect the environment and heal the world); (3) commemoration of the past (honoring ancestors, learning lessons and emulating achievements of African history); (4) recommitment to the highest cultural ideals of the African community (for example, truth, justice, respect for people and nature, care for the vulnerable, and respect for elders); and (5) celebration of the "Good of Life" (for example, life, struggle, achievement, family, community, and culture).

Kwanzaa is celebrated through rituals, dialogue, narratives, poetry, dancing, singing, drumming and other music, and feasting. A central practice is the lighting of the mishumaa (seven candles) of Kwanzaa. A candle is lit each day for each of the Nguzo Saba (Seven Principles). These principles are umoja (unity); kujichagulia (self-determination); ujima (collective work and responsibility); ujamaa (cooperative economics); nia (purpose); kuumba (creativity); and imani (faith). Kwanzaa ends with a day of assessment on which celebrants raise and answer questions of cultural and moral grounding and consider their worthiness in family, community, and culture.
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If we are all equal, why does the "African-American" community choose to segregate itself? Funny, no... not really, ironic, how they are the only one's to have a holiday because of their skin color.
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If we are all equal, why do the Jewish, Muslim, and Catholic communities choose to segregate themselves?

This is not "racism." It's a type of segregative celebration in which only members of a particular race are able to participate (according to the information you have provided... I'm not sure if whitey can convert himself to Kwanzaaity or something), but we see the same thing all year.

I don't see any part of this celebration talking shit about other cultures or Mr. Whitey. As far as I see it's somewhat of a "it's our party, stay out" celebration.

As long as whitey is allowed to start a "Whitezaa" holiday where they celebrate their struggles and shit and have a "WHITE ONLY" sign on the door with no problems, then I don't see the big deal.

Just hope the music is off by the time I go to bed...

-Warik
 
I can understand what you're saying Warik. However, the parties you mention, Jewish, Muslim, Catholic... they are all choices. People are celebrating because they believe in their faith and communit, and the choice they made to become a part of that idealogy. I shouldn't have said 'racism', rather segregation... and it is not something I can convert to, nor they can convert from.

And, I don't see a whitezaa, waacp, national scholarships for the poor white kid foundation.... etc...

I just believe that before their can be true equality; there would have to a change in some ideas. If they truely want equality, why isn't it something that we all take part in to strengthen our community and country TOGETHER?
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who cares? if they want to have thier own holiday, let em. and if you're interested, I'm sure you can celebrate it if you want to.
 
Crazier said:
I can understand what you're saying Warik. However, the parties you mention, Jewish, Muslim, Catholic... they are all choices. People are celebrating because they believe in their faith and communit, and the choice they made to become a part of that idealogy. I shouldn't have said 'racism', rather segregation... and it is not something I can convert to, nor they can convert from.

Yes.. but Kwanzaa is a choice too. I'm sure there are many black guys (oops, I mean "African-Americans") out there who don't celebrate Kwanzaa.

Crazier said:
And, I don't see a whitezaa, waacp, national scholarships for the poor white kid foundation.... etc...

You don't see those things because no white guys have had the care or the balls to stand up to political correctness and do it. Why not start a white scholarship or some kind of white-only organization? Because it's considered racist. It's considered, but it is not. It will happen one day, and that day will be the day everyone realizes how foolish and futile all of this "white vs. black vs. jew vs. asian vs. arab" bullshit is. Surprise surprise mr. whites blacks jews asians and arabs, you're all humans. Stop bickering amongst yourselves. Go find an alien species and bicker with them so they can blast yer whiney asses up.

:)

-Warik
 
I don't know a single African American that celebrates Kwanzaa.


I mean, I'd like to actually because ritual celebrations fascinates me. No really they do - no sarcasm.
 
Happy Saturnalia


rca11.jpg
 
Mb- Good one.

Kwanzaa was started by a black man who is in jail for murdering two other blacks....desopite being black himself he is an avid black hater.

He is currently incarcerated in CA, and designed this holiday to laugh at blacks who would actually celebrate it.

it is a crock of shit.
 
MattTheSkywalker said:
Mb- Good one.

Kwanzaa was started by a black man who is in jail for murdering two other blacks....desopite being black himself he is an avid black hater.

He is currently incarcerated in CA, and designed this holiday to laugh at blacks who would actually celebrate it.

it is a crock of shit.

Well, so? Christmas was started by a bunch of criminals in the Roman Empire. Huh? Huh? See!
 
Some truth about Xmas/Kwanzaa...But for different reasons. :-)
 
MattTheSkywalker said:
Kwanzaa was started by a black man who is in jail for murdering two other blacks....desopite being black himself he is an avid black hater.

He is currently incarcerated in CA, and designed this holiday to laugh at blacks who would actually celebrate it.

Haha... LOL!
 
Multiculturalism at its worst. A needless, made-up Holiday that serves to further divide American society.

It's laughable that people include it in their list of Holiday wishes along with Hanukka and Christmas.

Never to be celebrated or acknowledged in my home. Christmas is Christmas.
 
To me, both Chanhukah and Kwanzaa are bullshit holidays to keep up with Christianity. Everyone's having fun at christmas with santa claus and stuff so, naturally, everyone gets jealous who isn't a Christian and they want their own day as an excuse to have fun and give out presents.

Kwanzaa just seemed to pop up recently and any Jew will tell you that Chanhukah isn't supposed to be an important holiday like Christmas is. I'm not a jew so I don't know the real important one but I do know the real Jew holiday just doesn't get the kind of attention that this stupid holiday gets. It just reflects the commercialism of it all.
 
No doubt the rising Hispanic population in the US has the Hallmark executives scrambling to come up with a new "Latino" Winter Holiday.

Some names probably being thrown around: Winter Fiesta, Christmasita, La Festiv'al de la Noel.
 
Someone prepped in Photoshop should make a rendition of the last supper. However, James Earl Jones from "Coming to America" should be seated around a table of Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Beetlegeuse from Howard Stern, etc.

Mike Tyson can be the guy that wants to kill Jesus.
 
PsychoSkitz said:
Someone prepped in Photoshop should make a rendition of the last supper. However, James Earl Jones from "Coming to America" should be seated around a table of Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Beetlegeuse from Howard Stern, etc.

Mike Tyson can be the guy that wants to kill Jesus.

now why did you have to put James Earl Jones in that picture!!?!? Let's replace him with Lewis Farahkan.
 
for real, James Earl Jones is cool. when you are the voice of Darth Vader, you gotta be cool. he's cool for way more than that though, he's one helluvan actor and one of my favs.
 
Sushi X said:
he's cool for way more than that though, he's one helluvan actor and one of my favs.

Conan the Barbarian, The Great White Hope and the Bingo Long Traveling All-Stars and Motor Kings are three of my favorite JEJ flicks.
 
68GT350 said:
To me, both Chanhukah and Kwanzaa are bullshit holidays to keep up with Christianity.

Kwanzaa just seemed to pop up recently and any Jew will tell you that Chanhukah isn't supposed to be an important holiday like Christmas is. I'm not a jew so I don't know the real important one but I do know the real Jew holiday just doesn't get the kind of attention that this stupid holiday gets. It just reflects the commercialism of it all.


The events of Chanukah actually predate Jesus by many years.

Kwanzaa is brand new: about 30 years old actually.

Christmas only happens in December because the romans stuck it there: there was a festival called Saturnalia, and when Christianity became the religion of the Empire, Christmas replaced Saturnalia as the reason to celebrate in December.

Passover is the most important holiday to Jews. Chanukah is not really a big deal in their religion.
 
MattTheSkywalker said:



Christmas only happens in December because the romans stuck it there: there was a festival called Saturnalia, and when Christianity became the religion of the Empire, Christmas replaced Saturnalia as the reason to celebrate in December.


No shit?!?! I thought it was the day Jesus was born?!?!
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Well Matt... I hope your meaning of Kwazaa is more accurate than your idea of the Christmas celebration.

What is the true meaning of Christmas?

The stores are all stocked with Christmas trees, Santa Claus, Elves, and Eight tiny reindeer. All these things we now associate with Christmas are practically the only things we see. But Christmas is more than that. Christmas is about Jesus, it is His birthday and that is what we celebrate and the reason we give gifts on Christmas. Let us take a look now, at the typical modern Christmas as compared to that night long ago. The star that lead the wise men to the manger has been replaced by thousands of glowing Christmas lights. The sheep and cattle, have all been replaced by reindeer. The shepards have been replaced by elves. Jesus himself has even been replaced by a guy in a red suit who's name is Santa. Bethlehem has been relocated to the North Pole for a modern Christmas. Even the Salvation army wears santa suits when they are a Christian group. But it is too often that we forget the true meaning of Christmas. We get all caught up in what we're going to give people or get from our parents to make it a perfectly happy Christmas. Well, you'll never do it. You can't make someone perfectly happy with a gift. Only Jesus can do that. No gift on earth can measure up to the gift he gave that Christmas. Eternal life. We all need to remeber Jesus Christ on our Christmas.
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I went to an Episcopal high school and learned that Christmas was actually a pagan holiday. Christains called it Jesus's birthday to be on that day to have something in common w/ the pagans so they would all convert to Christianity. Ever since, Dec. 25th has been Jesus's bday.

As a Muslim, we beelive that Jesus was born in some time other than the winter time. In the Koran it says MAry was holding on to a date tree that was full of ripe dates when giving birth to Jesus, and the tree shook and the dates fell. Scholars interepret that to be sometime in where dates are harvested (Not December)

anyways these are 2 interesting ideas i wanted to share.
LAter
Omar
 
ttlpkg said:
No doubt the rising Hispanic population in the US has the Hallmark executives scrambling to come up with a new "Latino" Winter Holiday.

Some names probably being thrown around: Winter Fiesta, Christmasita, La Festiv'al de la Noel.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA

AWESOME!!!!
 
omar said:
I went to an Episcopal high school and learned that Christmas was actually a pagan holiday. Christains called it Jesus's birthday to be on that day to have something in common w/ the pagans so they would all convert to Christianity. Ever since, Dec. 25th has been Jesus's bday.

As a Muslim, we beelive that Jesus was born in some time other than the winter time. In the Koran it says MAry was holding on to a date tree that was full of ripe dates when giving birth to Jesus, and the tree shook and the dates fell. Scholars interepret that to be sometime in where dates are harvested (Not December)

anyways these are 2 interesting ideas i wanted to share.
LAter
Omar

it's all subjective bro. not everybody agrees with what the koran says, just like not everyone agrees with the bible too. I've read that islam was based on paganism. I don't believe it, but I've read it. So the lesson is, don't believe everything you read, I don't care if it's a holy book or a comic book.
 
i know that... i never told u to beleive it, Just sharing different views.

and trust me, i dont believe everything I read; but thanks for the very wise lesson. I wish more people could benefit from your open mindedness

later

Omar
 
Crazier said:
Well Matt... I hope your meaning of Kwazaa is more accurate than your idea of the Christmas celebration.

What is the true meaning of Christmas?

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Crazier,

You're mixing apples and oranges here. Christmas occurs in December due to the Roman Empire's adaptation of Christianty by the emperor Constantine in 315. The Romans repalced their Saturnalia festival with Christmas. Historical data seems to indicate that Jesus was born in the Spring.

Modern Christianity is rife with the imprints of the Roman emperor? You likely know htat churches are members of a diocese, heade by a bishop? Well, the very word diocese originates from the Roman emperor Diocletian, who implemented dioceses.

As the church grew, it simply adapted local traditions and customs to allow conversion by pagans without bloodshed. The Christmas tree and wreath were adapted from germanic peoples as the religion spread. Likewise Santa Claus.

This is just a brief look at the history of Christmas. The meaning of it, to you or others, can be different.
 
Sushi X said:
for real, James Earl Jones is cool. when you are the voice of Darth Vader, you gotta be cool. he's cool for way more than that though, he's one helluvan actor and one of my favs.
He was the voice of Darth Vader, u learn something new everyday!
 
Crazier... where do you work these days???

send me a e-mail and give me the haps.
 
Warik said:
If we are all equal, why do the Jewish, Muslim, and Catholic communities choose to segregate themselves?

This is not "racism." It's a type of segregative celebration in which only members of a particular race are able to participate (according to the information you have provided... I'm not sure if whitey can convert himself to Kwanzaaity or something), but we see the same thing all year.

I don't see any part of this celebration talking shit about other cultures or Mr. Whitey. As far as I see it's somewhat of a "it's our party, stay out" celebration.

As long as whitey is allowed to start a "Whitezaa" holiday where they celebrate their struggles and shit and have a "WHITE ONLY" sign on the door with no problems, then I don't see the big deal.

Just hope the music is off by the time I go to bed...

-Warik

You are a very witty motherfucker warik...
 
Could be true being that december here in the Northern Hemisphere is Winter where it may be summer down there. Or its just hot all year round down there that such plants can grow year round.

omar said:
I went to an Episcopal high school and learned that Christmas was actually a pagan holiday. Christains called it Jesus's birthday to be on that day to have something in common w/ the pagans so they would all convert to Christianity. Ever since, Dec. 25th has been Jesus's bday.

As a Muslim, we beelive that Jesus was born in some time other than the winter time. In the Koran it says MAry was holding on to a date tree that was full of ripe dates when giving birth to Jesus, and the tree shook and the dates fell. Scholars interepret that to be sometime in where dates are harvested (Not December)

anyways these are 2 interesting ideas i wanted to share.
LAter
Omar
 
What does it matter? How is it hurting you? I'm black (I hate the term african american) and I don't celebrate it but who cares if other people do. I also don't care about the hispanic community celebrating Dia de los muertos, Cinco de Mayo or deice seis(sp). One holiday I did grow up celebrating is June 19th which is a Black-Texan holiday, because that's when we finally found out that we had been freed from slavery. I just don't understand how it could upset someone if a group of people are trying to bring together a community or a group of people. And how do you concider it reverse racism? If you wanted to participate you could. My religion is AME, African Methodist Episcopal, but you know what? I can bring my white husband and my half white child to church and no one gives it a second thought. :rolleyes:
 
BronzedGoddess said:
What does it matter? How is it hurting you? I'm black (I hate the term african american) and I don't celebrate it but who cares if other people do. I also don't care about the hispanic community celebrating Dia de los muertos, Cinco de Mayo or deice seis(sp). One holiday I did grow up celebrating is June 19th which is a Black-Texan holiday, because that's when we finally found out that we had been freed from slavery. I just don't understand how it could upset someone if a group of people are trying to bring together a community or a group of people. And how do you concider it reverse racism? If you wanted to participate you could. My religion is AME, African Methodist Episcopal, but you know what? I can bring my white husband and my half white child to church and no one gives it a second thought. :rolleyes:

I too dislike the term african american... let's call a spade a spade. I'm white, you're black. No biggie. We're both American.

I started this post a while back, because I wanted to hear people's opinions on the matter. I never said that it particularily bothered me... I could care less what someone else believes in or celebrates so long as it encourages goodness. That's the truth. But, I also don't belong to an organization that supports one group and not the other. February is black history month. I know that much. When is the Indians? Afterall, they are the fuckin' founders of the land. And when is white history month? And don't bother saying 'the other 11 months.' :rolleyes: My point is, in order for us all to be equal, we can't segregate parties. There is simply no reason to. The birth of Jesus is celebrated one day, yet Kwaanza takes a week? Then, a month and a week later you have black history month? If anything, I think it would be a much better idea to celebrate the June 19th date you mentioned about the freedom of slavery. Then, blacks and whites would have something to celebrate together. Rather than me 'being able, or having the right to participate in Black History Month or Kwanzaa' I would celebrate for the rights we all have in this country, and on the 19th of June I can sit in a bar with whites and blacks alike and share a few drinks without one ruling over another, without one being superior... that's something the blacks and whites can be proud together on.

Please refer back to my original post which explains kwanzaa, the reason to celebrate... and where whites could possibly fit into the party.

I just don't understand the segregation. And, segregation it is. Unless you work for the NCAAP, I don't see how you or anyone else could disagree.
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First let me address this. Indians live in India, the people over here when Columbus "discovered" the US are Native Americans. Sorry this is another pet peeve of mind because I am too of native american ancestry AND caucasion ancestry (just like 70% of the blacks in the US). I understand how you feel it is segregation but most minorities don't want to "blend" in with the white society. We want to have the same opportunities as a white person but why must we loose sight of our heritage. America is made up of more nationalities than any other country in the world. This is a strength. But every nationality brought something with them to this country and they should have the right to celebrate it not just the National holidays. You know what sucks, I have no idea which country in Africa my ancestors were from, I have no idea which country in Europe my ancestors are from, although I looked up my last name and all roads point to Wales or Germany. The only real thing I know is which native american tribe my ancestors are a part of. I understand how this may be hard for you to understand, and I'm not angry with you because of that. But I do believe that you should embrace what makes this country diverse and don't sweat the small stuff like people celebrating kwanza.
 
I invent holidays all the time to create more reasons to drink and carry on like a fool. If people want to celebrate a day that has no real meaning, then let them - even better if the day does have meaning.

That said, MAD is almost upon us again.
 
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