Help needed for proper training

[dOWNHILL]

After I’ve had my way with various 1bodypart/week programs I bumped upon one of madcow’s posts which led me to Ripptoes program for beginners. I’m stuck with this program for about 6months now and I’ve seen much greater gains than any other program I’ve followed before.

The program splits into Workout A & B and it consists of
A: Squats, Bench press, Deadlift and
B: Squats, Military Press, Barbell Rows

Now my question is about the auxiliary work.

Ripptoes suggest to only do some ab work for auxiliary and some other’s add some dips for “A” and chin ups for “B” in the 2x8 range…well, I’ve taken this suggestion a step further adding:

A: Dips 3x5, reverse grip curls and Overhead Tricep Extension 2x8 superset, and 3x8-10 weighted abs

B: Chins 6x5, Calf Raises 2x8-12, some Rear Delt excersise, weighted abs (different exc from A) 3x8-10

Although I currently feel “I can handle it” i would like any experienced lifter to comment if I’m ruining this program and if these auxiliary exercises are “too much” and are going to burn me out.

I would appreciate any guidance as I would really like to get into proper training and stop waisting my time with futile programs…

I currently weigh 80kgs, and I’m 30 years old.

 

[dOWNHILL]

also, i found out a post that says you can increase your deadlift without deadlifting (cause actually deadlift is a really taxing excersice to perform often) by utilising olympic lifts and goodmornings...

can anybody guide me to that?
1. which olympic lifts?
2. where can i find descriptions?
3. is there a 5x5 program with olympic lifts implemented ??

i google and i google and i can't find anything...just need a push to the right direction!

 

[dOWNHILL]

ok... i've just read the sticky about ripptoes program where it mentions the power cleans and i've decided to ignore olympic lifts alltogether...so you might as well ignore the second question...

if i find the time i might upload some videos in the weekend so that somebody can comment on my form...

 

[dOWNHILL]

So here are the videos ...

Actually i found those videos quite helpfull myself as i already saw flaws in my rowing and chin ups that otherwise i wouldn't have noticed.


any comments are welcome...

First excersise - Squat ..

Warm up sets 1min rest:
50kg:8, 60kg:5, 70kg:3, 75kg:2

Working Sets 2min rest:
80kg:5,5,5
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtmBtScM64Q


Second excersise - Military Press ..

Warm up sets 1min rest:
10kg:8, 20kg:5, 30kg:3

Working Sets 1,5min rest:
37,5kg:5,5,5
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6GpF_uJ1eU


Third excersise - Rows [God make them Pendalay] ..

Warm up sets 1min rest:
40kg:8, 50kg:5, 60kg:3

Working Sets 1,5min rest:
67,5kg:5,5,5 [maybe i overdid those weights...]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Peo7JZVg_fk


Fourth excersise - Chins..

Warm up sets 1min rest:
Bodyweight:6

Working Sets 1,5min rest:
2,5kg:6,6,6
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lrptnz-3hiM


Fifth excersise - Calfs..

Warm up sets 1min rest:
40kg:8, 60kg:5,

Working Sets 1,5min rest:
75kg:8, 8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEad93YV2MI


Sixth excersise - Rear Delts..

Working Sets 1,5min rest:
40kg:8, 8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwTG7YtLTzk


Seventh excersise - Abs..

Warm up sets 1min rest:
25kg:15,

Working Sets 1,5min rest:
35kg:8,8,8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s507TK9PEio

+ 2 set of leg pull abs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGwOkqP1KX8

 

[dOWNHILL]

anybody? at least any comment on the squat! is form ok? Is the depth ok or should i strive to get lower? although i feel i can't get any lower without rounding my back...

 

[skyflyer231]

To me all your lifts look pretty good. Maybe get a little lower with squats, but at this point I think it would be more of a flexibility thing. Miles ahead of tons of people though.

I think for assistance you should just do chins, dips, abs, and maybe calf raises. (Chins work your Bis, dips work your tris.)

I say this because this routine is intense enough as it is. I say try this for assistance:

A: Dips 3x5, Calf Raises 2x8-12, Abs 3x8-10
B: Chins 6x5, Abs 3x8-10

 

[dOWNHILL]

Thanks for the answer skyflyer...i was starting to get dissapointed

You're right about flexibility on squats...can't get any lower without rounding my back...

But what about those "pendalay rows"... I thought that i should drop weight and do them in a strictier form. What do you think? do i have to reset on rows or keep uping the weight?

i also have very thin forearms that's why i had the reverse curls...do you think i should definately dump them?

Also a deadlift question. I read that the bar shold touch your shins. I seem to not have to do this. I lift the weight without the bar touching my shins at any part of the lift...is this wrong?

i hope i'll post a deadlift video this weekend

 

[sopac]

Hey bro, are you going for strength or size? I'm guessing you just want to put on some nice muscle?

 

[dOWNHILL]

well i'm actually quite skinny and i wouldn't mind gaining some size. Actually my current weight is 81kgs and i'm hoping to get to 90kgs but that's not my main goal. I'm more interested in strength gains as i also practice in martial arts.

I'm not a vicious guy but when i spar I want to kick and punch and make the opponent wonder "where the f*** all this strength comes from???!!".

 

[SofaGeorge]

I think we could nitpick child birth apart, but in reality your lifts are pretty good.

You need to find a higher chin rack. You aren't coming fully down... and I think it is because your rack is too low and you are trying to keep your feet above the floor.

Your rear delt exercise isn't really the best for isolating rear delts. It's good for lats... but to really target rear delts in isolation... two sets of dumbbell flies in your bent over row stance will isolate it much better. (Rear delts are a really freaky muscle. You won't see any better development hitting them this way for more than two sets a week... but if you ignore them they will be a gapping hole in your physique.)

Honestly, though, I consider this an insignificant change. I'd rather see you continue the exercise you are doing to support your lat development and picking up a little rear delt to boot.

I fight train as well (boxing, muay thai, and judo) and honestly my impression is that if you are training to support combat sports... you have done an excellent job in thinking through your routine.

The biggest change I'd recommend is scrapping your ab program. They aren't the kind of core torso training I'd want for a fighter. Much of your punching and kicking power comes from your torso and I'd rather see you train abs to seriously support that kind of power need. There are a couple funky exercises I'll see if I can find vids of... but in absence of finding them... nothing beats fast high board sit ups... combined with high board alternating elbows... and high board coming up into alternating punches.

All in all though, bravo... very well put togehter and very well presented for analysis.

 

[skyflyer231]

Thanks for the answer skyflyer...i was starting to get dissapointed

You're right about flexibility on squats...can't get any lower without rounding my back...

But what about those "pendalay rows"... I thought that i should drop weight and do them in a strictier form. What do you think? do i have to reset on rows or keep uping the weight?

i also have very thin forearms that's why i had the reverse curls...do you think i should definately dump them?

Also a deadlift question. I read that the bar shold touch your shins. I seem to not have to do this. I lift the weight without the bar touching my shins at any part of the lift...is this wrong?

i hope i'll post a deadlift video this weekend

Your rows are actually really good. Just keep lifting bro.

I just don't think you should be working your arms along with everything else 3 times per week. Maybe you should just do the assistance that is recommended for the 5x5 Routine. Which is: Monday-3 sets of weighted hypers, 4 sets of weighted sit ups. Wednesday-3sets of weighted sit ups. Friday- 3 sets dips, 3 sets 8-10 reps Curls, 3 sets 8-10 reps Tri extension. I'm doing this and it's more than enough. However I'm going to add in Calf raises on monday and tuesday.

When I do deadlift, the bar lightly touches my shins. I'm pretty sure that they should lightly touch at some point in the lift...

 

[dOWNHILL]

You need to find a higher chin rack. You aren't coming fully down... and I think it is because your rack is too low and you are trying to keep your feet above the floor.

The biggest change I'd recommend is scrapping your ab program. They aren't the kind of core torso training I'd want for a fighter. Much of your punching and kicking power comes from your torso and I'd rather see you train abs to seriously support that kind of power need. There are a couple funky exercises I'll see if I can find vids of... but in absence of finding them... nothing beats fast high board sit ups... combined with high board alternating elbows... and high board coming up into alternating punches.

Well you are right.This is my home basement and i have a very limited height. I am 183 cm and the ceiling is 200cm. But i'll try to keep my knees higher and get as low as i can on chins. As a matter of fact if you watch the video closely enough you'll see my hair brushing the ceiling...

As for abs...i was never pleased by my ab routine on this program. As a matter of fact this week i added some excersises and changed the rep range creating something like a heavy-light-medium day :
Sunday: Standing Cable Crunches 3x8-10, Hanging leg raises 2xas many as i can, Trunk Twists 2x50 with a 20kg bar on shoulders.
Tuesday: Decline Sit ups 3x15-20, hanging Leg raises 2x as many as i can
Thursday: Weighted Crunches 3x5.
Other than that i also do a punching session of 10-20minutes every other day on the bag and i think that's also training the abs.
But since you've mentioned it i'll do a search for your excersises...

I also added some rotator cuff excersises on Thursday.

Thanks for the reply...it's really nice to hear encouraging words by someone who's in martial arts. by the way i train krav maga which is a mix of boxing,muai thai and judo !!!!

Your rows are actually really good. Just keep lifting bro.

I just don't think you should be working your arms along with everything else 3 times per week. Maybe you should just do the assistance that is recommended for the 5x5 Routine. Which is: Monday-3 sets of weighted hypers, 4 sets of weighted sit ups. Wednesday-3sets of weighted sit ups. Friday- 3 sets dips, 3 sets 8-10 reps Curls, 3 sets 8-10 reps Tri extension. I'm doing this and it's more than enough. However I'm going to add in Calf raises on monday and tuesday.

When I do deadlift, the bar lightly touches my shins. I'm pretty sure that they should lightly touch at some point in the lift...

It's cool then that i didn't drop the weight on my rows on my last sesion.
Yes for arms you are correct...i'm sticking with the template. I had a scary pinch in my elbow (old trauma) the last time i did reverse curls and to compensate, this thursday i didn't do any arms at all...Luckily it was nothing...
I'll Keep uping rows then. But when do i know that my form is broken in the rows?
Also i followed your suggestion about auxiliary work on A & B days...and if i may ask you a question about calfs...is there a reason why i should put calfs in A workout instead of B?

i'm trying now to post a video of deadlifts...

 

[dOWNHILL]

Three videos this time...i didn't include dips ...

Actually this session was quite hard as i had a rough Fore Night partying with some friends!

First excersise - Squat ... Upped 2,5 kg from previous session

Warm up sets 1min rest:
50kg:8, 60kg:5, 70kg:3, 80kg:2

Working Sets 2,5min rest:
82,5kg:5,5,5
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kyRDl_YdcHg


Second excersise - Bench Press ..Upped 1kg from previous session. Had a bump on second set with the pins but third set came out smoothly.

Warm up sets 1min rest:
-40kg:8, 50kg:5, 60kg:3,

Working Sets 1,5min rest:
66kg:5,5,5
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hw7vHDyzXs


Third excersise - Deadlift ... This excersise always frightened me and always had been conservative on the weight i loaded...but lately i found that i can make huge jumps and handle it with ease... So here is 10kgs jump from my previous session and a more linear ramping of weights...I used to do 8,5,3,2 rep sets for warm up and then a single set of 5 but now i decided to really go for it and see what happens....so:

All sets 2min rest:
-50kg:5, 60kg:5, 70kg:5, 80kg:5, 85kg:5 and i really feel i have a lot more in me on these!

I post only the heavy weight to comment my form...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bmn0vCYMvZk

 

[skyflyer231]

I suggested that because you are diong 3 sets of Dips on A and 6 sets of Chins on B. Just keep doing that though. It looks good that way.

 

[dOWNHILL]

i beat my self up this Sunday! After 3 pr's on squat (+1,5kg), bench press(+1kg) and deadlift (+2,5kg) i felt great but sore as hell! I immediately decided to eat everything i could get my hands on and get a good night sleep but those measures didn't seem to help much. Today i still feel my quads swollen, ready to explode!!Lower back feels a bit fatigued also but i'll try to keep up the whole week without cutting down on any excersise... I think i'm experiencing a Hulk effect...I feel my trousers getting smaller on quads and Shirts tighter on the back! I love this program although it's getting really tough! Can't wait to go home and get a midday nap!

 

[dOWNHILL]

hello again...just another question...

i've reached now at 93kgs on squat and for the past few workouts on squat, benchpress and military presses, i found that i was more comfortable with a 1kg increase instead of the recommended 2,5kgs. Do you think i should deload and follow strictly the suggested weight loading of 2,5kgs or since i'm still progressing on even 1kg/workout i should keep it up the way i am...

Also i haven't had to deload yet on any lift...Am i applying too small weight increases? Is this wrong?

 

[dOWNHILL]

From the information i've found i came to understand that small increments enhance strength while larger increments promote hypertrophy...
So i think this is not such a big deal as long as weight goes up...is that correct or this is something that can render the 3x5 routine useless ?

 

[skyflyer231]

I would say: if you can increase the recommended ammount then continue to do that. If you can't or you feel like your strength is not increasing accordingly to make the lifts and with proper form then increase by 1kg.

 

[AEKDB]

Great work. Your form in the squat and deadlift are as good as it gets. Don't worry about the amount of increase in weight the trick, as skyflyer noted, is to just increase the weight or reps each time.

I disagree with many regarding increasing deads without deadlifting. From my experience a big dead will help the oly lifts but not vice versa. That said, nothing builds the shoulders, lats, and traps like oly lifts.

 

[dOWNHILL]

Thanks both!! I'll keep it up untill i stall (i reckon on squats i have one more week or so left in my tank)...then i'll go into an HST cycle to let my knees and tendons (my left arm starts showing pain from the chin ups) heal a bit...and then i'll try rippetoes advanced routine or the 5x5 intermediate routine!! Can't wait for that!!!

one more question though...

I'll try HST superseting ecxersises (due to time pressure).

Let's say i have a routine of A &B excersises

I'll follow the following routines

Routine A ...........................Routine B

Squat ................................Front Squat
Ham curls............................Deadlift
Incline Bench Press...............Dips
Pendalay Rows.....................Pull downs On a Cable machine
Military Press with BB............Military press with dumbbel
Rear Delt............................Rear Delt
Bi's....................................Bi's
Tri's...................................Tri's
Calfs..................................Calfs
Abs....................................Abs
Forearms.............................Forearms

Is it wise to Superset Front squats with Deadlifts (on workout B ONLY)???

and if not, is it ok to do Squats 2 times a week and deadlift in the middle???

 

[dOWNHILL]

I'm currently on HST and already have finished the 15's. Next week i'm going into 10's.
The routine i use is the following:

Routine A ...........................Routine B

Squat ................................Front Squat
Ham curls............................Goodmornings
Incline Bench Press...............Dips
Cable Pull downs..................Pendalay Rows
Military Press with BB............Sitted Arnold Presses
Rear Delt Lateral rase............Rows to neck
Curls with BB.......................DB Alternating curls
French Press.......................Cable Push downs
Calfs narrow stance..............Calfs wide stance
Weighted Abs Flat................Weighted Abs on Incline Bench
Forearms............................Powershrugs

Any comment on the workout layout is welcome but what i really want to ask is about FRONT SQUATS. When i do those i feel them really hard in the abs and fairly enough in my Lats/middle back. Is that normal?? Also how low should i go? Upper legs parallel, Just Below Parallel or ass to the ground?? I currently do them just below parallel...