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Dermacrine...makes no sense at all

Smokescreen

Experienced Noob
Platinum
Dermacrine Sustain utilizes a higher dose of the proprietary Phyto Aromatase Inhibitor (Phyto AI) complex and does not include the hormone precursors DHEA and pregnenolone.

this is what it says on the site.

Yet the ingredients clearly says it had DHEA. Wow!

Stuff converts to progesterone. I know a lot of about this damn hormone! It inhibiting the converision of test to DHT?! How can this be a good thing? No DHT means softer muscles, less strenght and No libido!
 
I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR all about the derma ...is mit legit...yes or no

who has used it a full 4 weeks?
 
I think that's a typo on their website... the original Derma does have DHEA and pregnenolone... Sustain does not. I'll tell you one thing though, I used the original formula for the first 2 weeks of my PCT and I definitely had my libido. Now I've been on Sustain for over 2 weeks and I still have my libido.
 
Carth said:
Dermacrine Sustain utilizes a higher dose of the proprietary Phyto Aromatase Inhibitor (Phyto AI) complex and does not include the hormone precursors DHEA and pregnenolone.

this is what it says on the site.

Yet the ingredients clearly says it had DHEA. Wow!

Stuff converts to progesterone. I know a lot of about this damn hormone! It inhibiting the converision of test to DHT?! How can this be a good thing? No DHT means softer muscles, less strenght and No libido!
so your saying the aifm that has DHEA in it that every one was taking is doing the same thing...

btw bro please explain all this because it sounds a little fishy to me as every one that has taken derma reg got some good gains from it and loved its effects in the gym and out of the gym...
 
Carth said:
Dermacrine Sustain utilizes a higher dose of the proprietary Phyto Aromatase Inhibitor (Phyto AI) complex and does not include the hormone precursors DHEA and pregnenolone.

this is what it says on the site.

Yet the ingredients clearly says it had DHEA. Wow!

Stuff converts to progesterone. I know a lot of about this damn hormone! It inhibiting the converision of test to DHT?! How can this be a good thing? No DHT means softer muscles, less strenght and No libido!

Carth, as to the reply to your PM -

The Derma Sustain does not have the DHEA/preg, what ingredients list are you reading?

The pregnenolone dose is small and therefore the progesterone conversion is kept to a minimum. Its just part of the fine balancing act, in trying to create a well rounded formula for everyone. Im a fan of DHT for sure, but it can get a little out of hand when androgens shoot though the roof.

-Pp
 
njmuscleguy said:
I think that's a typo on their website... the original Derma does have DHEA and pregnenolone... Sustain does not. I'll tell you one thing though, I used the original formula for the first 2 weeks of my PCT and I definitely had my libido. Now I've been on Sustain for over 2 weeks and I still have my libido.


Bro, I started mine last week, of the sustain! I will keep you informed. You still happy?????
 
DHEA's ability to increase libido, burn fat and slow the aging process may be reason enough to consider taking the supplement. But in addition to those, DHEA could also help you prevent and fight cancer. New research on DHEA is giving hope to many cancer patients. While studies are still navigating its positive and negative benefits, scientists are finally taking notice of the healing power of this natural hormone.

What is DHEA?

DHEA stands for dehydroepiandrosterone. It is a hormone produced in the adrenal glands. The body produces varying quantities of DHEA throughout one's life, converting it to the major sex hormones such as estrogen and testosterone. Once regarded as a buffer hormone, scientists had believed that DHEA was involved only in the production of these hormones. New research, however, has found that DHEA-specific receptors exist in many cells throughout the body and aid in numerous functions, including possibly helping you to prevent and fight cancer.

Sometimes referred to as the "Anti-Aging Hormone," DHEA is the only hormone to decline linearly with age in both sexes. Because the natural production of DHEA in the body peaks around age 25, scientists correlated the waning of this hormone with several kinds of age-related diseases. The reason for this decrease is that the endocrine glands begin to shrink, thereby limiting the amount of DHEA your body can naturally produce. Based on a number of blood tests, anyone over the age of 40 who does not supplement their naturally occurring DHEA levels is already deficient by that age. By age 80, our bodies produce only 10 percent of the DHEA produced at age 20.

Short history of DHEA

In the 1980s DHEA supplements were widely sold as weight loss and anti-aging products. However, in1986 the Food and Drug Administration stepped in to halt the sale of DHEA as a non-prescription supplement, requesting more research on its long-term effects. After an eight-year hiatus, DHEA hit the markets again in 1994, partly because of the U.S. Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act. Since then, the number of studies on DHEA has increased, thereby offering new insights into its cancer-fighting properties.

DHEA and cancer

In DHEA: A Practical Guide, Dr. Ray Sahelian describes several ways in which DHEA could prevent and fight cancer. In one study, nine healthy elderly men took 50 mg of DHEA for 20 weeks. Scientists found that DHEA increased the activity of lymphocytes, which are natural killer cells that find and destroy not only viruses, but also abnormal cells that may turn cancerous. Although the number of T lymphocytes was unaffected, T cell function was increased. In this way DHEA increased the quality of the body's natural defense against cancer, not necessarily the quantity of cells that do the fighting.

Sahelian chronicles another study that was conducted on mice and rats. In this experiment, DHEA was shown to inhibit the development of experimental tumors of the liver, breast, lung, colon, skin lymphatic tissue and other bodily tissues. Among pregnant rats implanted with a cancer-causing agent, 96 percent of the controls developed mammary (breast) tumors. Mice that were supplemented with DHEA but that otherwise received the same cancer-causing treatment had only a 35 percent incidence of mammary tumors. Dr. Inano, a Japanese researcher, concluded, "These findings suggest that DHEA has a potent preventive activity against the promotion/progression phase of radiation-induced mammary tumorigenesis."

Correlations have also been found between decreased DHEA levels and T cell leukemia. While DHEA has already been proven to be effective in treating hairy cell leukemia, new research also suggests that it might help T cell leukemia as well. Given the correlation between adult T cell leukemia and decreased levels of DHEA, some doctors speculate that DHEA might be beneficial. Other cancer studies show that DHEA inhibits cancer cell thymidine, a factor in cellular propagation, and disrupts the oxidizing effects of chemical carcinogens. Scientists claim that DHEA modulates the effects of chemical carcinogens on cells.

In his self-titled supplement bible, Dr. Earl Mindell, RPh, states that DHEA also appears to increase immune function. Evidence suggests that DHEA supplementation can reverse many of the immune function problems that arise as we age. Dr. Khorram found that DHEA stimulated the production of immune cells that fight against viruses and bacteria, as well as important cells called natural killer cells, which help weed out cancerous cells before they can grow.

DHEA for overall health

In addition to these findings, James Howenstine also suggests that DHEA "can counteract stress [and] improve clarity of thought and memory." DHEA is also widely believed to slow the process of aging, so supplementation may provide invigorating and replenishing effects. DHEA was sold as a weight loss supplement in the 80s, and it appears to have the ability to convert consumed calories into heat, rather than allowing them to be stored as fat. It may also promote lean muscle tissue.



DHEA comes in both non-prescription and higher dosage prescription-strength pills and capsules. Most DHEA supplements are made in laboratories from substances extracted from wild yams, the most common substance being diosgenin. You can also buy and eat wild yams, which the body can then metabolize and convert into DHEA.
dame people better stop eating yams man...lmao !!!!!

The experts speak on DHEA and cancer

There is a real hope that DHEA can counteract stress, improve clarity of thought and memory, functions as an antioxidant and may help protect against cancer and osteoporosis. Dosage is 50 mg. daily in males and 25 mg. daily in females.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 141

Nine healthy elderly men with an average age of 64 years took 50 mg nightly of DHEA for 20 weeks. DHEA treatment significantly elevated natural killer cells. These are lymphocytes that are involved in searching out and destroying not only viruses, but abnormal cells that are on their way to turning cancerous. Although the number of T lymphocytes was unaffected, T cell function was increased (as measured by an increased proliferative response to phytohemagglutinin, a chemical that normally stimulates T cells). B cell function was also increased.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 53

Studies have also shown that DHEA increases the activity of killer lymphocytes and may even help protect against cancer. Because of these many beneficial effects and lack of any clearly adverse effects, consider starting long-term therapy with DHEA beginning at age 4O.This therapy needs to be monitored with regular blood tests so the dosage can be appropriately changed as needed.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 237

DHEA is thought to inhibit glucose-6-phosphate dehy-drogenase enzyme. This enzyme is involved in cancer promotion, lipid formation, and production of toxic oxygen free radicals.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 31

DHEA … lowers cancer enzyme Glucose-6-Phosphate Dehyrogenase (G6PD). British women having 10% less DHEA than that expected for their age group, developed and died from breast cancer, predicted by low urine DHEA tested 9 years prior; inhibits lung tumors from urethane and 1,2 dimethylbenz-anthracene, skin cancers (100 mg./ day), blocks colon tumors in mice from carcinogen 1,2-dimethylhydrazine, inhibits prostate cancer, and testicle tumors in rodents.
Anti-Aging Manual by Joseph B Marion, page 1100

… DHEA appears to have a very broad range of positive effects. It is widely believed that DHEA slows the biological symptoms of aging, and helps protect the body from cancer, …
Brain Longevity by Dharma Singh Khalsa M.D. with Cameron Stauth, page 402

DHEA is a hormone produced by the adrenal glands, but production declines steadily with age…. DHEA supplementation during the later years can hinder the onset of an assortment of serious disorders, including heart disease, cancer, arthritis, and asthma. …
Complete Encyclopedia Of Natural Healing by Gary Null PhD, page 29

DHEA….. we tend to produce less of this important hormone as we age. This decrease is connected to a number of degenerative conditions, including cancer. Taking DHEA has been shown to reverse many illnesses.
Complete Encyclopedia Of Natural Healing by Gary Null PhD, page 84

Countless rodent studies with DHEA have shown increased life span and positive influences on a variety of illnesses such as heart disease, diabetes, and cancer.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 28

The majority of the research done on mice and rats has shown that DHEA inhibits the development of experimental tumors of the liver, breast, lung, colon, skin lymphatic tissue, and others. …When pregnant rats received whole body irradiation during pregnancy and were then implanted with a diethylstilbesterol pellet (DES is cancer causing) for a period of 1 year, a high incidence (96%) of mammary (breast) tumors was observed. Another group of mice who received the same unpleasant treatment, but were supplemented with DHEA, showed only a 35% incidence of mammary tumors. Dr. Inano, a Japanese researcher, concludes, "These findings suggest that DHEA has a potent preventive activity against the promotion/ progression phase of radiation-induced mammary tumori-genesis."
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 78

We have found DHEA… to be useful in a variety of conditions such as … certain forms of cancer. We've given high doses of DHEA, up to 1,000 mg a day, to some terminal cancer cases, such as pancreatic cancer, and noticed that it was of benefit. Other anecdotal cases include shrinkage of lymphomas. …
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 79

Chronic inflammation is also involved in …, cancer, …. Excess levels of one or more of the inflammatory cytokines … are usually found when a cytokine blood profile is conducted. DHEA has been shown to lower these pro-inflammatory cytokines and protect against their toxic effects .
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 642

DHEA has a role in cancer therapy as an addition to chemotherapy. This steroid is one part of the overall treatment, not a cure-all by itself. I've observed that patients with cancer do better when, in addition to conventional chemotherapy, we also add DHEA and use nutritional therapies such as vitamins, antioxi-dants and melatonin.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 9

DHEA has been shown to inhibit chemically induced cancers in the colon, lung, breast, and skin. When applied directly to the skin, DHEA prevents chemically induced skin cancer. DHEA has this effect by blocking the binding of carcinogens to skin cells and by inhibiting the enzyme G6PDH.
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 646

…. DHEA … increased the number and activity of cancer-fighting NK (natural killer) cells, which keep a watchful eye on potential cancerous cells and destroy them before they can grow.
Earl Mindells Secret Remedies by Earl Mindell RPh PhD, page 172

One study showed that patients with adult T-cell leukemia (ATL) had significantly decreased levels of DHEA compared to healthy controls. This has led some doctors to speculate that DHEA might be beneficial in treating this form of leukemia because DHEA has already been shown effective in treating hairy cell leukemia. Other cancer studies show DHEA inhibits cancer cell thymidine incorporation needed for cellular propagation and disrupts the oxidizing effects of chemical carcinogens. Scientists point out that DHEA functions not as an antioxidant, but as a modulator of the effects of chemical carcinogens on cells.
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 646

DHEA acts against everyday damage as well. By maintaining skin immunity, DHEA preserves the ability of skin to react to cancer-causing, skin-destroying pollutants in air, food, and water.
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 647

.. This anticancer surveillance hormone may inhibit the metabolism of cancer cells. For various reasons, the cancer cell fails to become an immuno-logical alien to the host and will, therefore, be more easily rejected. DHEA may also play a …
Herbal Medicine Healing Cancer by Donald R Yance Jr, page 242

DHEA has consistently been shown to boost beneficial interleukin-2 and suppress damaging interleukin-6 (IL-6) levels. Interleukin-6 is overproduced in …, breast cancer, …
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 647

Free radical defense may have a lot to do with DHEA's ability to prevent skin cancer and papillomas (benign tumors). According to several studies in mice, topically applied DHEA keeps oxidant-loving enzymes at bay. Chemicals with carcinogenic potential depend on oxidases for transformation. DHEA's antioxidant action stops them … DHEA has another important defense: It keeps chemical carcinogens from binding to DNA …
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 1406

Hundreds of studies have documented the vital role that DHEA plays in the body, but it appears to be especially important for normal immune function. As we get older our immune system weakens, making us more vulnerable to infection, cancer, …. There is good evidence that DHEA supplementation can reverse many of the problems that arise in immune function as we age. … Dr. Khorram found that DHEA stimulated the production of immune cells that fight against viruses and bacteria, as well as important cells called natural killer cells, which help weed out cancerous cells before they can grow.
Earl Mindell's Supplement Bible by Earl Mindell RPh PhD, page 46

This has been tested with respect to one of the body's most significant and abundant hormones, dehydroepiandrosterone sulfate (DHEA-S). …. Women with high levels of DHEA-S are known to have less breast cancer and osteoporosis. …
Freedom From Disease by Hari Sharma MD, page 191

... A deficiency of DHEA can cause breast cancer and heart attacks. ...
Health In The 21st Century by Fransisco Contreras MD, page 239

Many ^ranenopausal women with breast cancer have abnormally low DHEA levels in their blood and, for that group, DHEA may offer protection against cancer. ..
Herbal Medicine Healing Cancer by Donald R Yance Jr, page 242

…. 7-Keto DHEA is a derivative of DHEA that is not converted into estrogen or testosterone, which is good for women concerned about breast cancer and for men concerned about prostate cancer. 7-Keto DHEA is a good alternative to DHEA and has the same benefits.
Prescription For Nutritional Healing by Phyllis A Balch CNC and James F Balch MD, page 67

Serum DHEA levels are usually lower in men with malignant prostate disease compared to healthy control subjects. ... On the contrary, there is evidence indicating that maintaining youthful levels of DHEA may protect against prostate cancer. …
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 300

… 7-keto DHEA is a stronger, natural descendant of DHEA… 7-keto DHEA … may be a safer alternative to DHEA in combating breast cancer.
Prescription For Nutritional Healing by Phyllis A Balch CNC and James F Balch MD, page 226

… examined the action of DHEA on spontaneous mas-tosarcomas in dogs and cats. In six of seven animals, there was a regression at 10 mg of DHEA per day. Later, a human clinical study of 129 advanced cancer patients on 40 mg of DHEA per day found that while there wasn't significant regression of the cancer, two patients with renal cancer stabilized their conditions and tolerated the DHEA therapy without side effects for two and a half years. And according to Regelson and Kalimi, DHEA may be our best agent for blocking stress-mediated support of tumor growth.
Stopping the Clock by Ronald Klatz and Robert Goldman, page 64

Administration of DHEA inhibited tumor formation in a strain of mice that develops spontaneous breast cancer. DHEA has also been shown to prevent chemically induced colon and liver cancer, as well as skin papil-lomas in mice.
Textbook of Natural Medicine Volumes 1-2 by Joseph E Pizzorno and Michael T Murray, page 697

DHEA and cancer: potential adverse effects

All men should have a blood PSA and rectal exam before starting DHEA. This needs to be repeated annually as there is a theoretical risk of activating prostate cancer if the DHEA causes testosterone levels to rise.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 237

Women may experience rising estrogen levels with DHEA therapy. Women with estrogen dependent breast cancer must get advice from their physician before starting this treatment.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 319

…In addition, since DHEA can convert to estrogen and/or testosterone, monitoring these hormones is also important. Long-term effects of DHEA supplementation are not known. DHEA replacement is not suggested for …people at risk for breast, uterine, or prostate cancer.
Alternative Medicine by Burton Goldberg, page 372

… DHEA…. Do not use if pregnant or nursing, have acne, or with hormone-related ovary, adrenal, or thyroid tumors, prostrate, breast orreproductivecancers.
Anti-Aging Manual by Joseph B Marion, page 10

DHEA therapy could have preventive effects in humans, as it does in animals, but I doubt that it can be helpful when the cancer is already full steam ahead.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 79

Studies suggest that DHEA supplementation may cause certain cancers. In addition, DHEA can accelerate bone marrow production and worsen some cancers.
Complementary Cancer Therapies by Dan Labriola ND, page 192

To insure protection against possible prostatic enlargement and or prostate cancer, rectal exam and PSA blood test should be done before initiating DHEA and annually thereafter.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 318

I'm cautious about using any hormones on a regular basis without good reason and without medical supervision. We don't know what the downside of taking supplemental DHEA may be over time. … DHEA probably increases risk of prostate cancer and may increase risk of coronary heart disease.
Ask Dr Weil by Andrew Weil MD, page 78

DHEA is an extremely safe hormone. … unless it is taken in gross excess over a long period of time. Up to 1,600 mg daily have been taken in short-term administration without side effects. … Also, because DHEA elevates male hormones, it is not an appropriate drug for men who have prostate cancer.
Brain Longevity by Dharma Singh Khalsa M.D. with Cameron Stauth, page 403

Before initiating DHEA therapy, men should know their serum PSA (prostate-specific antigen) level and have passed a digital rectal exam. Men with prostate cancer or severe benign prostate disease are advised to avoid DHEA because DHEA can be converted into testosterone (and estrogen). These sex hormones and their metabolites can promote benign and malignant prostate cell proliferation…
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 300

DHEA may have some benefit against cancer, but it also has significant risks that, in some views, outweigh the potential benefits. DHEA is not recommended for use, based on the risks
Complementary Cancer Therapies by Dan Labriola ND, page 192

The December, 1995, issue of the Journal of the American Medical Association published the results of a long-term study in women. Blood samples were collected in 1974 from 20,000 women. By 1989, a total of 31 cases of ovarian cancer were identified. Hormone levels of these cancer patients were matched to a group of women who did not have ovarian cancer, known as controls. Compared with the controls, the women who had ovarian cancer had higher androgen levels such as androstenedione and DHEA.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 77

Theoretical risks with long-term DHEA supplementation include an influence on hormone-sensitive cancers such as breast, uterus, ovaries and prostate. High doses of DHEA for prolonged periods could potentially stimulate breast cysts or uterine fibroids. I believe DHEA has a positive role in low dosages, but we need to be careful not to go overboard. We may also find that DHEA can protect against certain cancers. It's still too early to predict.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 97

Because DHEA invigorates hormonal systems, DHEA is not recommended for men with prostate cancer or for women with estrogen-dependent cancer without physician approval. …
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 443

…. If DHEA were to elevate estrogen too much, this could theoretically increase the risk of breast cancer.
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 651

… Taking extra DHEA means being saddled with more estrogen and testosterone, which may increase the risk of developing hormone-based cancers (of the breast in women and the prostate in men). Maybe I'm too conservative, but that's one important reason why I do not recommend DHEA for any patient..
Dr Isadore Rosenfeld's Breakthrough Health By Isadore Rosenfeld MD, page 11

Several studies have failed to find any benefit from DHEA in breast cancer. …
PDR For Nutritional Supplements by Sheldon Saul Hendle and David Rorvik, page 130

…. DHEA, if improperly used, can … accelerate the growth of preexisting cancer. If you decide to use DHEA, I strongly advise you to use it only with your doctor's permission and under his or her strict medical supervision.
Permanent Remissions by Robert Haas MS, page 154

In other cases, though, DHEA has been reported to stimulate the growth of breast tumors, making its use in cancer uncertain. And in one mouse study, DHEA appeared to induce ovarian tumors. Clearly, more research needs to be done.
Stopping the Clock by Ronald Klatz and Robert Goldman, page 64









I have bin searching my ass of here bro but I am not seeing what you are putting down bro...help me out here.
 
Do DHEA supplements suppress the adrenal gland's natural DHEA production?
The production of many hormones is controlled by a "feedback loop," which means that when hormone levels get too high, the body is told to make less, and when hormone levels are too low, the body is told to make more. Cortisol, testosterone, and estrogen are all regulated by this feedback. In other words, if a person takes cortisol, or a similar derivative such as prednisone, it will shut off the body's natural production. DHEA appears to be one of the exceptions. There doesn't seem to be a feedback mechanism for DHEA. In other words, DHEA supplements are not likely to stop the body's own production.hmmmm just throwing things out as i find them....
 
A1platnum said:
definitely keep us informed guys. seriously thinking about using this product for my pct too.

peace
bro your good to go to use derma sustain for pct...it dont have any dhea in it...not that its a bad thing if it did.derma sustain is great for pct
 
boston789 said:
So does the original derma make your muscles soft, etc. etc.....? (Like stated earlier)
well I dont see him coming out with any thing to prove that other then "I said so"

so to answer the question.no no it dos not he is pretty much full of it or mis led or just trying to start shit.......


ask him were he got his info from...really I would like to know to.
 
The Mother of all posts. lol

needtogetaas said:
DHEA's ability to increase libido, burn fat and slow the aging process may be reason enough to consider taking the supplement. But in addition to those, DHEA could also help you prevent and fight cancer. New research on DHEA is giving hope to many cancer patients. While studies are still navigating its positive and negative benefits, scientists are finally taking notice of the healing power of this natural hormone.

What is DHEA?

DHEA stands for dehydroepiandrosterone. It is a hormone produced in the adrenal glands. The body produces varying quantities of DHEA throughout one's life, converting it to the major sex hormones such as estrogen and testosterone. Once regarded as a buffer hormone, scientists had believed that DHEA was involved only in the production of these hormones. New research, however, has found that DHEA-specific receptors exist in many cells throughout the body and aid in numerous functions, including possibly helping you to prevent and fight cancer.

Sometimes referred to as the "Anti-Aging Hormone," DHEA is the only hormone to decline linearly with age in both sexes. Because the natural production of DHEA in the body peaks around age 25, scientists correlated the waning of this hormone with several kinds of age-related diseases. The reason for this decrease is that the endocrine glands begin to shrink, thereby limiting the amount of DHEA your body can naturally produce. Based on a number of blood tests, anyone over the age of 40 who does not supplement their naturally occurring DHEA levels is already deficient by that age. By age 80, our bodies produce only 10 percent of the DHEA produced at age 20.

Short history of DHEA

In the 1980s DHEA supplements were widely sold as weight loss and anti-aging products. However, in1986 the Food and Drug Administration stepped in to halt the sale of DHEA as a non-prescription supplement, requesting more research on its long-term effects. After an eight-year hiatus, DHEA hit the markets again in 1994, partly because of the U.S. Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act. Since then, the number of studies on DHEA has increased, thereby offering new insights into its cancer-fighting properties.

DHEA and cancer

In DHEA: A Practical Guide, Dr. Ray Sahelian describes several ways in which DHEA could prevent and fight cancer. In one study, nine healthy elderly men took 50 mg of DHEA for 20 weeks. Scientists found that DHEA increased the activity of lymphocytes, which are natural killer cells that find and destroy not only viruses, but also abnormal cells that may turn cancerous. Although the number of T lymphocytes was unaffected, T cell function was increased. In this way DHEA increased the quality of the body's natural defense against cancer, not necessarily the quantity of cells that do the fighting.

Sahelian chronicles another study that was conducted on mice and rats. In this experiment, DHEA was shown to inhibit the development of experimental tumors of the liver, breast, lung, colon, skin lymphatic tissue and other bodily tissues. Among pregnant rats implanted with a cancer-causing agent, 96 percent of the controls developed mammary (breast) tumors. Mice that were supplemented with DHEA but that otherwise received the same cancer-causing treatment had only a 35 percent incidence of mammary tumors. Dr. Inano, a Japanese researcher, concluded, "These findings suggest that DHEA has a potent preventive activity against the promotion/progression phase of radiation-induced mammary tumorigenesis."

Correlations have also been found between decreased DHEA levels and T cell leukemia. While DHEA has already been proven to be effective in treating hairy cell leukemia, new research also suggests that it might help T cell leukemia as well. Given the correlation between adult T cell leukemia and decreased levels of DHEA, some doctors speculate that DHEA might be beneficial. Other cancer studies show that DHEA inhibits cancer cell thymidine, a factor in cellular propagation, and disrupts the oxidizing effects of chemical carcinogens. Scientists claim that DHEA modulates the effects of chemical carcinogens on cells.

In his self-titled supplement bible, Dr. Earl Mindell, RPh, states that DHEA also appears to increase immune function. Evidence suggests that DHEA supplementation can reverse many of the immune function problems that arise as we age. Dr. Khorram found that DHEA stimulated the production of immune cells that fight against viruses and bacteria, as well as important cells called natural killer cells, which help weed out cancerous cells before they can grow.

DHEA for overall health

In addition to these findings, James Howenstine also suggests that DHEA "can counteract stress [and] improve clarity of thought and memory." DHEA is also widely believed to slow the process of aging, so supplementation may provide invigorating and replenishing effects. DHEA was sold as a weight loss supplement in the 80s, and it appears to have the ability to convert consumed calories into heat, rather than allowing them to be stored as fat. It may also promote lean muscle tissue.



DHEA comes in both non-prescription and higher dosage prescription-strength pills and capsules. Most DHEA supplements are made in laboratories from substances extracted from wild yams, the most common substance being diosgenin. You can also buy and eat wild yams, which the body can then metabolize and convert into DHEA.
dame people better stop eating yams man...lmao !!!!!

The experts speak on DHEA and cancer

There is a real hope that DHEA can counteract stress, improve clarity of thought and memory, functions as an antioxidant and may help protect against cancer and osteoporosis. Dosage is 50 mg. daily in males and 25 mg. daily in females.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 141

Nine healthy elderly men with an average age of 64 years took 50 mg nightly of DHEA for 20 weeks. DHEA treatment significantly elevated natural killer cells. These are lymphocytes that are involved in searching out and destroying not only viruses, but abnormal cells that are on their way to turning cancerous. Although the number of T lymphocytes was unaffected, T cell function was increased (as measured by an increased proliferative response to phytohemagglutinin, a chemical that normally stimulates T cells). B cell function was also increased.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 53

Studies have also shown that DHEA increases the activity of killer lymphocytes and may even help protect against cancer. Because of these many beneficial effects and lack of any clearly adverse effects, consider starting long-term therapy with DHEA beginning at age 4O.This therapy needs to be monitored with regular blood tests so the dosage can be appropriately changed as needed.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 237

DHEA is thought to inhibit glucose-6-phosphate dehy-drogenase enzyme. This enzyme is involved in cancer promotion, lipid formation, and production of toxic oxygen free radicals.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 31

DHEA … lowers cancer enzyme Glucose-6-Phosphate Dehyrogenase (G6PD). British women having 10% less DHEA than that expected for their age group, developed and died from breast cancer, predicted by low urine DHEA tested 9 years prior; inhibits lung tumors from urethane and 1,2 dimethylbenz-anthracene, skin cancers (100 mg./ day), blocks colon tumors in mice from carcinogen 1,2-dimethylhydrazine, inhibits prostate cancer, and testicle tumors in rodents.
Anti-Aging Manual by Joseph B Marion, page 1100

… DHEA appears to have a very broad range of positive effects. It is widely believed that DHEA slows the biological symptoms of aging, and helps protect the body from cancer, …
Brain Longevity by Dharma Singh Khalsa M.D. with Cameron Stauth, page 402

DHEA is a hormone produced by the adrenal glands, but production declines steadily with age…. DHEA supplementation during the later years can hinder the onset of an assortment of serious disorders, including heart disease, cancer, arthritis, and asthma. …
Complete Encyclopedia Of Natural Healing by Gary Null PhD, page 29

DHEA….. we tend to produce less of this important hormone as we age. This decrease is connected to a number of degenerative conditions, including cancer. Taking DHEA has been shown to reverse many illnesses.
Complete Encyclopedia Of Natural Healing by Gary Null PhD, page 84

Countless rodent studies with DHEA have shown increased life span and positive influences on a variety of illnesses such as heart disease, diabetes, and cancer.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 28

The majority of the research done on mice and rats has shown that DHEA inhibits the development of experimental tumors of the liver, breast, lung, colon, skin lymphatic tissue, and others. …When pregnant rats received whole body irradiation during pregnancy and were then implanted with a diethylstilbesterol pellet (DES is cancer causing) for a period of 1 year, a high incidence (96%) of mammary (breast) tumors was observed. Another group of mice who received the same unpleasant treatment, but were supplemented with DHEA, showed only a 35% incidence of mammary tumors. Dr. Inano, a Japanese researcher, concludes, "These findings suggest that DHEA has a potent preventive activity against the promotion/ progression phase of radiation-induced mammary tumori-genesis."
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 78

We have found DHEA… to be useful in a variety of conditions such as … certain forms of cancer. We've given high doses of DHEA, up to 1,000 mg a day, to some terminal cancer cases, such as pancreatic cancer, and noticed that it was of benefit. Other anecdotal cases include shrinkage of lymphomas. …
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 79

Chronic inflammation is also involved in …, cancer, …. Excess levels of one or more of the inflammatory cytokines … are usually found when a cytokine blood profile is conducted. DHEA has been shown to lower these pro-inflammatory cytokines and protect against their toxic effects .
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 642

DHEA has a role in cancer therapy as an addition to chemotherapy. This steroid is one part of the overall treatment, not a cure-all by itself. I've observed that patients with cancer do better when, in addition to conventional chemotherapy, we also add DHEA and use nutritional therapies such as vitamins, antioxi-dants and melatonin.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 9

DHEA has been shown to inhibit chemically induced cancers in the colon, lung, breast, and skin. When applied directly to the skin, DHEA prevents chemically induced skin cancer. DHEA has this effect by blocking the binding of carcinogens to skin cells and by inhibiting the enzyme G6PDH.
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 646

…. DHEA … increased the number and activity of cancer-fighting NK (natural killer) cells, which keep a watchful eye on potential cancerous cells and destroy them before they can grow.
Earl Mindells Secret Remedies by Earl Mindell RPh PhD, page 172

One study showed that patients with adult T-cell leukemia (ATL) had significantly decreased levels of DHEA compared to healthy controls. This has led some doctors to speculate that DHEA might be beneficial in treating this form of leukemia because DHEA has already been shown effective in treating hairy cell leukemia. Other cancer studies show DHEA inhibits cancer cell thymidine incorporation needed for cellular propagation and disrupts the oxidizing effects of chemical carcinogens. Scientists point out that DHEA functions not as an antioxidant, but as a modulator of the effects of chemical carcinogens on cells.
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 646

DHEA acts against everyday damage as well. By maintaining skin immunity, DHEA preserves the ability of skin to react to cancer-causing, skin-destroying pollutants in air, food, and water.
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 647

.. This anticancer surveillance hormone may inhibit the metabolism of cancer cells. For various reasons, the cancer cell fails to become an immuno-logical alien to the host and will, therefore, be more easily rejected. DHEA may also play a …
Herbal Medicine Healing Cancer by Donald R Yance Jr, page 242

DHEA has consistently been shown to boost beneficial interleukin-2 and suppress damaging interleukin-6 (IL-6) levels. Interleukin-6 is overproduced in …, breast cancer, …
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 647

Free radical defense may have a lot to do with DHEA's ability to prevent skin cancer and papillomas (benign tumors). According to several studies in mice, topically applied DHEA keeps oxidant-loving enzymes at bay. Chemicals with carcinogenic potential depend on oxidases for transformation. DHEA's antioxidant action stops them … DHEA has another important defense: It keeps chemical carcinogens from binding to DNA …
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 1406

Hundreds of studies have documented the vital role that DHEA plays in the body, but it appears to be especially important for normal immune function. As we get older our immune system weakens, making us more vulnerable to infection, cancer, …. There is good evidence that DHEA supplementation can reverse many of the problems that arise in immune function as we age. … Dr. Khorram found that DHEA stimulated the production of immune cells that fight against viruses and bacteria, as well as important cells called natural killer cells, which help weed out cancerous cells before they can grow.
Earl Mindell's Supplement Bible by Earl Mindell RPh PhD, page 46

This has been tested with respect to one of the body's most significant and abundant hormones, dehydroepiandrosterone sulfate (DHEA-S). …. Women with high levels of DHEA-S are known to have less breast cancer and osteoporosis. …
Freedom From Disease by Hari Sharma MD, page 191

... A deficiency of DHEA can cause breast cancer and heart attacks. ...
Health In The 21st Century by Fransisco Contreras MD, page 239

Many ^ranenopausal women with breast cancer have abnormally low DHEA levels in their blood and, for that group, DHEA may offer protection against cancer. ..
Herbal Medicine Healing Cancer by Donald R Yance Jr, page 242

…. 7-Keto DHEA is a derivative of DHEA that is not converted into estrogen or testosterone, which is good for women concerned about breast cancer and for men concerned about prostate cancer. 7-Keto DHEA is a good alternative to DHEA and has the same benefits.
Prescription For Nutritional Healing by Phyllis A Balch CNC and James F Balch MD, page 67

Serum DHEA levels are usually lower in men with malignant prostate disease compared to healthy control subjects. ... On the contrary, there is evidence indicating that maintaining youthful levels of DHEA may protect against prostate cancer. …
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 300

… 7-keto DHEA is a stronger, natural descendant of DHEA… 7-keto DHEA … may be a safer alternative to DHEA in combating breast cancer.
Prescription For Nutritional Healing by Phyllis A Balch CNC and James F Balch MD, page 226

… examined the action of DHEA on spontaneous mas-tosarcomas in dogs and cats. In six of seven animals, there was a regression at 10 mg of DHEA per day. Later, a human clinical study of 129 advanced cancer patients on 40 mg of DHEA per day found that while there wasn't significant regression of the cancer, two patients with renal cancer stabilized their conditions and tolerated the DHEA therapy without side effects for two and a half years. And according to Regelson and Kalimi, DHEA may be our best agent for blocking stress-mediated support of tumor growth.
Stopping the Clock by Ronald Klatz and Robert Goldman, page 64

Administration of DHEA inhibited tumor formation in a strain of mice that develops spontaneous breast cancer. DHEA has also been shown to prevent chemically induced colon and liver cancer, as well as skin papil-lomas in mice.
Textbook of Natural Medicine Volumes 1-2 by Joseph E Pizzorno and Michael T Murray, page 697

DHEA and cancer: potential adverse effects

All men should have a blood PSA and rectal exam before starting DHEA. This needs to be repeated annually as there is a theoretical risk of activating prostate cancer if the DHEA causes testosterone levels to rise.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 237

Women may experience rising estrogen levels with DHEA therapy. Women with estrogen dependent breast cancer must get advice from their physician before starting this treatment.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 319

…In addition, since DHEA can convert to estrogen and/or testosterone, monitoring these hormones is also important. Long-term effects of DHEA supplementation are not known. DHEA replacement is not suggested for …people at risk for breast, uterine, or prostate cancer.
Alternative Medicine by Burton Goldberg, page 372

… DHEA…. Do not use if pregnant or nursing, have acne, or with hormone-related ovary, adrenal, or thyroid tumors, prostrate, breast orreproductivecancers.
Anti-Aging Manual by Joseph B Marion, page 10

DHEA therapy could have preventive effects in humans, as it does in animals, but I doubt that it can be helpful when the cancer is already full steam ahead.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 79

Studies suggest that DHEA supplementation may cause certain cancers. In addition, DHEA can accelerate bone marrow production and worsen some cancers.
Complementary Cancer Therapies by Dan Labriola ND, page 192

To insure protection against possible prostatic enlargement and or prostate cancer, rectal exam and PSA blood test should be done before initiating DHEA and annually thereafter.
A Physicians Guide To Natural Health Products That Work By James Howenstine MD, page 318

I'm cautious about using any hormones on a regular basis without good reason and without medical supervision. We don't know what the downside of taking supplemental DHEA may be over time. … DHEA probably increases risk of prostate cancer and may increase risk of coronary heart disease.
Ask Dr Weil by Andrew Weil MD, page 78

DHEA is an extremely safe hormone. … unless it is taken in gross excess over a long period of time. Up to 1,600 mg daily have been taken in short-term administration without side effects. … Also, because DHEA elevates male hormones, it is not an appropriate drug for men who have prostate cancer.
Brain Longevity by Dharma Singh Khalsa M.D. with Cameron Stauth, page 403

Before initiating DHEA therapy, men should know their serum PSA (prostate-specific antigen) level and have passed a digital rectal exam. Men with prostate cancer or severe benign prostate disease are advised to avoid DHEA because DHEA can be converted into testosterone (and estrogen). These sex hormones and their metabolites can promote benign and malignant prostate cell proliferation…
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 300

DHEA may have some benefit against cancer, but it also has significant risks that, in some views, outweigh the potential benefits. DHEA is not recommended for use, based on the risks
Complementary Cancer Therapies by Dan Labriola ND, page 192

The December, 1995, issue of the Journal of the American Medical Association published the results of a long-term study in women. Blood samples were collected in 1974 from 20,000 women. By 1989, a total of 31 cases of ovarian cancer were identified. Hormone levels of these cancer patients were matched to a group of women who did not have ovarian cancer, known as controls. Compared with the controls, the women who had ovarian cancer had higher androgen levels such as androstenedione and DHEA.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 77

Theoretical risks with long-term DHEA supplementation include an influence on hormone-sensitive cancers such as breast, uterus, ovaries and prostate. High doses of DHEA for prolonged periods could potentially stimulate breast cysts or uterine fibroids. I believe DHEA has a positive role in low dosages, but we need to be careful not to go overboard. We may also find that DHEA can protect against certain cancers. It's still too early to predict.
DHEA A Practical Guide by Ray Sahelian MD, page 97

Because DHEA invigorates hormonal systems, DHEA is not recommended for men with prostate cancer or for women with estrogen-dependent cancer without physician approval. …
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 443

…. If DHEA were to elevate estrogen too much, this could theoretically increase the risk of breast cancer.
Disease Prevention And Treatment by Life Extension Foundation, page 651

… Taking extra DHEA means being saddled with more estrogen and testosterone, which may increase the risk of developing hormone-based cancers (of the breast in women and the prostate in men). Maybe I'm too conservative, but that's one important reason why I do not recommend DHEA for any patient..
Dr Isadore Rosenfeld's Breakthrough Health By Isadore Rosenfeld MD, page 11

Several studies have failed to find any benefit from DHEA in breast cancer. …
PDR For Nutritional Supplements by Sheldon Saul Hendle and David Rorvik, page 130

…. DHEA, if improperly used, can … accelerate the growth of preexisting cancer. If you decide to use DHEA, I strongly advise you to use it only with your doctor's permission and under his or her strict medical supervision.
Permanent Remissions by Robert Haas MS, page 154

In other cases, though, DHEA has been reported to stimulate the growth of breast tumors, making its use in cancer uncertain. And in one mouse study, DHEA appeared to induce ovarian tumors. Clearly, more research needs to be done.
Stopping the Clock by Ronald Klatz and Robert Goldman, page 64









I have bin searching my ass of here bro but I am not seeing what you are putting down bro...help me out here.
 
boston789 said:
So does the original derma make your muscles soft, etc. etc.....? (Like stated earlier)

No, it will not make your muscles soft… on the contrary actually.

There isn’t enough progesterone conversion to totally crush DHT, just enough to keep it from getting out of hand. Helps prevent prostate and hairloss issues.

-Pp
 
Carth said:
No offense...but that is ONE HUGE MOTHERFUCKING BIG ASS TYPO!!! Can that shit even be classified as a typo?! OMFG!!!

http://www.dermacrine.com/ingredients.cfm

Yeah, I was going to try this out. But now with this so-called "typo" (my ass!). I changed my mind.
you know I found if you do a search of post and threads mad by carth he was using a lot of aifm....hmmmmmmm yet did not care about the dhea in that...so whats this thread really about bro..... :)
 
Stryker1992 said:
Bro, I started mine last week, of the sustain! I will keep you informed. You still happy?????

So far, so good... still.... there may be a day here or there that I don't feel as good as other days, in which energy and strength are down... or I just want to crawl into bed... but that could happen regardless of being on Derma....

What I'm curious about is how my trial with Derma turns out in comparison to say yours, since I did 2 weeks of the original version first, then hopped onto Sustain. If this PCT works out well, the next time around I will have to figure out if I want to do it the same way again or just use Sustain.

Pp - any thoughts?
 
njmuscleguy said:
So far, so good... still.... there may be a day here or there that I don't feel as good as other days, in which energy and strength are down... or I just want to crawl into bed... but that could happen regardless of being on Derma....

What I'm curious about is how my trial with Derma turns out in comparison to say yours, since I did 2 weeks of the original version first, then hopped onto Sustain. If this PCT works out well, the next time around I will have to figure out if I want to do it the same way again or just use Sustain.

Pp - any thoughts?

I have been wondering the same thing bro! I am almost feeling remiss about not using the original but pp has told me everything should be cool.
 
njmuscleguy said:
So far, so good... still.... there may be a day here or there that I don't feel as good as other days, in which energy and strength are down... or I just want to crawl into bed... but that could happen regardless of being on Derma....

What I'm curious about is how my trial with Derma turns out in comparison to say yours, since I did 2 weeks of the original version first, then hopped onto Sustain. If this PCT works out well, the next time around I will have to figure out if I want to do it the same way again or just use Sustain.

Pp - any thoughts?

Will still feel like sustain is the best for getting natural test levels up – as in, purely stimulating the testes to produce testosterone rather than relying on the DHEA. Starting off with original Derma may help… but its most important that you run the sustain either way.

-Pp
 
So if Sustain is the way to go for PCT, then when is the original version useful / applicable / necessary?
 
njmuscleguy said:
So if Sustain is the way to go for PCT, then when is the original version useful / applicable / necessary?

Original Derma would be for those that want a quicker and stronger boost in androgen levels. Its also something that could be cycled with the sustain for an extra boost. (like in 2 or 3 week intervals)

Weve had some users (like spywizard) mention a certain “kick” with the original formula that they havnet noticed with the Sustain, so it appears that the original with be better for strength, recovery, and mental drive… but as Ive said before, perhaps these results will maninfest in a sustain user after several weeks of use, once testosterone levels kick in.

-Pp
 
could this be done as a SUPP LIKE STEROID program for people who have not gone to dark side as well

4 weeks derma
4 sustain

or was it made for pct situations only?
 
needtogetaas said:
you know I found if you do a search of post and threads mad by carth he was using a lot of aifm....hmmmmmmm yet did not care about the dhea in that...so whats this thread really about bro..... :)

Good catch.
 
GLEN said:
could this be done as a SUPP LIKE STEROID program for people who have not gone to dark side as well

4 weeks derma
4 sustain

or was it made for pct situations only?

No, weve got plenty guys running these products as stand alone supps.

I think some guys are doing cycles with the Derma and stacking it with an oral like dbol or anavar… and then running Sustain for PCT… which is a great way to use the products too.

But, yeah, original Derma could be like a very light testosterone cycle.

-Pp
 
Dermacrine should be good as a stand-alone supplement. :)
 
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what do you think anthony- about derma ?_
I want more feedback this sounds like a product people like-

I have been Pm'ed by a few who like it-
 
can u gain muscle on the sustain or would this be more for RECOVERY and that is it and sex drive- ?"
 
Primordial Performance said:
No, weve got plenty guys running these products as stand alone supps.

I think some guys are doing cycles with the Derma and stacking it with an oral like dbol or anavar… and then running Sustain for PCT… which is a great way to use the products too.

But, yeah, original Derma could be like a very light testosterone cycle.

-Pp
ya I had 3 guys pm me about this in the last week or to and I let them know thats perfect....guy asked me if he could run say dbol for 4-6 weeks then run derma reg for 4 weeks give his lever a brake well still keeping levels and test up and not lose gains.then use anavar 4-6 weeks then use derma sustain for pct...they loved the idea and there going to be doing this cycle so I cant wate to here from them about it.
 
GLEN said:
so the org derma can suppress you?

hey ross why are these good products and how would you run them?
no it will not suppress you unless taken for a long time but even then most studies have shown

Do DHEA supplements suppress the adrenal gland's natural DHEA production?
The production of many hormones is controlled by a "feedback loop," which means that when hormone levels get too high, the body is told to make less, and when hormone levels are too low, the body is told to make more. Cortisol, testosterone, and estrogen are all regulated by this feedback. In other words, if a person takes cortisol, or a similar derivative such as prednisone, it will shut off the body's natural production. DHEA appears to be one of the exceptions. There doesn't seem to be a feedback mechanism for DHEA. In other words, DHEA supplements are not likely to stop the body's own production.hmmmm just throwing things out as i find them....
 
GLEN said:
can u gain muscle on the sustain or would this be more for RECOVERY and that is it and sex drive- ?"

Yes you can gain muscle with Derma Sustain, since it will increase testosterone.

Original Derma can inhibit natural test production eventually because it converts to other androgens, but its not going to "shut you down" like a high dose of test.

-Pp
 
i just got the org version of dermacream and im gonna run it 4 weeks and then the sustain/ I will report a log of what results and what I think.

AFTER THAT is done i will try unleashed myogenx stack-
 
Going off the subject for one second here. About that AIFM poopoo. I still got that piece of shit product here. Want me to take a pic of this bottle of shit and post it up? If I had used it all..that shit would've been in the trash MONTHS ago!

And I'm NOT complaining about the DHEA in it. "learn to read fuckers" . What I'm bringing out is that this product claimed to NOT have DHEA. "learn to read fuckers before you throw your money into a product"

Yet, on the same fucking site I clicked the "ingredients" link. And whats the first thing I see? THIS PRODUCT HAS DHEA!!!

So once again, learn to read posts correctly. And research any product you buy before throwing your money out!

KNOWLEDGE IS POWER! BTW...many thanks to all that gave me karma for this. Very nice of you. :-)
 
SO let me get it clear-

the BEST one for natural test increase is the sustain and over time works better...primordal-ross-carth-needtogrow
 
Carth said:
Going off the subject for one second here. About that AIFM poopoo. I still got that piece of shit product here. Want me to take a pic of this bottle of shit and post it up? If I had used it all..that shit would've been in the trash MONTHS ago!

And I'm NOT complaining about the DHEA in it. "learn to read fuckers" . What I'm bringing out is that this product claimed to NOT have DHEA. "learn to read fuckers before you throw your money into a product"

Yet, on the same fucking site I clicked the "ingredients" link. And whats the first thing I see? THIS PRODUCT HAS DHEA!!!

So once again, learn to read posts correctly. And research any product you buy before throwing your money out!

KNOWLEDGE IS POWER! BTW...many thanks to all that gave me karma for this. Very nice of you. :-)
for some reason I am not seeing it when I go to the site click on derma sustain then click on ingredients I come up with this
http://www.primordialperformance.com/derm_sust_ingredients.cfm


but what ever to each his own...have a nice day.
 
GLEN said:
i just got the org version of dermacream and im gonna run it 4 weeks and then the sustain/ I will report a log of what results and what I think.

AFTER THAT is done i will try unleashed myogenx stack-
thats awesome bro...but I am not needtogrow.lol I am needtogetaas :evil:
 
Dermacrine has DHEA
Dermacrine Sustain does not have DHEA
There isn't now, but was there a typo under Sustain ingredients on the site saying it had DHEA?

And who is GLEN, lol.
 
Carth said:
Dermacrine Sustain utilizes a higher dose of the proprietary Phyto Aromatase Inhibitor (Phyto AI) complex and does not include the hormone precursors DHEA and pregnenolone.

this is what it says on the site.

Yet the ingredients clearly says it had DHEA. Wow!

Stuff converts to progesterone. I know a lot of about this damn hormone! It inhibiting the converision of test to DHT?! How can this be a good thing? No DHT means softer muscles, less strenght and No libido!


I don't know about that.. but

as i stated..

I got 95 lb db for 20 reps for the 1st time ever
wood every morning
muscles seem hard.. not like on var or mast but still


so not sure what to make of that..
 
DBBT said:
Dermacrine has DHEA
Dermacrine Sustain does not have DHEA
There isn't now, but was there a typo under Sustain ingredients on the site saying it had DHEA?

And who is GLEN, lol.

Yep, there was a bad mix of Derma and Derma Sustain info on the site... apparently our web guy had his head up his ***

There is no DHEA in Dermacrine Sustain

-Pp
 
Primordial Performance said:
No, weve got plenty guys running these products as stand alone supps.

I think some guys are doing cycles with the Derma and stacking it with an oral like dbol or anavar… and then running Sustain for PCT… which is a great way to use the products too.

But, yeah, original Derma could be like a very light testosterone cycle.

-Pp

This is exactly what Ima do to test out derma.
 
lol...Im Glen ...I read the site and I did not see that when I did my order.

Which one makes you more hard do you guys think?-
 
needtogetaas said:
ya I had 3 guys pm me about this in the last week or to and I let them know thats perfect....guy asked me if he could run say dbol for 4-6 weeks then run derma reg for 4 weeks give his lever a brake well still keeping levels and test up and not lose gains.then use anavar 4-6 weeks then use derma sustain for pct...they loved the idea and there going to be doing this cycle so I cant wate to here from them about it.


that is great, and it's exactly the way it should be run with out an anti e or serm during anytime..

can't wait to see the results they should be very good..
 
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whats best place to rub in....i was gonna rub it in my ass cheeks...lol i thought it was muscle and fat and a im a hairless bro so that would be a good place...NOT MY NUTS like everyone says lol=-
 
GLEN said:
both...did u say the sustain makes you hard and leaner ...and better sex drive BIG TIME-

I noticed better sexual results from the sustain and Im sure I would have noticed results in the gym if I actually had time to go these days…

-Pp
 
needtogetaas said:
for some reason I am not seeing it when I go to the site click on derma sustain then click on ingredients I come up with this
http://www.primordialperformance.com/derm_sust_ingredients.cfm


but what ever to each his own...have a nice day.







Dermacrine Sustain is a topically applied product that can reduce estrogen and increase testosterone. Dermacrine Sustain is designed as a hormonal optimizer for long-term use. By safely and effectively reducing and blocking estrogens, Dermacrine Sustain can help increase the primary male androgen – Testosterone. This may help increase energy, lean muscle, libido, and sexual performance.

As a benefit to men using other “testosterone” products, Dermacrine Sustain serves as our most powerful product for encouraging the bodies own production of testosterone and rejuvenation of hormone production.




Dermacrine Sustain is positively correlated to improve body composition, increase virility, and improve erectile function by antagonizing estrogens and stimulating the body's natural production of testosterone.

Dermacrine combines the proprietary anti-estrogen Phyto-AI complex of 7,8 benzoflavone, chyrsin and resveratrol with DHEA and pregnenolone to support testosterone production while combating estrogen.

Skin is the optimum site for delivery of the polyphenols and flavonoids contained in Dermacrine Sustain

The hormone profile has tremendous influence over body composition, mental performance, the immune system, cholesterol levels, prostate health and sexual performance. Genetics, lifestyle, and age can all influence your steroid enzymes and hormone profile for better or worse.

For maximum testosterone boost, apply product to shoulders and upper back, as these areas of the skin contain the highest concentration of enzymes required to convert DHEA to testosterone and other beneficial androgens. Use Dermacrine everyday for 2-4 weeks.



It comes up when you hit the "printer friendly" version.
It is pretty obvious it was just a typo. Maybe someone got a little lazy and tried to cut and paste too much. :)
 
Stryker1992 said:
I have been wondering the same thing bro! I am almost feeling remiss about not using the original but pp has told me everything should be cool.


Well, I have to say... my libido is still "healthy" right now, 2 weeks into Sustain.... while I was the original Derma, it seemed like a different kind of "boost"... so both have their merits, both seem to be doing their job. I just hope that everything doesn't go back into the toilet once I'm off in a couple weeks!
 
needtogetaas said:
for some reason I am not seeing it when I go to the site click on derma sustain then click on ingredients I come up with this
http://www.primordialperformance.com/derm_sust_ingredients.cfm


but what ever to each his own...have a nice day.


-edit- Didn't you read any of these post? Didn't read how this owner/pusher of this stuff said he made a major "so-called" typo? And said he was going to fix it. This is what I got and he admitted it was a mistake and said...he was going to fix it. Dude, read this whole entire thread please before opening your mouth by TRYING to put me on the spot.

http://www.dermacrine.com/ingredients.cfm


And once again!!! The fucking karma keeps coming. Which goes to show that I'm NOT fucking crazy/stupid. Its obvious that the real "ELITE" bros know what I'm saying.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
One more thing to add. It is the beginning of the new day. Its early morning and people are just starting off with their work day. If that link is NOT working. Or is corrected. Its because the owner of this product fixed it first thing in the morning as soon as he got to work.
 
KrackerJam said:
Dermacrine Sustain is a topically applied product that can reduce estrogen and increase testosterone. Dermacrine Sustain is designed as a hormonal optimizer for long-term use. By safely and effectively reducing and blocking estrogens, Dermacrine Sustain can help increase the primary male androgen – Testosterone. This may help increase energy, lean muscle, libido, and sexual performance.

As a benefit to men using other “testosterone” products, Dermacrine Sustain serves as our most powerful product for encouraging the bodies own production of testosterone and rejuvenation of hormone production.




Dermacrine Sustain is positively correlated to improve body composition, increase virility, and improve erectile function by antagonizing estrogens and stimulating the body's natural production of testosterone.

Dermacrine combines the proprietary anti-estrogen Phyto-AI complex of 7,8 benzoflavone, chyrsin and resveratrol with DHEA and pregnenolone to support testosterone production while combating estrogen.

Skin is the optimum site for delivery of the polyphenols and flavonoids contained in Dermacrine Sustain

The hormone profile has tremendous influence over body composition, mental performance, the immune system, cholesterol levels, prostate health and sexual performance. Genetics, lifestyle, and age can all influence your steroid enzymes and hormone profile for better or worse.

For maximum testosterone boost, apply product to shoulders and upper back, as these areas of the skin contain the highest concentration of enzymes required to convert DHEA to testosterone and other beneficial androgens. Use Dermacrine everyday for 2-4 weeks.



It comes up when you hit the "printer friendly" version.
It is pretty obvious it was just a typo. Maybe someone got a little lazy and tried to cut and paste too much. :)


"note" that that one sentence says dermacrin and "not dermacrin sustain ie typo
but really who cares they mad a mistake no one is saying they did not make a mistake but who gives a shit.
 
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Ummm, I might have gotten the original derma instead of sustain..........because my balls are kind of disappering, like on cycle. My libido is certainly fine, so there's always the option that I'm just letting go of "charge" before it really has time to build up.... :biggrin: guilty!

Also, been putting it on my balls......obviously started out with just a spray or two to see if there would be a problem, now I'm putting about half the sprays on my sack. Really gratifying heat-tingle followed by some rising wood..........I like it. Now as for gym gains, it's going to be hard to tell.....I'm currently also using HGH because of some joint issues. But I definitely notice some more aggression the last couple days, coupled with the need to copulate........... :evil:
 
needtogetaas said:
"note" that that one sentence says dermacrin and "not dermacrin sustain ie typo
but really who cares they mad a mistake no one is saying they did not make a mistake but who gives a shit.
wasn't trying to knock it. you said you could not see the error, I pointed to where it was, even adding it was obviously a typo.
 
redsamurai said:
Ummm, I might have gotten the original derma instead of sustain..........because my balls are kind of disappering, like on cycle. My libido is certainly fine, so there's always the option that I'm just letting go of "charge" before it really has time to build up.... :biggrin: guilty!

Also, been putting it on my balls......obviously started out with just a spray or two to see if there would be a problem, now I'm putting about half the sprays on my sack. Really gratifying heat-tingle followed by some rising wood..........I like it. Now as for gym gains, it's going to be hard to tell.....I'm currently also using HGH because of some joint issues. But I definitely notice some more aggression the last couple days, coupled with the need to copulate........... :evil:

Redsamurai,

Rubbing the derma on the balls will make the scrotal skin “cinch up” and contract after several hours because of the vasodilators causing a rebound in skin temp. If you stopped rubbing so much Derma on them, they might actually be able to regulate their temperature, and drop to a normal level. – give it a try.

Trust me, if it says “sustain” on the bottle, that is what you got, and your balls are not actually shrinking.

-Pp
 
I dont have the balls to rub it on my balls!!

Does the regular Dermacine have the same stong alcohol smell as the sustain?
5 pumps on the chest gets me a little choked up!!
 
KrackerJam said:
I dont have the balls to rub it on my balls!!

Does the regular Dermacine have the same stong alcohol smell as the sustain?
5 pumps on the chest gets me a little choked up!!

Yeah, its the nature of the topical.

I suppose you've never done a "back draft" then?

-Pp
 
well, I actually think I was getting pretty good results from the ballsack rub ins.......how about the tops of the feet? Seems there's alot more vascular area's of the body than the chest imo?
 
redsamurai said:
well, I actually think I was getting pretty good results from the ballsack rub ins.......how about the tops of the feet? Seems there's alot more vascular area's of the body than the chest imo?

The ballsack if fine, but like you noticed, it might make it seem like your balls are smaller than they are.

-Pp

Yes, tops of feet would probably be good.
 
Why can’t some of these supplement discussions just be moved over to the Supplement forum, that’s why we have a separate board for you guys that think this is so important,

Go over there and discuss these critical issues, I like to hear about gear, and what is and what is not working.
 
solidspine said:
Why can’t some of these supplement discussions just be moved over to the Supplement forum, that’s why we have a separate board for you guys that think this is so important,

Go over there and discuss these critical issues, I like to hear about gear, and what is and what is not working.

Its sort of related, being that its a supplement for PCT and all...

-Pp
 
Maybe start a pct section, the pimping and whoring on this site is worse than listening to a Nascar driver.
 
solidspine said:
Why can’t some of these supplement discussions just be moved over to the Supplement forum, that’s why we have a separate board for you guys that think this is so important,

Go over there and discuss these critical issues, I like to hear about gear, and what is and what is not working.
bro you are one of the biggest bashers of all time right now....is it because it gets a few people riding your nuts is that why you do it.....

its all about aas,its effects,and what we can use to help.this product and many can and do help people.the supplement discussions board is more for supplement
that have less to do with aas use then these products do......


now I have searched a hole ot of aifm threads and now were in them do I see you telling them to stop talking about it here in aas and take it to supplement board.....why is that...why now are you saying this but not them...please explain....I am thinking maybe because it had a lot to do with aas use and so dos this product and many others...bro stop trying to start fights and get back to helping people.your a ring leader to a lot of the bull shit bashing around here and I hope you make the right choce to just stop the crap...lets get back to helping and quit with the drama.
 
corporate ceo said:
One way to find out...

I will order the product at a random time in the near future and have it tested, twice.

CEO

did you end up having the Dermacrine tested?
 
Another old thread when pp first came around. I just love these old threads. Look how much I had to go threw. Derma fucking rocks and all pp products rock. I knew it then and I know it now. Pm me for info or discounts guys. People should b thanking me for fighting so hard for such a good sponsor!!!!!!!!!!!
 
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