tbol/anavar

[jfish2134]

I'm 6' 170lbs. 25yrs old. I am looking to add strength and a little size with no bloat. I'm an amateur boxer and MMA fighter so I can't add much weight and I definetly don't want to get slower from putting on alot of bulk. I'm wanting to get to 180-185 and gain as much strength as possible. I was considering the following cycle:

Wks 1-4 = Turanabol 50mg/daily
Wks 5-8 = Anavar 50mg/daily
PCT???

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thank You.

 

[machine23]

Why not just eat a bit more. Look at needto product line and see what he has that can probably help you. That's just me tho. You ever done any aas

 

[Zyglamail]

at 6' 170lbs at 25 years old your pretty scrawny (no offense intended) and adding 10-15lbs naturally should be easy enough if your eating and training for mass gain. Technically speaking if your goal is strength you shouldnt be concerned with weight at all. A lot of strength comes from your CNS so you should be following a strength training program and eat to get strong, IF weight comes with it so be it but dont confuse mass with strength they are not always one in the same. I know of some 165lb guys who can deadlift >630.

 

[machine23]

at 6' 170lbs at 25 years old your pretty scrawny (no offense intended) and adding 10-15lbs naturally should be easy enough if your eating and training for mass gain. Technically speaking if your goal is strength you shouldnt be concerned with weight at all. A lot of strength comes from your CNS so you should be following a strength training program and eat to get strong, IF weight comes with it so be it but dont confuse mass with strength they are not always one in the same. I know of some 165lb guys who can deadlift >630.

You pretty much said what I was thinking I just didn't want to come off like I was punking him out..that's why I just said why not eat more.

 

[jfish2134]

I'm asking for advice about using steroids. If I was only concerned with gaining size and strength I'd lay around and stuff my face and lift a few times a week. But as I said I fight which involves alot of training making it hard to gain weight and strength by just eating. Scrawny?? just because someone is 170lbs doesn't make em scrawny. Would you consider GSP or Bernard Hopkins scrawny? Not saying I'm like them guys, but you get the point. Anyways back to what I was asking. Can anyone help me with advice for using steroids to reach my goals listed above? Thank You.

 

[Zyglamail]

I'm asking for advice about using steroids. If I was only concerned with gaining size and strength I'd lay around and stuff my face and lift a few times a week. But as I said I fight which involves alot of training making it hard to gain weight and strength by just eating. Scrawny?? just because someone is 170lbs doesn't make em scrawny. Would you consider GSP or Bernard Hopkins scrawny? Not saying I'm like them guys, but you get the point. Anyways back to what I was asking. Can anyone help me with advice for using steroids to reach my goals listed above? Thank You.

Sure. id call then scrawny too from a BB or PL standpoint, but they are still amazing athletes and fighters.

We know your asking about steroids, and what we are telling you is you dont need them for your goals. AAS will likely hamper your endurance and possible cause muscle pumps that interfere with existing training. We are not telling you to lay around and eat bon bons either but you cant add mass without consuming the building blocks to support it, pretty simple concept.

Strength training is what you need, not steroids. Can you even deadlift 2x your bodyweight?

 

[machine23]

Sure. id call then scrawny too from a BB or PL standpoint, but they are still amazing athletes and fighters.

We know your asking about steroids, and what we are telling you is you dont need them for your goals. AAS will likely hamper your endurance and possible cause muscle pumps that interfere with existing training. We are not telling you to lay around and eat bon bons either but you cant add mass without consuming the building blocks to support it, pretty simple concept.

Strength training is what you need, not steroids. Can you even deadlift 2x your bodyweight?

Hey I'm with you.. But he wants some advice. So can someone help him... Just remember tho, Tbol may do nothing for you and var may help you out a bit but everything is just temporary if you don't eat right and eat enough above your maintenance level.

 

[Zyglamail]

Hey I'm with you.. But he wants some advice. So can someone help him... Just remember tho, Tbol may do nothing for you and var may help you out a bit but everything is just temporary if you don't eat right and eat enough above your maintenance level.

I did give him advice, he doesnt need AAS. And if he is a fighter its not worth the risk anyways. Why shut down HPTA when goals are easily attainable?

For christs sake the guy is 170lb at 6 foot, there is no reason he cant add a lot of strength naturally AND stay lean AND maintain endurance if he would just alter his training and diet slightly.

Screw it, if the guy just wants to jump on AAS then go for it, he doesnt want advice he wants someone to agree with him.

 

[machine23]

Cycle is ok... Just look in the pct section. Many posts of ppl doing these type of cycles.. Good luck dude.

 

[Lancer55]

Listen to Zyg he knows his shit, im 5lbs heavier than you and 4 inches shorter than ya man, all you got to do is eat more, check out Needtos products like machine said. Good luck.

 

[jfish2134]

To ZYGLIMAIL Hey man not everyone uses steroids to be a bodybuilder or powerlifter. I don't want the bloated, big slow physique. Them guys get no pussy and no respect. Lol It's true though.. Who needs that? Alot of guys use them to HELP reach a certain goal in athletics. I've got the diet and training under control man, I'm not here for advice on that and that is why I didn't ask for it. Deadlift twice my own bodyweight? I can actualy, but who cares? I've seen guys that can deadlift a bridge and squat a house get thrown around like rag dolls on the football field and in the cage by guys who have very unimpressive numbers in the weightroom and guys that don't even lift. It's called ACTIVE STRENGTH. It doesn't matter how strong I am now, I am looking to IMPROVE. Again, that's why I'm here!! So anyone else with help about Steroids I'd appreciate it. Thank You.

 

[jfish2134]

To Lancer55. You should probably concentrate on more cardio If you're heavier than me and only 5' 8"

 

[jfish2134]

Rafael Palmeiros goal was to hit home runs. He wasn't trying to be a bodybuilder or powerlifter. He was using them for a specific reason and they damn sure HELPED. He hit over 500 hr's. My goal is to jump up a weight class and add strength. Added strength and muscle endurance will not hinder my performance in fighting. I'm not looking for your advice on becoming a better fighter because you probably don'y know shit about it. I'm asking which steroids I should take and how much of them I should take to reach my goals. I don't mean to be a dick, I'm just trying to help you understand what I'm looking for . Thank You.

 

[machine23]

Someone is going to help you out dude just be a bit patient. These guys aren't trying to put you down or anything man. Just give it a little time someone will come and help you out. But like I said, there is a ton of info on this site. While you are waiting for someone to help you out why not do a little research on EF. Probably 1000 posts with ppl doing similar cycles like yours.

 

[Lancer55]

To Lancer55. You should probably concentrate on more cardio If you're heavier than me and only 5' 8"

lol I got a 11% bf I dont need any cardio, you need to take advice from the vets, its like Zyg said you don't want advice you want somone to agree with you.

 

[Zyglamail]

To ZYGLIMAIL Hey man not everyone uses steroids to be a bodybuilder or powerlifter. I don't want the bloated, big slow physique. Them guys get no pussy and no respect. Lol It's true though.. Who needs that? Alot of guys use them to HELP reach a certain goal in athletics. I've got the diet and training under control man, I'm not here for advice on that and that is why I didn't ask for it. Deadlift twice my own bodyweight? I can actualy, but who cares? I've seen guys that can deadlift a bridge and squat a house get thrown around like rag dolls on the football field and in the cage by guys who have very unimpressive numbers in the weightroom and guys that don't even lift. It's called ACTIVE STRENGTH. It doesn't matter how strong I am now, I am looking to IMPROVE. Again, that's why I'm here!! So anyone else with help about Steroids I'd appreciate it. Thank You.

Of course having strength and knowing how to use it are 2 different things, train for both and you wont get thrown around. You said you want some strength and a little size and I have told you multiple times now you dont need AAS for that!

Im trying to save you the hassle of pumps, shutdown etc all to gain something that likely isnt going to come from AAS alone anyway. AAS isnt some magic pill you just take and all your dreams come true, its an aid to help you reach a goal by following a plan to acheive goals. If you alter your plan to acheive the goals of strength and a little size, it will come without AAS but the fact that you cant get their on your own and at your size means your not following a proper plan to acheive your goals tp begin with.

And FYI, not everyone who uses steroids is "bloated, big slow physique" But I can tell you most dont want the physique of 12 year old girl either. Most want a little size and strength and train for it, they dont pop some pills and continue to run marathons on sparse diets because their afraid to looze their killa abzz!

 

[ALIN]

I'm 6' 170lbs. 25yrs old. I am looking to add strength and a little size with no bloat. I'm an amateur boxer and MMA fighter so I can't add much weight and I definetly don't want to get slower from putting on alot of bulk. I'm wanting to get to 180-185 and gain as much strength as possible. I was considering the following cycle:

Wks 1-4 = Turanabol 50mg/daily
Wks 5-8 = Anavar 50mg/daily
PCT???

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thank You.

Bad idea IMO. ANAVAR for only a few weeks is a waste. Use some testosterone as your base
and pick one oral.

 

[irishrugger]

Definitly agree^^^
Beastdrol is always a great option whether in-experienced or experienced users of gear

 

[Lancer55]

Bad idea IMO. ANAVAR for only a few weeks is a waste. Use some testosterone as your base
and pick one oral.

Wouldn't he put on more than the 10-15bs if it is his first cycle on test + an oral?

 

[machine23]

Wouldn't he put on more than the 10-15bs if it is his first cycle on test + an oral?

Yea probably! But how much would he keep after!!

 

[jfish2134]

I used andropen 275 last year and went from 180 to 195. Circumstances out of my control caused me to not be able to lift or eat much for a few months and i went down to 170. I decided I wasn't going to worry about putting the muscle back on and focus more on fight training plus I could then fight in a lighter weight class. So I'm not really wanting to do a test cycle because I think I'd add too much weight, making me get bigger and slower. So that's why I'm more interested in something like anavar. So how long should I run the anavar then? The whole 8 weeks? Or 6 weeks after 4 weeks of turanabol? I'd like to keep the turanabol in the cycle to gain a little size and strength. Just not as much size as test or dianabol. And btw zyglamail even marathon runners on a strict diet have a use in their sport for steroids. Again, everyones goal isn't the same. Lance Armstrong was a cyclist, he wasn't using steroids to get bigger and bulkier, and he sure wasn't gonna alter his training and diet to get bigger and stronger. His training was geared toward winning championships in cycling and steroids allegedly HELPED him do that.

 

[machine23]

What exactly was Armstrong taking tho?

 

[Zyglamail]

And btw zyglamail even marathon runners on a strict diet have a use in their sport for steroids. Again, everyones goal isn't the same. Lance Armstrong was a cyclist, he wasn't using steroids to get bigger and bulkier, and he sure wasn't gonna alter his training and diet to get bigger and stronger. His training was geared toward winning championships in cycling and steroids allegedly HELPED him do that.

Once again, no offense bro but I have a hard time believing you are anywhere near as elite as armstong and even if you were I stand by my original assessment based on YOUR goals. Just to remind you what you said they were......

I am looking to add strength and a little size with no bloat

if your looking for no bloat, strength and a little size you DONT NEED AAS you simply need to adjust your training and diet accordingly.

Im continually amazed how people with little or no mass think they need AAS to add a few lbs.

 

[jfish2134]

I'm certainly not claiming to be elite as Armstrong. That doesn't mean I don't want to succeed in my sport. And to succeed I have certain training that I'm not going to alter for the sake of a few pounds. I'd simply like to get more out of the strength training that I do. Do you get it yet bro? I don't understand why you are so offended by me wanting to do a quick cycle to jump up a weight class and get a little stronger? As I said I got the diet and training in check. I'm not gonna add calories because I consume enough already. And I'm not gonna add more weight lifting because I don't want to overtrain. I have in the past and I know what I can handle. So how about some input on what I'm asking for?? Thank You.

 

[jfish2134]

I'm thinking:

Option 1:
Wks 1-4 tbol 50-60mg/daily
Wks 5-8 anavar 50mg/daily

Option 2:
Wks 1-4 Tbol 50mg/daily
Wks 1-8 Anavar 50mg/daily

Option 3:
Beastdrol?? Is this even a steroid? It doesn't appear to be from what I've been reading so far

And What would be a good PCT for the above mentioned cycles? I like what I've heard about toremifine. How much and when should I use this?

 

[Zyglamail]

I don't understand why you are so offended by me wanting to do a quick cycle to jump up a weight class and get a little stronger? As I said I got the diet and training in check. I'm not gonna add calories because I consume enough already. And I'm not gonna add more weight lifting because I don't want to overtrain.

What offends me is your lack of common sense when it comes to what people are telling you. By your own admission your not going to eat more or change your training so with that in mind, why even waste your time with AAS, anything you get from it, which will likely be minimal because you refuse to alter anything, wont last because once again you refuse to alter anything.

You asking for strength and mass all the while refusing to eat more or change your training to retain what little you will gain which means it will likely be an epic waste of time and unnecessarily shut you down for no reason at all.

What I am doing, believe it or not, is listening to what you are telling us you will and will not do and in turn offering advice that is in all likely hood accurate even though its not what you want to hear. Im trying to save you time, money and the inevitable HPTA shutdown you are going to have all so you can gains some strength that your not going to keep because you refuse to alter whats needed to keep it.

You want pct advice, run HCG throughout cycle at 2x a week 250IU a dose and run it until 1 week after last oral dose, then stop and wait for your system to start back up. Dont waste your time with nolva/clomid. Good luck!

 

[jfish2134]

Zyglamail. Steroids are what you turn to after you have done all the right things in other areas and then you stop making gains. Steroids get you to that next level. That is where I'm at right now. While training to fight, I'm not going to get much bigger than 175. It's just too much to devote aot of time to weights and it is also hard to keep on weight while doing the things involved in boxing/mma. Genetics also play a role and that is why you should never get too caught up in numbers. Again, I'm simply trying to get the most out of the calories I eat and the lifting I do. Steroids no doubt will help me achieve that. I know bc I've been there. And I'm not telling anyone what I will or will not do I'm letting people know what I'm considering and asking for advice on what Steroids I should and should not use. And at what dosages and how long and when I should run them. I appreciate you and anyone else willing to help. Thank You.

 

[Zyglamail]

Zyglamail. Steroids are what you turn to after you have done all the right things in other areas and then you stop making gains. Steroids get you to that next level. That is where I'm at right now. While training to fight, I'm not going to get much bigger than 175. It's just too much to devote aot of time to weights and it is also hard to keep on weight while doing the things involved in boxing/mma. Genetics also play a role and that is why you should never get too caught up in numbers. Again, I'm simply trying to get the most out of the calories I eat and the lifting I do. Steroids no doubt will help me achieve that. I know bc I've been there. And I'm not telling anyone what I will or will not do I'm letting people know what I'm considering and asking for advice on what Steroids I should and should not use. And at what dosages and how long and when I should run them. I appreciate you and anyone else willing to help. Thank You.

Steroids are only going to help your situation while you are taking them and then results will be less than ideal in terms of strength or size because thats NOT what you are training and eating for.

If your going to be "on" for your next fight I would be inclined to agree with your goals BUT as I said, steroids are not a magic panacea you seem to think they are.

YOU CAN NOT continue to train as you do and eat as you do and expect to maintain gains once you end the cycle.

To attain and MAINTAIN strength you need to continually work strength. Just like your endurance, if you stop your endurance work, your endurance will suffer. As a fighter you have to walk a very fine line and balance what your genetics allow. That being said I dont for one minute buy that you cant increase your strength greatly, with little mass gain and without hampering your endurance naturally IF you are simply willing to alter your training with those goals in mind. The problem however is you, like so many athletes are stuck in a rutt and refuse to alter what works yet expect some miracle to change the outcome of your workouts.

That miracle, to you, is steroids, and I do agree it will help to a degree BUT only while you are on them because you refuse to change your workouts and diet. So once again, if you refuse to alter your training and diet to account for and build some strength dont expect to keep it post cycle.

Additionally as I already mentioned you may also find that you will have to experiment a bit to find a dose that works for you without causing the pumps that so many folks get when attempting endurance work and to top it all off orals are hard on the system.

Im trying to look at your goals, what your willing to do to acheive them (which is nothing but pop some pills) and you expect them to take you to the next level. Hate to break the news to you but they will only keep you at the next level while you continue to use them if your not going to change anything else.

 

[EarthRider]

And btw zyglamail even marathon runners on a strict diet have a use in their sport for steroids. Again, everyones goal isn't the same. Lance Armstrong was a cyclist, he wasn't using steroids to get bigger and bulkier, and he sure wasn't gonna alter his training and diet to get bigger and stronger. His training was geared toward winning championships in cycling and steroids allegedly HELPED him do that.

This is true. I would add, the marathon runner nor Lance Armstrong would be on a bodybuilding web site looking for advice on what cycle to take. I would touch base with some guys that are in mma and find out what they are using and doing.

 

[jfish2134]

Zyglamail You make some good points in your last post. I don't think they're some magic pill though. I've done one cycle and I know what they can do. Yes. they are mostly temporary gains. You do what you can training and eating until you can't do any more then you get on steroids to reach the next level. You come off the steroids and you continue to do the best you can training and eating and you use some PCT drugs to keep what you can but you won't stay on that level. This is the same with anyone using steroids. I'm no different. I want those gains and I'll do what I need to make them. Right now the next rung on the ladder is steroids. I know I won't keep everything, but no one does. I'm also asking for the proper PCT to keep what I can. So from what I've read the options I have listed above seem to be the best, but I'd like some opinions or recommendations on steroids. That's why I posted on this site. So again, any help in that regard will be greatly appreciated. Thank You.

 

[jfish2134]

balboa29 I just know this site to be very helpful regarding steroids. I don't see it as a bodybuilding only site. I often see mma and boxing guys post here, and I'm hoping some of them chime in on this thread to help me out. Thanks.

 

[machine23]

My boy zyglamail is on his shit tho. I would listen to this guy. Hes clearly not a rookie. I agree with him 100%.. you will see slight gains but will diminish once you go off them. Cause you are refusing to look at your diet and make a few adjustments.

 

[jfish2134]

machine23 How do you know I'm not looking at my diet? How do you know those adjustments haven't been made a long time ago? Because I've been there and done that and this is where I'm at now. So, once again, the next rung on the ladder for me is steroids bro. It's strange to come on a site about steroids, looking for advice and everyone wants to tell me how steroids are not needed. If you guys are so anti-steroids then why are you on a site discussing steroids???

 

[machine23]

Because this is more of a bodybuilding site. Not a mma site. Yes we have a section on it. So you moving up on weight and strength can only be accomplished thru steroids!!! So what happens when you finish your cycle? You'll be back to square one! Stay with your cycle than. Pct add some post cycle and some unleashed. You can add some forma as well... Have you bothered looking at old threads...

 

[jfish2134]

machine 23 Yeah I look at old threads. That's how i came up with the idea of this cycle in the first place. I simply wanted opinions and suggestions on this exact cycle. What to change, add, dosages, PCT, etc. And by your reasoning isn't everyone back to square one after a cycle?? I mean the fact is you shouldn't mess with steroids until you've done everything else right first. Then you get on steroids continue to do everything right, you come off and all you can do is continue to do everything right. Except now you're doing everything right but you're no longer on steroids. The same as you were before the steroids. So you're back to square one!!!

 

[studlife22]

Jfish its your overall arrogance in assuming your training is on point and you dont need any advice that is frustrating. Obviously your not in the UFC or a collegiate athlete so what youve been doing hasn't been cutting it. Zyg asked some valid questions and you got defensive. Go ahead and waste your money on your cycle which IMO is not gonna give you the results your looking for and come back to EF with a new attitude and somebody will help you out.

 

[Zyglamail]

I mean the fact is you shouldn't mess with steroids until you've done everything else right first. Then you get on steroids continue to do everything right, you come off and all you can do is continue to do everything right. Except now you're doing everything right but you're no longer on steroids.

And here is where things get derailed. What we are telling you, at your 6' height and scrawny 170lbs is that you DO NOT need steroids to add strength with a little mass. Your clearly NOT doing everything right or you WOULD be larger and stronger naturally. Thats what we are telling you and you are ignoring because you dont want to hear that your training is NOT ideal FOR THE GOALS you stated. If it was you WOULD already be larger and stronger.

There is absolutely NO reason at all that you cant hit a lean 200lbs NATURALLY. The only thing standing in your way is your own ignorance and pride.

You have a very narrow goal and everyone responds differently to AAS. As most of us here know the sides associated with AAS vary greatly from dose to dose and person to person which means no one can really accurately give you cycle advice. Even another fighters recommendation could be horribly wrong for you.

I told you what PCT to us. Personally I dont like oral only cycles because your natural test is shut down and I feel that it should at least be replaced by enough exo test to replace normals levels your not producing. Orals jack your lipid profiles and are generally rough on the liver. If you want strength with no mass try some winny but you may find the painful joints and perhaps pumps are too much to handle, wont know until YOU try. Anavar may be good as well but since one of its uses was for treating anemia you may find as a healthy person the increase in RBC has a detrimental impact on endurance, once again you would have to see how it affects you at various doses, ideally accompanied by blood work.

All of these unknowns and for sure testicular shutdown and for what? Some strength and a couple pounds, both of which should be easy to come by at your weight.

Im bowing out of this thread now, its clear you wont listen to reason but just remember what I said, with your narrow set of goals/requirements your as likely to get an inaccurate recommendation regarding a cycle as you are a good one, even from another fighter due to the differences in the way people tolerate AAS.

 

[jfish2134]

studlife22 I didn't come here for training advice. There is alot better places for me to go for that. And I've done that plenty. And you call me arrogant? Come on man, your name on here is studlife lol. I bet you're a real stud. LOL. And how would you know if what I'm doing is cutting it. Nobody starts out in the UFC.It's a long road to get anywhere near that level. And I was a division 1 college athlete pal. MAC football. And because someone is 170 you guys assume they can get to 200 naturally? It's called genetics. You might as well justy say a guy 270 can get to 300 naturally then. Nobody can use steroids. And all 170lb guys aren't scrawny, like I said GSP, Bernard Hopkins. Bad Motherfuckers and theirs plenty of guys around 170-180 with way better physiques than you powerlifters with your sloppy 275lbs throwin up as much weight as you can pile on, yet you're too slow and striif to whip my grandmother. Nobody wants to be like that. Well, besides a few of you guys. Thanks for your advice, but unless it involves steroids, keep it to yourself. I didn't come on a steroid site to get training and nutrition advice from bodybuilders. Bodybuilding just isn't my thing. You guys grow muscle for what? It's not the kind you can use anywhere but the weight room.

 

[jfish2134]

Zyglamail You keep referring to me as scrawny. I'd love to see how you're built man. 9,000 posts on an internet discussion board. I bet you could use a little time in the gym. Or at least in the real world.

 

[spezzy]

Why don't you run Ostarine.. It seems more suited for your goals than AAS and will likely be cheaper than what you have proposed.

 

[Zyglamail]

Zyglamail You keep referring to me as scrawny. I'd love to see how you're built man. 9,000 posts on an internet discussion board. I bet you could use a little time in the gym. Or at least in the real world.

For starters, im 5'10 and was 180lbs when I graduated high school and about 10%bf and I WAS SCRAWNY!. In 2-3 years I went to 220lbs and about 13%bf and thats where I stayed while working a full time job, spending about 1.5 hours in the gym and practicing martial arts for 2-3 hours 5 days a week.

Now, im nearly 20 years older than you, im no longer looking to be big, simply strong and well rounded with decent endurance. Im holding steady at about 15% at 230lbs, I can currently row a 2k on an erg rower in under 7 minutes, not going to set any records but not bad either, especially for an old fart. Im not letting BF or weight be my guide but performance in strength and endurance. I train with those goals in mind and let my body adjust accordingly.

Ive spent plenty of time in the real world, enough to add serious mass and adjust my body comp in various ways for various goals. Ive trained clean and have used AAS (after I was in my 30 mind you) and have been as large as 265lbs and about 10%bf.

What I dont need is scrawny snot nosed kids like yourself preaching to me that you need AAS to gain a little strength and mass because you clearly dont. I gave you advice, take it or leave it I dont really care but you have made it abundantly clear your a waste of my time.

 

[jiggagold]

What Mac school u play at

 

[Zyglamail]

What Mac school u play at

Dont any more, was a long time ago. We studied under Sifu Park Bok Nam.

 

[Lancer55]

Zyglamail You keep referring to me as scrawny. I'd love to see how you're built man. 9,000 posts on an internet discussion board. I bet you could use a little time in the gym. Or at least in the real world.

I lol@you 9000 posts in 10 years hahah thats barely anything compared to alot of people around here. He got that many over a 10 year period of time helping people like you who want it their way, you have been given advice by many people your not taking it, hell you were even given a pct by Zyg, maybe try another board or take the cycle with the pct he gave you then when you lose it all because you didn't want to listen maybe you'll come back with an open mind.

 

[Lancer55]

studlife22 I didn't come here for training advice. There is alot better places for me to go for that. And I've done that plenty. And you call me arrogant? Come on man, your name on here is studlife lol. I bet you're a real stud. LOL. And how would you know if what I'm doing is cutting it. Nobody starts out in the UFC.It's a long road to get anywhere near that level. And I was a division 1 college athlete pal. MAC football. And because someone is 170 you guys assume they can get to 200 naturally? It's called genetics. You might as well justy say a guy 270 can get to 300 naturally then. Nobody can use steroids. And all 170lb guys aren't scrawny, like I said GSP, Bernard Hopkins. Bad Motherfuckers and theirs plenty of guys around 170-180 with way better physiques than you powerlifters with your sloppy 275lbs throwin up as much weight as you can pile on, yet you're too slow and striif to whip my grandmother. Nobody wants to be like that. Well, besides a few of you guys. Thanks for your advice, but unless it involves steroids, keep it to yourself. I didn't come on a steroid site to get training and nutrition advice from bodybuilders. Bodybuilding just isn't my thing. You guys grow muscle for what? It's not the kind you can use anywhere but the weight room.

Bodybuilders know more about nutrition and training than most people and this is not only a steroid site lol if you looked there are many other forum areas on this site just as active and more active. Muscle is muscle you can use it anywhere your logic makes no sense. You want to add 10-15lbs of muscle to your body, guess what thats is building your body in other words Bodybuilding. You goin off on everyone who posts who doesn't give you the answer you want isn't going to help you. At 170lbs your height what position did you play? Left Bench? Not many people here weigh 275 most are not that heavy. Obviously if what you were doing was cutting it you wouldn't be here.

 

[Zyglamail]

Not many people here weigh 275 most are not that heavy. Obviously if what you were doing was cutting it you wouldn't be here.

Obviously he has limited experience with anything outside his chosen sport. Powerlifting and weightlifting both have weight classes. There are plenty of insanely powerful 165lb dudes and there are plenty of very fast 275lb dudes. Look at any elite weightlifter doing a snatch it takes a lot of explosive power and speed to toss 450lbs in the air and then pull themselves under the bar to receive it.

jfish2134 clearly has a very narrow perspective of the world, training, powerlifting, weightlifting and AAS and even what women want. He cant even see that I am trying to help him but clearly is too closed minded to see he is not the do all, be all of training and is not willing to admit he cant improve without AAS. After dealing with him in this thread I am finally going to agree with him, he CAN NOT get any farther without the help of AAS because his ego is in the way.

 

[jfish2134]

Zyglamail If that's all you wanted out of athletics in your life, hanging around the weight room, puttin on some size, than that's cool. That's all you did and you can be happy with that. But that wouldn't satisfy me, I've done way more than that already and I'm nowhere near being done. And I'd appreciate it if you were trying to help, but you have done nothing but try to belittle me. So keep hangin around chat rooms bragging about being a short stumpy weightlifter. That's nothing impressive.

lancer 55 I don't see much advice. More like self righteous guys trying to lecture me for asking information about steroids on a steroid site. And yeah man this discussion board is called anabolic steroids. So this section of the site is about steroids. If you don't wanna talk steroids than why are you even reading this board. Don't you have a life? And I played division one college football. In case you don't know that's some serious shit and they take nutrition and training very serious, so I bet I know a little more than a guy like you that sits around making 1000 post on an internet discussion board. So get back to playing world of warcraft or whatever you do and keep your opinions to yourself unless they're about steroids.

This site offered good information in the past. What happened here? The only guys I can get to respond are all self righteous anti steroid guys preaching to a screen name about not using steroids. Can't you guys make better use of your time???

 

[Zyglamail]

And I'd appreciate it if you were trying to help, but you have done nothing but try to belittle me.

I AM trying to help but because I am not telling you what you want to hear you take it otherwise. If you walked up to any serious coach like say Poliquin, Kilgore, Reppetoe etc etc etc at 6' 170lbs and told them you want strength with only a little size and didnt want to lose endurance and it could only be done by taking AAS and you wont alter diet or training because it will affect your current status they would laugh your ass right out of their gym.

Have you even read whats been posted in this thread? How many views does it have and how many people actually took the time to type anything? Now ponder for a moment why that is. The reason is because your unreachable!

Ive given you PCT, Ive told why no one can recommend a cycle and commented on a few orals you could try, Ive given you what you have asked for and still your not satisfied because its not what you want to hear.

This site offered good information in the past. What happened here? The only guys I can get to respond are all self righteous anti steroid guys preaching to a screen name about not using steroids. Can't you guys make better use of your time???

The reason no one else is chiming in is because of your attitude. No one can offer you, someone who apparently already knows everything, any advice that will satisfy you so why bother?

P.S. For the record im not anti steroid at all, done my fare share of cycles. Im against people using them for all the wrong reasons when they arent needed to attain the goals stated. I dont want you to suffer the post cycle crash and the potential other sides for gains that wont last because you refuse to change anything in your life. The same things that would bring you to your goals without the help of AAS.

 

[jfish2134]

Zyglamail I've tried to tell you that I'm pretty confident that my diet is a good one for reaching my goals(diet can only take you so far), ill pm you with it if you want and maybe you can give me some advice. And I train hard and lift as often as possible. Lifting can't be my primary concern right now. There comes a time when steroids can be a big help. And I have no qualms about taking them, in fact I have in the past and I've mentioned that. So what's the big deal about doing a pretty mild cycle right now? Of course I'll lose some of my gains , but everyone does. What would qualify a guy in your opinion to take steroids? Don't look at weight because someones weight don't mean shit. Genetics affect that and some guys can only get so big naturally. I can give you some examples of guys smaller than me who used steroids and they were very beneficial to these guys. I didn't want to get into all this, I just wanted advice on my cycle. And unless I missed it, I really don't see any besides your PCT advice.

 

[Lancer55]

Zyglamail If that's all you wanted out of athletics in your life, hanging around the weight room, puttin on some size, than that's cool. That's all you did and you can be happy with that. But that wouldn't satisfy me, I've done way more than that already and I'm nowhere near being done. And I'd appreciate it if you were trying to help, but you have done nothing but try to belittle me. So keep hangin around chat rooms bragging about being a short stumpy weightlifter. That's nothing impressive.

lancer 55 I don't see much advice. More like self righteous guys trying to lecture me for asking information about steroids on a steroid site. And yeah man this discussion board is called anabolic steroids. So this section of the site is about steroids. If you don't wanna talk steroids than why are you even reading this board. Don't you have a life? And I played division one college football. In case you don't know that's some serious shit and they take nutrition and training very serious, so I bet I know a little more than a guy like you that sits around making 1000 post on an internet discussion board. So get back to playing world of warcraft or whatever you do and keep your opinions to yourself unless they're about steroids.

This site offered good information in the past. What happened here? The only guys I can get to respond are all self righteous anti steroid guys preaching to a screen name about not using steroids. Can't you guys make better use of your time???

LOL dude your calling me little? your lighter than me and half a foot taller your a stick no way a twirp like you played college ball. You do have the build of a world of warcraft player tho I will give you that. I will keep stating facts about steroids so quit crying, take the advice given or gtfo tbh. Ya this area is for advice on steroids in your opinion you didn't get the advice, in everyone elses you got it, the site still offers good advice we just get lazy people like you on here. Go make better use of your time somwhere else, just cause you don't have a life and want to keep arguing doesn't mean anyone else does. You act like bodybuilders don't take nutrition and training seriously that only people who do sports do lol. Again with the post count, your sad. We are talking about steroids your just not listening, this forum area you said steroid site before get it right. Again your opinion on how we use our time, people give advice but because its not what you want to hear we are wasting our time.

 

[Lancer55]

Why not just eat a bit more. Look at needto product line and see what he has that can probably help you. That's just me tho. You ever done any aas

Bad idea IMO. ANAVAR for only a few weeks is a waste. Use some testosterone as your base
and pick one oral.

what about these two guys? advice, just not the advice you wanted to hear.

 

[jfish2134]

lancer Lol. Holy shit man. You're only 5'6" and calling me a twirp? My 10 yr old cousin is taller than you. Who couldn't put a little muscle on that little frame? But what does it matter how much muscle you have? At 5'6" you don't have enough leverage to do anything with it, besides lift weights. And I'm guessing all you do is lift weights and you're probably muscle bound and that sucks for you man. Musclebound means you can barely move because your useless muscles are in the way of each other. And speed is what gets you places in football pal, not alot of weight. That gets you on the biggest loser. And what advice did you give about my cycle? I must've missed it? Oh, probably just said don't use steroids. Good information for the steroids site man. You must be another guy that thinks only short fat guys need steroids to write down how much they squat. Alot of good that will do you.

 

[jfish2134]

Alins advice is useful Of all the posts on here there has been maybe 2 that are useful, so I don't understand why you other guys are even on here.

 

[Lancer55]

lancer Lol. Holy shit man. You're only 5'6" and calling me a twirp? My 10 yr old cousin is taller than you. Who couldn't put a little muscle on that little frame? But what does it matter how much muscle you have? At 5'6" you don't have enough leverage to do anything with it, besides lift weights. And I'm guessing all you do is lift weights and you're probably muscle bound and that sucks for you man. Musclebound means you can barely move because your useless muscles are in the way of each other. And speed is what gets you places in football pal, not alot of weight. That gets you on the biggest loser. And what advice did you give about my cycle? I must've missed it? Oh, probably just said don't use steroids. Good information for the steroids site man. You must be another guy that thinks only short fat guys need steroids to write down how much they squat. Alot of good that will do you.

5'8 learn to read lol. and ya I called ya a twirp, ya mad bro? Speed and not weight okaaaay lol. I said listen to Zyg and Machine is the advice I gave again learn to read man its funny seeing how frustrated you get lol.

 

[Lancer55]

Alins advice is useful Of all the posts on here there has been maybe 2 that are useful, so I don't understand why you other guys are even on here.

Again your opinion, fact is there is lots of useful advice its just advice you don't want to hear, so we do not understand why you are even here. Oh and there are recievers more than 10lbs heavier and 1' shorter than you in Div1 Football and younger, you have been training a few years more than them lol.

 

[digit0x]

Wow. I've said it once, I'll say it again. When Zyg speaks, your note pad better be ready. 90% of that Zyg's 9000 posts are helpful quality feedback from years of experience and knowledge. There are guys on this board who should be paid for the advice they give. You're getting it free and being ungrateful to say the least. Bodybuilders aren't fighters, they are body GURU's. Bodybuilders are masters of the body, hence the name of the sport. If you want to change your body, a BB knows how. Nutrition-training-endocrine are subjects they all must master.

Mr. Fish, I don't know who taught you about MMA but my guess is that you actually don't fight or possibly just signed up at a MMA gym and now think you know all. It's not common that a fighter wants to go up in weight class. There are circumstances where they do, but most of them win a title at a lower class or are naturally prodigal athletes. At 6 ft you have many choices of weight classes. I know for a fact your trainer/coach is not telling you to jump a weight class. Fighters are hard pressed to successfully fight their natural equilibrium.

If your goal is to get to 185 from 170, you CAN NOT train like you are prepping for the next fight. Rather, as Zyg has state, you must modify your training to gain size, then, you can go back to fight prep.

"A fighter can often add or shed muscle mass to move a weight class (sometimes two), but there is generally a weight where their cardiovascular and muscular-skeletal structures are healthy and efficient. Fighting outside this "natural" weight class generally means you're giving up strength, speed, or other." - words from a fighter.


Its ok to be wrong bud. We all knew everything once.

 

[Dustinstubbs]

Look into check shots they are great for mma aggression increase increase in strength not much in size!

 

[LightWeight918]

Sure. id call then scrawny too from a BB or PL standpoint, but they are still amazing athletes and fighters.

We know your asking about steroids, and what we are telling you is you dont need them for your goals. AAS will likely hamper your endurance and possible cause muscle pumps that interfere with existing training. We are not telling you to lay around and eat bon bons either but you cant add mass without consuming the building blocks to support it, pretty simple concept.

Strength training is what you need, not steroids. Can you even deadlift 2x your bodyweight?

Lol just my input but GSP isn't scrawny at all. Maybe compared to top level BBs such as jay cutler but then again how many jay cutlers do you see walking around? GSP isn't huge but he sure as hell isn't scrawny. Just saying man.

 

[Zyglamail]

Lol just my input but GSP isn't scrawny at all. Maybe compared to top level BBs such as jay cutler but then again how many jay cutlers do you see walking around? GSP isn't huge but he sure as hell isn't scrawny. Just saying man.

Okay, maybe by the precise websters dictionary definition he isnt scrawny but 5'10 170lbs is from a pure size/mass standpoint average at best. That would put him what 100lbs lighter than off season jay and significantly lighter than anyone who strength trains as a primary focus at the same height. Regardless of GSP's build there is no doubt he is an awesome athlete and fighter, thats not in question here.

 

[thewhiz7]

If you determined to take something pick either the var or tbol. I would not take 2 orals. I'd take tbol for 5-6 weeks @ 50-60mg ed or Var for 8 weeks @ 60-80mg. I'd still take at least 500mg test a week. You will lose the bloat after your cycle. JMO

 

[alwayzquikwayout]

Just wanted to add my 2cents in here. GSP walks around 190lbs or heavier as do mostly all 170 lbs welterweights!!! ALL Pro MMA fighters walk around heavier than there competition weight on there non fight days!!! To Jfish 2134: The best advise on here is a Test base and an Oral (i'd pick Var at 5wks at least 40mg/day) IMO. If you go over your desired weight,, and you apparently got your dieting and training "down",, than modify your diet and training after your cycle to keep desired muscle and drop back to your 185 lbs. The Test add in is important for LOTS of reasons: if your worried about bloat from the TEST, Arimidex will help and or Proviron, if its still a concern you can do 250mg per week of TEST E w the Var. Mind u most guys will say at least 500mg,,,, but 250mg will keep sides down, estro etc and will giv ya a litte test with that ANavar which you need, IMO. Remember and im sure you know, you cant cut weight and get huge at the same time,,,, so gain what you need and tweak your diet and training to drop back down.

Although U can scratch all the above and do wat Zygla is saying,,, which is prob ur best bet bro!!! after all, muscle aint everything especially in MMA,,, Look at Nick Diaz,, K>florian,,, even that really FAT dude Roy Nelson!!! ITS TECHNIQUE B4 CONDITIONING every time !!!!!!!! ask your sensei or instructor wats more important.