For those who dont come off..........

[ripper911]

I just ended my cycle and now im just using nolv/GH at 2iu's to try to keep as much muscle as possible. Everytime i come off for the past 3 years I have never fully recovered. I get my bloodwork done everytime after PCT lets say 8-10 weeks after my last shot and my test levels are always around 80ng/dl. No matter what PCT i try (Clomid HCG Nolvadex) i not fully coming back. The only possible way to come back is to fully stay off for 6 months or more.
Im 24 5'9 210 and 8%bf............if my test levels ar enot coming back to the minimum of 300ng/dl then why not just stay on a maintance dose of 200mg Cyp/wk. Does anyone find this making more sense????

so my other question is for those who dont come off and just lower their doses to a 200mg maintance dose do you hit HCG during that time ??

My question is for those who dont come off

 

[Makavelli]

I just ended my cycle and now im just using nolv/GH at 2iu's to try to keep as much muscle as possible. Everytime i come off for the past 3 years I have never fully recovered. I get my bloodwork done everytime after PCT lets say 8-10 weeks after my last shot and my test levels are always around 80ng/dl. No matter what PCT i try (Clomid HCG Nolvadex) i not fully coming back. The only possible way to come back is to fully stay off for 6 months or more.
Im 24 5'9 210 and 8%bf............if my test levels ar enot coming back to the minimum of 300ng/dl then why not just stay on a maintance dose of 200mg Cyp/wk. Does anyone find this making more sense????

so my other question is for those who dont come off and just lower their doses to a 200mg maintance dose do you hit HCG during that time ??

My question is for those who dont come off

If you don't come off and recover you can forget about ever having kids. As great as being a BB is, I know that there are other things in life that take priority.
I have to edit this b/c I know someone will bring it up. Yes pro BB's have kids, but are you a pro? Do you want to go pro? If not, then I'd suggest playing it safe. Those that stay on year round will eventually be able to have kids, but it takes a long time and not really worth the risk.

 

[DMI]

That's really not true. I believe Jenetic has a good thread on this, maybe in the PCT forum. There are plenty of ways around this. I know of a few guys personally who stay on and have healthy kids.

In answer to your question, a good way of doing it is to use base dose that you are comfortable with, perhaps between 200 and 400mg test enanthate / cyp per week, keep it simple. An AI will be necessary (aromasin, adex, etc.) and 10mg of nolva per day will help the lipids. Gains will be slow and steady, and when you want to make some serious gains you can up the dosage, or add other drugs, or both. Then drop back down to your base dosage. 5000ius of HCG every 2-3 months is a wise idea whilst on the base dose, as is regular blood profile tests.

If you don't come off and recover you can forget about ever having kids. As great as being a BB is, I know that there are other things in life that take priority.

 

[DMI]

LOL, got you before the edit!

 

[Makavelli]

LOL, got you before the edit!

I knew it was coming...

 

[ripper911]

nice post DMI anyone else

 

[badslinky]

You could talk to galaxy about this, from what he said he has been on since sometime in 2003.

 

[riverrock]

Well, Arnolds two kids are proof of recovery. He took more drugs than me, you, and the rest of the Bros put together. Gunther spoke in a recent interview that he'll start a family immediately upon retirement in a few years, and Jay said its his ultimate ambition.

 

[ripper911]

Is there anyone here that desnt come off ???

 

[DMI]

Yup, me for one. 250mg test enanthate every 6 days, I gain on average 1-2lbs of lean mass per month and occasionally up the stakes and raise my test doses and add my winny, primo, tren etc for just 6-8 weeks, then drop back down. Very similar to how I described above.

I get regular bloodwork and only my last blood profile was out of whack where my liver values were very slightly elevated and my HDL was a little low, but I put this down to currently being on accutane. When your liver values are raised it effects it's ability to metabolise fats, hence the impact on cholesterol.

 

[Steve The Bluesman]

This is just curiousity, but how big are the guys that don't come off? Do you continue contanstly growing at a small rate even at 200-300mg/wk, or is it more to simply hold onto the gains already made?

I can't imagine someone on for a # of years turning into a 500lb monster - at some point the cost and potential for health risk far outweighs the benefits, even for a pro, no?


Bluesman

 

[MASSIVE1000]

I do not come off...I have 2 very healthy boys...the first was conceived when I was on 750mgs per week of sustanon...My youngest...8mo's old was conceived while I thought I was doing Tornel supertest....turns out it was bogus....was on it for about 2 months and wife got pregnant. It all depends on each individual. My "off time" usually includes 250mgs of test per week. Good thing is....while other bros are losing size and strength, I am still always big and getting bigger and stronger as time goes on....just takes alittle longer to get those gains though.

 

[Ulter]

The fertility issue is valid but certainly steroids are not a reliable male contraceptive. I got my wife pregnant after 4 years on deca/test.

r911 you're PCT needs to go longer if you don't want to go on for good. And as was posted you need to use HCG/Nolva more.
If you feel like you're just not going to get your test levels back and it's affecting your quality of life then by all mean use 200mg/wk.

 

[wls8687]

I do not come off...I have 2 very healthy boys...the first was conceived when I was on 750mgs per week of sustanon...My youngest...8mo's old was conceived while I thought I was doing Tornel supertest....turns out it was bogus....was on it for about 2 months and wife got pregnant. It all depends on each individual. My "off time" usually includes 250mgs of test per week. Good thing is....while other bros are losing size and strength, I am still always big and getting bigger and stronger as time goes on....just takes alittle longer to get those gains though.

That is so wrong that i don't even want to start

 

[PolfaJelfa]

Ulter i think it is in reality UNFAIR for you to be giving advice to the members on this topic! You are a Polish brother as am I. We all know we Polish brothers have testes like the horses.

PS: On a serious note i personally like the low dose "of period" and coming off fully once in a while. DMI what do you mean 5,000 IU HCG every few months....just 1 5,000 IU amp, or something like 5,000 IU every 5 days for 2 weeks each few months?

 

[DMI]

I spread 5000iu over the period of a week every 3 months or less.

 

[PolfaJelfa]

5,000 Iu is realy not much at all bro. Im not saying your wrong. Can someone who is more knowledgable on HCG clarify? To mee thats not enough IMO.

Thanks

 

[hammertime30]

Is there anyone here that desnt come off ???

I don't come off anymore....after the main cycle I hit test cyp 125mg every 7 days....and I hit HCG at 250 to 300iu every 4 days....my balls stay full and swinging!!! Though I'm not sure as to sperm count, I shoot a pretty full load!!!

Even if having kids is an issue, I have an 8 year old son....wife and I are pretty set on not having any more...

 

[PolfaJelfa]

250 IU every 4 days or so ....FOR HOW LONG......just for the period you are using the low 125 mg every 7 days correct?

 

[hammertime30]

250 IU every 4 days or so ....FOR HOW LONG......just for the period you are using the low 125 mg every 7 days correct?

No even during my primary cycle......

 

[PolfaJelfa]

Arent you woried about shutting yoourself down for good lilke that....i though it was common knowledge tha tusing HCG during cycle too frequently can de sensetize the boys and in soem cases turn them off.

 

[hammertime30]

Arent you woried about shutting yoourself down for good lilke that....i though it was common knowledge tha tusing HCG during cycle too frequently can de sensetize the boys and in soem cases turn them off.

Yes it has been speculated that the prolonged use of HCG could permanently repress the body's own production of gonadotropins but it seems to be more directed towards high dosages....250iu every 4-5 days....is very little compared to the recommended 2500 to 5000iu every 5 days for 3 weeks........Does anyone else have solid information about this??

 

[PolfaJelfa]

Im sory bro, i just realized you said 250 not 2,500. In that case i can see where you are coming from.

 

[Mr_MAX]

good info

 

[ripper911]

ok so someone help me Ive been off everything for 13 days I am gonna get back on Test Cyp 200mg/wk for 10 weeks til my next cycle. My question is........should I use HCG or anything else ? (Im a vet this is not a dumb question)

FYI:my balls are not small and they still hang low. If I have to really analyze them Id say they are 85% full but i dont remember what they use to look like so im kinda use to the sixe now.

 

[hammertime30]

ok so someone help me Ive been off everything for 13 days I am gonna get back on Test Cyp 200mg/wk for 10 weeks til my next cycle. My question is........should I use HCG or anything else ? (Im a vet this is not a dumb question)

FYI:my balls are not small and they still hang low. If I have to really analyze them Id say they are 85% full but i dont remember what they use to look like so im kinda use to the sixe now.

Personally....I would say that small HCG dosages wouldn't hurt....the longer you are on the smaller they become....usually...all though one of the guys one the board says his never shrinks.....As far as anything else, because you are not going off, there is no need for nolva or clomid....unless you are seeing problems with your nipples.....

 

[DMI]

I suggest you use 5000iu over the next week, then run it again after your next cycle. Opinions will vary on this.

 

[a-f-x]

All This Fucking Talk About Becoming Sterile Off Of Moderate Doses Of Test Is Making Me Freak Out.

 

[hammertime30]

All This Fucking Talk About Becoming Sterile Off Of Moderate Doses Of Test Is Making Me Freak Out.

You have to take the bad with the good....it's never perfect....and beauty is pain!! Remember the ones who are walking around out of shape, low self esteem, playa hating, and all the other mental crap that you see on these talk shows are like that because they set on their azz and don't do shit to try and improve their lives.....all the others take major risks and work fuckin' hard as hell for what they have............

 

[DIVISION]

All This Fucking Talk About Becoming Sterile Off Of Moderate Doses Of Test Is Making Me Freak Out.

That's all it is: Talk.

What are you worried about?

Do what's best for you and you'll be alright.

Kids are always gonna be worried about HPTA shutdown......that's just a part of the game.



DIV

 

[DMI]

There is some truth in it but it has been blown out of proportion. There are also ways around it. Hell, I know of a 76 year old life long juicer, just come off once in his whole life, no HCG, no clomid. He got a girl pregnant at 63!

 

[DIVISION]

There is some truth in it but it has been blown out of proportion. There are also ways around it. Hell, I know of a 76 year old life long juicer, just come off once in his whole life, no HCG, no clomid. He got a girl pregnant at 63!

Sounds like your 76yo friend was an ape on the rampage.......no HCG needed.

Evidently his packet has longstanding freshness....

Some kids are like that.....




DIV

 

[a-f-x]

well i keep bugging out reading these posts about sterility issues.. this is my first cycle, and im a large guy and i feel that lower doses of test dont do too much for me. today is like, exactly 16 weeks into it, sust, enanthate and cyp, usually do at least 1000mg a week, andi have not used any nolva or clomid or hcg yet. im starting to let myself off right now (i know youre not supposed to stop cold turkey), and then use hcg for a week. with all this talk about becoming sterile, its really getting to me. yes im quite aware that there are risks etc, but i mean what the fuck... some people make it sound like 1 cycle of test will make it impossible to have children someday.