O.k., o.k., so the consensus seems to be that PRE-CONTEST, dairy products should be eliminated... however, let's keep in mind that the vast majority of us don't compete, and that pre-contest dieting is notoriously quite drastic, and impractical to follow on a long-term basis (not to mention unhealthy). I guess what I meant to ask is that if one is looking to shed some fat over many months and/or maintain this kind of "diet" long-term, what is the place for dairy products in the nutritional regime? Surely it must be somewhat different than "cutting" for a contest right? Thanks for the input everyone.