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what is your opinion of the fence/wall/barrier that Isreal is building around itself?
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Allon
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Re: what is your opinion of the fence/wall/barrier that Isreal is building around its
Ok, I am going to do one of your Quote thingies.
I am really hoping that we will meet a middle ground at one point, me and you GD.
Who voted for them? The same fucking Idiots that I said earlier make up over half of this country, just like in practically any society, most people in my opinion are fucking stupid and ignorant. I have constantly been saying to your UTTER disregard, that I am just giving my 2 cents as to why all this is the way it is, NOT justifying anything. REALITY is that most countries are full of fucking idiots, THUS the fucked up state of humatiy.
The Palestinians IMHO should think about this and realize that Israelis are not gonna be nice to them under any circumstances, unless they get stronger than us or start talking terms that are acceptable to us. IT IS REALITY, NOT MY OPINION .
Israeli's that voted SHARON are the scm of the earth, just like americans that voted BUSH IMHO, and I am one ISRAELI that is not glad that BUSH invaded Iraq or Afghanastine. I am disgusted.
Israel on the other hand in my opinion is not the aggressor, but our way of dealing with the situation is very often aggresive. Sometimes this is the only way, sometimes it is inexcusable (I beleive you will ignore I said this negative thing about Israel and find something positive I said to tear up in your answer )
To say we are THE aggresor is just wrong, it is so much more complicated than that, Yuh, the settlers are fucking aggressive, and today I have no excuse for them, I wish I could burn em, but regarding the original settlers in the west bank, you should understand that after THE WHOLE ARAB WORLD attacked Israel and Israel won and overtook land, Israel felt that the land won was not only now rightfully ours, but also a great security to the rest of the land. Thus the settlers who settled there originally were mostly militant god beleiving radicals. Not every country has the cosy past of Australia. Tday a lot could be changed and done, but to say we are the aggressor or that the palestinians are the aggressor is childish. Politics and reality in most confrontations is so much more complicated and dynamic than that, but you could not know that living in Australia, you should live here and learn it from experience. CONFRONTATION IS NOT BLACK AND WHITE. This is something that I see more and more Israeli's understanding (off course not the majority of the nation which like any other country is fairly ignorant and narrow minded) however I do not hear about that many palestinians understanding this. However, I do not hear much from palestinians ever, I beleive that the voices of most plaestinian people is not ever heard due to their culture. How many arabs on this board? I barely ever hear an arabs point of view apart from politicians, and that is a fucking shame.
Assigning blame and Israel being instigitave is basically the same thing you said in the last quote I just answered.
Let me tell you a story about Arab Israeli relations.
In Israel there are many Arabs. We work together and get along. Our cultures differ but those Arabs in the cities are just the same as us. Yes there is a culture gap, and a lot of racism everywhere, but in day to day life it is not how you would imagine. It is a social issue, yet when Jews and Arabs buy from each others shops or walk past each other on the strees, we get along very well. I am not talking about the west bank and GAZA.
Israeli's Love going to Sinai. That is in Egypt.
Apart from being the only border us Israeli's can cross by foot or car instead of plane or boat to get out of our country, it is a small paradise in Sinai with great diving.
We get on very well with the Beduin there, they tell us and I tend to beleive them, that they preferred life when Sinai was in Israels control and not under Egypt. Now I know that we are tourists there and their livlyhood, but in any case I think their great spirit and intentions towards us are real.
I have been in Sinai myself about 10 times in my life.
I have made many friends there including beduins and regular Egyptians.
Many of the people I met there are not nessacerily people who thrive from Israelis being there financially.
I met young Egyptian guys who are spending there 20's learning to dive and just enjoying the laid back life in Sinai after CAIRO, Egyptians who were there when I was there on holiday, on holiday themselves, hell, I even smoked a joint on the beach there with two policemen from Cairo who were on holiday... etc....
Not one ARAB EGYPTIAN I met there had the kind of opinion about Israel that you do GD. Why? Because they know us, and they know how it is like to be living in this part of the world.
Many students I met said that they hate ARAFAT (this was obviously before his death) and that they WISH Egypt would be democratic and free like Israel.
Regarding the conflict they seem to understand Israels point of view as well as the palestinians.
Most the (arab) people I met in Sinai are amazing, polite and truly gentle people. We Israeli's could learn from them a thing or two.
My point is that I got on with most people I met there and it made me understand that the CONFLICT is political and not between the people. When the people are part of it, it is always instigated by a minority from EITHER side. We take TURNS.
Ok man GD, I will quit my story here, I hope (kinda doubt though) that you get the point.
G'day mate...
Ok, I am going to do one of your Quote thingies.
I am really hoping that we will meet a middle ground at one point, me and you GD.
GoldenDelicious said:only below the waist
your comment is telling, though - youre dismissive, and sarcastic, which imo is juvenile
sooooooo...who voted for them? and who shrugs their shoulders when they do waht they do in palestine?
Who voted for them? The same fucking Idiots that I said earlier make up over half of this country, just like in practically any society, most people in my opinion are fucking stupid and ignorant. I have constantly been saying to your UTTER disregard, that I am just giving my 2 cents as to why all this is the way it is, NOT justifying anything. REALITY is that most countries are full of fucking idiots, THUS the fucked up state of humatiy.
The Palestinians IMHO should think about this and realize that Israelis are not gonna be nice to them under any circumstances, unless they get stronger than us or start talking terms that are acceptable to us. IT IS REALITY, NOT MY OPINION .
Israeli's that voted SHARON are the scm of the earth, just like americans that voted BUSH IMHO, and I am one ISRAELI that is not glad that BUSH invaded Iraq or Afghanastine. I am disgusted.
At last you make one comment that does not say the Palestinians are so absolutely pure.
Israel on the other hand in my opinion is not the aggressor, but our way of dealing with the situation is very often aggresive. Sometimes this is the only way, sometimes it is inexcusable (I beleive you will ignore I said this negative thing about Israel and find something positive I said to tear up in your answer )
To say we are THE aggresor is just wrong, it is so much more complicated than that, Yuh, the settlers are fucking aggressive, and today I have no excuse for them, I wish I could burn em, but regarding the original settlers in the west bank, you should understand that after THE WHOLE ARAB WORLD attacked Israel and Israel won and overtook land, Israel felt that the land won was not only now rightfully ours, but also a great security to the rest of the land. Thus the settlers who settled there originally were mostly militant god beleiving radicals. Not every country has the cosy past of Australia. Tday a lot could be changed and done, but to say we are the aggressor or that the palestinians are the aggressor is childish. Politics and reality in most confrontations is so much more complicated and dynamic than that, but you could not know that living in Australia, you should live here and learn it from experience. CONFRONTATION IS NOT BLACK AND WHITE. This is something that I see more and more Israeli's understanding (off course not the majority of the nation which like any other country is fairly ignorant and narrow minded) however I do not hear about that many palestinians understanding this. However, I do not hear much from palestinians ever, I beleive that the voices of most plaestinian people is not ever heard due to their culture. How many arabs on this board? I barely ever hear an arabs point of view apart from politicians, and that is a fucking shame.
actually, i didnt say too much about the palestinians, but i do not think that they are angels - but i think that they are being reactive, while israel is instigative, which means everything when it coumes to assigning blame
yeah, i kinda do
Assigning blame and Israel being instigitave is basically the same thing you said in the last quote I just answered.
Let me tell you a story about Arab Israeli relations.
In Israel there are many Arabs. We work together and get along. Our cultures differ but those Arabs in the cities are just the same as us. Yes there is a culture gap, and a lot of racism everywhere, but in day to day life it is not how you would imagine. It is a social issue, yet when Jews and Arabs buy from each others shops or walk past each other on the strees, we get along very well. I am not talking about the west bank and GAZA.
Israeli's Love going to Sinai. That is in Egypt.
Apart from being the only border us Israeli's can cross by foot or car instead of plane or boat to get out of our country, it is a small paradise in Sinai with great diving.
We get on very well with the Beduin there, they tell us and I tend to beleive them, that they preferred life when Sinai was in Israels control and not under Egypt. Now I know that we are tourists there and their livlyhood, but in any case I think their great spirit and intentions towards us are real.
I have been in Sinai myself about 10 times in my life.
I have made many friends there including beduins and regular Egyptians.
Many of the people I met there are not nessacerily people who thrive from Israelis being there financially.
I met young Egyptian guys who are spending there 20's learning to dive and just enjoying the laid back life in Sinai after CAIRO, Egyptians who were there when I was there on holiday, on holiday themselves, hell, I even smoked a joint on the beach there with two policemen from Cairo who were on holiday... etc....
Not one ARAB EGYPTIAN I met there had the kind of opinion about Israel that you do GD. Why? Because they know us, and they know how it is like to be living in this part of the world.
Many students I met said that they hate ARAFAT (this was obviously before his death) and that they WISH Egypt would be democratic and free like Israel.
Regarding the conflict they seem to understand Israels point of view as well as the palestinians.
Most the (arab) people I met in Sinai are amazing, polite and truly gentle people. We Israeli's could learn from them a thing or two.
My point is that I got on with most people I met there and it made me understand that the CONFLICT is political and not between the people. When the people are part of it, it is always instigated by a minority from EITHER side. We take TURNS.
Ok man GD, I will quit my story here, I hope (kinda doubt though) that you get the point.
G'day mate...
Re: what is your opinion of the fence/wall/barrier that Isreal is building around its
I'd say it's better than them killing each other.
I'd say it's better than them killing each other.
Allon
New member
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/01/21/mideast/index.html
Basically Mahmoud Abbas is saying to the Hamas that in order to make sure Israel gets out of Gaza ever or quickly, it would be a good idea to stop terror attacks and launching rockets into Israel from Gaza. This is pretty wise in my opinion and something Arafat never seemed to care about. It is also my point in most of what I have said in this thread when I was talking negatively about the Palestinians.
Abbas seems to understand that Israel have no desire whatsoever to be in GAZA and we are only there because of the attacks.
Israel understands that if the palestinians get a good life, our lives will also be good.
The palestinian peoples suffering will end sooner and their quality of life will improve sooner if the HAMAS stops attacking Israel, the attacks which are causing the Israeli population to put PRESSURE on the government to retaliate.
If attacks stop, Israel will withdraw, palestinians will be able to start building their lives again and hopefully eventually Israel will come to a compromise with them which hopefully will involve giving them as much land as possible as well as permits to work in Israel for a big percentage of them.
If things work out, we will start doing business with each other and we will all prosper.
Maybe one day we will start fucking each other and have kids together, then things will get much better.
The key right now is for both sides to start understanding each others point of view.
The Israeli press are talking alot about Mahmoud Abbas and he definitely seems to be doing all he can to stop the violence, on the one hand saying what Israel wants to hear and on the other hand saying what the Hamas want to hear, which must be very tricky for him to b doing.
I think Mahmoud Abbas might be a good guy. I am getting positive vibes and his eyes look pretty pure, unlike ARAFAT'S eyes or SHARON's.
Lets watch and find out.
Basically Mahmoud Abbas is saying to the Hamas that in order to make sure Israel gets out of Gaza ever or quickly, it would be a good idea to stop terror attacks and launching rockets into Israel from Gaza. This is pretty wise in my opinion and something Arafat never seemed to care about. It is also my point in most of what I have said in this thread when I was talking negatively about the Palestinians.
Abbas seems to understand that Israel have no desire whatsoever to be in GAZA and we are only there because of the attacks.
Israel understands that if the palestinians get a good life, our lives will also be good.
The palestinian peoples suffering will end sooner and their quality of life will improve sooner if the HAMAS stops attacking Israel, the attacks which are causing the Israeli population to put PRESSURE on the government to retaliate.
If attacks stop, Israel will withdraw, palestinians will be able to start building their lives again and hopefully eventually Israel will come to a compromise with them which hopefully will involve giving them as much land as possible as well as permits to work in Israel for a big percentage of them.
If things work out, we will start doing business with each other and we will all prosper.
Maybe one day we will start fucking each other and have kids together, then things will get much better.
The key right now is for both sides to start understanding each others point of view.
The Israeli press are talking alot about Mahmoud Abbas and he definitely seems to be doing all he can to stop the violence, on the one hand saying what Israel wants to hear and on the other hand saying what the Hamas want to hear, which must be very tricky for him to b doing.
I think Mahmoud Abbas might be a good guy. I am getting positive vibes and his eyes look pretty pure, unlike ARAFAT'S eyes or SHARON's.
Lets watch and find out.
B
BrothaBill
Guest
Agreed to some points of Allon, the best choice for the palestinians is to end terror and negotiate peaceful solutions to end the conflict. Their course of violence against the overwhelming stronger state of Israel is just a vent of raw emotion and is counterproductive. They have no chance of winning a conflict with Israel...
PALESTINIANS FINALLY RUN OUT OF ROCKS
WEST BANK — Palestinian stone throwers disclosed for the first time Friday, that due to a gross miscalculation of their arsenal, they had finally run out of rocks and would be forced to come up with more inventive ways of continuing their Intifada on the Jewish state of Israel.
“I reached down to grab a rock this morning and all I got was a handful of sand,” said one Palestinian militant who asked to remain anonymous. “I tried throwing it but it just blew back in my face. Man, It really stung my eyes!”
Militant groups were quick to cast blame for the depletion of their arsenal on a group of teenage “stone hogs” who exhausted the supply by throwing indiscriminately at passing cars, various neighborhood bullies and the occasional stray dog.
Others accused a local housewife of wasting the rocks by building “a cute little gravel path” leading up to a backyard bird feeder.
“The important thing is we find an another resource as quickly as possible, said Palestinian militant leader, Achmed Ashanni. “Meanwhile, we’re alternating between spitting on the Israelis and throwing feces at them. We really need to find some alternatives quick."
Leaders of two radical groups, Hamas and Islamic Jihad, not wanting show signs of military unreadiness, decided to immediately unleash a precious cargo of snack-sized, tapioca pudding containers stolen from an Israeli middle school cafeteria.
According to reports, the pudding has great hangtime and can be thrown almost as far as rocks. Plus, it’s really impressive when it explodes all over enemy clothing.
I do have to admit, It really kills me to throw the tapioca Snack Packs," Ashanni said. "Those goddamn Jews really know their pudding.”
Above: Palestinians have resorted to throwing their own feces
heehee, like this so much but my thread with this went away too quickly.
(
BOBFROMACCOUNTING.COM
PALESTINIANS FINALLY RUN OUT OF ROCKS
WEST BANK — Palestinian stone throwers disclosed for the first time Friday, that due to a gross miscalculation of their arsenal, they had finally run out of rocks and would be forced to come up with more inventive ways of continuing their Intifada on the Jewish state of Israel.
“I reached down to grab a rock this morning and all I got was a handful of sand,” said one Palestinian militant who asked to remain anonymous. “I tried throwing it but it just blew back in my face. Man, It really stung my eyes!”
Militant groups were quick to cast blame for the depletion of their arsenal on a group of teenage “stone hogs” who exhausted the supply by throwing indiscriminately at passing cars, various neighborhood bullies and the occasional stray dog.
Others accused a local housewife of wasting the rocks by building “a cute little gravel path” leading up to a backyard bird feeder.
“The important thing is we find an another resource as quickly as possible, said Palestinian militant leader, Achmed Ashanni. “Meanwhile, we’re alternating between spitting on the Israelis and throwing feces at them. We really need to find some alternatives quick."
Leaders of two radical groups, Hamas and Islamic Jihad, not wanting show signs of military unreadiness, decided to immediately unleash a precious cargo of snack-sized, tapioca pudding containers stolen from an Israeli middle school cafeteria.
According to reports, the pudding has great hangtime and can be thrown almost as far as rocks. Plus, it’s really impressive when it explodes all over enemy clothing.
I do have to admit, It really kills me to throw the tapioca Snack Packs," Ashanni said. "Those goddamn Jews really know their pudding.”
Above: Palestinians have resorted to throwing their own feces
heehee, like this so much but my thread with this went away too quickly.
(BOBFROMACCOUNTING.COM
B
BrothaBill
Guest
HumanTarget said:
Can chinamen actually pronounce the consonant sound we associate with the letter P? Seriously and if not what would it sound like?
Tiervexx
New member
Re: what is your opinion of the fence/wall/barrier that Isreal is building around its
Yes, my opinion is totally un-biased because I have no affiliation with either side, and therefore do not benefit either way. The same can not be said about Allon, who is clearly part of one side.
This is why they don't select judges or juries that have personal relationships with the defendants or accusers.
If this concept is beyond you than you need to return to elementary school.
Gambino said:yeah, his opinion is worthless. afterall, he only lives in israel
surely your opinon is 100% un-biased
Yes, my opinion is totally un-biased because I have no affiliation with either side, and therefore do not benefit either way. The same can not be said about Allon, who is clearly part of one side.
This is why they don't select judges or juries that have personal relationships with the defendants or accusers.
If this concept is beyond you than you need to return to elementary school.
Allon
New member
Re: what is your opinion of the fence/wall/barrier that Isreal is building around its
uhmmm, maybe you need to go back to school and learn how to read. Gambino did not say I was unbiased, he was saying to GD that my point of view is not worthless, and was implying that GD seems to be biased, which he is.
Tiervexx said:
uhmmm, maybe you need to go back to school and learn how to read. Gambino did not say I was unbiased, he was saying to GD that my point of view is not worthless, and was implying that GD seems to be biased, which he is.
