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Why does prop hurt so bad?
- Thread starter Nucman
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macrophage69alpha
New member
its a short chain fatty acid, which are irritants.
macrophage69alpha
New member
slyder190 said:Because the label read Quality Vet.
A
Animal
Guest
Well, people really shouldn't discuss things they have relatively little knowledge about.
It has nothing to do with 'irritants'. Too much solvent could be a problem initially but is not the real answer.
When a solvent like BA leaves the depot which it does quickly, it leaves behind the high melting point AS like Tp which crystallizes out then causing a painful depot.
If it has high BA which even pharm products have, it will hurt until they figure out the right formula which some of us have!
But the point of that is that they don't actually care if it hurts cause they sell it all the same.
It has nothing to do with 'irritants'. Too much solvent could be a problem initially but is not the real answer.
When a solvent like BA leaves the depot which it does quickly, it leaves behind the high melting point AS like Tp which crystallizes out then causing a painful depot.
If it has high BA which even pharm products have, it will hurt until they figure out the right formula which some of us have!
But the point of that is that they don't actually care if it hurts cause they sell it all the same.
macrophage69alpha
New member
animal,
once again less than wise comments.
http://www.new-asthma.uk.net/scfas.html
1: Contact Dermatitis. 1999 Jun;40(6):328. Related Articles, Links
Acute irritant contact dermatitis from propionic acid used in animal feed preservation
once again less than wise comments.
http://www.new-asthma.uk.net/scfas.html
1: Contact Dermatitis. 1999 Jun;40(6):328. Related Articles, Links
Acute irritant contact dermatitis from propionic acid used in animal feed preservation
macrophage69alpha
New member
not to say that Benzyl alcohol and Benzyl benzoate are not offenders, at the doses used by less savvy UG, even mexican labs, to achieve high mg/ml they can be necrotic.
A
Animal
Guest
Wow! You are scary and vastly misinformed!
There is no propionic acid in Tp nor is any thing in Tp ever converted to propionic acid by the body.
Tp, Te, P, E, and anything else which has a high melting point even like the ne prohormones or winstrol will hurt because they crystallize out in the depot.
Oh, maybe they are all making propionic acid, too! Go back to eating ag products full of propionic acid when you write. Again, you make a totally irrelevant statement with no science when you could have helped some people and looked up the contact dermatitis and coughing and breathing problems consistant with BA and BB in injectables, but you made your choice..........
There is no propionic acid in Tp nor is any thing in Tp ever converted to propionic acid by the body.
Tp, Te, P, E, and anything else which has a high melting point even like the ne prohormones or winstrol will hurt because they crystallize out in the depot.
Oh, maybe they are all making propionic acid, too! Go back to eating ag products full of propionic acid when you write. Again, you make a totally irrelevant statement with no science when you could have helped some people and looked up the contact dermatitis and coughing and breathing problems consistant with BA and BB in injectables, but you made your choice..........
macrophage69alpha said:
A
Animal
Guest
Oh, maybe propionic acid is made by 1T which is why it hurts so bad, too?
Fill us with your reference articles and don't choose to educate people as to the true anwer, but continue to go after me.
By the way, esters ARE NOT removed until AFTER the Tp leaves the depot so ithere is NO way there is any ppa at the site, ever.
And to further illustrate the tomfoolery, Np DOES NOT have this problem at all, or maybe it's just hidden.
And tren hurts cause it's releasing acetic acid!
HAHA!
Anyhow, maybe your blood is boiling and becoming acid from PPA when the ester is removed after it exits the depot?
Fill us with your reference articles and don't choose to educate people as to the true anwer, but continue to go after me.
By the way, esters ARE NOT removed until AFTER the Tp leaves the depot so ithere is NO way there is any ppa at the site, ever.
And to further illustrate the tomfoolery, Np DOES NOT have this problem at all, or maybe it's just hidden.
And tren hurts cause it's releasing acetic acid!
HAHA!
Anyhow, maybe your blood is boiling and becoming acid from PPA when the ester is removed after it exits the depot?
macrophage69alpha
New member
IDIOT BOY,
no one discounted the negative health impact of BB and BA. The question was why prop shots hurt and its because its a short chain fatty acid. This issue is aside from any BA and BB.
as a note, for reference, it was long ago that I that pointed out to you the issues with BA and BB. So try to remember who the teacher is.
no one discounted the negative health impact of BB and BA. The question was why prop shots hurt and its because its a short chain fatty acid. This issue is aside from any BA and BB.
as a note, for reference, it was long ago that I that pointed out to you the issues with BA and BB. So try to remember who the teacher is.
A
Animal
Guest
Again, thanks for the insult and name calling! I'm to play fair, but you mods just rip on the insults and names instead of discussion and education.
Feel free to show us the research backing up your claim and how Np hurts as bad as Tp because of the 'short chain fatty acid irritants.'
You also can't seem to fathom that not all Tp formulations hurt which makes your argument fall right on its face. If it were the propionate, ALL propionate esters and formulations would hurt and we all know they do NOT!
But thanks for the info.
Feel free to show us the research backing up your claim and how Np hurts as bad as Tp because of the 'short chain fatty acid irritants.'
You also can't seem to fathom that not all Tp formulations hurt which makes your argument fall right on its face. If it were the propionate, ALL propionate esters and formulations would hurt and we all know they do NOT!
But thanks for the info.
macrophage69alpha
New member
Animal said:
maybe you should re-read your posts, consider those comments as just being more direct. so you are able to understand.
A
Animal
Guest
Post them, please as you surely know how many times I start off a thread by calling somebody a name.
macrophage69alpha
New member
khemix said:now children...
Chris
Big Rick Rock
istrator
Animal said:
I'de say 82.3% of the time.... Unfortunatly I don't have any studies or data to back up my claim.
A
Animal
Guest
Hehe!
Amazing how quiet it gets when the real facts are demonstrated, ie:
'You also can't seem to fathom that not all Tp formulations hurt which makes your argument fall right on its face. If it were the propionate, ALL propionate esters and formulations would hurt and we all know they do NOT!'
Amazing how quiet it gets when the real facts are demonstrated, ie:
'You also can't seem to fathom that not all Tp formulations hurt which makes your argument fall right on its face. If it were the propionate, ALL propionate esters and formulations would hurt and we all know they do NOT!'
macrophage69alpha
New member
actually the oils used will affect irritation as well depending on their fatty acid profile.
though as noted before, never said that BA and BB were not responsible for many negative sides INCLUDING irritation.
However again, ONE of the reasons that propionate causes irritation is that it is a short chain fatty ester.
though as noted before, never said that BA and BB were not responsible for many negative sides INCLUDING irritation.
However again, ONE of the reasons that propionate causes irritation is that it is a short chain fatty ester.
Beachbum1546
New member
yeah you owned him good. he complety avoided a response to you.Animal said:
bicepts101
New member
i'll bump this.
i would like to see a conclusion
i would like to see a conclusion
A
Animal
Guest
I think it's quite conclusive!
To prove it wrong all you have to do is show that ALL Tp formulations hurt. The real world usage shows such not to be the case and since ALL Tp formulations DO NOT hurt, it's not the p.
Additionally, Np and Npp do not hurt most, either.
That's conclusive and no name calling was used!
To prove it wrong all you have to do is show that ALL Tp formulations hurt. The real world usage shows such not to be the case and since ALL Tp formulations DO NOT hurt, it's not the p.
Additionally, Np and Npp do not hurt most, either.
That's conclusive and no name calling was used!
macrophage69alpha
New member
Animal said:
its not conclusive except in your mind.
with respect to short chain fatty esters the oil that it is in, the site of injection and histamine response (which varies- and why the same bottle of prop injected may or may not cause pain even in the same individual) must be accounted for (hence at least part of the reason for variation with respect to this issue)
once again, never said that BA and BB were not issues. IMO they are the primary problem with most UG and high MG injectables made today.
this does not discount the fact that propionate is one of the causes of irritation
Big Rick Rock
istrator
What causes the hard Notts on my ass ? the Ester or the BA/BB ?
Talking about Fina now.
Talking about Fina now.
Big Rick Rock
istrator
Big Rick Rock said:
A
Animal
Guest
The answer has been given, but if somebody wants to play Bill Clinton in light of all the facts including that not one study or research article in the history of the world or invention of esters EVER touches on what he wrongly believes and will continue to state until he dies, I'm not discussing it.
BRR, I'm sure somebody would tell you it's acetic acid while on the other hand we know of formulations not using or using very little BA/BB where there is no pain and no knots. Must be magic in those cases, but anyhow, your question has to be qualified as to how much of those is in there vs the amount of time which goes by before it starts to hurt and then how long the pain lasts.
Right off hand I'd say it's cause a crystalline depot is forming.
BRR, I'm sure somebody would tell you it's acetic acid while on the other hand we know of formulations not using or using very little BA/BB where there is no pain and no knots. Must be magic in those cases, but anyhow, your question has to be qualified as to how much of those is in there vs the amount of time which goes by before it starts to hurt and then how long the pain lasts.
Right off hand I'd say it's cause a crystalline depot is forming.
Big Rick Rock
istrator
When making the stuff, I used less oil to get a higher concentration.... However I didn't compensate by using less Magic Solution... Pain is almost instant and the knott begins to form minutes later after injection and last up to 72 hours.... Knott gets progressively bad for about 12-14hr(after injecting) and then starts to get better after the 12-14hr mark, but is does take about 72hrs total for it to be gone, and it hurst all the way till is almost gone...
bicepts101
New member
Big Rick Rock said:
i here ya man
i keep getting know on my left glute with turkish sust. it sucks
macrophage69alpha
New member
this issue aside. having shown IMO that propionate is an irritant, though in agreement that BA and BB content are much bigger issues when it comes to all injectables.
irritation and swelling at the site are to be avoided because it affects ester metabolism and release of the actives.
irritation and swelling at the site are to be avoided because it affects ester metabolism and release of the actives.
A
Animal
Guest
When you reduce the oil you change the ratio of solvent to oil. I wouldn't and don't recommend higher mg/ml unless it's being mixed with another hormone oil.
Anyhow, the immediate onset of pain is due to the solvent ratio being higher than it was designed for. It will work, but that doesn't mean you should do it.
Immediate onset and gone after 3 days is indicative of solvent while pain after 2-3 days would be indicative of depot crystallization.
(but then again, somebody else would tell you its from the acetic acid as you know that's a short chain fatty acid which causes much irritation!)
Anyhow, the immediate onset of pain is due to the solvent ratio being higher than it was designed for. It will work, but that doesn't mean you should do it.
Immediate onset and gone after 3 days is indicative of solvent while pain after 2-3 days would be indicative of depot crystallization.
(but then again, somebody else would tell you its from the acetic acid as you know that's a short chain fatty acid which causes much irritation!)
A
Animal
Guest
I was just wondering where the people are who get bit by fire ants and say it didn't hurt!
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