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PLEASE help me design a 16 week pre contest stack
- Thread starter B-legit
- Start date
jc21
New member
BigAndy.
well i dont consider this to be a brutal stack, like i said earlier i believe most of the stuff is needed when you compete. and yes winny is a most along with either halo or anavar. i didnt say that is what the kid should do, i said that is what i would do, i believe it is a good stack. now it isnt really what i would do, mine is much more complex. if you want to compete at high levels you have to take risks. i left the arimidex out because i dont need it when I cycle...i dont have a problem with aromitiztion, now i do recommend it for other people...but using it 2 weeks out is a must. i dont consider the use of androgens to be excessive at all...all androgens are cut out 6 weeks out...except for halo..which WILL not thicken the skin.
i am not trying to tell b-legit to take this....but i believe it is a good stack for a show. my friend just used almost this exact stack( it was his second) and tore up the show.
my question to you andy is have you ever competed?
well i dont consider this to be a brutal stack, like i said earlier i believe most of the stuff is needed when you compete. and yes winny is a most along with either halo or anavar. i didnt say that is what the kid should do, i said that is what i would do, i believe it is a good stack. now it isnt really what i would do, mine is much more complex. if you want to compete at high levels you have to take risks. i left the arimidex out because i dont need it when I cycle...i dont have a problem with aromitiztion, now i do recommend it for other people...but using it 2 weeks out is a must. i dont consider the use of androgens to be excessive at all...all androgens are cut out 6 weeks out...except for halo..which WILL not thicken the skin.
i am not trying to tell b-legit to take this....but i believe it is a good stack for a show. my friend just used almost this exact stack( it was his second) and tore up the show.
my question to you andy is have you ever competed?
No JC1, I've never competed but I've been through pre contest like dieting. I've help 3 people compete in real life(not the board), 2 men and 1 woman. My expertise are more related to dieting than anything else as I beleive that gear use is only secondary. A friend of mine won his weight class and the overall; using a zambon amp ED for 6 weeks along with arimidex at half a mg a day and clenbuterol. That was it.
I respect your opinion if you feel that all these drugs are necessary and in some cases they are. What really bother me was that B-Legit looked like he was going to do that stack and was going to follow it blindly instead of learning the logic behing the cycle you presented.
I respect your opinion if you feel that all these drugs are necessary and in some cases they are. What really bother me was that B-Legit looked like he was going to do that stack and was going to follow it blindly instead of learning the logic behing the cycle you presented.
jc21
New member
well good to see you do have knowledge about what it takes to compete...you are right some people can go in on virtually nothing an win. and you are right that it wasn't the brightest idea to follow a cycle blindly that some guy uses off the net. i was just meant to be a starting out point. i figured depending on his experince that we would take something things out of put somethings in.
i respect your opinion as well and i am glad that we could discuss this in a civil manner without flames flying everywhere.
i respect your opinion as well and i am glad that we could discuss this in a civil manner without flames flying everywhere.
Remember that this kid is only 20 years old so advising that kind of cycle to someone of that age is already pushing it. He also has some sort of previous AS usage which means he probably started at 19 and maybe younger which we all know is bad news. I stopped growing vertically by 10th grade but I didn't completely fill out until I was at least 21. I put on a lot of muscle mass naturally a few years after high school and I didn't even work out. Had I started AS I might have missed out on that natural growth period.
At any rate I still think it's too many drugs for a cutting stack. He would probably do well on 250-300mg of Test weekly along with a high dose of Ox and a low dose of T3. He could stop the Test after 10 weeks and let it taper off naturally while he continued the Ox throughout the show. Chances are he'd probably gain a little LBM from the Ox while significantly dropping his bodyfat IF his diet is in check. Ox is one of the best anti-catabolic drugs out there. Combined with a very strict low calorie diet he should be able to drop considerable fat while keeping most of his mass.
Remember, he wants to win this show and if he's 12% bodyfat now then he needs to concentrate on cutting and nothing else. Who cares if he adds 10 pounds of LBM before the show, if he doesn't come in shredded it won't matter. He'll look bigger with 10 pounds less LBM if he is at 5% bodyfat than if he was 10 pounds heavier at 8%.
My bottom line is KISS. As jc21 said "he isnt pro he is just a kid doing a novice show to have fun" so I see no need to go balls out on a cycle like you suggested. I know there are pros out there that probably take less drugs while dieting than you advised.
At any rate I still think it's too many drugs for a cutting stack. He would probably do well on 250-300mg of Test weekly along with a high dose of Ox and a low dose of T3. He could stop the Test after 10 weeks and let it taper off naturally while he continued the Ox throughout the show. Chances are he'd probably gain a little LBM from the Ox while significantly dropping his bodyfat IF his diet is in check. Ox is one of the best anti-catabolic drugs out there. Combined with a very strict low calorie diet he should be able to drop considerable fat while keeping most of his mass.
Remember, he wants to win this show and if he's 12% bodyfat now then he needs to concentrate on cutting and nothing else. Who cares if he adds 10 pounds of LBM before the show, if he doesn't come in shredded it won't matter. He'll look bigger with 10 pounds less LBM if he is at 5% bodyfat than if he was 10 pounds heavier at 8%.
My bottom line is KISS. As jc21 said "he isnt pro he is just a kid doing a novice show to have fun" so I see no need to go balls out on a cycle like you suggested. I know there are pros out there that probably take less drugs while dieting than you advised.
JohnnyHollywood
New member
B-legit said:
I know your not a pussy.......ehh........I guess not. I agree with what you are saying, bulk the first 8 weeks and harden up the other 8. I don't see anything wrong with that?
I don't know where the pussy thing came from unless you feel that we don't think you can handle the cycle. It has nothing to do with that, all of my replies were mostly to the effect that you're getting bad advice.
First and foremost I think you're setting yourself up for failure. The average pro bodybuilder never goes above 12% bodyfat in the off season yet they routinely take 16 weeks to diet down to contest shape. You on the other hand want to bulk for 8 weeks then diet for 8. If you want to put on muscle for 8 weeks then you are gonna have to eat and when you do that you're gonna put on some fat. Even if it's minimal it's still more than you have now. Even IF you managed to not put on any more fat, you still only would have 8 weeks to diet down to contest shape which I'm guessing is in the neighborhood of 5%. I no of no individual who can go from 12% to 5% bodyfat in 8 weeks without burning off all of the mass they worked so hard to gain. This is just plain and simple fact it has nothing to do if you're "tough enough" to handle it.
I'm just trying to clue you into reality instead of blowing sunshine up your ass as others have done. You cannot realistically do what you're wanting to do and hope to come into the contest with expectations of winning. If you don't think you're big enough to win 16 weeks out then you shouldn't enter because you will only get smaller while dieting. Bulking for 6 weeks before hand isn't the answer because if you con't come in shredded you will place horribly. Even if you managed to hit the 8% mark you will look smooth compared to the others around you that I guarantee will be shredded to the bone. Perhaps this needs to happen so you will then realize the true dedication it will take to reach contest shape. As it seems now you think it's not hard to do and that you'll just shed that extra 7% bodyfat in a mere 8 weeks. Unless you're a genetic anomaly I don't see this happening. Not to mention the fact that if you were a genetic anomaly you'd never have gotten up to 12% as it is.
My suggestion is to come in to the contest with the muscle mass you have now, just be as hard and dry as you can be to make yourself appear even bigger. Anyone who tells you that you can gain muscle for 8 weeks then shed fat for the last 8 and expect to be down in contest shape is full of shit plain and simple.
My last little advice to you is it's the diet and workout that do 90% of the work, any amount of drugs won't make up for this fact. That is why the mega-cycle advised to you isn't the answer to your prayers, being prepared is.
First and foremost I think you're setting yourself up for failure. The average pro bodybuilder never goes above 12% bodyfat in the off season yet they routinely take 16 weeks to diet down to contest shape. You on the other hand want to bulk for 8 weeks then diet for 8. If you want to put on muscle for 8 weeks then you are gonna have to eat and when you do that you're gonna put on some fat. Even if it's minimal it's still more than you have now. Even IF you managed to not put on any more fat, you still only would have 8 weeks to diet down to contest shape which I'm guessing is in the neighborhood of 5%. I no of no individual who can go from 12% to 5% bodyfat in 8 weeks without burning off all of the mass they worked so hard to gain. This is just plain and simple fact it has nothing to do if you're "tough enough" to handle it.
I'm just trying to clue you into reality instead of blowing sunshine up your ass as others have done. You cannot realistically do what you're wanting to do and hope to come into the contest with expectations of winning. If you don't think you're big enough to win 16 weeks out then you shouldn't enter because you will only get smaller while dieting. Bulking for 6 weeks before hand isn't the answer because if you con't come in shredded you will place horribly. Even if you managed to hit the 8% mark you will look smooth compared to the others around you that I guarantee will be shredded to the bone. Perhaps this needs to happen so you will then realize the true dedication it will take to reach contest shape. As it seems now you think it's not hard to do and that you'll just shed that extra 7% bodyfat in a mere 8 weeks. Unless you're a genetic anomaly I don't see this happening. Not to mention the fact that if you were a genetic anomaly you'd never have gotten up to 12% as it is.
My suggestion is to come in to the contest with the muscle mass you have now, just be as hard and dry as you can be to make yourself appear even bigger. Anyone who tells you that you can gain muscle for 8 weeks then shed fat for the last 8 and expect to be down in contest shape is full of shit plain and simple.
My last little advice to you is it's the diet and workout that do 90% of the work, any amount of drugs won't make up for this fact. That is why the mega-cycle advised to you isn't the answer to your prayers, being prepared is.
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