Bfs Vs 5x5

[SDHW]

I was just wondering what the difference with these programs is. They both focus on the basic lifts. I know the BFS changes reps ranges each week, and the 5x5 does not. Is there any benefit to changing the reps ranges each week?

 

[Protobuilder]

both are good progressive programs. there are a million ways to structure your training. IIRC, BFS has more of a "periodized" or cyclical pattern: volume decreases as intensity increases over a period of weeks. Whether or not you need this and whether it's more beneficial than not periodizing in this fashion is up for debate.

BFS rotates rep ranges more than the typical 5x5 (although you have high rep backoff sets typically in a 5x5 so . . . ). Again, whether you need this variation or whether it's "better" is hard to say, and it may vary from person to person.

 

[Protobuilder]

I guess I could be more specific about changing the rep ranges. Traditional periodization (IIRC, LoL) involves basically starting w/ lighter weights and more volume (basically, more hypertrophy focused) . . . then you transition into more of a strength phase where you're lifting heavier weights and doing fewer reps . . . and then you "convert" that new strength and size into power and build up to a new max single. So by the end, you're doing very little volume but using gut-busting weights whereas at the beginning you were doing lots of volume w/ moderate weight.

One problem w/ this approach is, there seems to be little "carry over" from one rep range to the next (e.g., improving your best set of 15 won't really improve your best set of 3). So while the goal is to hit a big single, why are you messing around w/ 10s? Another problem is that as you move from one rep range to the next, you're basically dropping the old rep range. So even if you get some adaptations, you may lose them b/c you'll go for several weeks w/out ever hitting them again. For example, let's say you work sets of 10 in weeks 1 & 2, well by weeks 7 & 8, you're no longer doing 10s and there's a good possibility those adaptations disappear between weeks 2 and 8.

So those are some problems w/ rotating rep ranges in a weekly block fashion. The 5x5 as set out on madcow's site has you rotating DURING the week a little bit, in that you're hitting a heavy triple on one day and a heavy 5 on another (or multiple sets of 5). Plus, yo'ure doing some backoff sets so you're keeping some adaptations from the higher rep range each week. IMO, it's the best of all worlds really. But, I'd have to look at the BFS exactly to see how they rotate the reps and how they structure it both within each week and across several weeks. It's a good program, from what I've heard. Again: logical progressive training w/ non-stupid lifts.

 

[SDHW]

I guess I could be more specific about changing the rep ranges. Traditional periodization (IIRC, LoL) involves basically starting w/ lighter weights and more volume (basically, more hypertrophy focused) . . . then you transition into more of a strength phase where you're lifting heavier weights and doing fewer reps . . . and then you "convert" that new strength and size into power and build up to a new max single. So by the end, you're doing very little volume but using gut-busting weights whereas at the beginning you were doing lots of volume w/ moderate weight.

One problem w/ this approach is, there seems to be little "carry over" from one rep range to the next (e.g., improving your best set of 15 won't really improve your best set of 3). So while the goal is to hit a big single, why are you messing around w/ 10s? Another problem is that as you move from one rep range to the next, you're basically dropping the old rep range. So even if you get some adaptations, you may lose them b/c you'll go for several weeks w/out ever hitting them again. For example, let's say you work sets of 10 in weeks 1 & 2, well by weeks 7 & 8, you're no longer doing 10s and there's a good possibility those adaptations disappear between weeks 2 and 8.

So those are some problems w/ rotating rep ranges in a weekly block fashion. The 5x5 as set out on madcow's site has you rotating DURING the week a little bit, in that you're hitting a heavy triple on one day and a heavy 5 on another (or multiple sets of 5). Plus, yo'ure doing some backoff sets so you're keeping some adaptations from the higher rep range each week. IMO, it's the best of all worlds really. But, I'd have to look at the BFS exactly to see how they rotate the reps and how they structure it both within each week and across several weeks. It's a good program, from what I've heard. Again: logical progressive training w/ non-stupid lifts.

I have read a little bit on BFS, and some other programs, and i always wondered why, people move from one rep range to another, BFS seems to do it weekly. I have seen others that go for example 3wk of 10-12reps, 3wks 6-8reps, 3wks 3-5 reps. I just wonder if there is any real benefit to this or not? I guess you would have to do this to some extent, but to what extent is questionable.

 

[BiggT]

BFS is a sound program from what I remember of it, although I have to admit I would need to look at it again to refresh myself.

As a whole, I think Western Periodization sucks for the drawback that Proto listed. DOing sets of 10 will not help you lift heavy triples or singles......doing 3 weeks of 'conditioning' work in weeks 1 -3 and 3 weeks of 'hypertrophy' work in weeks 4-6 are really not going to carry over as the conditioning and hypertrophy will fade as you move into weeks of strength and then peaking phases.

Personally, I think Western Periodization has too many drawbacks in practice.....although it is much better than the simply idiotic methods that people refer to as "bodybuilding" training.

I'd rather a 5x5 base with backoff sets in the appropriate rep ranges for conditioning and then you can peak in as little as a few weeks as the 5's are close enough to strength training that you'll get carryover to heavier weights......getting conditioned in weeks 1-3 will not keep you conditioned in week 13......basically, the 'conditioning' and 'hypertrophy' phases are a waste of time as both conditioning and hypertrophy can be gained WITH strength.

 

[SDHW]

BFS is a sound program from what I remember of it, although I have to admit I would need to look at it again to refresh myself.

As a whole, I think Western Periodization sucks for the drawback that Proto listed. DOing sets of 10 will not help you lift heavy triples or singles......doing 3 weeks of 'conditioning' work in weeks 1 -3 and 3 weeks of 'hypertrophy' work in weeks 4-6 are really not going to carry over as the conditioning and hypertrophy will fade as you move into weeks of strength and then peaking phases.

Personally, I think Western Periodization has too many drawbacks in practice.....although it is much better than the simply idiotic methods that people refer to as "bodybuilding" training.

I'd rather a 5x5 base with backoff sets in the appropriate rep ranges for conditioning and then you can peak in as little as a few weeks as the 5's are close enough to strength training that you'll get carryover to heavier weights......getting conditioned in weeks 1-3 will not keep you conditioned in week 13......basically, the 'conditioning' and 'hypertrophy' phases are a waste of time as both conditioning and hypertrophy can be gained WITH strength.

Thanks for the input, its defiantly food for thought. Here is a good link on it that I found.
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/s...threadid=287915