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5x5 routine

M

mphowells

New member
In keeping with (what seems to be) tradition, I thought another 5x5 post was called for.

I've been training for some time now and have always stuck with the standard 3x10-12 4 days split and I feel a change is loooong overdue. If you could give some advise on the following it would be appreciated.

The Routine:
4 day split -
DAY 1 (Monday) - Chest & Abs
Day 2 (Wednesday) - Back & Shoulders
Day 3 (Friday) - Bis & Tris
Day 4 (Saturday) - Legs

DAY 1 (Monday) - Chest & Abs
5x5 Flat bench
2x8-10 Incline bench
2x8-10 Pec dec
5x5 Weighted sit ups
2x8-10 Hanging leg raises
2x8-10 Crunch machine

Day 2 (Wednesday) - Back & Shoulders
5x5 cable row
2x8-10 dumbbell pullover
2x8-10 shrugs
5x5 machine press
2x8-10 dumbbell lateral raises
2x8-10 machine behind neck

Day 3 (Friday) - Bis & Tris
5x5 preacher curl (with straight bar)
2x8-10 palms up pull down
2x8-10 concentration curls
5x5 close grip press
2x8-10 machine tricep extensions
2x8-10 French press

Day 4 (Saturday) - Legs
5x5 squats
2x8-10 leg curls
2x8-10 toe presses

Explanations:
I've tried to keep things as simple as possible and not over think things.
The main thing to point out is the absence of deadlifts. I have been doing them for 5 months now and feel it's time for a break. Never tried palms up pull down but have been advised they can really work the bicep.

The idea will be to start small and constantly add weight. By week 4-5 I should be matching what i can currently lift.

What do you think?
 
That is nothing like the bill starr 5x5 that is imfamous on these boards.No offence man but it look like you took a half-assed bodybuilder split and merely changed some of the rep ranges to 5,not to mention the shotgun array of isolation exercises that will not do much to drive long term success.

I suggest you take a look at the 5x5 thread in this forum and base you routine on that.The routine is effective not because of the rep range,but due to the fact that there is a singular focus on increasing a few key lifts(squat/deadlift/bench/rows/military press) over a long period of time.

Sorry if I came across as offensive,if you have any questions feel free to ask :) .
 
I looked at the threads on the 5x5. Some of them did seem to be quite different but guess I got it wrong.

I thought the idea was to have a companound 5x5 for each body part and 2 isolation 2x8-10 for each body part, is not the case?

I thought i covered all of the key lifts you mentioned...bar the deadlift.
 
The link is dead.

As asdfzxcv points out, your split bears no resemblance to any of the 5x5 programs on here. One of the main tenets of the 5x5 is that you work compound exercises multiple times per week. Turning it into a conventional split of 1x per week completely breaks it.
 
Been looking at the links in this forum and the ones from anotherbutters and I don't know what the f*ck I was looking at before but it sure wasn't 5x5. Also the new set up giving the information out is brilliant

I took the day off work and have been reading madcow threads for about 5 hours (I'm determined to hit the gym like never before!).

anotherbutters, I'm a little unsure whether I would fall under intermediate or advanced. I have read through the advanced program and like the look of it and I have been lifting for quite a bit. Have been juggling rep ranges for a year or so now after hitting various platues and have lately hit a bit of a dead end. Think it's time for the DF 5x5.

2 questions...

1 - Can Militry be seated?
2 - Can I throw a preacher curl (with straight bar) in to the mix? (I've read that it's ok but want to be sure)

Cheers guys, you've been a big help
 
Maybe you were thinking of Needsize's 5x5 template? To be honest though, that exercise selection is pretty bad and I think he'd have more than a few corrections to make if that was what you were aiming for.
 
Madcow2 said:
Maybe you were thinking of Needsize's 5x5 template? To be honest though, that exercise selection is pretty bad and I think he'd have more than a few corrections to make if that was what you were aiming for.
Click to expand...

Cool, so I was wrong on both routines anyway. Shame really as I did try and put some thought into it. :worried:

Nevermind, I'm here to learn....and grow.
 
There are ways of playing with the SF to get the gains going after you stall, but it sounds like you've been doing that already. Go for the DF. I was just going off the limited info you provided.

Any particular reason why you want to do the military sat down? Stood up will help strengthen your core.

Curls and other beach work are generally left until Friday after you've finished everything else. Just don't go mad with them.
 
anotherbutters said:
There are ways of playing with the SF to get the gains going after you stall, but it sounds like you've been doing that already. Go for the DF. I was just going off the limited info you provided.

Any particular reason why you want to do the military sat down? Stood up will help strengthen your core.

Curls and other beach work are generally left until Friday after you've finished everything else. Just don't go mad with them.
Click to expand...

Yes thanks I really managed to get the wrong end of the stick when I was researching last week.

Just personal preferance with the military, I really don't like doing them stood up but then again I'm just being a pussy so stood up it is.

Ok cool I'll add some curls on the friday.

Thanks again.
 
I had quite an impressive arch to my back when I first started doing them stood up, but it's much less pronounced now, so I think it's worth it.
 
Think of all the body parts involved to form a connection from the weight to the place you are resting. Every part the line passes through is being worked. If you are seated, you are using, and thus working, less of the body. I think the line is called the "Kinetic Chain".
 
Cheers guys, went to the gym last night to work out some 5 rep maxes and did the standing military press....it's been a while but felt really good.

Anotherbutters, I know what you mean about the back arch :)

To be honest after considering the amount of strain all these compounds will put on my body I'm not sure I'll need to throw in the bicep curls on the Friday but we'll see. I take it abs can be the Friday after finishing everything too?

Finally, how strict are the days (Monday Wednesday Friday)? Are the two days off (sat and sun) there for a reason or can it be just one day off on the 1st week of volume phase?

Thanks for the help.
 
when running a 5x5 program you will realize that working at high percentages of your maxes is hard work. mwf is really enough. if you wish to do more i suggest: abs, bw hypers and light cardio on "off" days.

as far as arm work run your first program as is. then tinker with it the second time. you can always "shape" the muscle after the mass is there. your arms will grow more from the compounds than isolation ever will.
 
mphowells said:
Cheers guys, went to the gym last night to work out some 5 rep maxes and did the standing military press....it's been a while but felt really good.

Anotherbutters, I know what you mean about the back arch :)

To be honest after considering the amount of strain all these compounds will put on my body I'm not sure I'll need to throw in the bicep curls on the Friday but we'll see. I take it abs can be the Friday after finishing everything too?

Finally, how strict are the days (Monday Wednesday Friday)? Are the two days off (sat and sun) there for a reason or can it be just one day off on the 1st week of volume phase?

Thanks for the help.
Click to expand...
The weekend gives you a mini-deload. One very important aspect of trying to grow or get stronger is ensuring that you get adequate recovery time. Lose the BB mindset of striving to work out seven days a week, it won't help you with this program. The essence of the 5x5 is that you progressively work the compound exercises multiple times per week. That means adding weight to the bar compared with the previous week's session in a reasonably taxing work-range every session. The body adapts and you get stronger. In the dual-factor version you court over-training but you always keep control of your recovery time.

Do abs after every session if you wish. Just don't grind yourself down with them.
 
I just got off my first 5x5, so I don't have as much experience on that program as many here. However, I am a huge believer in "active recovery", so I went in on Tuesdays and Saturdays and did abdominal and hyperextension exercises, along with some bodyweight metabolic conditioning exercises. Even with the extra work, I gained 17 lbs over the 9 weeks.

Run it as is. You'll be glad you did. :)
 
Sorry guys I must not have been clear, i didn't mean add more to it I meant do tue, Thur Sat this week and then Mon wed fri next week and constantly mon wed fri from then on (basically just changing the days slightly this week as monday has been and gone)
 
Do OHPs standing. Seated puts a much greater strain on the lumbar spine. You're also going to be weaker seated, in the end. Standing makes it more of a compound.
 
Just a quick update guys, currently in my 5th week, which is pretty much welcome after a tough week 4. Broke all PR's and didn't fail on a single rep (although the bench was very close!)!

Although strength gain hasbeen good, muscle has not really been great. My diet isn't the best around so i intend to just eat shit loads over the next 5 weeks and as I tend to pay too much attention to it which results in not enough cals being consumed.
 
All any program can do is get you better at big lifts in a valid hypertrophy range. There is no magic, just different layouts to facilitate this process. You are covered here. After that it's diet and up to your body to add muscle (and this is a notoriously lumpy process in the short term with huge varriance). Rest assured if your lifts are going up and you are eating with your weight is rising on the scale consistently - you are on the right track and over longer periods it will all even out and give you nice results (i.e. if you sell your house everyday the prices are going to be all over the place, if you have a 3-6 month window where you wait for interested buyers and good offers it will be a lot more smooth). If your absolute bodyweight is not going up the you are not eating enough so pay attention to that. Don't be someone who makes good strength gains and wonders why he stayed pegged at 220 the whole time.
 
Cheers man, like you said I need to pay attention to the eating enough bit if my weight is not progressing.

so long as the weights I am lifting are progressing I'm contemplating using my finishing 5x5 PB's and jumping into another 5x5. May help address the house price issue :)
 
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