Do the palestinians deserve what they get ?

[bouncer]

I'm going to keep this simple and confine to recent event's, ie. in the last 18 months.

Ehud Barak was elected on the promise that he would finally bring about a settlement to the crisis in both Isreal and Lebanon. The young population of Isreal wanting peace voted for him.
Some of his election promises were the halt to building on arab territories, (limited) automony for the Palestininan population and the withdrawal of IDF forces from South Lebanon within 6 months of his election. This he done within 2 months, catching everyone by surprise. Lands were given back to the palestinians and building on already occupied lands was halted. The West Bank and Gaza were brought under the control of the Palestian authorities, ie everything was looking rosy in the garden !. Then Sharon visited the Temple Mound, something which is the right of both Jew, arab and Christian.
The result of that action was to start the present intifada.
Why the Palestianians read the situation so wrong ?. After continuous attacks on the Isreali state and peace talks breaking down with Barak who was still seeking a peacfull settlement the Isreali population was lead to beleive (by the opposition party) that Baraks governement was soft on the Palestian's, a vote of no confidence was brought by Sharon's party, a general election was called which he lost. Sharon was voted in, an intifada was declared and the rest as they say is history.

So do the Palo's deserve to lay in the nest the feathered ?.

Bouncer

 

[the nature boy]

sad to say but the matter is not a black and white issue. Peace initiaves can be made by both sides but the fact remains that pali's and isreali's are going to hate each other. Too much blood has been spilt on both ends for things to become "peachy keen". As much as I'd like to see Isreal stop building settlements, it's not going to stop the hate. I'm not religious, but I'm afraid only God himself can stop the madness in that area. I'm drunk so I guess I'll elaborate later on.

 

[Kryp2o]

It's a holy war between the two, so you know both sides will not rest until the other is annihilated.

 

[Long Beach]

Facts:

1. Isreal is the only democratic nation in the middle east.

2. Isreal supports the Islamic relgion among all other religious beliefs in its country.

3. 'Palestinians' allows only mandatory Islam in its coalition, and death, imprisonment, or torture for defectors.

4. Isreal has enough nuclear and militray capalibitly to blow the 'Palestinians' off the face of the earth 1000 times over, but they do not because they are trying to be a just nation.

5. The fundamental Islamic 'Palestinians' continue their attacks/hate of Israel, in direct accordance with Bin Laden/Iraq/Hitler/attacks/etc on Israelis, Christians, and supporters of Isreal.

6. The Bible predicted Isreal would one day become a sovergn nation after 100s of years not existing as anything close to even a group forming in that area.

7. Isreal once again became a sovergn nation just under 40 years ago, for the first time in 100s of years, miracuously.

8. The Bible says only the anti-Christ will establish peace in the Middle East.

9. Recent anthrax letters from terrorists repeated the common phrase found in many Islamic nation, "Death to America, Death to Israel..."

10. The Islamic 'Palestinians' will never settle for anything but the total demolition of the Isrealis, and the Isrealis constantly have tried everthing peaceful to get these people to stop their terrorist attacks only moving to counterattacks and defensive shields as a last resort...as the U.S. was forced to do recently.

11. The Holy war is a name Muslims like Bin Laden perpetuated and waged in accordance with the Koran and their leader/'prophet' Muhammed stating that the world will be converted to Islam at any costs...death, terror, or war. The 'Holy' war only exists through their delusioned minds' eyes.

 

[danielson]

as much as anyone will try top justify israels actions with facts and statistics, no the palestinians dont deserve to be treated like that. not when you see the things israel has ordered or sanctioned before

 

[Long Beach]

So you are saying Israel made these orders(not sure what orders those were) for their own greed/gain just out of the blue? What would they have to gain by this? Israel could car less about any 'religious' aspect of the war, they allow all 'religions'(which include Muslims) to exist as citizens free in their nation/area, just like the U.S. The Palestians and Islamic terrorists like them torture, jail, and kill those that are not Muslim in their own area.

I am not saying Israel has been perfect by any means, just like the U.S. has not always been perfect; however, Israel must protect itself from fundamentalist Islamic attack, just like the U.S. is now doing. Even if it means setting up defensive systems or going to war to protect the very existence of non-Islamic democratic nations.

America and Israel do not begin wars, they move to war only in an absolute neccessity of defense.



http://www.jiloa.org

 

[the nature boy]

America and Israel do not begin wars, they move to war only in an absolute neccessity of defense.



http://www.jiloa.org

you're saying america never began a war? Does the vietnam war mean anything to you? Have you heard of the tonken gulf?

Or Panama? Or Grenada? Or the Contras in Nicaragua?

How about the Desert storm? Who put Saddam on the payroll? Who indirectly gave Saddam the green light to invade Kiwait?

 

[danielson]

arafat is in a very tough situation

he has a huge mass of people who feel very hard done by, and all wanting different things. so yes peace is going to be hard to achieve

this is their best shot at it however. eliminating the palestinians is not an act of self preservation, its a holocaust

israel only allows palestinians into that country as cheap manual labour, and have you seen how it treats those people? ships them in via underground tunnels, barriers etc.

How often have they just closed of an area of a town and shelled it silly, killing children and families? the settlements they've built are opposed by the UN, yet they recieve protection in billions of $$ and weapons, but make very liottle effort to stamp out the west bank seperatists, didnt they knock off one of isreal's leaders?

no-one deserves to be treated like that, to have their children gunned down while in school....

 

[Latimer]

I wish they were both ruled by the crown still.

 

[Long Beach]

kingjohn, I agree that it is very hard to imagine peace ever existing in the middle east. Interesting that the Bible predicts that the anti-christ will be the first to miracuously create peace there(although it will be temporary).

Nature Boy, America did just no go into Vietnam and start killing people for no reason whatsoever. America does not attack other countries because the other country does not believe in Islam. Do you really believe that in each of your examples America just went on over to the other country for no reason but to start a war? America defends(and I am not arguing that at times the defense may have been a bad choice), they do not attack other countries simply to spread its religion or to just start up a war.

Danielson, my respect to you and I agree that just wiping out a bunch of people probably isn't such a good idea even when it may be the only solution. However, I completely disagree with the rest. I have been in this debate quite often but have not come across your entire line of thinking or understanding. I am curious to know where you are getting your information about what goes on in Jerusalem, particularily your inference that Israelis are gunning down Palestinian children in school and that Israel is making money off the backs of Palestinians. I am very interested in looking at all arguments in the other side of the debate, if it wouldn't be too much trouble I'd appreciate it.





http://www.jiloa.org