Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below
Eating To Grow
- Thread starter theoak01
- Start date
I'm with Finaplix.
This thread has covered a good bit of ground, so I have two points to make: 1, that eating huge meals is not ideal, and I'll cite specific examples from pro bbing to support my case; and 2, that high carbs definitely *aren't* necessary to get big, again with specifics.
And yes, this will be long. If that offends somebody they need to go read a book...say, _War and Peace_. Hell, read a comic book--THEN come tell me this is long
Big Meals:
I mean no disrespect to anyone, and I will admit that I enjoy buffets, but I think eating a lot at one sitting is sending the wrong message. They're great as a psychological reward after a hard workout, but let's look at the big picture...if you're eating huge meals on a frequent basis, are all those calories fueling growth?
Fat growth maybe, but LBM gains are a different story. Consistency is the key there, and I'll tell you why.
Most of us, including powerlifters, Olympic lifters and bodybuilders, aren't EXTREMELY active, agreed?
Since we're not overly active, the simple fact of the matter is, we can only use so many calories at one time. When we sit down to a 2,500 kcal meal (or whatever), the unnecessary calories are just turned to fat. The fact that those huge meals play havoc with your metabolism, the "feast before famine" scenario, makes this worse. Our bodies actually are quicker to hold onto fat stores than they ordinarily would be, so we're hit with a double-whammy.
We can see this in a large no. of bodybuilders. Nasser El Sonbaty is a good example.
When Nasser was the no. 2 guy in the world, he ate a lot, but he didn't gorge too many of his daily kcal in single sittings. He spread things out among 7-8 meals/day IIRC.
In recent years, though, it's said that Nasser is maybe eating heavily twice a day. Look at him now...the poor guy is considered an also-ran. He can't get into the same condition he used to.
Flex Wheeler is the same way. When he was at his very best, in early 1993 and early 1998, he was eating somewhere around 8-9 small meals a day, fairly low-carb, high protein, moderate fat fare (chicken breasts, steak, nuts, some veggies, peanut butter). His conditioning was just incredible. If he could reproduce that form he could probably dethrone King Ronnie. I KNOW he would whip Cutler and Schlierkampf.
But look at him in almost any other year, when he's admitted that he ate lots of pizza, ice cream and didn't eat super-frequent meals. You'll see that his glutes were "jiggly" fat. His lower back and hamstrings were very smooth. That kills the illusion his physique creates. He went from being the king to a guy that can't hold the big guys' jock straps.
How about Lee Priest?
It's no secret that he pigs out in his offseason and just gets FAT, sloppy fat sometimes. He talks about eating tubs of ice cream, tons of cheeseburgers and a bunch of other junk all at once...
Are we seeing a pattern here?
Remember, this is even WORSE for non-assisted trainers. Most pros do clen and T3 year-round, even when bulking. Natural guys, especially those who are no longer teenagers with super-fast metabolisms, would DEFINITELY get fat if they made large meals/eating too much at once a habit. I see it in people from my gym all the time.
To clarify, I am not stating a dichotomy--that you can either eat frequent meals OR shovel it in with a few meals.
No...I imagine you could eat at a buffet and still get your 7 daily meals. BUT, the large meals thing is ALWAYS going to be counterproductive in the long run. And don't make conceits...yes, a little fat gain is inevitable, but you CAN curtail that. It's just a matter of balls to the wall discipline. You have to punish yourself in AND out of the gym, including at the supper table.
No one said it'd be easy. But it IS doable, and the less experienced and more impressionable posters here deserve to know that.
Carbs:
Some people handle carbs a little differently, but I definitely think a moderate carb approach is best for "safe" bulking. Most people, especially non-trainers, are fatter than ever, yet they're not eating as much fried foods or quite as much protein, beef specifically. They bought into the low-fat craze (read: higher carbs), and they're fatter still!
And sure, someone could say that Kaz or Jumbo Palumbo are just "freaks" for their success with that, but that's a BIG appeal to ignorance fallacy: one could say the same thing for the rare few guys who advocate very high carbs; e.g., big mouth also-ran Gary Strydom.
I say that "logic" is a dead end. Besides, Kaz and Dave Palumbo aren't the only guys who do low-moderate carbs for bulking. Milos Sarcev is a high protein, low carb guy. So's Tom Prince and Chris Cormier. I know Dogg recommends mod. carbs, and he's not exactly a small guy
I'm pretty sure Trevor Smith isn't too big on carbing out either, and he's close to 400 lbs.
Low-carbs aren't for everyone. And I bet this'll never be resolved. That's okay; we can't all agree on EVERYTHING
But again, I do think it's important for the young'uns to see both sides. Large meals, high or low carb--that's something they'll have to decide on their own.
This thread has covered a good bit of ground, so I have two points to make: 1, that eating huge meals is not ideal, and I'll cite specific examples from pro bbing to support my case; and 2, that high carbs definitely *aren't* necessary to get big, again with specifics.
And yes, this will be long. If that offends somebody they need to go read a book...say, _War and Peace_. Hell, read a comic book--THEN come tell me this is long
Big Meals:
I mean no disrespect to anyone, and I will admit that I enjoy buffets, but I think eating a lot at one sitting is sending the wrong message. They're great as a psychological reward after a hard workout, but let's look at the big picture...if you're eating huge meals on a frequent basis, are all those calories fueling growth?
Fat growth maybe, but LBM gains are a different story. Consistency is the key there, and I'll tell you why.
Most of us, including powerlifters, Olympic lifters and bodybuilders, aren't EXTREMELY active, agreed?
Since we're not overly active, the simple fact of the matter is, we can only use so many calories at one time. When we sit down to a 2,500 kcal meal (or whatever), the unnecessary calories are just turned to fat. The fact that those huge meals play havoc with your metabolism, the "feast before famine" scenario, makes this worse. Our bodies actually are quicker to hold onto fat stores than they ordinarily would be, so we're hit with a double-whammy.
We can see this in a large no. of bodybuilders. Nasser El Sonbaty is a good example.
When Nasser was the no. 2 guy in the world, he ate a lot, but he didn't gorge too many of his daily kcal in single sittings. He spread things out among 7-8 meals/day IIRC.
In recent years, though, it's said that Nasser is maybe eating heavily twice a day. Look at him now...the poor guy is considered an also-ran. He can't get into the same condition he used to.
Flex Wheeler is the same way. When he was at his very best, in early 1993 and early 1998, he was eating somewhere around 8-9 small meals a day, fairly low-carb, high protein, moderate fat fare (chicken breasts, steak, nuts, some veggies, peanut butter). His conditioning was just incredible. If he could reproduce that form he could probably dethrone King Ronnie. I KNOW he would whip Cutler and Schlierkampf.
But look at him in almost any other year, when he's admitted that he ate lots of pizza, ice cream and didn't eat super-frequent meals. You'll see that his glutes were "jiggly" fat. His lower back and hamstrings were very smooth. That kills the illusion his physique creates. He went from being the king to a guy that can't hold the big guys' jock straps.
How about Lee Priest?
It's no secret that he pigs out in his offseason and just gets FAT, sloppy fat sometimes. He talks about eating tubs of ice cream, tons of cheeseburgers and a bunch of other junk all at once...
Are we seeing a pattern here?
Remember, this is even WORSE for non-assisted trainers. Most pros do clen and T3 year-round, even when bulking. Natural guys, especially those who are no longer teenagers with super-fast metabolisms, would DEFINITELY get fat if they made large meals/eating too much at once a habit. I see it in people from my gym all the time.
To clarify, I am not stating a dichotomy--that you can either eat frequent meals OR shovel it in with a few meals.
No...I imagine you could eat at a buffet and still get your 7 daily meals. BUT, the large meals thing is ALWAYS going to be counterproductive in the long run. And don't make conceits...yes, a little fat gain is inevitable, but you CAN curtail that. It's just a matter of balls to the wall discipline. You have to punish yourself in AND out of the gym, including at the supper table.
No one said it'd be easy. But it IS doable, and the less experienced and more impressionable posters here deserve to know that.
Carbs:
Some people handle carbs a little differently, but I definitely think a moderate carb approach is best for "safe" bulking. Most people, especially non-trainers, are fatter than ever, yet they're not eating as much fried foods or quite as much protein, beef specifically. They bought into the low-fat craze (read: higher carbs), and they're fatter still!
And sure, someone could say that Kaz or Jumbo Palumbo are just "freaks" for their success with that, but that's a BIG appeal to ignorance fallacy: one could say the same thing for the rare few guys who advocate very high carbs; e.g., big mouth also-ran Gary Strydom.
I say that "logic" is a dead end. Besides, Kaz and Dave Palumbo aren't the only guys who do low-moderate carbs for bulking. Milos Sarcev is a high protein, low carb guy. So's Tom Prince and Chris Cormier. I know Dogg recommends mod. carbs, and he's not exactly a small guy
I'm pretty sure Trevor Smith isn't too big on carbing out either, and he's close to 400 lbs. Low-carbs aren't for everyone. And I bet this'll never be resolved. That's okay; we can't all agree on EVERYTHING
But again, I do think it's important for the young'uns to see both sides. Large meals, high or low carb--that's something they'll have to decide on their own.
louden_swain
New member
Don't forget to eat!! Not having enough time to eat is no excuse. . especially if you are serious about training.
overhead::I followed DC's program , or something close to it for about a month. I enjoyed it, worked well for me. But, the diet he suggests (which probably works for most people) caused me to gain an unexceptable amount of fat.
Doggcrapp:: thats kind of confusing to me because Ive never gone over exact specifics of diet anywhere--just hit on the basics--because I get very detailed with diet with the people who pay me to train them. My diet you never combine fats around a potential insulin release (or carb intake) and ive never gone over that on any board and wont.
Doggcrapp:: thats kind of confusing to me because Ive never gone over exact specifics of diet anywhere--just hit on the basics--because I get very detailed with diet with the people who pay me to train them. My diet you never combine fats around a potential insulin release (or carb intake) and ive never gone over that on any board and wont.
overhead
New member
I was basing it on the general outline that I read on the cycling for pennies thread. I really do not want to dig it up, so correct if I am wrong. But, I remember reading something about not counting calories, loads of protein and cutting off carbs after 6pm or somewhere in that area. I also remember something about you adjusting peoples carb cut off time with gains in fat or increasing cardio. But, being that specifics were not mentioned that was all I had to go on so that is what I did. I did not pay you for training, and only had the thread to go by, I really cannot say how I would do on the diet that you give to people that you train. I have no way of knowing what that is.
No problem overhead--I guess I posted more to say that I dont post on specifics of my diet because many people have been asking me where Ive posted on it (and i havent except for a little bit of basics)--I hope you dont think I was pissed at you I just wanted to clarify for the masses on that one--take care.
JJFigure
New member
Guldukat - very well said. Nutrition is 80% of the game, IMO, and the quality of food (carbs/pro/fat) is an important factor easily overlooked by many trainees when bulking. Yes, it's hard to get the amount of kcals necessary when eating clean macro sources, but that's why we eat 6-8 times/day.
Similar threads
