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Just A Reminder

Nelson Montana

Chairman of Board
Chairman Member
I had an impromptu round table discussion with a few doctors knowledgable in weight training, steroids, etc...and we concurred on something that is suprisingly overlooked in the world of "fitness."

The human body is designed to perform in a certain manner. Doing so leads to optimum strength, health, and longevity. We are also designed NOT to do certain things which leads to our ultimate breakdown and demise. These rules can also be applied to bodybuilders looking to make the most of their gains.

For example, the body was NOT designed to...

Stay in a state of stress.

Go without sleep.

Not eat meat.

These are pretty obvious. Do these things and you'll be working against your goals. But there's something else the body was never designed to do.

Uh oh, here it comes.


The body was not designed to JOG. In fact, there isn't a single species of animal that jogs. Why? Because it serves no purpose. The body, however, was designed to work, (i.e.exercise).

Using about 10,000 years of evolution and survival as a guide, it's apparent the body was meant to work mainly in TWO ways.

One: Walking. LOTS of walking. This is what early man and all animals in the wild do in search of food. But we no longer have to walk, so we get fat -- fatter every year. If people walked more, they'd burn more calories and they'd do it without stressing the joints or increasing oxidation with sustained heavy breathing. No one ever overtrained by walking too much.

And Two: The body was meant to release bursts of exertion. i.e. KILL the food. We also need those bursts of energy for lifting rocks and logs to build shelter. We may also need a quick burst of exertion to run away from danger. We don't jog away from danger.

We thrive on this type of maximm exertion. Physical exertion is a part of what we are. Is it any wonder GH is naturally released during times of intense exertion? It's almost as if our system gets the message that we have a purpose. And when you stop exerting yourself, the message you give your body is: "your time is up -- time for the younger ones to hunt and kill the food". You are no longer vital. You are no longer needed. Begin to die and make room for the replacements.

Well, can anyone think of a way where we can maximize our physical effort in a short amount of time thus leading to a longer, fuller life? Ding ding ding ding! That's right. Lifting weights. It literally is the fountain of youth. It makes us stronger. It makes us healthier. It makes us more energetic. It makes us more beautiful.

Jogging? It just takes up a lot time to put you someplace far away from where you were.











Aerobics: The most unnatural activity known to man -- and ironically, the most implemented in the name of "health."
 
Nelson

Nelson did you have some terrible psychological trama with an aerobics instructor along the way or something? You don't like cardio. We all know this. You don't beleive in it. Fine. You've said it many times. Now let it rest man. Others of us here do cardio, including myself. Just because you don't beleive in something doesn't mean you have to shove your point of view down our throats. I feel it benefits me, good exercise for the heart and what not. You make it sound like those of us who do cardio are morons who are trying sabatoge ourselves. I'm not trying to flame you, but give it a rest already.
 
Umm, in the caveman years, what did you do when you were being chased? RUN!

Was the body ever ment to take steroids? NO.

-sk
 
Jogging (and aerobics in general) is a lingering, mind numbingly boring, agonizing slow death. Running is a quick, fairly short burst of energy and if you're running from something, its not boring.

But don't worry; I'm not jumping on Nelson's coat tails concerning cardio. I'm just too lazy to do any so I talk bad about it.:D
 
Yes sk...RUN, not jog. I brought up that very point in the post.

How do you know the body wasn't meant to take steroids? Drugs help the body do certain things better. One thing has nothing to do with the other.

slyder: Don't mean to flame but ...don't be an a**hole. I'm not calling anyone morons so stop projecting. It's another point of view and some people may want to hear it. It's my understanding that's why these boards are here. Do you honestly think your post is more productive?
 
Dude, there is a huge difference between aerobics and aerobic activity. In ancient time the fight or flight response that you are discussing served a purpose for survival such as killing food and outrunning a saber tooth tiger.

Today that threat does not occur but there are plenty of psychological stressors that literally induce the same mechanism with no real outlet and cause deleterious effect on the human body.

Okay, enough of that. Secondly aerobic activity is necessary for the health of the cardiovascular system hence, the human body. Yes I do think that jogging suck but strength training alone will not keep the CV system healthy. How many weight trainers here have to dash 50 feet and get winded? How is that for your hypothesis?

In ancient times man traveled great distance to find food and avoid harsh winters. There were no cars, buses, bikes, hover-rounds, etc. The CV system stayed in shape by virtue of lifestyle. That does not happen anymore hence, making aerobic activity necessary.

just my 2c's.
 
My post

No I don't feel my post was more productive. I'm not trying to have a pissing contest with you. That's just how you seemed to come off. No harm meant.
 
Last edited:
Re: My post

slyder190 said:
No I don't feel my post was more productive. I'm not trying to have a pissing contest with you. That's just how seemed to come off. No harm meant.

Okay, cool.
 
How do you figure it wasn't ment to jog?

No offense, but this really is a silly argument. What do you base on what is ment or not ment?

Maybe someone wanted to get somewhere fast, but not too fast? JOGGING!

-sk
 
What makes the human body not designed to do any of the things lifted, and what makes it designed to do certain things?

I believe our body is designed to do whatever is capable, if it wasn't it wouldn't be possible, assuming that design comes from the process of evolution, so we evolved in a manner that certain things are possible to do.
 
people jog and go to aerobics all the time without joint problems. Adam and Eve might not have done aerobics but it is healthy and you do burn calories more than walking. Man was not meant to jog? maybe, but our bodies are very adaptable - i think the only people that get joint problems are either unhealthy in the first place or marathon runners
 
Adam and Eve might not have done aerobics but it is healthy and you do burn calories more than walking.

you might burn more, but it might not be the calories you are wanting to burn. any cardio that makes you out of breath is not burning fat. fat burning requires oxygen, anytime someone does cardio to the extent the he/she is out of breath he/she is no longer burning mostly fat, but rather glycogen. all of this is assuming that one is doing cardio to burn fat.
 
If I had to travel far to make my kill, at that point I am sure to be hungry. I believe I would jog back to save time so I could cook it.
That is if fire has been invented yet.
 
sk* said:
Was the body ever ment to take steroids? NO.
-sk [/B]

Food for thought....was the body ever meant to take penicillin ?
Probably not but look how many MILLIONS of lives it saved.
Antibiotics ? Ditto. The list goes on and on.
Not trying to start a war here but after reading that post and doing some thinking.............the body was probably not meant to take many things but man in his infinite wisdom came up with "things" that has greatly improved the human condition.
 
Not to split hairs but I have seen a lion "jog" She was not walking or stalking. She was not sprinting as in trying to take down a gazelle or what not. She was moving from point A to point B at a pace best described as a jog.
 
argent said:
She was moving from point A to point B at a pace best described as a jog. [/B]

Indeed..... it`s called trotting. My dog trots, horses trot.
Divorced women are hot to "trot" te he he :smash:
 
Nelson- Were any of these Doctors Anthropologists? How would they know WTF humans did at the dawn of time?

How about people that use their fitness for something other than pure recreation... like Police Officers? When I have to chase some fucker over fences, through back-yards, down alleys... then scrap with him to get him hancuffed... it takes explosive power AND aerobic fitness. A few years back, I got mobbed while I was ground-fighting with an arrest at a nightclub... had to fight my way out of that place. In all... the whole incident took about 5 minutes to transpire. How long would I have lasted on anaerobic power alone?
 
I'm of the school of thought that says that a workout properly super-setted can be more effective than cardio.

Good call, Nelson.

-M
 
call me crazy, but I found Nelson's logic to make sense. I'm not saying that cardio exercise is totally useless, but he's right, what other animal runs for extended periods of time? Plus, if anyone in here has run a marathon, you can't tell me you weren't beat to hell from it. and that's only 4hours, 3 if your from Kenya. The day I bought my first hear rate monitor and saw that I was hitting 160's during certain exercises in the gym, (which happens to be about the same as when I'm riding my mountain bike up hill for a half mile) is the day I believed that you can get a decent cardio training from weight lifting. And all these people that are talking about the calorie burning effectiveness of jogging: Stop eating so many calories and fat. Check out the people on "Survivor (CBS)" those people get skinny in 30 days and they don't exercise everyday.
 
I run four miles a week, and wihout you running i'd damn sure like to see who the bear catches first! Your wind would give out a lot sooner than mine, and the bear can eat you while I make a clean get a way!!!! LOL Nelson. I'll keep running. Based on some of your opinions, I value what I read. I just don't agree with this one!
 
SCOTTY-TWO-HOTTY said:

How about people that use their fitness for something other than pure recreation... like Police Officers? When I have to chase some fucker over fences, through back-yards, down alleys... then scrap with him to get him hancuffed... it takes explosive power AND aerobic fitness. A few years back, I got mobbed while I was ground-fighting with an arrest at a nightclub... had to fight my way out of that place. In all... the whole incident took about 5 minutes to transpire. How long would I have lasted on anaerobic power alone?

I bet this guy gets his gear REAL cheap!! lol
 
I can see why jogging would be bad because of the constant pounding but what about stair masters and stationary bikes? Are these somewhat akin to walking in that they are low intensity and little stress on the joints. I bring this up because as much as I like to walk sometimes it's not convenient (weather, environment (live in the city with lots of cars), etc.)
 
powerhouse972 said:
people jog and go to aerobics all the time without joint problems. Adam and Eve might not have done aerobics but it is healthy and you do burn calories more than walking. Man was not meant to jog? maybe, but our bodies are very adaptable - i think the only people that get joint problems are either unhealthy in the first place or marathon runners

The only people I've seen who has been able to continue jogging for 20+ years rarely weighed more than 145 lbs. I think when you start to get up to 180 lbs+ the constant pounding begins to takes it toll on the knees. I'm sure there are exceptions and I'm just giving you my very biased opinion. BTW, I use to love jogging. It had a very exhilarating "zen-like" feeling to it but, alas, my knees started to give me problems.

I would think that for a sport like boxing that jogging could be beneficial. Jogging mixed with sprints seems to mimic a lot the physical exertion a boxer endures (without someone hitting you).
 
jogging sucks

I have only injured myself jogging, and I've never felt good from it.. However I have done a ton of mountain biking and not got injured.. But my sex drive gets trashed.

This reminds me of the studies of early man and his diet. Also reminds me of "The Warrior Diet" by Ori Hoffmekler. Save our bodies.

How does this relate to the total calories = life expectancy theory? We only have a finite amount of calories to process during our lifetimes and minimizing food intake is good for us.

Great Posts.. TW
 
Not the point of this thread, but on the vegetarian thing. . . eating meat may be natural, but then again, so maybe is rape, but I'm not planning one this week. There are many parts of the world where religiously and culturally meat-eating is prohibited, so the question is, "Can you build a great physique if you are vegetarian?" From Bill Pearl, to great competitors throughout India and Pakistan, many in the Mr. Asia title, etc. have built competitive level physiques without meat. Even in older age, there is the likes of Steve Holt. If you have all the protein, and all branched chain amino acids, there is no obstacle, it's just a little trickier, that's all. In some ways, vegetarians make great bodybuilders because they're already used to dissecting and controlling their diets fully.
 
Interesting read Nelson. Some good points You have to remember that not all man evolved the same way. Sure you are talking about hunter-gatherer societies (men hunt, women gather). They are meant to conserve energy and release it short bursts like you mention to kill. Their bodies are also designed to hold on to access fat much longer than other societies for times when food is scarce and times are tough. You will see no ectomorphs in this society.

However early asian communities were the first to live in an agrarian society (farm and produce), they also fished a lot and ate from the sea. This type of lifestyle does not require the "killing" energy that the H-Gs needed. Africans were designed to run. The also do not need the extra fat storage. Different diets and different geographic locations influenced the way our bodies were designed and the foods we can tolerate. Did you know that Inuits (eskimos) have less blood circulation in there hands than non-Inuits? This is a fact where they have adapted, geographically. I do agree though ... there are not many cultures where people jogged!
 
Nelson Montana said:




One: Walking. LOTS of walking. This is what early man and all animals in the wild do in search of food. But we no longer have to walk, so we get fat -- fatter every year. If people walked more, they'd burn more calories and they'd do it without stressing the joints or increasing oxidation with sustained heavy breathing. No one ever overtrained by walking too much.



So if you walked on a treadmill for forty five minutes three times at a 4.0, you would be walking three miles each session. Would you consider that cardio for a person who has an office job?
 
majutsu said:
In some ways, vegetarians make great bodybuilders because they're already used to dissecting and controlling their diets fully.

Hmm, most veggie's I've ever known think vegetarianism means only eating Butterfingers and ice cream.
 
Burning_Inside said:


Hmm, most veggie's I've ever known think vegetarianism means only eating Butterfingers and ice cream.

hmmm . . . maybe you need friends with a higher IQ ;)
 
wolves and wild african dogs will JOG for hours, so the original starter of this thread is a bit mis or undereducated.

Last time I checked there weren't and weight trees or money trees, either!
 
Fllying or jogging?

OHHOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!


Ostriches and roadrunners jog, too.

Wildebeasts jog for miles when migrating.

Migrating birds effectively 'jog' when flying to winter or summer lands.

Ahhh, but no species goes about putting out less then maximal effort for hours, right?

EEyep!
 
you might burn more, but it might not be the calories you are wanting to burn. any cardio that makes you out of breath is not burning fat. fat burning requires oxygen, anytime someone does cardio to the extent the he/she is out of breath he/she is no longer burning mostly fat, but rather glycogen. all of this is assuming that one is doing cardio to burn fat.


Okay, so say someone is doing cardio to burn fat. What kind of cardio would burn fat besides jogging? Sprinting and resting?
How does one exercise to burn fat (as opposed to glycogen) besides lifting?

Thanks-
Chewy
 
I can see why you would say that jogging is bad,and i'm certainly not a big jogger. I also see the point to training your cv system a bit more than powerlifting as well. I imagine there are quite a few people out there with similar goals to myself. I want to find my limits and push on as much as i can. I guess it's all on what goals you set for yourself. I want the strength and the muscular endurance to use it for a short period of time when needed. I'm not sure jogging or walking would help anyone out to a great degree with those goals.

Sorry if i rambled,but it was following along with your hunter/gatherer train of thought. If you were actually training to be a hunter/gatherer(well rounded )...how would you train generally for the best strength with the endurance to pull it off when you needed it? Would you go with powerlifting and train your cardio with the specific type of cardio you would need,like boxing,grappling,sprinting,etc. ? I keep seeing images of Mark Coleman from the ultimate fighting series sucking wind after 2 or 3 minutes and wondering what your fix for that is.

-Jeff
 
Birds jog?

Okay, Ostriches jog. So if you want legs like an Ostrich, jog.

Jeff: If someone is sucking wind after 2 minutes of hard exertion, how would 20 minutes of low intensity activity help him?

No. For developing stamina for a sport, you need to do the activity of the sport. That's why (smart) boxers now train by running 3 minute sprits instead of jogging for miles, like the old timers.
 
A physics education needed?

The amount of time a fast runner spends on the track requires him the SAME amount of calories it takes a slow runner to do the same distance even though it takes him longer.

Same calories burned to move a distance and in fact a 'sprinter' would burn LESS in a general workout scheme because the lactic acid buildup stop thier workout HOURS before a 'slow jogger' who then does a greater distance and therefore burns more calories.
 
Now you tell me. All the mileage it would have saved my knees:) By the way,i had to steal your quote to post up near my weight rack..definitely a classic. You are no longer vital,you are no longer needed,begin to die and make room for the replacements. lol.

-Jeff
 
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