Don't Buy 500mg ALA caps!

[Iceburg]

It's all in the filler.

Yep, if you look on the bottle it lists "Other ingredients". One for example lists - white rice and magnesium serate in the "other ingredients". www.anabolical.com has zero filler. You will notice this in the color. We list no other ingredients on the bottle because there are no "fillers"

 

[The Game]

ala

Fellas what exactly does ala do for you, and before sopmeone says to do a search I did, all I got was if someone liked it or not, thanx The Game





[email protected]

 

[soflaguy]

thanks, ulter and iceberg

thanks guys, the use of fillers explains the variances in the size of caps and the amounts in them.

iceberg, thumbs up on your service.

 

[specter]

I gotta give props to anabolical.com. I can feel teh stuff working, and its cheap as hell. So, yeah, I switched over from kilosports, and i recommend you do to! (provided you want to save money)

So Suspension, what is your take on ALA now? Could you provide a little more detail? You were pretty skeptic to start and I'm curious to know what your thinking now, if you don't mind elaborating.

 

[THeMaCHinE]

The one problem that all these places have is that they are selling you a mixture of r and s ALA. These mixtures are not 50-50 and they don't have to tell you how much r (which is the one that works) you are actually getting. So if you find that your results and sides vary from batch to batch that's why. All of the research done was done with the r and all the research done with the s was very disappointing. Thus the s is very cheap and used as almost a filler in the cap with the r in terms of what you need it for.

You don't need to sell this way...R will sell itself; you should be upselling the benefits of R rather than trying to smear all racemic mixtures. It makes you look shady. (Bill Phillips(ish)) If it's an honest mistake, I understand, you and Mac don't strike me as the types that say something without a lot of research though...

As a matter of fact, most ALA mixtures on the market are 50/50 mixtures. S is the synthetic racemate to R; unless specifically stated, mixtures are 50/50.

By definition, racemic means half and half. So any racemic mixture of ALA is 50/50.

The S[-]-enantiomer ? part of the racemate, which is present as about a 50% impurity, needs to be eliminated."

Dr. Guido Zimmer and colleagues, in Methods in Enzymoogy.

The 50:50 mixture of both optical isomers, called the racemic mixture, is the usual form of alpha-lipoicacid available commercially and is often-times
re f e rred to as thioctic acid. In addition to its use...

Timothy J. Maher, Ph.D.
Sawyer Professor of Pharmaceutical Sciences
Professor of Pharmacology
Dean, Research and Sponsored Programs
Massachusetts College of Pharmacy and Health Sciences

Unless they specify otherwise, "lipoic acid" supplements are a 50/50 mixture of the natural R(+)-lipoic acid, and the synthetic S(-)-lipoic acid. These mixtures are called "racemates." In some cases, S(-)-lipoic acid - or the racemate - is simply less effective than R(+)-lipoic acid. But in other cases, the S(-)-form actually acts in opposition to the...

from R-lipoic.com, a marketer of R-type ALA

Of the two isomers of lipoic acid present in conventional supplements, the enantiomer which is identical to the one made by living things for their use – the natural form of lipoic acid – is the “R(+)-enantiomer,” or “ R(+)-lipoic acid.” “S(-)-lipoic acid” is a purely artificial molecule: it does not exist in nature but is produced as a byproduct in the normal method of producing commercial lipoic acid

from R-lipoic.com, a marketer of R-type ALA

A 50/50 mix of two enantiomers  is called a “racemic compound” or “racemate,” and so the proper, scientific designation for the lipoic acid in conventional supplements is “rac-lipoic acid,” “R,S-lipoic acid,” or “(±)lipoic acid.” But because of industry conventions – and because, of the fact that, until recently, lipoic acid was only available as the racemate, except for tiny quantities of R(+)-lipoic acid which were made available exclusively to scientists using it for research purposes – conventional “lipoic acid” supplement labels don’t bother to tell you that you’re getting a racemic compound, rather than the pure, natural R(+)-form of the nutrient. 

Zimmer G, Mainka L, Ulrich H. ATP synthesis and ATPase activities in heart mitoplasts under influence of R(+)- and S(-)-enantiomers of lipoic acid. Methods Enzymol. 1995;251:332-40.
 
 

 

[Ulter]

You don't need to sell this way...R will sell itself;

I am not selling anything. I am quoting what I have learned in the past months about ALA and the supp industry. Mostly from Macro. I don't agree at all that the mixture is 50-50 as you say and I have seen the scans of the Nature's Purest 50-50 that prove it. It's nothing shady on my part and I certainly welcome your opinion on how to conduct my business. Don't take it personally if I go my own way though.

 

[THeMaCHinE]

I am not selling anything. I am quoting what I have learned in the past months about ALA and the supp industry. Mostly from Macro. I don't agree at all that the mixture is 50-50 as you say and I have seen the scans of the Nature's Purest 50-50 that prove it. It's nothing shady on my part and I certainly welcome your opinion on how to conduct my business. Don't take it personally if I go my own way though.

Hey, nothing personal at all; and let me say for the record that I do believe in your company and products -- I also respect your openess and willingness to discuss these matters without it becoming a bloodfest.

Now, back to the point -- its not my opinion (well, it is, but because of what I've read) it is fact as presented by published researchers, doctors and marketers of R-type lipoic acid. That's not to say there aren't exceptions, like Nature's Purest that you alluded to. S is produced as a racemate to R and costs money to seperate. Is there a secondary market for pure S-type? That would be the only way that I could think of companies adding S to their mixtures. Or, perhaps a flaw in their manufacturing process that degrades the R somehow?

I would suspect that the majority of ALA supps out there are truly racemic based on the published research and information that I've read.

However, you are the one doing the grunt-work, scans, etc... If you were to post say four or five lab assays that supported your point, I'd eat my left foot. Say Kilosport, BAC, Nature's Purest, Anibolical to start...

Anyway, I'm looking forward to the 10 gram product you are putting out.

 

[Ulter]

Macro happens to be on vacation in Australia chasing kangeroo's so he may not post as much this week. You know his record as you've stated and it's not likely that anything that comes out his lab is not going to be first rate and without considerable research to back it up. The Nature's Purest was the one that caught my attention a month ago when the weights of the 100mg and 300mg were virtually identical. I mean what are the chances that the filler and the ALA weigh exactly the same. I thought well if they aren't consistant with the contents in terms of how much ALA is in the cap what about how much s vs r ALA can they be trusted to use.
I agree that a smear campaign doesn't serve anyone's interest. MP Tech could have easily jumped on the mix bandwagon and offered the cheaper product, but that's not what people expect of us and not what we expect of ourselves.
None of this is a race or contest in the true sense. Everyone will put out their products and the marketplace will decided who stays and who goes. That's what makes our system great.

 

[barnidge]

Does IceBurg accept paypal.com?

 

[Iceburg]

Does IceBurg accept paypal.com?

No. To many horror stories about them.