I'm new and really need some help.

[NGP]

Hi everyone!

First post here but have been a reader on and off for a long time... I'm not sure if this post is in the right forum...

I need some help! This post may be quite a long one, but please take the time to read - you may find this ineteresting, or may be not.

Right then... I'm 31 years old, I've been training nearly 10 years, but the trouble is I still weigh 140lbs.

"You should eat more" I hear you say... well, I have been as high as 174lbs with a 36 inch waist - that was in the middle of a cycle, yeah that's right, I've used AAS and still haven't gained any muscle mass, or any real strength.

In fact, the strength I have gained has just been neural, there's not been any real strength increase or muscle growth. Whilst on the juice I did gain some strength and a load of water retention and fat, but all that was lost 2-3 weeks after the cycles had finished. Even during the cycles I've done (there's been a few) I didn't notice any new muscle, I just looked fatter/ I've used alsorts of steroids from Dianabol, to Prop, to Sus to Tren and even drol. I haven't used any gear in 3 years now, wasn't much point.

You'll probably be thinking that the gear was fake - I know it wasn't.

You might think I drink, smoke and have a crap diet - that's not true either.

You might think I train 50 sets a session and train every set to failure and train 7 days a week - that couldn't be any further from the truth either.

My diet is good and I've worked with two bodybuilding nutrionists, I keep my protein consumption from whey protein low and try and get most of it from good solid foods, good fats in there and low-moderate carb intake. I've tried different ratios with my diet, but still nothing changes for the better.

When it comes to training, as you can imagine, I've tried a lot, but still haven't found anything that works. I've tried abreviated routines, volume, high and low frequency, failure training, beyond failure, training 1-2 reps shy of failure, training 2-5 days a week but so far I've still found nothing that works better than the previous method. I've trained using two personal trainers too, one was an online trainer, the other was at a gym.

You're probably thinking that I should get to the doctors to get checked out, but I've done that too - I had a full blood work done 10 weeks after a cycle and everything was fine - test levels were high, and everything in order. I then went on to have cortisol, DHEA, estradiol, prolactin, thyroid, SHBG and again everything appears to be normal.

So What is going on? Has anyone heard of anything like this before? I don't have any trouble gaining weight, but that weight is just fat. I do like training but being strict and consistent for nothing in return is taking it's toll!... I know that my CNS might be part of the problem along with abnormal levels of myostatin... maybe my IGF-1 levels are low, maybe all of these factors may be contributing, maybe it's nothing to do with any of those, maybe it's something else?

If you've read this, thanks for reading and if anyone has anything constructive to say, then please do so. I've posted on other forums before but just get people talking down to me like I'm some kind of idiot... I'll keep posting on the internet, I'll keep reading and hopefully some day I'll have an answer! I'd love to be able to make some kind of progress with lifting weights, but at the moment it just doesn't look possible.

 

[RADAR]

By Golly you're at the right place,If you can't make it here then you can't make it anywhere,Since I don't know what your diet and training looks like ,lets start there.
Training.
For starters i reccommend the push pull method.

4 days a week
Day one
Push Exercises
Chest,Shoulder presses,Tri's

Day two

Pull Exercises

Rows,Lat pull downs,chin ups,curls


Day three

Free Squats,Leg extentsions,leg curls,calves


Day 4

Abs,incline sit ups, leg raises ,etc

Diet

You should consume whole foods,not process food,
Nuts,Grains,Dairy,Meats(except Pork)Veggies

And supplement your diet with a hi calorie protein shake,I love Muscle milk(vanilla)

Eat 5-7 smaller servings thruout the day so not to stress the body and include some protein with each meal.

This is just a rough draft to get you going ,i'll send you a pm when i get time with more details.


RADAR

 

[JDid23]

hey.. just wanted to let you know i read your post. I don't know what you can do, but i want to commend you for your dedication. It's hard to find someone who would keep persisting the way you are, and i truly wish you the best of luck and much success in the near future.

 

[NGP]

By Golly you're at the right place,If you can't make it here then you can't make it anywhere,Since I don't know what your diet and training looks like ,lets start there.
Training.
For starters i reccommend the push pull method.

4 days a week
Day one
Push Exercises
Chest,Shoulder presses,Tri's

Day two

Pull Exercises

Rows,Lat pull downs,chin ups,curls


Day three

Free Squats,Leg extentsions,leg curls,calves


Day 4

Abs,incline sit ups, leg raises ,etc

Diet

You should consume whole foods,not process food,
Nuts,Grains,Dairy,Meats(except Pork)Veggies

And supplement your diet with a hi calorie protein shake,I love Muscle milk(vanilla)

Eat 5-7 smaller servings thryout the day so not to stress the body and include some protein with each meal.

This is just a rough draft to get you going ,i'll send you a pm when i get time with more details.


RADAR

Thanks radar, I've tried similar routines to that in the past. I also eat 5-6 meals a day (sometimes 7 on training days) and I like to keep whey protein consumption low as I prefer to get my protein from whole foods and aim for 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight and I don't eat any processed foods, just good and healthy foods... I may have a cheat meal once a week.

I eat well both pre and post workout and sleep 8 hours a night.

Thanks again.

 

[NGP]

hey.. just wanted to let you know i read your post. I don't know what you can do, but i want to commend you for your dedication. It's hard to find someone who would keep persisting the way you are, and i truly wish you the best of luck and much success in the near future.

Thanks for that, though some people would deem me as a bit of fool for continuing weight training having gained nothing from it - the people at my gym must think I'm a loon because for years my appearance hasn't changed other than an increase in fat, they must think 'why does he even bother?' lol

But thanks for the sentiments, appreciated.

 

[AEKDB]

The best thing you did was go to the doctor. As everything is normal, the problem must be your training. I would recommend you forget everything you have learned so far and start over with an open mind.

If you have not already, you should become familiar with the different body types. After you have an idea of your body type, you should pick a realistic goal based on your body type. Since you may never be a 200lb lean giant, why not aim for 160lb freak who can lift more than a 200lb giant? Muscle size is not directly proportional to strength.

The Training Vault at the top of the sub-forum page is the place to start reading on how to really train. But please do not stop at the 5x5 as most people do. Read as much of the info and links in the vault as you can especially Dan John's page. The really good stuff on his site is in the archives at the bottom of the page. I also recommend the routines on Joe Skopec's page (the Smolov squat routine is one of the best). It is not in the vault (it should be) but the Coan/Phillipi dead lift routine is great:Excel Spreadsheet at bottom of page.

 

[NGP]

Hi aekdb, you said "The best thing you did was go to the doctor. As everything is normal" - there still could be something wrong, like myostatin levels, CNS frailty, IGF-1 levels etc- I haven't been tested for everything, so although the tests I have had done indicate there isn't a problem, it doesn't mean that there isn't something wrong. I actually disagree with the bit about my training - in ten years I've tried so many different ways of training - the 5x5, WSB and HST I'm familiar with but that last routine looks good. How can anyone go as high as 1750mgs of test a week and not see anything in the way of muscle and strength gains? I haven't bee able to progress on anything I've tried and the only thing I regressed on was training to and beyond failure - that sent me backwards pretty fast. I'm on the 5/3/1 at the moment but it's not going great. Thank you for replying.

 

[mad_monkey59]

Thanks radar, I've tried similar routines to that in the past. I also eat 5-6 meals a day (sometimes 7 on training days) and I like to keep whey protein consumption low as I prefer to get my protein from whole foods and aim for 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight and I don't eat any processed foods, just good and healthy foods... I may have a cheat meal once a week.

I eat well both pre and post workout and sleep 8 hours a night.

Thanks again.

Have you tried just doing a dirty ass bulk, eating high calorie, high protein foods... rather then doing just a clean bulk and then just cutting down? Maybe you need the calories... other then that you're not a vegetarian or anything are you?

 

[NGP]

Have you tried just doing a dirty ass bulk, eating high calorie, high protein foods... rather then doing just a clean bulk and then just cutting down? Maybe you need the calories... other then that you're not a vegetarian or anything are you?

I'm @ 140lbs with about 15-20% bodyfat.

I've been as high as 174lbs and as low as 130lbs and even at that low weight I couldn't see my abs because there was still some fat covering them.

I've got stretch marks on the side of my buttocks, so I have done a "dirty ass bulk" before.

And no, I'm not a vergetarian either.

 

[RADAR]

As Ronnie Coleman once said Don't be mad because you ate that Big Mac ,be mad because you didn't eat 2 of them.



The most anabolic substance you can put in your body is food.
RADAR

 

[mad_monkey59]

I'm @ 140lbs with about 15-20% bodyfat.

I've been as high as 174lbs and as low as 130lbs and even at that low weight I couldn't see my abs because there was still some fat covering them.

I've got stretch marks on the side of my buttocks, so I have done a "dirty ass bulk" before.

And no, I'm not a vergetarian either.

Did you not even see any muscle gains after you came off of the bulk? Surely you couldn't have just put on 100% fat on?

How tall are you?

What are your goals?
- I assume since you said that you only weight 140lbs, but have weighed in at 1764lbs, that it is more about the lean muscle then just the weight?

Your case is a curious one, but I am sure between the guys and gals here we will be able to help you... we're cool like that.

 

[iggy]

eat a ton of red meat and whole eggs. a MASSIVE amount of veggies. check out greens+. one quote a BBer gave me is that your body is like a train that needs coal and fuel. Protein the the coal for keeping your train of a body running, and building muscle. So every 2-3 hours make sure your body gets some Coal (protein) in it!

 

[NGP]

eat a ton of red meat and whole eggs. a MASSIVE amount of veggies. check out greens+. one quote a BBer gave me is that your body is like a train that needs coal and fuel. Protein the the coal for keeping your train of a body running, and building muscle. So every 2-3 hours make sure your body gets some Coal (protein) in it!

I already do, but cheers for posting!

 

[NGP]

Did you not even see any muscle gains after you came off of the bulk? Surely you couldn't have just put on 100% fat on?

How tall are you?

What are your goals?
- I assume since you said that you only weight 140lbs, but have weighed in at 1764lbs, that it is more about the lean muscle then just the weight?

Your case is a curious one, but I am sure between the guys and gals here we will be able to help you... we're cool like that.

I'm 5 feet 9

My goals? To gain some strength, I don't care how small it is, but if I was able to add just 20lbs to all my lifts asnd keep within the same rep range, I'd be ecstatic.

I haven't noticed any new muscle gain or strength from dirty bulking.

 

[RADAR]

Click on the Gladiator symbol in my post,get some Beasterol,follow my workout routine ,as others stated eat every 2 hrs Take Measurments with a tape measure,don't use scales they will lie to you, also the best way to guage progress is before & after pics.If you havn't done anything after that,get another Doc and Bloodwork,you may have a thyroid problem.



RADAR

 

[moya]

POST YOUR DIET... dont just tell us you eat good... tell us exactly what you ate today...

 

[RADAR]

Thanks radar, I've tried similar routines to that in the past. I also eat 5-6 meals a day (sometimes 7 on training days) and I like to keep whey protein consumption low as I prefer to get my protein from whole foods and aim for 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight and I don't eat any processed foods, just good and healthy foods... I may have a cheat meal once a week.

I eat well both pre and post workout and sleep 8 hours a night.

Thanks again.

Ok You like to keep your Protein Consumption low and get it from whole foods,Well theres a problem right there,you probably are not getting as much protein as you think your are, Protein Shakes (the good ones) Are loaded with Vitamins/minerals, Branch chain amino acids,I have 4 Blender fulls of muscle milk Every day alone with my meals,thats an extra 200 Grams of protein right there.
And I also would like to see a rundown of everything you eat daily,not just bits & pieces.
No one can help you if you can't provide that info.

RADAR

 

[AEKDB]

I have thought about this a while and I agree with Radar, we need to see your planned diet and your workout. Not because we do not believe you but most "hard gainers" think they eat a lot and train correctly when in fact they do not.

You say you eat 1.5 grams of protein per lb of body weight. At 140lbs that is only 200g. The 1.5g per lb of body weight is not a golden rule and many lifters eat 2g+. How about fats? Do you eat enough fish, nuts, and other good fats? What about carbs? Give us a complete rundown of everything you eat and drink (including water, candy, alcohol, etc), your workout, work schedule, and sleep schedule. I am sure something will stand out.

Other than a medical condition, there should be no reason a healthy male your age should not be able to gain weight.

 

[RADAR]

I have thought about this a while and I agree with Radar, we need to see your planned diet and your workout. Not because we do not believe you but most "hard gainers" think they eat a lot and train correctly when in fact they do not.

You say you eat 1.5 grams of protein per lb of body weight. At 140lbs that is only 200g. The 1.5g per lb of body weight is not a golden rule and many lifters eat 2g+. How about fats? Do you eat enough fish, nuts, and other good fats? What about carbs? Give us a complete rundown of everything you eat and drink (including water, candy, alcohol, etc), your workout, work schedule, and sleep schedule. I am sure something will stand out.

Other than a medical condition, there should be no reason a healthy male your age should not be able to gain weight.

Ditto! I sent you Karma for that with a message.
From one Ga boy to another..!

RADAR

 

[NGP]

I have thought about this a while and I agree with Radar, we need to see your planned diet and your workout. Not because we do not believe you but most "hard gainers" think they eat a lot and train correctly when in fact they do not.

You say you eat 1.5 grams of protein per lb of body weight. At 140lbs that is only 200g. The 1.5g per lb of body weight is not a golden rule and many lifters eat 2g+. How about fats? Do you eat enough fish, nuts, and other good fats? What about carbs? Give us a complete rundown of everything you eat and drink (including water, candy, alcohol, etc), your workout, work schedule, and sleep schedule. I am sure something will stand out.

Other than a medical condition, there should be no reason a healthy male your age should not be able to gain weight.

I don't have much time at the moment, I'll get back to this thread when I have more time; I have been as high as 350 grams of proitein a day, which for someone with a lean body weight of about 110lbs is a massive amount, trouble is, when it was that high, results remained non existant then too, I also was peeing every 20-30 minutes at that time, so I don't know if there was a connection between the high protein consumption and the peeing but it appear to stop when protein consumption was reduced, I gained an awful lot of weight then, but no strength gains and that weight was just blubber, it wasn't lean.

I aim for at least 1.5 grams per pound of protein which is 210grams a day, but no higher than 250 grams a day. Protein consumption is always slightly higher on training days.

I gotta get back to work

 

[RADAR]

I don't have much time at the moment, I'll get back to this thread when I have more time; I have been as high as 350 grams of proitein a day, which for someone with a lean body weight of about 110lbs is a massive amount, trouble is, when it was that high, results remained non existant then too, I also was peeing every 20-30 minutes at that time, so I don't know if there was a connection between the high protein consumption and the peeing but it appear to stop when protein consumption was reduced, I gained an awful lot of weight then, but no strength gains and that weight was just blubber, it wasn't lean.

I aim for at least 1.5 grams per pound of protein which is 210grams a day, but no higher than 250 grams a day. Protein consumption is always slightly higher on training days.

I gotta get back to work

If it was blubber then you are not training correctly or either long enough no intense enough,I train so hard sometimes My leg will start shaking like its gonna give, hard to hold that clutch in at the red light, If i do arms,i have trouble sometime guiding the spoon or fork to my mouth my arms are totally wiped out,thats the way to train.



RADAR

 

[moya]

did he give up on us when we asked him to post his diet...???...

 

[SaiBoT]

Post your det and training for a week.

First thought it crossed my mind was: someone's alter fucking around...

 

[RADAR]

I'm feeling that now.

tomorrow someone is taking a long vacation.


RADAR

 

[NGP]

If it was blubber then you are not training correctly or either long enough no intense enough,I train so hard sometimes My leg will start shaking like its gonna give, hard to hold that clutch in at the red light, If i do arms,i have trouble sometime guiding the spoon or fork to my mouth my arms are totally wiped out,thats the way to train.



RADAR

Hi all, I've been too busy and haven't had any internet access since I last posted...

I was training and doing cardio at that time when I was getting fat, I was eating under the instructions of a professional bodybuilding nutrionist (who I worked with for 12 weeks) when I was consuming high amounts of protein. As for not training hard enough, well I've been at both ends of the spectrum - I tried alsorts from high volume to abreviated routines, nothing works better than the next. I've always remained stagnant, I've never progressed and the only time I regressed was when I was training 2 days a week with HIT - I was training under the supervision of a personal trainer who had his own gym and he really pushed me, he pushed me as hard as I could go and he wouldn't be satisfied with anything less than 100%. trouble was I ended up dropping reps and weight. Within 2 weeks I had dropped 8 reps on chins and dropped weight and 9 reps on deadlifts and my other lifts regressed but not as much the ones I just mentioned.

Ironaddicts says that hardgainers shouldn't train to failure and I guess he's right - I found out the hard way. Is anyone familiar with ironaddict? He's also trained me online for a couple of years.

I'm still convinced that my training and diet aren't to blame, maybe I just need some totally unconventional way of training though? I dunno. All I know is that I've eaten all the right foods, big quantities, big protein consumption, tried got knows how many different methods of training, pumped my ass full of shit loads of steroids, even used igf-1 and I still haven't found anything that works.

I haven't posted my diet because I feel as though I'm running round in circles - I've been on so many forums, get asked the same questions, get told to post my diet, get told to train harder, get told to try this routine and that etc, I guess I was just hoping to find someone who might know some more about the body and what might be preventing me from gaining in the gym, because as I said - I don't think diet or training are responsible.

 

[mad_monkey59]

Hi all, I've been too busy and haven't had any internet access since I last posted...

I was training and doing cardio at that time when I was getting fat, I was eating under the instructions of a professional bodybuilding nutrionist (who I worked with for 12 weeks) when I was consuming high amounts of protein. As for not training hard enough, well I've been at both ends of the spectrum - I tried alsorts from high volume to abreviated routines, nothing works better than the next. I've always remained stagnant, I've never progressed and the only time I regressed was when I was training 2 days a week with HIT - I was training under the supervision of a personal trainer who had his own gym and he really pushed me, he pushed me as hard as I could go and he wouldn't be satisfied with anything less than 100%. trouble was I ended up dropping reps and weight. Within 2 weeks I had dropped 8 reps on chins and dropped weight and 9 reps on deadlifts and my other lifts regressed but not as much the ones I just mentioned.

Ironaddicts says that hardgainers shouldn't train to failure and I guess he's right - I found out the hard way. Is anyone familiar with ironaddict? He's also trained me online for a couple of years.

I'm still convinced that my training and diet aren't to blame, maybe I just need some totally unconventional way of training though? I dunno. All I know is that I've eaten all the right foods, big quantities, big protein consumption, tried got knows how many different methods of training, pumped my ass full of shit loads of steroids, even used igf-1 and I still haven't found anything that works.

I haven't posted my diet because I feel as though I'm running round in circles - I've been on so many forums, get asked the same questions, get told to post my diet, get told to train harder, get told to try this routine and that etc, I guess I was just hoping to find someone who might know some more about the body and what might be preventing me from gaining in the gym, because as I said - I don't think diet or training are responsible.

NGP, just post your damn diet. You're the one thats asking for help here...

 

[NGP]

Did you read the last sentence of my post?

 

[mad_monkey59]

Did you read the last sentence of my post?

did you read mine?

 

[NGP]

did you read mine?

yes I did but it makes no sense after reading my post.

I'm not after help with training or diet - I've been looking at training and diet for 10 years and worked with the best in this game both with diet and training - I'm not interested in that, I was hoping someone might know about the biochemistry of the body and what might be preventing me from gaining strength and muscle - I stated this in my last post in which you replied by telling me to post my diet. I'm convinced it isn't my diet or training, there's no way it can be.

I guess I probably posted this in the wrong forum then, my bad.

 

[QiangDa]

It has to be either training, diet, or you're a genetic freak. Have you considered taking up marathon running? You might have suberb genetics for that...