I dislike extremist mideast culture

[Lao Tzu]

So is Christianity. Shall we discuss the freedom of europeans when the church dominated?

The point is, theocracy suicks. Dioesn't mater which kind. europeannations started to achieve freedom only when these holds began to be broken.

Part of the reason for America adopting democracy so early is that the forefathers were not Catholics, and had no adherence to their spiritual leaders...

anyway that's another topic.

islam is not the problem. Mixing mosque (or church) and state is.

I agree, totalitarian theocracy is the main reason Islamic nations are repressed, not the religion of Islam in and of itself. There are many more moderate, more secular muslims who get along fine in first world countries like the US, Canada or France. That is why i think there need to be stiff regulations to enforce secularism in the new Iraqi state. The Shiites in the south are wanting to create an Iran style government and they make up a majority. There need to be regulations to inhibit religious totalism in the new Iraq.

Even though we said we were doing it to liberate Iraq and that it is up to them to control their government, i feel they owe us enough to not turn Iraq into another Iran.

 

[Mandinka2]

So is Christianity. Shall we discuss the freedom of europeans when the church dominated?

The point is, theocracy suicks. Dioesn't mater which kind. europeannations started to achieve freedom only when these holds began to be broken.

Part of the reason for America adopting democracy so early is that the forefathers were not Catholics, and had no adherence to their spiritual leaders...

anyway that's another topic.

islam is not the problem. Mixing mosque (or church) and state is.

Hi to all my ef colleagues , I consider you a thinking person on this board Matt , but I cannot agree with your comment. Coming from Ireland , perhaps the most truly Catholic country in Ireland I can promise you that people were far happier there when they were POORER and MORE CATHOLIC. The sooner SOCIETY and not purely the INDIVIDUAL realises that money does not equate with happiness the better. Indivuduals will always seek immediate gratification , so society should interven on their behalf should it wish to exercise judgemen for their benefit. The problem is therefore in choosing what is "good" and having the guts to stick with it. That is why we see the Western societies all heading towards virtual moral and spiritual bankruptcy (ie unhappiness). I am far from a religious person myslef but that is my observation of the societies I have lived in and the people I have encountered.

 

[2Thick]

but I cannot agree with your comment. Coming from Ireland , perhaps the most truly Catholic country in Ireland I can promise you that people were far happier there when they were POORER and MORE CATHOLIC.

What?

 

[Mandinka2]

What?

Ahem ,sorry , I was a bit pissed when I wrote that , it should have read something to the effect that it is probably the most "Catholic" country in the world. If you are familiar with the principle of economic utility (or "goodness") then I was stating that in my experience the wholehearted pursuit of wealth by a society does not maximise their utility.