Thyroid dangers in reality? -- EVERYONE VOTES

[poantrex]

GOOOOD GOD MAN, did that fly right over your head? JESUS CHRIST. Pay attention now:

Fasting blood glucose concentrations are a measure of ones insulin sensitivity - fasting blood glucose is tested to assess ones risk of acquiring diabetes.

[Quote/]

Again....Flat out wrong. You're regurgitating information you have seen on these boards that is utterly FALSE.

Whatever you say fonz.

1. Normal BG readings are between 80-120, fasting normally being at about 60mg/dl.

1. The "normal range" for fasting blood glucose is 65-120. 90 and above are considered insulin resistance. I never said that 80-120 isn't normal, although i would be very leery of the upper end of tthat at fasting.

2. Nobody said he was. But, thats not to say damage can be done during that time frame.

3. Hyperglycemia is prolonged while using any type of thyroid hormone. It generally remains for as long as the drug remains in the body.

4. ...

5. Thats not even the fucking point. The point is, exogenous thyroid hormones cause hyperglyecmia and it is NOT Just after meals like you are trying to say. I have seen this in myself 24 hours after a dose of cytomel - strangely high blood glucose readings.

6. Due to #5, r-ALA will only be helpful for prevening postprandial hyperglycemia. It won't offset prolonged hyperglycemia unless you pop a couple of pills every 15 minutes.

7. The half life of r-ALA. Not that it makes a huge difference, because whether the half life is 15 minutes or 25 minutes, it aint gonna help someone with insulin resistance problems or diabetes. Aside from preventing surges in blood glucose after meals. But, I remember macrophage specifically stating that the half life of r-ALA is around 10 minutes.

8. Its interesting that you don't dispute the issue with bone loss. Hmm.

 

[jpl26]

GOOOOD GOD MAN, did that fly right over your head? JESUS CHRIST. Pay attention now:

[Quote/]

8. Its interesting that you don't dispute the issue with bone loss. Hmm.

I will never understand why people never use some small amount of logic before feeding more fuel to the fire.

Let's see:

T3 ALONE = Bone dcalcification...via mineral loss I never disputed this.

BUT, T3 is meant to be run with AAS. Hope you got this rather simple point.

And guess what? As I stated before, AAS INCREASE mineral bone deposition and off-set any bad effects from ther T3.

Want some proof?

Ok. And this on ELDERLY women, which suffer from osteoporosis, far worse than anything T3 can do to ant BB'er in a short-term 8-week T3 cycle.


1: J Bone Joint Surg Br. 2002 May;84(4):497-503. Related Articles, Links


Positive effects of anabolic steroids, vitamin D and calcium on muscle mass, bone mineral density and clinical function after a hip fracture. A randomised study of 63 women.

Hedstrom M, Sjoberg K, Brosjo E, Astrom K, Sjoberg H, Dalen N.

Department of Orthopaedics, Karolinska Institute and Danderyd Hospital, Sweden.

A total of 63 women who had an operation for a fracture of the hip was randomly allocated to one year of treatment either with anabolic steroids, vitamin D and calcium (anabolic group) or with calcium only (control group). The thigh muscle volume was measured by quantitative CT. The bone mineral density of the hip, femur and tibia was assessed by quantitative CT and dual-energy x-ray absorptiometry and of the heel by quantitative ultrasound. Quantitative CT showed that the anabolic group did not lose muscle volume during the first 12 months whereas the control group did (p<0.01). There was less bone loss in the proximal tibia in the anabolic group than in the control group. The speed of gait and the Harris hip score were significantly better in the anabolic group after six and 12 months. Anabolic steroids, even in this moderate dose, given in combination with vitamin D and calcium had a beneficial effect on muscle volume, bone mineral density and clinical function in this group of elderly women.

Publication Types:
Clinical Trial
Randomized Controlled Trial

PMID: 12043767 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


Next time, try to throw something at me that I won't chew up.

Ta-da.

 

[jpl26]

yes you have had some useful information, but alot of it is BS, as you say. i have family members with such and such thyroid situations, including graves which yes its an auto immune disease. for you to think you can fix a thyroid storm so easily is the most rediculas thing you have said through all your bs. i guess that why they put some people under strick isolation when in risk of thyroid storm huh??? you have done reaserch, but you need to do more, if you have an altered thyroid like graves disease, it may not take you as much as 150mcg to have a thyroid storm, which is very fatal, i dont give a fuck what you say.

Look brainiac.....stop trying to back-peddal.

You equated Graves disease with the use of exogeneously administered T3, not knowing it had a completely DIFFERENT mode of action...it's an auto-immune disease.

That by itself, renders any opinion of yours non-existent on the subject.

 

[jpl26]

Man.. who are you and where did you come from?? ha ha.. these are some of the best threads i've read in a while.. i knew a little about a lot of what you said, but i didn't know the relationships between a lot of it.. but anyway.. hope you hang around more often.. help us answer some serious questions..

have a good holiday..

Thanks. And likewise. Have a good holiday.

 

[jpl26]

GOOOOD GOD MAN, did that fly right over your head? JESUS CHRIST. Pay attention now:

Fasting blood glucose concentrations are a measure of ones insulin sensitivity - fasting blood glucose is tested to assess ones risk of acquiring diabetes.

see http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=3393


The effect of thyroid hormones on blood insulin level and metabolic parameters in diabetic rats.

I think your use of studies says it all. We aren't diabetic rats. Your argument would have a little bit more credibility if you had used HUMAN diabetic individuals, but you didn't. So that's that.

Next time, use the proper studies that are relevant to the discussion at hand.

 

[poantrex]

Fonz, you can browse pubmed and find a study. You're such a braniac...I am impressed. BUT where is the study of simultaneous Cytomel and anabolic steroid use? Eh? That study you posted means nothing.

There is no proof that steroids can offset thyroid hormone bone loss - and in fact, bone loss is still likely because most people are reporting muscle loss with thyroid hormone use. Even with high doses of multiple compounds, like I mentioned earlier. If muscle loss is occuring, bone loss is also likely to occur.
Next time, use the proper studies that are relevant to the discussion at hand.

By the way - if you knew a damn thing about pharmacology, you'd know that rats mimic humans in nearly every way when it comes to drug reactions. I can't think of a single exception to that. Besides which, if you doubt that thyroid hormones cause increased blood sugar, simply look at any insert to prescribed thyroxine or triiodothyronine, in which it explicitly states that blood sugar will be higher during use (for all individuals).

 

[shortstack]

Fonz, you can browse pubmed and find a study. You're such a braniac...I am impressed. BUT where is the study of simultaneous Cytomel and anabolic steroid use? Eh? That study you posted means nothing.

There is no proof that steroids can offset thyroid hormone bone loss - and in fact, bone loss is still likely because most people are reporting muscle loss with thyroid hormone use. Even with high doses of multiple compounds, like I mentioned earlier. If muscle loss is occuring, bone loss is also likely to occur.
Next time, use the proper studies that are relevant to the discussion at hand.

By the way - if you knew a damn thing about pharmacology, you'd know that rats mimic humans in nearly every way when it comes to drug reactions. I can't think of a single exception to that. Besides which, if you doubt that thyroid hormones cause increased blood sugar, simply look at any insert to prescribed thyroxine or triiodothyronine, in which it explicitly states that blood sugar will be higher during use (for all individuals).

oh thats the ab guy, lol.....
nuff said.

 

[jpl26]

oh thats the ab guy, lol.....
nuff said.

...

 

[jpl26]

Fonz, you can browse pubmed and find a study. You're such a braniac...I am impressed. BUT where is the study of simultaneous Cytomel and anabolic steroid use? Eh? That study you posted means nothing.

There is no proof that steroids can offset thyroid hormone bone loss - and in fact, bone loss is still likely because most people are reporting muscle loss with thyroid hormone use. Even with high doses of multiple compounds, like I mentioned earlier. If muscle loss is occuring, bone loss is also likely to occur.
Next time, use the proper studies that are relevant to the discussion at hand.

By the way - if you knew a damn thing about pharmacology, you'd know that rats mimic humans in nearly every way when it comes to drug reactions. I can't think of a single exception to that. Besides which, if you doubt that thyroid hormones cause increased blood sugar, simply look at any insert to prescribed thyroxine or triiodothyronine, in which it explicitly states that blood sugar will be higher during use (for all individuals).

"nearly every way".......

Rats, pigs, mice etc... I deleted about 5,000 studies on my computer on them.

What counts is human studies. Allthough I'll admit they are hard to find, they are really the only completely and totally useful piece of information.

Non-human studies make you extrapolate your answers in a statistical fashion. That leads to errors.

I'd rather not have to go along with those errors.

But Ok, use your rat studies. Whatever floats your boat. It's your opinion.

At least you have one. The other guy, doesn't even know what we're talking about. Which is amusing.

 

[poantrex]

You know, my biggest problem with exogenous thyroid hormone use is that post treatment TSH will likely be higher. It won't always be out of normal range assuming the person in question is eating a hypercaloric diet and exercising, but it is often higher. For example, if one individual has a TSH of 1.5 before doing anything and then a TSH of 3 after stopping cytomel use, is that ideal? (I've seen this happen) No its not ideal, and thats why there are far better means of losing weight in my opinion. Personally morning cardio always makes me feel better and i'm sure as hell its better for my long term health than using a shitload of stimulants and thyroid hormones.

I think a lot of people that get bloodtests done don't even realize this is happening, because they get their bloodtest result and their doctor sees that their TSH is in the "normal range". Normal range is NOT always normal for a healthy person. Its like saying a testosterone level of 300ng/dl is fine because its in the "normal range". There are 80 year old men that produce more than that naturally, and I sure as hell don't want to be at that level for the rest of my life.