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Newbie Cycles Galore

T

Twitched

New member
Newbie Cycles Galore - With Newbie FAQ

It seems in the past two days there have been a lot of similar posts hinting around cycles where EQ replaces Deca, or EQ and Anavar are looking to be used in conjunction.Below or what I feel are the 3 best cycles that will continue to work over and over for most people. The focus here is on quick and easy recovery, gains retention, quality mass, and bload supression. I recommend that you research the following cycles, since I cannot recommend anything without knowing specific statistics, but they should be perfect in this form. If you are unwilling to spend money on HCG and Arimidex, then I can't condone what you are doing. The clomid, arimidex, and hCG are set up perfectly for a nice recovery.

Here they are, enjoy.

And no, the dosages aren't too low.

It was formatted nicely, but the board seems to strip tabs from text.

Boldenone/Oxandrolone

wk 1-9 Equipoise (Boldenone) 400 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 1-12 Arimidex (Anastrazole) .25 mg/Daily
wk 4-11 Anavar (Oxandrolone) 40mg/Daily BTG or SPA Brand!
Wk 3-4 Pregnyl (hCG) 500IU/Daily
Wk 7-8 Pregnyl (hCG) 500IU/Daily
Wk 11 Pregnyl (hCG) 500IU/Daily
wk 12 Day 5-7 Clomid (Clomiphene) 100mg/Day
wk 13-14 Clomid (Clomiphene) 50mg/Day
wk 15 Clomid (Clomiphene) 25mg/ED

Test Cyp/Boldenone

wk 1-9 Equipoise (Boldenone) 300 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 1-10 T200 (test Cypionate)300 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 1-12 Arimidex (Anastrazole) .5 mg/Daily
Wk 3-4 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
Wk 7-8 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
Wk 11 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
wk 12 Day 5-7 Clomid (Clomiphene) 100 mg/Day
wk 13 Clomid (Clomiphene) 75 mg/Day
wk 14 Clomid (Clomiphene) 50 mg/Day
wk 15 Clomid (Clomiphene) 25 mg/ED


Test Cyp/Boldenone/Oxandrolone

wk 1-9 Equipoise (Boldenone) 300 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 1-10 T200 (test Cypionate)300 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 6-11 Anavar (Oxandrolone) 30mg/Daily BTG or SPA Brand!
wk 1-12 Arimidex (Anastrazole) .5 mg/Daily
Wk 3-4 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
Wk 7-8 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
Wk 11 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
wk 12 Day 5-7 Clomid (Clomiphene) 100 mg/Day
wk 13 Clomid (Clomiphene) 75 mg/Day
wk 14 Clomid (Clomiphene) 50 mg/Day
wk 15 Clomid (Clomiphene) 25 mg/ED

I would recommend reading the drug profiles for all of these substances. There is a link in my signature.

Best regards,

twitched
 
Last edited:
Quadsweep said:
Very nice post twiched! I think all the cycles look very good for a newbie. And you all know I am one conservative son of a bitch! Good job bro, Karma to you!
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot quadsweep..

I am a very patient man. If done right, I feel you can continually gain solid mass off of conservative cycles.

I've done the EQ/Anavar/Cyp one personally 3 times, keeping 15 pounds of quality mass every time. I don't see the need to blow up like a water baloon.

I see some some people on other boards who have done 10 cycles and are sitting at 220 lbs, 5'8", 12% bf. Why is that?. If they only concentrated on gaining 8lbs of quality mass from each cycle.. well anyone can do the math :).

twitched
 
Quality stuff bro... I can only hope people take your advice... I defenitely agree with everything you said though ;)
Karma...

YUM
 
Willyumyum said:
Quality stuff bro... I can only hope people take your advice... I defenitely agree with everything you said though ;)
Karma...

YUM
Click to expand...


Thanks a lot willy.

Treating your HPTA nicely is more then just bieng safe with your body, it's also about reaching your maximum potential IMO!
 
Newbies: If you need help on training during your cycle, I posted a routine that has been very successful for me and my friends.(although everyone is different).

I designed it with a million factors in mind, even avoiding busy times in the gym, and avoiding involvement of sore muscles in each days workout.


I posted it here:

Bulking Regime



Regards,

Twitched
 
Last edited:
I'm going to keep a running log of FAQs that I get in my email in this thread. Maybe to answer any questions newbies might have before emailing.. Emails are always welcome however.

Q: How about Deca instead of EQ? I hear Deca is a safe drug that is great for newbies.

A: EQ and Deca are very similar in their action pathways.. The reasons NOT to choose Deca:

Most anabolics, except for Deca, Finaplex, and Anadrol to name a few, convert to estrogen.

If you notice in my post, I prescribed arimidex, which will decrease aromatise enzyme values, thus preventing that from taking place. This helps ensure you do not bloat up, and most importantly, you do NOT grow a pair of tits!

Deca on the other hand, converts to Progesterone. Progesterone is UNSTOPPABLE (within reason, Ru-486 isn't worth mentioning IMO). If you start to show signs of gyno on deca, there is no way to combat it. Deca also has a very long half life, so even if you quit using it at the first sign of gyno, it will be too late. The bloat is similarly uncontrollable.

If you are hardheaded, I would never recommend Deca over 300mg/wk. It seems most people can duck the progesterone sides at this dose and lower.

Furthermore, EQ greatly stimulates your appetite, which is great for a beginner who may not be used to eating 4,000cal/Day. The pumps are great, and serve for some exitement in the gym.


Q: "My friends use D-Bol and get real big..Can I jumpstart one of these cycles with D-bol?"

Sidenote: No offense to the vets who use d-bol properly, this answer is directed more to novices.

This drug is very popular because it has a "name" on the street. People love the convienience of just popping a d-bol without the "inconvienience" of an inject. AS is a very serious endeavor. Your "convienience" should be low on your list of priorities. D-bol is liver toxic, which complicates things for a newbie. D-bol is of high school locker room lore, and hence is rarely taken properly. The reason people "explode" on it is more attributable to their lack of use of anti-e's resulting in massive water retention. When taken with the right amount of arimidex, the gains from d-bol are still good, but not as "astonishing" and certainly not worth the liver toxicity or further complicating your beginner cycle. As my mom always used to say "Tomorrow is another day". Save something wrecklessly endangering for later cycles.


More to come...

twitched.
 
I see you got my mail Twitched. Thanks for a good post! Nice to see someone putting effort into their posts - instead of bragging about girls they've banged and posting stupid questions about getting shampoo in their eyes and stuff
(no offense shadycakes16)... [LOL]

Anyway; BUMP!
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the post twitched! Everyone is helpful here, but things are rarely put out so clearly for us newbies. I have a couple of questions. You referred to T200 in the cycles as being Cyp. I thought T200 was always a enanthate ester. Is this correct? Also I'm tryying to come up with the best way to preserve gains post cycle. What do you think of running clen and a very low dose of anavar while doing clomid therapy. Would this be unwise. Again, I appreciate your post.
 
Thanks a lot everyone. I'm glad it was helpful.

muscle_geek, actually you're right.. T200 is usually referring to that brovel or tornell test enanthate.. I kinda prefer Cyp but it really doesn't make much difference..

As for the anavar/clen thing..

Running clen during clomid is fine.. might even help you out in the gym during this rough time.. as for the anavar.. despite the fact that it isn't supposed to "effect" the hpta, I still think it does mildly at anywhere near useful doses.. therefore you would have to run it at a dose that would be a waste of time..

Clen is a good idea though.. I was going to include it, but I was already pushing 5-6 substances in one cycle!

regards,

twitched


P.S. If you run the anavar as listed, and go through the pain in the ass process of the mid cycle hcg therapy as specified, you will retain your gains almost completely. Your testes will remain full and vibrant, and recovery will be a snap at those dosages with that hcg therapy + clomid therapy. The hcg is actually kind of overkill, but it's damn nice touch at that dosing schedule.
 
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Bro, I don't know how you did it but you read my mind! That's exactly the cycle I plan on running with HCG and arimidex setup the exact way. (Eq at 400mg in 2 shots, Ox 25mg ED(BTG).)

I do include clen in cycles, gets your ass in the gym and gives you extra hardness.
 
BigAndy69 said:
Bro, I don't know how you did it but you read my mind! That's exactly the cycle I plan on running with HCG and arimidex setup the exact way. (Eq at 400mg in 2 shots, Ox 25mg ED(BTG).)

I do include clen in cycles, gets your ass in the gym and gives you extra hardness.
Click to expand...


Good stuff good stuff.. I wanna hear about everyones results.

Let me know!
 
Twitched, AWESOME post bro! The cycles you came up with look great and I especially like the idea of low doses for newbies, which almost seem unheard of now a days. The Test/EQ/Anavar cycles looks REALLY good. It just might be my FIRST cycle...
 
I couldn't have said it better myself!!!!

Great stuff, this is one of the reasons I'm still on Elite and not switched over to another board. Bro's who know what the hell is up!!!

Karma!!
 
Great Post. Definitely should be in our Post Hall of Fame (if we ever make one)....I have decided to use HCG just the way you stated. From my research 500 seems to be best dosage. High enough to stimulate the little guys, but low enough not to desensitize them to LH.
 
Well, I think that's great info, but I'm still one of those guys who thinks that your first cycle will be your best, so make the best of it. There I see no problems with a deca/dbol cycle. I always advice to go with a androgen/anabolic. dbol/primo would be another I suggest. But, again, great post.kji
 
Very good post indeed. I liked what i saw. My cycle that im running now, is going to include HCG, except i will start HCG weeks 4-5, and 8-10.

Sustanon 750mg wk (3 shots Mon-Wed-Fri)
EQ 600mg wk (3 shots Mon-Wed-Fri)
Dbol 30mg day for 5 weeks
Immediately after dbol, im starting
50mg Winny Zambons per day for 5-7 weeks
Arimidex .5mg day
HCG, and clomid therapy..got that

Pretty much ready to rock. I have gone from weighing about 170 2 months ago to 190 right now. Only on day 8 of my cycle. Just from eating right, and YES> MUSCLE MEMORY!!!!!!!
 
Thanks everyone for the positive feedback..

el_cubano: different strokes for different folks I guess! :). By bieng real methodical and putting enough off time between cycles I feel like a virgin every time! thanks for the feedback!


twitched
 
newbies save the cycle post for those who know more.

Twitched said:
It seems in the past two days there have been a lot of similar posts hinting around cycles where EQ replaces Deca, or EQ and Anavar are looking to be used in conjunction.Below or what I feel are the 3 best cycles that will continue to work over and over for most people. The focus here is on quick and easy recovery, gains retention, quality mass, and bload supression. I recommend that you research the following cycles, since I cannot recommend anything without knowing specific statistics, but they should be perfect in this form. If you are unwilling to spend money on HCG and Arimidex, then I can't condone what you are doing. The clomid, arimidex, and hCG are set up perfectly for a nice recovery.

Here they are, enjoy.

And no, the dosages aren't too low.

It was formatted nicely, but the board seems to strip tabs from text.

Boldenone/Oxandrolone

wk 1-9 Equipoise (Boldenone) 400 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 1-12 Arimidex (Anastrazole) .25 mg/Daily
wk 4-11 Anavar (Oxandrolone) 40mg/Daily BTG or SPA Brand!
Wk 3-4 Pregnyl (hCG) 500IU/Daily
Wk 7-8 Pregnyl (hCG) 500IU/Daily
Wk 11 Pregnyl (hCG) 500IU/Daily
wk 12 Day 5-7 Clomid (Clomiphene) 100mg/Day
wk 13-14 Clomid (Clomiphene) 50mg/Day
wk 15 Clomid (Clomiphene) 25mg/ED

Test Cyp/Boldenone

wk 1-9 Equipoise (Boldenone) 300 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 1-10 T200 (test Cypionate)300 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 1-12 Arimidex (Anastrazole) .5 mg/Daily
Wk 3-4 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
Wk 7-8 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
Wk 11 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
wk 12 Day 5-7 Clomid (Clomiphene) 100 mg/Day
wk 13 Clomid (Clomiphene) 75 mg/Day
wk 14 Clomid (Clomiphene) 50 mg/Day
wk 15 Clomid (Clomiphene) 25 mg/ED


Test Cyp/Boldenone/Oxandrolone

wk 1-9 Equipoise (Boldenone) 300 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 1-10 T200 (test Cypionate)300 mg/wk (two shots per week)
wk 6-11 Anavar (Oxandrolone) 30mg/Daily BTG or SPA Brand!
wk 1-12 Arimidex (Anastrazole) .5 mg/Daily
Wk 3-4 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
Wk 7-8 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
Wk 11 Pregnyl (hCG) 500 IU/Daily
wk 12 Day 5-7 Clomid (Clomiphene) 100 mg/Day
wk 13 Clomid (Clomiphene) 75 mg/Day
wk 14 Clomid (Clomiphene) 50 mg/Day
wk 15 Clomid (Clomiphene) 25 mg/ED

I would recommend reading the drug profiles for all of these substances. There is a link in my signature.

Best regards,

twitched
Click to expand...

that is WAY to much HCG. Please read below.


by Bill Roberts - HCG is provided as a glycoprotein powder to be diluted with water, and acts in the body like LH, stimulating the testes to produce testosterone even when natural LH is not present or is deficient. It therefore is useful for maintaining testosterone production and/or testicle size during a steroid cycle. Use of this drug in the taper is rather counterproductive, since the resulting increased testosterone production is itself inhibitory to the hypothalamus and pituitary, delaying recovery. Thus, if this drug is used, it is preferably used during the cycle itself. A daily amount of 500 IU is generally sufficient, and in my opinion usage should not exceed 1000 IU per day.

Daily administration is superior to less frequent administration.

Doses over 1000 IU are noted for their tendency to cause or aggravate gynecomastia, and also act to desensitize the testicles to LH.

HCG may be injected intramuscularly, subcutaneously, or in a shallow injection about 1/4" deep with the needle going straight in. A 29 gauge insulin needle is recommended. Injection speed should be slow.

Some HCG products are diluted 5000 or even 10,000 IU per mL, while others are diluted 1000 IU per mL. So far as I know there is no need to make the preparation so dilute. Once mixed, the preparation should be refrigerated and used within a few weeks. The substance is also somewhat temperature sensitive before mixing and should not be exposed to excessive heat.

HCG does not correct the problem of progressively-decreasing ejaculatory volume that is typical during a steroid cycle. So far as I know the only cure is to go off-cycle and use Clomid, but it is possible that HMG, a related drug which works analogously to FSH might be useful during a cycle to treat this problem. HMG supports spermatogenesis and is commonly used in conjunction with HCG to treat male fertility problems. (Consider use of HMG to maintain ejaculatory volume to be a strictly past-the-cutting-edge hypothesis: I have not yet had the opportunity to test the matter.)

The athlete who would otherwise fail a urinary ratio test because of low epitestosterone may find HCG useful in increasing epitestosterone and therefore improving this ratio. A 500 IU dose is sufficient, but on the other hand, HCG itself is also banned by the IOC and is readily detected in urine.

HCG can also useful for returning testosterone to normal levels should levels be low post-cycle, or, with care, to increase levels from normal to high normal. Titration of the dose, by measuring T levels and then adjusting the HCG dose accordingly, is recommended for long term use.
 
Re: newbies save the cycle post for those who know more.

johnboy said:


that is WAY to much HCG. Please read below.


by Bill Roberts - HCG is provided as a glycoprotein powder to be diluted with water, and acts in the body like LH, stimulating the testes to produce testosterone even when natural LH is not present or is deficient. It therefore is useful for maintaining testosterone production and/or testicle size during a steroid cycle. Use of this drug in the taper is rather counterproductive, since the resulting increased testosterone production is itself inhibitory to the hypothalamus and pituitary, delaying recovery. Thus, if this drug is used, it is preferably used during the cycle itself. A daily amount of 500 IU is generally sufficient, and in my opinion usage should not exceed 1000 IU per day.
..
Click to expand...


What are you talking about? He says right there 500IU per day is generally sufficient. That is exactly what I have recommended.
 
Great post,Karma for you.
 
Thanks guenepo..I am still waiting for johnboy to explain his post.. just to make sure everything is in agreement here..
 
Last edited:
Your right

Twitched said:


What are you talking about? He says right there 500IU per day is generally sufficient. That is exactly what I have recommended.
Click to expand...

My bad, I could have sworn it said 5000.
 
.25 mg is okay... especially at low overall AS dose on that cycle.. but I personally prefer .5mg. It really KO's any chance of gyno, and you stay rock hard through the entire cycle without any bloat.



twitched
 
Twitched said:
.. just to make sure everything is in agreement here..
Click to expand...

Something you will RARELY find on EF. ;) But something you've seemed to do nevertheless.

Great post bro!
 
Twitched, take a look at this and tell me what do you think? Test Enathate@500mgs for 10 weeks, EQ@400mgs for 9 weeks, and Winstrol@50mgs a day for weeks 7-12. Clomid therapy starting weeks 13-15, Arimidex throughout and post cycle at .50mgs a day. My goal is 20lbs of Lean Muscle with low water retention post cycle. Stats- 6'4" 245lbs with 9-10% bodyfat. This will be my FIRST cycle. So, what do you think?
 
Texas Ranger said:
Twitched, take a look at this and tell me what do you think? Test Enathate@500mgs for 10 weeks, EQ@400mgs for 9 weeks, and Winstrol@50mgs a day for weeks 7-12. Clomid therapy starting weeks 13-15, Arimidex throughout and post cycle at .50mgs a day. My goal is 20lbs of Lean Muscle with low water retention post cycle. Stats- 6'4" 245lbs with 9-10% bodyfat. This will be my FIRST cycle. So, what do you think?
Click to expand...


That will be a fucking incredible first cycle.

You'll reach your goal easy if you eat 4000+ calories a day, which will be easy with the boldenone.

You'll be a bad mofo when you are done.

I definately would like to see before/after pics and any week to week progress reports if you will..

Those are the doses I was considering for my own next cycle..

Try to get some real good test.. some upjohn or something..
twitched
 
Last edited:
Twitched, I'm going to go with some high quality Test(Testoviron or ICN). I'm trying to track down some QualityVet EQ, right now. (Guys, any help would be appreciated!!!). I'm also going to use ** Winny Tabs. They're cheap and have at least 45mgs of Winstrol in each tab from a recent lab test. As far as diet goes, I'm going to take in between 5,000-6,000 calories and 400+ grams of protein a day. Looking for some BIG results. Thanks again for your help!!!
 
You'd be fine with just clomid..

I just think the HCG makes for a flawless recovery...and I think it helps gains too..I just like to keep my nuts nice and full and sensitive.

Tex-Ranger: Fantastic.. would be cool if you could get some Zambons instead of IP but that would really be pushing it cost wise .

*bumping* for the newbies asking for newbie cycles..

Twitched
 
I hope it works out for you guys.. Let me know how it turns out.. if you have time email me every once and a while with a status update :).


twitched
 
just out of curiousity, what would be the approximate price for these cycles? obviously there will eb a large range because prices are different everywhere. does anyone have a ballpark figure as to how much these would run you in north america (canada more specifially)?
 
Roughly...

If you have a good source, and you buy real quality humgrade..

Cycle 1:

Two bottles of EQ (TTokkyo): $150
Astra Zeneca Arimidex (30 tabs): $175
Organon hCG 6x2500IU ~ 50$
(24) anfarm hellas clomid 50mg ~ 24$

Pick one:
SPA Oxandrolone. 1$ per pill ~ 896$
Zambon winny (50mg amps) ~ 448$ (To substitute for anavar)

Total: $1300
With Zambon Winny instead (50mg/day): $847 (and kickass)

Cycle 2:

Two bottles of EQ (TTokkyo): $150
Astra Zeneca Arimidex (30 tabs): $175
Organon hCG 6x2500IU ~ 50$
(24) anfarm hellas clomid 50mg ~ 24$
12 amps of Testoviron (schering) ~ 96-108$

Total: $507


Cycle 3:

Two bottles of EQ (TTokkyo): $150
Astra Zeneca Arimidex (30 tabs): $175
Organon hCG 6x2500IU ~ 50$
(24) anfarm hellas clomid 50mg ~ 24$
12 amps of Testoviron (schering) ~ 96-108$

Pick one:
SPA Oxandrolone. 1$ per pill @ 30mg/day ~ 672$
Zambons (50mg amps) @ 50mg eod ~ 224$ (To sub for anavar)

Cycle 3 total (with anavar): $1179
Cycle 3 total (with zambon winny): $731



Hey, no one ever said doing it right was cheap :).



twitched
 
Great Job Twitched!!!!!!

Are you looking forward to bring up versions of newbie cycles for chicks and MPB ??

Take Care
 
Thanks ryce.

As for the womens cycles.. I really don't feel comfortable making recommendations on that topic.. with men.. although it is dangerous..I could recommend just about anything and they would recover eventually.. AS can be VERY harmful to women..For example.. say if I were to give a cycle.. then if the woman who read it wasn't experienced enough to have a really good source could end up taking anadrol when she meant to take anavar (*cough* IP), or shooting test suspension from her "zambon" amps. Counterfiets are much more of an issue with women, therefore I think it is better to actually keep the info away from them for as long as possible :).

As for MPB, I've not done much research on Proscar myself.. maybe someone else here can chime in on how to incorporate Proscar and Nizoral shampoo into the above cycles..

I'll look into it myself if we don't see any input..


twitched
 
Again...great post. I am running the HCG just the way you wrote it. You could also consider running the arimidex until the clomid therapy is finished. Seems logical that this would further assist in HPTA recovery as there would be less estrogen to compete with the clomid.



Twitched said:


Deca on the other hand, converts to Progesterone. Progesterone is UNSTOPPABLE (within reason, Ru-486 isn't worth mentioning IMO).
Click to expand...

One more thing, technically this is wrong. Deca does NOT convert to progesterone.

Great post bro.
 
Texas Ranger said:
I'm trying to track down some QualityVet EQ, right now. (Guys, any help would be appreciated. Thanks again for your help!!!
Click to expand...

screw TT

get some Fort Dodge

at

50 ml

50 mg per ml
 
This is hands DOWN the best post I have read so far - and I've been lurking (and learning) for a while now :). I am going to start my *first* cycle soon. I really perscribe to the "smaller"/ more consistant/ over time theory that this post is based on - after all, that is what lifting weights has been all about for me - small, consistant, over time gains if I am dedicated and focused. OK - next logical question:

If money was not an issue (its really not for me), which of these three cycles would I choose?

Some background info:

I'm 6'2", 200lbs (I have no idea what my body fat is) but I have a 48" chest, 34 inch waist, 17 inch bicepts. I'm looking to cut down some stomach fast and gain LEAN muscle (I'd like to get my arms up to 21 inches eventually and my waist down to 32 - chest - as big as I can go :) ).

Thanks for this GREAT post!!

KARMA FOR YOU! :angel:
 
Again...great post. I am running the HCG just the way you wrote it. You could also consider running the arimidex until the clomid therapy is finished. Seems logical that this would further assist in HPTA recovery as there would be less estrogen to compete with the clomid.
Click to expand...

I would run arimidex halfway through clomid but that is it. It is important that you let your natural test aromatize into estrogen in the recovery stage because estrogen is an important hormone for restoring good cholesterol levels, and it DOES play a role in the muscle building process. There is no need to supress estrogen during clomid therapy since the androgens (which produced the above average estrogen levels) are gone. Estrogen binds just as well as clomid ( a synthetic estrogen itself ) to the hypothalimus, therefore it isn't 'competing' with the clomid. When you don't run clomid, the androgens in your blood dip, and your natural test production is down, therefore it is the LACK of estrogen in your body that is hindering your recovery! Clomid is the "estrogen" of choice for recovery because it does not activate the nasty receptors such as the ones in your tits. Estrogen isn't BAD at normal levels! It's important!

screw TT

get some Fort Dodge

at

50 ml

50 mg per ml
Click to expand...

I agree, however I feel TT is more appropriate because 50mg/ml is FAR too much injection volume for a first time user. It would be very awkward.


and again...great avatar.

Where did you get that before pic.
Click to expand...

I snagged some pics off of muscletech's site and messed with em.. I just love how muscletech claims to be responsible for Lee's off season -> competition transformation.


If money was not an issue (its really not for me), which of these three cycles would I choose?
Click to expand...

I would recommend the Anavar/EQ cycle for starters, with BTG anavar.

I hope money isn't an issue because BTG @ 40mgED for 8 weeks can be over $1200.



thanks for the replies,

twitched
 
strong island said:

One more thing, technically this is wrong. Deca does NOT convert to progesterone.

Great post bro.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what you mean by this, maybe I should rephrase.. Deca might not "convert" to progesterone, I was oversimplfying. What I meant is by hook or crook Deca can activate the progesterone receptors in your titties. Although many people don't report this causing problems for them.


twitched
 
Twitched said:


I'm not sure what you mean by this, maybe I should rephrase.. Deca might not "convert" to progesterone, I was oversimplfying. What I meant is by hook or crook Deca can activate the progesterone receptors in your titties. Although many people don't report this causing problems for them.


twitched
Click to expand...


I meant that deca does not convert to progesterone. I am sure you know that...but others take everything that is written as FACT. Next thing you know everyone is saying that deca converts to progesterone...which is not true. Thats all bro. Great post.

peace
 
Twitched said:


There is no need to supress estrogen during clomid therapy since the androgens (which produced the above average estrogen levels) are gone. Estrogen binds just as well as clomid ( a synthetic estrogen itself ) to the hypothalimus, therefore it isn't 'competing' with the clomid. When you don't run clomid, the androgens in your blood dip, and your natural test production is down, therefore it is the LACK of estrogen in your body that is hindering your recovery! Clomid is the "estrogen" of choice for recovery because it does not activate the nasty receptors such as the ones in your tits. Estrogen isn't BAD at normal levels! It's important!
Click to expand...


When you begin clomid therapy the androgens are not gone...but they are lower relative to their peak levels. The clomid is competing with the estrogen, since we are trying to block the estrogen from binding to the estrogen receptors on the hypothalamus. Even if there were no androgens...the presence of high estrogen levels would be enough to suppress the HPT axis. So it is important for both androgen and estrogen levels to be low for the hyothalamus to be "motivated" into sending GnRH. Estrogen is important AT NORMAL LEVELS...but right after your cycle estrogen is high and can be a problem. Maybe tapering off the arimidex is ideal??

my .02
 
The main idea is that high estrogen levels never exist in your body because of the anastrozole usage through the cycle. The only way for "high estrogen levels" to exist would be to terminate the anastrozole early enough that there is still enough overdose of androgen in your blood to aromatize. If you stop arimidex halfway through clomid, chances are all of your androgens will have dipped very low (and hence won't be able to cause a estrogen spike). The key point is that arimidex controls the aromatise enzyme, so even if you discontinue halfway through clomid, it's gonna take a little time to get that enzyme up to par.. You at some point need to let your endocrine functions completely settle themselves.. and that means not meddling with your estrogen production.. giving your estrogen levels time to find a healty balance is just as important as getting your test concentration where it needs to be..

twitched
 
Twitched said:
Thanks ryce.

As for the womens cycles.. I really don't feel comfortable making recommendations on that topic.. with men.. although it is dangerous..I could recommend just about anything and they would recover eventually.. AS can be VERY harmful to women..For example.. say if I were to give a cycle.. then if the woman who read it wasn't experienced enough to have a really good source could end up taking anadrol when she meant to take anavar (*cough* IP), or shooting test suspension from her "zambon" amps. Counterfiets are much more of an issue with women, therefore I think it is better to actually keep the info away from them for as long as possible :).

As for MPB, I've not done much research

I'll look into it myself if we don't see any input..


twitched
Click to expand...

Twitched,
something I've noticed in Brazil is that the % of women looking for steroids is increasing several time folder due to a lot of reasons, that may fit another topic, but my point is that women usually won't think twice or try to make an informed decision before juicing. I always try to convince to the contrary but when I can not I ask them to try a prohormone (19 nordiol) first as I feel the limited number of enzymes for conversion makes up for some safety and might deliver 2 to 4 kilos usually what they look for. If I still can not dissuade chicks from juicing I try to stick with the 10mg day Anavar for 6 weeks. Cycles for women and MPB concerned pals have been debated here by lots of experts but I asked you to do a "Twitched" version because you seem to have a unique way of summarizing those things.

What's ya take?
Ryce
 
ryce,

If I had to suggest, I would recommend clen to females.. they seem to react well to it, and it works like hell on them.. It probobly has near the anabolic effect they would see @ 10mg/ED of Anavar (at least for the first few weeks).

If they absolutely are desperate to up the risks, a cycle of 5mg/ED anavar (good anavar) should be more then enough. If they are brave they can increase to 10mg/ED but never exceed 10mg/ED.

Thats my limited view on the topic...Only top women competitors (with a experienced female steroid user as an advisor) should ever use any other substance.


twitched
 
Twithced, thanks very much for starting this thread. I've spent roughly 2 years researching AAS, even though I haven't used anything yet. And everytime I get close to deciding on what I want to use for my first cycle, a thread like this one starts and throws me all off.
Originally, I was really set on using more mild drugs. I didn't want to go gun ho with the big mass drugs, because gaining 10 pounds a cycle is all I'm looking for. I want to make reasonable and keepable gains, that's all.
So, I had originally considered using just Ox for 10 weeks @ 40mg ED. The didn't last for too long. I then was thinking about Deca for 8 weeks @ 200mg every week w/ Ox for 10 weeks @ 40mg ED, but when I posted that cycle on here for feedback, people thought it was mild, but would kill my sex drive, which I knew was probably going to happen, but I figured 200mg was mild enough not to effect me that bad. I then was thinking about Primo for 10 weeks @ 400mg every week w/ 200mg for 10 weeks @ 200mg every week. This seemed like a nice, conservative cycle, something that could gain me an easily keepable 10 pounds, but even though Primo has some androgenic properties, it's still primarily an anabolic, which means it would be a cycle of 2 anabolics, just like the prior one I listed, and my sex drive would be down the tubes again. I don't know. I was getting all frustrated.
Is deca a drug worth using? Is primo a drug worth using? I know they're mild, but I consider mild drugs to be a good thing. Damn, what to do....what to do!!!
Any how, after reading your post, I'm now wondering if I should do something like what you listed. Ideally, since this is my first cycle, I would really like to keep it down to 2 drugs. Perhaps EQ w/ Ox or Cyp w/ Eq or Cyp w/ Ox. The more and more I read on deca, the more people bash it. I just didn't think that a low dose of deca @ 200-300mg was really that detrimental, but maybe I'm wrong.
So, what do you think? Given that I want to keep to 2 drugs, what do you think I should do? Money is somewhat of an issue, but I want to do it right and not screw it up, so if need be, I'll spend the dough. So anyway, I'd greatly appreciate some feedback from you. That would be great. An oh yeah, sorry about the length of this post. I kind of just started venting in the middle of this, considering this has been frustrating me for some time now. Any way, thanks a lot man.
 
Last edited:
All of the cycles you mentioned are fine, but I am not a huge fan of deca.

Do ox only, do primo+ox, do eq+ox, you'll be happy regardless..

Cyp+eq+ox is real great :-D.
 
Twitched said:
All of the cycles you mentioned are fine, but I am not a huge fan of deca.

Do ox only, do primo+ox, do eq+ox, you'll be happy regardless..

Cyp+eq+ox is real great :-D.
Click to expand...

is that really your picture????? i think im in love:p :luxlove:
 
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