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Plunkey Mark VIII

mrplunkey

mrplunkey

New member
- Just under 10 feet tall
- GPS Enabled
- 3 Axis Magnetic Compass
- 3 Axis Accelerometer
- 3 Axis Gyroscope
- 2 km telemetry link
- 5.5 inch diameter phenolic core
- Carbon fiber fins and guidance system
- Servo controlled guidance with ~20 ms updates
- Dual deployment parachute system

That metal thing off to the side is the hybrid fuel (liquid nitrous/PVC) engine.

339hd8w.png


:nerd:
 
Wow that's really cool.


Sent from my iPhone using EliteFitness app
 
billfred said:
WTF are you going to do with that?
Click to expand...

Fire it, of course!

It's proof that you can build a cruise missile in your own basement. Obviously it doesn't have a warhead, but it has all the other features.
 
The sensor cone uses an eight core multiprocessing chip (essentially eight independent, but linked microprocessors) and the GPS/guidance system uses a single ARM Cortex-based MBED processor.
 
So what is the ultimate goal? Just really cool gear-head hobby or do you have a commercial application in mind?
 
billfred said:
So what is the ultimate goal? Just really cool gear-head hobby or do you have a commercial application in mind?
Click to expand...

Just a nerdvig thing.

What's the ultimate goal? To put something into orbit. I'm thinking summer 2014.
 
What does it burn? Rocket fuel?
Don't you need a permit to get rocket fuel?
Where are you going launch it from?
Your back yard?


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goin on 4T said:
What does it burn? Rocket fuel?
Don't you need a permit to get rocket fuel?
Where are you going launch it from?
Your back yard?


Sent from my iPhone using EliteFitness app
Click to expand...

The Mark I through Mark VII used solid fuel engines made from PBAN and Ammonium Perchlorate. I mixed them up in a KitchenAid mixer and cured them in a Hamilton Beach toaster oven.

The latest engine is a hybrid that uses liquid nitrous oxide (oxidizer) and cylindrical tubes of PVC (fuel). You can get the nitrous from any gas supplier -- no permit necessary.

I can't launch it in my back yard, but there's a perfect spot about 30 mins from my home.
 
mrplunkey said:
The Mark I through Mark VII used solid fuel engines made from PBAN and Ammonium Perchlorate. I mixed them up in a KitchenAid mixer and cured them in a Hamilton Beach toaster oven.

The latest engine is a hybrid that uses liquid nitrous oxide (oxidizer) and cylindrical tubes of PVC (fuel). You can get the nitrous from any gas supplier -- no permit necessary.

I can't launch it in my back yard, but there's a perfect spot about 30 mins from my home.
Click to expand...

How's my new fleshlight design cuming?
 
wootoom said:
Look at me, I'm rich
Click to expand...

That has nothing to do with it.

The MBED processor (with peripherals) is $59.

A 4 foot section of the body runs about $50.

The GPS module (with antenna) ran $80.

It's shocking how inexpensive the components are.
 
mrplunkey said:
That has nothing to do with it.

The MBED processor (with peripherals) is $59.

A 4 foot section of the body runs about $50.

The GPS module (with antenna) ran $80.

It's shocking how inexpensive the components are.
Click to expand...

Just buggin ya big guy haha
 
I spoke with a client that's really into that as well. He was saying that nerdvirg enthusiasts like him need to let the FAA and someone else know (he didn't buy so I wasn't paying attention after that), because the airlines needed to know traz wasn't trying to blow planes up.
 
jnevin said:
I spoke with a client that's really into that as well. He was saying that nerdvirg enthusiasts like him need to let the FAA and someone else know (he didn't buy so I wasn't paying attention after that), because the airlines needed to know traz wasn't trying to blow planes up.
Click to expand...

There's an FAA clearance you have to get. And they deny it if you're near an airport traffic pattern or want to go too high.

Normally at nerdvig events they get the clearance for the entire day, but they're cracking down on the use of "uncertified" motors. Rocketry used to appreciate the experimental guys, but now all the events are sponsored by the motor manufacturers and they're trying to drive the roll-your-own guys out.

It's ironic too, since the recovery system is vastly more important than the motor. A bad launch may create a 30' fireball, but I'd prefer that to a 30 lb rocket free-falling back to earth from 10,000 ft.
 
That thing is awesome. One of the coolest hobbies I have ever seen.

Just one question. . . What devices do u use to communicate with the rocket after launch? Is it fire and forget or can u track/guide it?

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
 
homingpigeon said:
That thing is awesome. One of the coolest hobbies I have ever seen.

Just one question. . . What devices do u use to communicate with the rocket after launch? Is it fire and forget or can u track/guide it?

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...

The telemetry system uses an XBee Pro 900, which is just a 9600 baud serial point-to-point modem. They claim up to 10 mile range but in practice, it's a couple of km.

The rocket takes commands and streams data back through the telemetry link, but is also autonomous when fired. The autonomous functions include detection of ascent phase, apogee detection and the firing of front and rear parachutes. I do that so even if the link is broken, the parachutes will fire at the appropriate times.

While the GPS destination can be updated at any time, obviously you need enough ballistic energy (launch or altitude) to actually reach the desired location.

09099-03-L.jpg
 
mrplunkey said:
The telemetry system uses an XBee Pro 900, which is just a 9600 baud serial point-to-point modem. They claim up to 10 mile range but in practice, it's a couple of km.

The rocket takes commands and streams data back through the telemetry link, but is also autonomous when fired. The autonomous functions include detection of ascent phase, apogee detection and the firing of front and rear parachutes. I do that so even if the link is broken, the parachutes will fire at the appropriate times.

While the GPS destination can be updated at any time, obviously you need enough ballistic energy (launch or altitude) to actually reach the desired location.

09099-03-L.jpg
Click to expand...

Add a gopro camera to that thing.
 
youpissmeoff said:
Add a gopro camera to that thing.
Click to expand...

I bought a Hero 2 to attach to it (along with the mounting kit).

The camera would have to be mounted on the side, which makes me nervous about how it would change the aerodynamics of the rocket. My math assumes that the rocket is rotationally symmetric along the center axis (which it essentially is). It's a doable change, but I'll have to do it later.
 
Again that is a cool hobby.


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mrplunkey said:
I bought a Hero 2 to attach to it (along with the mounting kit).

The camera would have to be mounted on the side, which makes me nervous about how it would change the aerodynamics of the rocket. My math assumes that the rocket is rotationally symmetric along the center axis (which it essentially is). It's a doable change, but I'll have to do it later.
Click to expand...

You can't mount it in the cone??
 
youpissmeoff said:
You can't mount it in the cone??
Click to expand...

I'd want the camera to look down, so it should go closer to the tail section.

For the liftoff, I'd want to see the ground. For the parachute portion, the tail section would be pointing down again.

Really all the cone sees that's cool is the time between apogee and parachute firing where the nose is briefly pointed toward the ground.

But I will get a camera on it at some point for sure.
 
When I was a wee lad in Germany the whole neighborhood was into model rocketry. There'd be 10-15 kids launching at once.
 
Dial_tone said:
When I was a wee lad in Germany the whole neighborhood was into model rocketry. There'd be 10-15 kids launching at once.
Click to expand...

Those were called V-1's and those "wee lads" were the Hitler Youth.

HTH.
 
Everything I need is in place for the next launch.

Right now, I'm tied-up by:

1) Hospitals and doctors freaking the hell out over ObamaCare. It's vastly worse out there than you'd hear in the media.

2) Family (yes, unfortunately... in that order)

3) The FIRST robotics competition. I'm working with a local high school and our first competition is in four weeks!
 
i can't help but think if a LEO saw you setting up to launch they would stop
and check you out with concern.
plunkey, given you have the huge advantage of tech, could v-1 esque tech be able
to compete against you and others at nerdvirg comps? is there any comparison
or is v-1 tech like coal fired navies, totally outdated?
 
i was thinking that a good paint job with some skulls/eagles/etc
would look sick...but would additional paint throw off the aerodynamics?
are things that sensitive?
 
binö said:
i can't help but think if a LEO saw you setting up to launch they would stop
and check you out with concern.
plunkey, given you have the huge advantage of tech, could v-1 esque tech be able
to compete against you and others at nerdvirg comps? is there any comparison
or is v-1 tech like coal fired navies, totally outdated?
Click to expand...

Lotsa rules regarding what you can and can't shoot up into the air.

The old ways had some incredible engineering in them. Today's engineers would have a fit duplicating them from scratch. But a well-trained nerdvig of today could completely crush their tech, just because the off-the-shelf stuff is good beyond belief. You can get a killer GPS now with all sorts of interface options (antenna included too) for $50-$80 -- quantity one.
 
binö said:
i was thinking that a good paint job with some skulls/eagles/etc
would look sick...but would additional paint throw off the aerodynamics?
are things that sensitive?
Click to expand...

My avionics algorithm assumes the rocket is radially symmetric in its weight distribution (which is a pretty safe assumption).

Paint and decals wouldn't affect it at all. You can even get away will small features (like a pitot tube). Where you'd get screwed is something like a Hero 2 camera that sticks-out to the side. For a rocket with a 5.5" diameter, it's just too much overhang.
 
You should upgrade to the SMII or SMIII, they build them at the rocket ranch down the street from me.

SMII shot down the Chinese satellite entering the atmosphere from a navy ship a few years back
 
UA_Iron said:
You should upgrade to the SMII or SMIII, they build them at the rocket ranch down the street from me.

SMII shot down the Chinese satellite entering the atmosphere from a navy ship a few years back
Click to expand...

Don't know what that is.

My propulsion skills are meh... I can mix PBAN/Ammonium Percholorate engines well and I'm learning hybrid engines (Nitrous Oxide / ABS). But I'm certainly no propulsion scientist.

My electronics are pretty solid though. Anything I can reduce to a digital control system = teh win.
 
mrplunkey said:
Don't know what that is.

My propulsion skills are meh... I can mix PBAN/Ammonium Percholorate engines well and I'm learning hybrid engines (Nitrous Oxide / ABS). But I'm certainly no propulsion scientist.

My electronics are pretty solid though. Anything I can reduce to a digital control system = teh win.
Click to expand...

Control systems get nasty... stable nodes and unstable nodes... bleh.

That's a badass rocket though.

I was referring to the Standard Missile - things are huge
 
UA_Iron said:
Control systems get nasty... stable nodes and unstable nodes... bleh.

That's a badass rocket though.

I was referring to the Standard Missile - things are huge
Click to expand...

Yeah, the trick is always in the control system. Once I can reduce it to a digital system, I'm golden. But the problem is characterizing the mechanical part. What I really need is a wind tunnel.

I briefly tried a gimbal design for a solid rocket engine and it was a disaster. The benefit of moving to a hybrid platform is that with a multi-injector design (I use five fixed injectors right now), I could eventually move to electronically-controlled injectors that could steer the propulsion.

It's amazing what you can build with ordinary components available online. I just need to find the time to play with everything. I may post some footage of my newest electronic knuckle (for a relatively strong robot) later this week.
 
mrplunkey said:
Yeah, the trick is always in the control system. Once I can reduce it to a digital system, I'm golden. But the problem is characterizing the mechanical part. What I really need is a wind tunnel.

I briefly tried a gimbal design for a solid rocket engine and it was a disaster. The benefit of moving to a hybrid platform is that with a multi-injector design (I use five fixed injectors right now), I could eventually move to electronically-controlled injectors that could steer the propulsion.

It's amazing what you can build with ordinary components available online. I just need to find the time to play with everything. I may post some footage of my newest electronic knuckle (for a relatively strong robot) later this week.
Click to expand...


is it all modeled up in CAD? We could run some fluid flow analysis on it and get an idea of how it will fly/steer before a wind tunnel.

For that see if your local university will let you in haha
 
somebodies got alot of free time, the board send you home fatty? did they tire of your ineptitude? Did the coffee cup get slapped out of your hand with a "that's for closers"?
 
UA_Iron said:
is it all modeled up in CAD? We could run some fluid flow analysis on it and get an idea of how it will fly/steer before a wind tunnel.

For that see if your local university will let you in haha
Click to expand...

I've got most of it modeled in the latest SolidWorks. At the very end I switched-over to RockSim because it has great launch simulation and will automatically calculate things like the rocket's margin of stability.

Let me finish-up the model and send you the .SLDASM file. What I'd really like is a flow simulation of the net forces acting on the rocket as a function of its velocity and the angle of its guidance fins. That would be incredibly helpful.

You may know this: I've got a fully-licensed seat of SolidWorks Premium for my home. I went from Professional to Premium because I needed the FEA back when we were designing periarticular plates. Would that have a flow simulation module or would I have to buy an extra add-on?
 
redsamurai said:
somebodies got alot of free time, the board send you home fatty? did they tire of your ineptitude? Did the coffee cup get slapped out of your hand with a "that's for closers"?
Click to expand...

how much time do you have on your hands to crop and resize pics of doods?
 
PICK3 said:
how much time do you have on your hands to crop and resize pics of doods?
Click to expand...

I find it hilarious that he uses his free time to "demo" movies and play PC-based video games.

But what does he have other than free time? He's obviously not progressing on his degree nor is he gainfully employed.

That's a lot of video pirating and PC playing.
 
Nose cone electronics were locked-down and hardened tonight.

Guessing I'll try a launch in Southern Virgina a week from today, weather and personal schedule permitting.

110zx54.jpg
 
That's an eight core processor, three axis accelerometer, three axis gyroscope, three axis compass and a digital altimeter all with a self-contained unit that communicates through a RF transmitter/receiver.

Wish me luck!
 
This is the guidance section. It's got a MBED processor (ARM-based), a dedicated GPS computer, and two wireless RF transmitter. The longer range transmitter/receiver works over a 24 km distance.

29bhxsk.jpg
 
Post a pic of that on Facebook and you will have France contacting you wanting to surrender.
 
AAP said:
Post a pic of that on Facebook and you will have France contacting you wanting to surrender.
Click to expand...

I like it. I'll demand they give me their wine and a few of their best women -- but they have to scrub them down and shave them first.
 
PICK3 said:
Is that PhD speak for how high it went :confused:
Click to expand...

Well I thought I'd have numbers. The flight computer reset while it was on its ascent. I lost a full 7.6 seconds worth of data. By the time it restarted, it was about 0.5 km above the launch site and headed down quickly.

So no, I don't know how high it went. Can probably guess-timate tho.
 
mrplunkey said:
Well I thought I'd have numbers. The flight computer reset while it was on its ascent. I lost a full 7.6 seconds worth of data. By the time it restarted, it was about 0.5 km above the launch site and headed down quickly.

So no, I don't know how high it went. Can probably guess-timate tho.
Click to expand...

guess-timate


in U.S. feet
 
digimon7068 said:
i take it that you didn't get around to mounting the camera on the unit?
Click to expand...

Not yet. The aerodynamics scared me.

I may print a nosecone that can take a camera on one side yet keep everything balanced.

I sent my old 3D printer into work. My new one comes in mid-late July.
 
digimon7068 said:
ditto!! i built and launched a bunch of estes rockets in my yute...lost as many as i recovered hahahaha
Click to expand...

This is just like those, but 12+ feet high with 385 lbs of thrust.

And instead of those thin wire solar igniters, you use four 50 caliber pyrodex pellets wired to two jetski batteries.

Fun stuff though.
 
mrplunkey said:
This is just like those, but 12+ feet high with 385 lbs of thrust.

And instead of those thin wire solar igniters, you use four 50 caliber pyrodex pellets wired to two jetski batteries.

Fun stuff though.
Click to expand...

mine were battery ignited...wasn't a lot solar shit around in like 1974 hahaha
 
digimon7068 said:
mine were battery ignited...wasn't a lot solar shit around in like 1974 hahaha
Click to expand...

That's just what they call them. Hell, I seriously doubt even the sun was around when you were a kid -- let alone solar cells.

s7_550913_999_01
 
Mr. dB said:
Are there horsies there?
Click to expand...

Mostly cows, but a few horses.

The horses are much harder to hit though. Plus, cow meat tastes better than horse when it's cooked over an ABS/Nitrous Oxide flame.
 
mrplunkey said:
Mostly cows, but a few horses.

The horses are much harder to hit though. Plus, cow meat tastes better than horse when it's cooked over an ABS/Nitrous Oxide flame.
Click to expand...

Just thought the rockets might spook the livestock.
 
Mr. dB said:
Just thought the rockets might spook the livestock.
Click to expand...

Not nearly as much as you'd think. You hear noise on the ground (as evidenced by the video), but the thing comes off the ground so fast that it's only loud for a couple of seconds. And then it's 100% silent on the way down.
 
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