INTRODUCTION TO SHUAIJIAO !!! (Attn : Judo Tom)

[Djimbe]

can you go into more detail about the standing game being similar to judo's standing game.. and im guessin you mean judo as the style not as the sport correct?

thanks

i found this link http://www.atlantamartialarts.com/styles/shuaijiao.htm but it didnt really say much so im not sure if im in the right place or not

Umm , most of that stuff is pretty accurate , some of it isnt . Most of the Functional parts are pretty on , but some of the "Facts" are skewed unfairly twards , I think , the group that the author was affiliated with .

The main Idea is that Shuaijiao , especially in its less sportive incarnations , is about Accelerating the Opponent into the Earth as violently as possible , and the use of Strikes are in Conjuction with the Throws in a VERY non-Aikido way - in fact they are used together to create damage that is more than the Sum of its parts . For instance Imagine Upending your opponent so that not only do you sent his head HURTLING tward the earth , but in that same moment you execuse a perfect "Feild Goal" kick to the same head that is crashing downward ... or following the same throw with the kind of Downward Punch or Elbow strike and torquing of the waist that you see used in so many Breaking Competitions ? Of course these are just a couple opf simply explained suggestions , but you can start to see how the movements together can do more dam than they would seperately . These Clips aree very Simple ,. and not all from STRICT Shuaijiao practitioners , but many CMA stylists are Crosstrained , and Shuaijiao and Kuaijiao permeate most of the Internals Systems pretty Thouroughly .

HOWEVER , the Crosstrained apps are gong to be a bit more Simplistic than the advanced Sahuaijiao-only man , but he basic Ideas/Principles will be appearant , and most of what I have shown SHOULD be familiar to you , as SJ/KJ is a great-great-great grandfather to JJJ .



http://www.emptyflower.com/xingyiquan/crushing/ken/video/video02.html
http://homepage.mac.com/stevefarrell/images/tj_day_01.wmv
http://homepage.mac.com/stevefarrell/images/tj_day_03.wmv
http://homepage.mac.com/stevefarrell/images/tj_day_04.wmv

http://homepage.mac.com/mancheta/iMovieTheater21.html#

http://homepage.mac.com/mancheta/iMovieTheater17.html



Even in Striking , the Idea is about Manipulation of the Opponents frame ...

http://homepage.mac.com/stevefarrell/images/tj_day_05.wmv

For reading you can try ...

Principles, Analysis, and Application of Effortless Combat Throws By Tim Cartmell

Chinese Fast Wrestling for Fighting: The Art of San Shou Kuai Jiao -- by Shou-Yu Liang, Tai D. Ngo

You could get the both of them for < $30 on Amazon right now .

Web :

http://www.johnswang.com

http://www.combatshuaichiao.com/younglin.html

The Message Board that has the most active SJ discourse , including one of the worlds most respected Teachers (John Wang) as a REGULAR poster :

http://www.emptyflower.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi/YaBB.cgi

SHUAIJIAO MATCHES ! (warning , amateur)

[web] http://www.johnswang.com/index.html.sc [/web]

 

[Judo Tom]

wow great great post..

could you kinda describe what a normal class is like? is there 'sparring'? whats that like?

sorry if the answers to those questions are in the links im not through with all of em yet..

thanks again!!!!!

 

[Big Rick Rock]

http://homepage.mac.com/stevefarrell/images/tj_day_01.wmv
http://homepage.mac.com/stevefarrell/images/tj_day_03.wmv
http://homepage.mac.com/stevefarrell/images/tj_day_04.wmv

Guys,


I don't want to sound like a dickhead or anything but I just don't see any of those moves working on a real fighter.
Looking at those videos I just learned that all of my wrestling and vale tudo coaches were wrong about how i should defend agains a double leg! I was always tought to sprawl my hips away and stuff the head or dig in deep with a cross face and work to break the guy's grip... I seems like I was wrong!

The guy in the park just grabbed his opponent by the head and threw him to his back when they guy went in for a double leg... Geez, why didn't any of my coahces or instructors ever teach me that stuff.

I don't know, maybe I'm just too close minded. I just don't see the stuff in these links as being effective.


-BRR

 

[AEKDB]

Big Rock,

I agree. Every technique looks good when the attacker is not trying to hurt you. The way I was taught to shoot, you come in low and hard. I doubt his little spin move would work.

 

[Big Rick Rock]

Big Rock,

I agree. Every technique looks good when the attacker is not trying to hurt you. The way I was taught to shoot, you come in low and hard. I doubt his little spin move would work.

Bro... When I shoot double leg on somebody:

-My legs are not straight with my back bent like the "attacker" in the video.

-I don't reach down and stop my forward motion waiting to be countered.

If I shot a double leg on this guy, his feet would have left the ground and he would be traveling sideways 2-3ft off the ground before he even had a chance to get his arms around my head.

I don't think I'm a bad ass Martial Artist or tought guy or anything... Just that some of the videos on those links show techniques that go against everything I have come to know about hand to hand encounters...

I still can't get over watching videos where these Aikido instructors toss people around and even make them do full 360 flips in mid air all while holding the guy at arms length...
I have a hard enough time tossing guys when I'm locked around their body and I'm using my hips to leverage them over, I can't ever imagine throwing somebody head over heels when my arms are extended and holding on to their shirt collar...
Maybe that stuff only works on students that know to fly thru the air when the teachers pulls at their Gi. Maybe it can be done against a real life resisiting opponets... Until some dude grabs me by the wrist and flips me across the air I won't believe in that stuff.

Again... I don't want to offend anybody or piss any of you off. I'm just voicing an educated opinion.


-BRR

 

[Kane Fan]

I think the demonstration is assumed to be against a relativly untrained streetthug
he did say there would be some differences if you used it for cross training to do something in MMA

to the origional poster; a friend of mine has told me if I want to work a ground game my only chance is to do a very solid (read: high impact) takedown, as my grappling currently sucks
would this style be good for hard takedowns?

 

[Big Rick Rock]

I think the demonstration is assumed to be against a relativly untrained streetthug
he did say there would be some differences if you used it for cross training to do something in MMA

to the origional poster; a friend of mine has told me if I want to work a ground game my only chance is to do a very solid (read: high impact) takedown, as my grappling currently sucks
would this style be good for hard takedowns?

What do you mean by "hard takedowns" you mean like high amp throws that can hurt a guy on the way down or something?



-BRR

 

[Judo Tom]

yeah those are demo's and i couldnt get the tournament footage to load that is what i was more interested in..

i mean a sprawling demo in front of a crowd is not too exciting..

the style looks pretty interesting!

do you guys practice just pure throws/subs enough that you could compete in a naga style tournament or even bjj/judo/sambo? just curious

thanks again!!

oh btw i lost my last match for 1st in a judo tournament last weekend it was as i shot a 'sloppy' double (also my 5th of the match..BIG MISTAKE)

this isthecounter to a double that was used against me
http://judoinfo.com/images/nauta/tawaragaeshi.htm

 

[Ralph_Wiggum]

after looking at those videos, I don't see how I could use any of those techniques effectively. My educated guess as to where I would have to defend myself would be @ a bar parking lot where drunk assholes linger and bother people passing by. As most people here problably know, most guys b/w the ages of 18-30 these days lift weights and are bigger than those guys in the video to some extent. I also wouldn't expect the person to act like a string puppet like that guy in the video.... People throw punches @ full force and pull many of them...they also know how to wrestle to some extent. Add anger and alcohol to that, and those granny-like moves aren't anything I would want to put my life's safety in. Add in their pussy ass friends who will jump in to defend the asshole's "honor" and then the odds are even more stacked.

When I start a martial art, I will train some boxing/MT/clinchwork/takedowns/and quick ground finishers. I won't mess around w/ those throws, in hopes that the person would just magically goto sleep once he is on the ground. The techniques shown there seem like Russian roullete at best.

 

[Judo Tom]

any links to tournaments/competitions?

thanks again!