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I think my gear days are over!!!!

pittbull2

New member
I just got from the hospital started having chest pain 2 weeks ago and
finally went to emerg room and they
gaveme nitro Glycerin 3 times and then morphine and it was still hurting so
they ran some tests and had to do emergency surgery found 99 % blockage
and had to put a stent in. Now they are saying that i cant have any fluid on me because it will make me have congestive heart failure :bawling: has anyone else reading this had a stent put in and still
do gear???? let me know , i have lost 8 lbs while in hospital but they still had to use the biggest blood pressure cuff to take my blood pressure hehe they were starving me !!!!!
 
no experience with a stent but good luck with your health. maybe stopping aas till things are resolved is a good idea. hope everything turns out ok.
 
Sux...

I'm sorry to hear that bro. I hate to use examples to show some of the @$$es on here that there can be potentially dangerous sides to using A.S. which is why i recommend the lowest doses possible not to mention lots of time between cycles. Also the fact that if you chose to do A.S. you better use certain supps for preventative measures but they do not always guarenteed to help!!! Wish you the best bro... ~JT~ :angel:
 
Uuuummm.....if you are close to heart failure than why don't you give up on the gear? Come on man....you can't stay on the sauce your entire life, especially if you are having these types of problems.
 
GOOD LUCK BRO, AS FOR THE GEAR, FORGET ABOUT IT, MAN YOU BEING ALIVE IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING!!!!!BEST OF LUCK TO YOU AND YOUR FAMILIY....
 
Re: Sux...

TheDarkSideNinja said:
I'm sorry to hear that bro. I hate to use examples to show some of the @$$es on here that there can be potentially dangerous sides to using A.S. which is why i recommend the lowest doses possible not to mention lots of time between cycles. Also the fact that if you chose to do A.S. you better use certain supps for preventative measures but they do not always guarenteed to help!!! Wish you the best bro... ~JT~ :angel:

I'm not saying it came from gear , but it was collapsed the picture look just like 2
sharp pencils on each side of the artery point to point barely big enough to get there little wire through it my chest in the middle was extremely tight and BAD burning feeling!!!
 
could be the gear, maybe not though.

its hard to pin point the culprit.

be strong dude.
 
sorry to hear it bro. my brother juiced maybe 12 years ended up having some heart problems hard to say if they were related but its likely. anyway he gave up the sauce for about two years and then started back up. after two cycles he was back in the hospital. he's juice free these days training natural and says he wont juice again. be careful whatever it is you decide to do, on one hand you only live once, but on the other life is to short to possibly end it early. good luck
foo
 
I would suggest staying away from the juice. It's not worth dying over. Remember, bodybuilding is about self improvement; making a heart condition worse is certainly not improvement.
 
Gear is insignificant, forget about it, all of it. Linus Pauling has a protocol for heart disease that includes Vitamin C and L-Lysine in large doses. Do a Google search and read up. Also, look into chelation therapy, it could help out some. All the best to you brother.
 
Gear fucks your lipid profile to hell. If you have high LDL and low HDL for long enough, particualrly if you are predisposed to it, blockage is highly likely. I agree, your gear days are over. Do lost of cardio. look at the bright side, hGH is always an option, it improves lipid profile. (so im told)
 
sorry to hear that bro, thanks for sharing it with the board, that is a significant problem you have there. Next step after is a Coronary Bypass if you dont take care of yourself. May I ask your age?

Also CHF isnt something to be taken lightly, it isnt something that just comes and can be treated, everytime you retain fluid like that it puts a tremendous stress on the heart and forces the mycoardium to hypertrophy and this decreases coronary flow even more and keeps adding to the problem,
good luck.
 
Sorry to hear about the health problems. I agree with everybody else, stay away from the gear. Life is precious, a few pounds of muscle isn't worth it. Good luck. Stay strong brother!
 
Thanks for all the concern my brothers,I'm hanging on to a skinny little
208 lbs at 5 "6 1/2 but i lost 8 - 10 lbs in the hospital
because of fasting and the meds they gave me i guess and i'm not able to train for awhile. I guess i will be able to train
does anyone know anyone that has had a stent put in there main artery and trains hard , please let me know I just turned 45 and have been training since
my teenage years and cant stop .I have cut my cals down to about 2000 aday for 7 months and stay 215 + so i hope i dont get to small if i do i guess i will change my name from pittbull2 to pussycat .:bawling:
 
5'6 208 small......maybe I missed the sarcasm and you were joking...but dude thats not small (compared to me at least).
 
Re: Sux...

TheDarkSideNinja said:
I'm sorry to hear that bro. I hate to use examples to show some of the @$$es on here that there can be potentially dangerous sides to using A.S. which is why i recommend the lowest doses possible not to mention lots of time between cycles. Also the fact that if you chose to do A.S. you better use certain supps for preventative measures but they do not always guarenteed to help!!! Wish you the best bro... ~JT~ :angel:

You're making the assumption that AAS was the source of causation, but cannot determine that. Additionally, I will point out that many nonjuicers have this health problem.
 
pittbull2 said:
Thanks for all the concern my brothers,I'm hanging on to a skinny little
208 lbs at 5 "6 1/2 but i lost 8 - 10 lbs in the hospital
because of fasting and the meds they gave me i guess and i'm not able to train for awhile. I guess i will be able to train
does anyone know anyone that has had a stent put in there main artery and trains hard , please let me know I just turned 45 and have been training since
my teenage years and cant stop .I have cut my cals down to about 2000 aday for 7 months and stay 215 + so i hope i dont get to small if i do i guess i will change my name from pittbull2 to pussycat .:bawling:

You hang in there brother. I don't know why a stint would mean an end to exercise or even weight training. Best thing is to ask your doc about what your limits are. I think you'll find out that there isn't too many. Also, if you have that much occlusion in one artery then the chances you have plaque buildup in others is possible. You may want to consider taking something for preventing clotting such as Nattokinase and also something to help minimize as much as possible arterial inflammation such as FYI, Wobenzym and Samento. I wish you all the best brother and you'll be in my prayers friend.

:)
 
You're making the assumption that AAS was the source of causation, but cannot determine that. Additionally, I will point out that many nonjuicers have this health problem.


This is Denial. And its poor, advice. AAS in FACT change your lipid profile to include high levels of LDL (bad cholesterol). No matter how you slice it, AAS were not helping and probably are a major contributor. Yes, nonjuicers have this problem, but if you are predisiposed to it, and you add juice, its going to make it worse...

Its my opinion that the problem came from all the bulking food ate daily ,RED MEAT.

Again, dont be rediculous. Red meat is certainly a contributing factor, but the AAS are more likely to drastically change your lipid profile..... Be true to yourself. You have increased your genetic potential and will have lifelong gains from juice. Stick to slin or hGH but stay away from AAS....
 
READ my thread : My gear days may be over too.

It sucks but I'm starting to accept it. At least we didnt die and have a second chance. I'm nit going to waste mine. If I ever do something again matybe in a year it wont be anything that puts on much weight. good luck bro
 
Recover my man, as you recover research testosterone treatment in men with congestive heart failure. You had a close call but that is not a reason to give up the lifestyle that you love, however you must learn to modify that lifestyle and make changes. Ant-e's and lasix will keep fluid retention down enough so as not to affect
CHF. I know a little over three years I contracted viral endocarditis and it really messed my heart up. My family was told that I would not survive 24 hours. Then I was told that I would not not last six months without an heart transplant, my injection fraction at the time was barely 15%. I started light weightlifting and walking on the threadmill a few minutes at a time. I was also put on the heart med coreg and bp med atacand. Sat. April 12th I will compete in a large bodybuilding show. My heart had enlarged to the extent that the valves were not working anyway near the way that they were meant to. Now I only have mild mitral valve insuffiencey, and no murmmer, brfore I had one hell of a murmmer with constant pcv's. Also my cardiologist has stated that my heart has repaired itself to the extent that it should last me at least another 30 years. So hang in there , if I can be of help let me know.:)
 
I'm not sure if you have muscle dysmorphia or not but I just can't believe that the only thing you are worried about right now is getting smaller. There are many things in the world that are much more important than muscles and your life is one of them. We should be working out to stay healthy and that seems to be the opposite of what many people are doing. Just take it one day at a time and see what happens.
 
40butpumpin said:


You hang in there brother. I don't know why a stint would mean an end to exercise or even weight training. Best thing is to ask your doc about what your limits are. I think you'll find out that there isn't too many. Also, if you have that much occlusion in one artery then the chances you have plaque buildup in others is possible. You may want to consider taking something for preventing clotting such as Nattokinase and also something to help minimize as much as possible arterial inflammation such as FYI, Wobenzym and Samento. I wish you all the best brother and you'll be in my prayers friend.

:)



I agree w/ the above, and also w/ the idea of chelation. I've seen people w/ stents do quite well afterwards with such therapies, and continue thier exersize regimens.
Also, everyone is so quick to condemn the gear; how many men each year in their 40's manifest coronary artery disease who've never touched AAS?
I'm not necessarily suggesting he continue high dose AAS, but so many people tend to come out of the woodwork in these situations with blanket condemnations and poorly thought out advice.
We have all heard only the tip of the iceberg in terms of his history. The CHF potential maybe be strictly temporary, unless he infarcted a big portion of his ventricle, which it doesn't sound like he did. Also, we know next to nothing about coexistent diseases, other medications, superimposed coronary vasospasm, and a lot of other factors.
Let the man settle in with the new situation, and get some direction from his physicians (they kinda know the situation just a little better than us!)
 
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IMO you should be forgetting about EVERYTHING right now and focus on your health bro....The heart is the lifeline to your body, u gotta get healthy brutha...My father had a quad bipass at 47(or 48, one of them) so I know how serious these things can be. PLEASE, just relax and do what ever it takes to get healthy...keep us posted

M18
 
It would be nice to know how well he was doing before the gear, during gear and in recovery. Yet another reason to keep a close eye on your vitals.

Example: My ldl/hdl ratio before were very good, but with AS they go completely sideways. Since I am looking at a lifelong choice, I don't do the mondo bulking and I do lots of AM cardio.
 
pharmguy said:
You're making the assumption that AAS was the source of causation, but cannot determine that. Additionally, I will point out that many nonjuicers have this health problem.


This is Denial. And its poor, advice. AAS in FACT change your lipid profile to include high levels of LDL (bad cholesterol). No matter how you slice it, AAS were not helping and probably are a major contributor. Yes, nonjuicers have this problem, but if you are predisiposed to it, and you add juice, its going to make it worse...

Its my opinion that the problem came from all the bulking food ate daily ,RED MEAT.

Again, dont be rediculous. Red meat is certainly a contributing factor, but the AAS are more likely to drastically change your lipid profile..... Be true to yourself. You have increased your genetic potential and will have lifelong gains from juice. Stick to slin or hGH but stay away from AAS....

lol Looks like you're in denial here. I am aware of the changes C-17AA AAS can have upon the lipid profiles of users, however, you don't know whether or not they are the cause, as he could very well have been predisposed. You'd rather demonize than look at it in a more objective fashion.

"probably are a major contributor"

Sheer opinionated speculation without any factual evidence IN THIS USER to back it up.
 
PHARMGUY....

Thankx for posting logical info. bro and all the others who can get past denial. I didn't say it was directly from AAS usage but only that it didn't help the situation and more than likely contributed to it!!! Predisposition sucks and just some advice before using AAS i feel people should do a health history on their family to see if anything runs in the family like heart probs., cancers, etc..
 
Baoh said:


lol Looks like you're in denial here. I am aware of the changes C-17AA AAS can have upon the lipid profiles of users, however, you don't know whether or not they are the cause, as he could very well have been predisposed. You'd rather demonize than look at it in a more objective fashion.

"probably are a major contributor"

Sheer opinionated speculation without any factual evidence IN THIS USER to back it up.

Lol ,ok i know the gear didn't help and i know that i started having more sides while on such as RED FACE constantly
HR of 132 resting esp after the last cycle of EQ at 500 mgs & DECA 400 mgs & TEST Enanthate 500 mgs i started waking up with my heart POUNDING !!! i knew something wasn't right so i stoped the EQ and it got better but maybe the problem was there already and it made it worse , i dont know but through all of that i gained some good size and at 5'6 1/2 220 lbs people said i looked like i was unstopable like a tank but i guess they were wrong .All i can say is thank GOD i went to the hospital because they said i was fixing to have a massive heart attack and i have 2 sons i want to be here for them. BTW my hdl/ldl ratio was off for a few months to the neg so i would suggest watching that
my brothers !!!! Also i was just doing reps with 315 two days before i went in so i should be able to workout now that the artery is open but i will take a month off and hit it again and do some walking during my brake from the weights.
 
Bro there're things more important in your life than another cycle and bulking like a pig just like most of us do. Your health should and will be your main concern from now on. You're a big dude (5'6, 208 lbs) but I'm sure you'll find yourself a lot better with a few lbs less.

Good luck.
 
I agree with everyone else that the safest thing would be to stay away from juice. However, if the main problem you are trying to avoid is high blood pressure, I don't see why a moderate dose of anavar would be so bad. Sure, stay away from the androgenic stuff like test, A50, etc., but something like anavar should still be OK.
 
I do understand you because I have almost 20 years in the iron game, so I would suggest to stay away from all oil based and oral steroids, me being you would use winstrol depot, test suspension, hgh,..... I do figure that you have a healthy diet, dont smoke and "0" alcohol......
 
Bro, first off everyone who plays this game knows the risks associated with it. No body is immune to it, even though alot of times we think we are or we tend to ignore the warning signs. It just as easily could have happened to anyone on this board. I am sorry to hear about your condition, but it is time to start thinking about your future and put all blame behind you. No one will ever know the exact cause for your condition, and who is to say any single reason is the culprit? It may very well have been a combination of things that contributed to it. But one of the main causes of artery occlusions are related to Coronary Artery Disease which is due to the accumulation of fatty deposits in the coronary arteries, causing blockage of the arteries and subsequent reduction in blood flow, O2, and nutrients to the cardiac tissue. Atherosclerosis is the main cause of CAD, and again is the build up of fats, cholesterol and other inflammatory mediators ultimately termed plaques. ( I am sure since you have experienced this, you know all of this already. But I thought I might add it for those interested). Anyways the process of atherosclerosis begins very early in life, even as early as childhood. The risk of developing atherosclerosis is increased in persons with modifiable risk factors (those you can change) and non-modifiable risk factors (those you can't change). The risk of CAD can be reduced by improving the modifiable risk factors. Like I mentioned, there are two types of risk factors: 1) non-modifiable risk factors for heart disease (the ones you can't change) and consist of age, sex, race, family history (including genetic predisposition), and personal history (previous cardiac episodes). 2) modifiable risk factors (the ones you can change) and consist of major risk factors: smoking, HTN, dyslipidemia, physical inactivity, and obesity. Major risk factors are those which by themselves increase your chance for developing heart disease. Secondary risk factors also increase your chance of heart disease and include stress, diabetes, and Etoh abuse.
So while there are things in the development of CAD which we cannot control, there ARE certain things we can do to decrease our risk of developing it as well.
Your goals should now be focused on adjusting to your current condition (adapting a favorable lifestyle), decreasing your risks of CAD, and probably most importantly (at least now, short term speaking, and long term) the prevention of restenosis. Restenosis is the re-narrowing of the coronary artery and the formation of new blockage at the site of angioplasty/stent placement. The first 3-6 months after the procedure is the most crucial. It is estimated that during this time, the incidence of restenosis with angioplasty alone is 40-50 %, but is reduced to 20-30 % with the use of a stent.
Since stent implantation requires angioplasty to put the stent in place, this causes trauma to the tissue/vessel.
There are two major mechanisms for restenosis. The first is thrombosis, or blood clot formation at site of placement. This risk is greatest right after the procedure because it immediately triggers the clotting cascade. This is why the use of anticoag/antiplatelet meds are crucial during this time and after the procedure as well. The second mechanism is actual tissue growth where the stent was placed. This is caused by proliferation of the endothelial cells which line the blood vessels, and is a normal response in which the body tries to heal and regenerate the damaged tissue. But may be somewhat hindered by placement of the foreign stent. The time frame for this is ~ 3-6 months after the procedure. But this mechanism is not preventable by anticoag meds (obviously). Recurrent atherosclerosis (the cause of stent placement in the first place), is of course a major concern because it can also lead to restenosis of the treated artery. But this may be of little concern during the first 6 months after stenting.
So the most immediate threat of restenosis after stent placement is thrombosis. This is where the use of the anti-platelet meds termed glycoprotein IIb/IIIa inhibitors (Abciximab, Eptifibatide) come into play. These drugs have been clinically proven to reduce restenosis by taking care of the 1st mechanism I mentioned of thrombosis. IMO, these drugs may seem to be the best choice and they work extremely well, but are not without sides, and can be very costly. There are, however, good alternatives. The next mechanism to worry about is the actual tissue re-growth. You have partly solved this problem by the use of a stent, as opposed to angioplasty alone. But, like I said above, the incidence of restenosis during the first 6 months after stent placement is still ~ 20-30 %. So this is where the hot topic of desigining alternative, improved stents is focused. Soon there will be drug coated stents which will be able to inhibit the tissue growth, and there will be stents which are coated in a polymer which will deliver DNA to the surrounding tissue to prevent tissue regrowth so the body wont recognize it as foreign.
Anyways, sorry to spew. But I want you to realize that having a stent is not the end of the world. It just means you will now have to be more aware of your body, and the things you do. You will probably have to take meds to allow for the stent accomodation. You will have to keep your cholesterol, BP and CV system in careful check, and do other things which make sure you reduce your risk factors for CAD. It doesn't mean you will not be able to work out anymore, but you will have to do so accordingly. There are also lots of helpful natural/alternative supps that can help which are beyond traditional medicine. There are many resourceful and educated people on this board who know a great deal about these alternatives, and I am sure they would be more than willing to help.
I also just want to remind people that in our quest for body building and AAS use, we often times put ourselves in situations which increase our risk factors for CAD as well as many other risks. I'm sure I will get reamed for this statement, but if you look at all of the relavent posts, well, I think they speak for themselves. Of course there are many things we can do to decrease our risk factors, and it is absolutely crucial we try and do so. One of the great things about Elite (and a few other boards), is the outstanding wealth of information provided by these people (you know who you are) who take their time to do the research and keep us up to date on these topics. I know I am
grateful for this. Do you think our traditional medical system does this? Hardly!
Anyways, good luck in all you choose to do, and a reminder to others that we are not immune to the misfortunes of life.
Here are a few good links in regards ot stenting and CAD:
http://www.texheartsurgeons.com/cad.htm
http://www.tmc.edu/thi/cad.html
http://www.guidant.com/condition/cad/
http://www.mplsheartfoundation.org/heart_disease.cfm
http://heartdisease.about.com/library/weekly/aa062402a.htm
http://www.heartcenteronline.com/The_Stent_Center.html
**This one is excellent, but you need a flash player**
http://www.ucdmc.ucdavis.edu/ucdhs/health/a-z/03coronary/doc03angioplasty.html
 
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