Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below I read alot of posts on hear that say don't overtrain. What exactly does that mean? I started lifting in the days of Arnold, Sergio and Bertil Fox. All these guys would do numerous sets for each bodypart with alot of sets going to failure. I've always trained like that until recently. Started training with this young kid at the gym and he said I'm overtraining. Just started trying to cutback on number of sets and limited number of sets to failure, but I just don't feel like I'm getting the same workouts. On a 5on / 2off routine hitting a bodypart per day. Can I get some thoughts on what overtraining is?
What is overtraining?
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I think these days people undertrain more than overtrain. If you're constantly sore all over, not recouperating, losing weight, getting sick or feeling run down, you're overtraining. But if you're under 40, healthy, sleep enough and want to grow -- go all out.
As Jack LaLanne said to me about overtraining; Get down and do push ups until you die! It can't happen!
As Jack LaLanne said to me about overtraining; Get down and do push ups until you die! It can't happen!
jumpmaster82
Well-known member
I think the normal bodybuilding enthusiasts dont have the time to overtrain.
E
ego boner
Guest
i think most peoples idea of overtraining now is when it starts to burn--- BUT THEY ARE ALL VAGINASSSSSSS. i train till i cant anymore. but i also dont hit the same parts of the body too frequently... never next day same part or two days out same part. i have people tell me i overtrain at my gym--- but i am the only one there that is 6'5" 263lbs and can bench 405lbs for 6 reps. which is hard when you have LONG arms.
EGO!
EGO!
2raptors
New member
Yeah, I'm beginning week 4 of my cycle....and it's a "lite" cycle, but I am starting to feel like doing my routines 2x per week now instead of the once per week I was doing....like, I did legs this am (Squats, D/L, wide leg press, leg curl, nelsons CALF routine (fucker)) and I think on Thursday I'm giong to do Kettle Bell swings/front squats (Sset), bulgarian split squats, leg ext, and walking lunges..... my legs have been recouping faster...I feel like I need to do more!! that I "can" do more.
So I just think that when you get injured, constantly sore, run down, hey...didn't somebody JUST write that?
But it's a good post....fursure.
So I just think that when you get injured, constantly sore, run down, hey...didn't somebody JUST write that?
But it's a good post....fursure.
airsmith2k
New member
its hard to overtrain if your on juice
Kingfeade2
New member
I think you would have to be obsessed to over train....When i am on....I feel like to get the full effect I have to workout two times a day...Over training has got to be tough to do on juice
Thunderclap47
New member
Would it be considered overtraining if the range of motion in your shoulders goes to shit? I haven't been able to itch my back, or extend my arm to the side and bend my elbow to touch my shoulder for a couple weeks.
bigdofba
New member
I have never met anyone that overtrains. I think that expression is thrown around way too much. I think most people undertrain.
Arnold, Franco, etc. used to train for 2-3 hours. Sometimes twice a day. They do a shitload of reps and sets and always used the heaviest weights they could. They used minimal gear compared to today's bodybuilders and looked amazing.
If you are working out a bodypart once a week it's almost impossible to overtrain it.
People that think they are overtraining are probably not eating enough and getting enough rest.
Bottom line. Don't worry about overtraining. Go balls to the wall.
Arnold, Franco, etc. used to train for 2-3 hours. Sometimes twice a day. They do a shitload of reps and sets and always used the heaviest weights they could. They used minimal gear compared to today's bodybuilders and looked amazing.
If you are working out a bodypart once a week it's almost impossible to overtrain it.
People that think they are overtraining are probably not eating enough and getting enough rest.
Bottom line. Don't worry about overtraining. Go balls to the wall.
Thanks alot!!! I've always trained hard and just don't feel right walking out of the gym without even getting up a sweat, which is what I've done the last two weeks. I told my training partner I seemed to be stuck on both growth / strength and that's when he told me I was overtraining. I'm beginning to feel it just might be my age and maybe I've plateaued. Again thanks for the feedback.
Overtraining is a complex subject because we all different. Some ppl overtrain a lot easier than others, it all depends on many factors like sleep, food, exercise routine, genetics etc.
Can you overtrain? absolutely! Can you overtrain on juice? Absolutely!
The bad thing is that once you overtrain depending how serious, it will take a lot of rest to come back and make progress again. I wasted 2-3 years in my mid-20s being uneducated about what overtraing is and what to do. If you feel you hit a wall back off then come back stronger and try to go passed your previous maxes or goals.
Everybody is different and we all have different goals but no matter what the goal is if you not making progress is common sense to make changes.
I'm geting older too bro and still making progress so I would not use that as an excuse
Good luck to you
Can you overtrain? absolutely! Can you overtrain on juice? Absolutely!
The bad thing is that once you overtrain depending how serious, it will take a lot of rest to come back and make progress again. I wasted 2-3 years in my mid-20s being uneducated about what overtraing is and what to do. If you feel you hit a wall back off then come back stronger and try to go passed your previous maxes or goals.
Everybody is different and we all have different goals but no matter what the goal is if you not making progress is common sense to make changes.
I'm geting older too bro and still making progress so I would not use that as an excuse
Good luck to you
THE GOOD SUN
New member
Nelson Montana said:
I love it!!!
great quote!!!
Mavafanculo
New member
no such thing as overtraining?
it depends on body type, hereditary reaction to stress, diet, age, recovery ability, juice or no juice etc
an ectomorph is prone to overtraining. a mesomorph isnt but still can. Everybodies seen the skinny guy doing 100 sets and never growing. why?
generally speaking, if you start to notice a drop in strength, loss of appetite, loss of motivation for the gym (or life lol), elevated basal heart rate (or lowered basal body temp), swollen glands, ur probably overtraining and should take a few days off then lower your training volume or intensity. when you go back, you'll be amazed.
before everybody started juicing, the best trainers (giranda etc) all advocated taking a week off every few months to let the body recharge and recover.
you dont grow in the gym, you grow during sleep and recovery. If your training exceeds your body's ability to recover before the next workout, you just go backwards. You do the damge but not the supercompensation that results in growth.
it depends on body type, hereditary reaction to stress, diet, age, recovery ability, juice or no juice etc
an ectomorph is prone to overtraining. a mesomorph isnt but still can. Everybodies seen the skinny guy doing 100 sets and never growing. why?
generally speaking, if you start to notice a drop in strength, loss of appetite, loss of motivation for the gym (or life lol), elevated basal heart rate (or lowered basal body temp), swollen glands, ur probably overtraining and should take a few days off then lower your training volume or intensity. when you go back, you'll be amazed.
before everybody started juicing, the best trainers (giranda etc) all advocated taking a week off every few months to let the body recharge and recover.
you dont grow in the gym, you grow during sleep and recovery. If your training exceeds your body's ability to recover before the next workout, you just go backwards. You do the damge but not the supercompensation that results in growth.
lmm23
New member
Mavafanculo said:
Overtraining is definitely possible and really serious. I'm experiencing directly at the moment. Mavafanculo is spot-on with the symptoms. I had these, and I also started to get a constantly streaming nose, but also serious mood changes. I had been away from training for a few years, and wasn't taking anything - just wanted to get back into it. But I hit it way too hard, and it started with frequent sore throats and colds. Seen as I was always prone to these, I ignored it. My sleep was terrible, and I seemed to be making no improvements, but losing weight and gaining fat around my stomach. Six months in this, I upped my training thinking I was selling myself short, and suddenly improved. Two days later, my strength just dropped out of the sky, and then one morning I could barely conjure the energy to get out of bed, my eyelids were flickering like crazy, I had headaches and was dizzy all the time.
It's been 10 months now and I'm still not able to do any exercise at all, even light cardio can throw my back over the edge, and I stop sleeping for 5 days, etc. Dermacrine has helped balance the cortisol-testosterone ratio, and for the first time in a long time I can get some good sleep without waking up at 3am.
I don't think overtraining is purely about training, however; I was also suffering serious stress trying to make a career for myself, and doing serious travelling, including on my 'rest' day.
It's no fucking fun at all! I wonder if it is possible to recover if you get it bad!
Thunderclap47
New member
That would explain a few things. I've been off D-bol for a couple weeks now and it seems to be getting better. I dropped about 6 lbs of water weight so far and can actually touch my back somewhat now. Thanks for the info Acela.
lmm23 said:
You will come back bro, not to worry but it will be a while.
When I overtrained years ago I went through something similar as you experience at the moment, sleepness, gaining fat, no pleasure in going to the gym, no results etc. I stopped lifting for 6 or 8 months maybe even a year, I do not remember exactly but it took a long time and also depression set in as well. I actually played golf all that year, it was a nightmare to say the least!
Never ever I will listen to anybody about what I should be doing in the gym, but to my own body. As you can see from this thread there are a wide range of opinions on overtraining. If you listen to your body you will know when its time to back off.
You are experiencing an complete overtraining bro, the worse kind!
Good luck to you bro and if you need any help let me know
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LiquidPhire
New member
stretch more, had the same thing happend to me its not called over training ;PThunderclap47 said:
instant.muscle
New member
overtraining is a myth
maxspeed96ct
New member
I think the not sleeping enought part is killin my growth! and it sucks cause i cant help it
most i ever get is 6 hrs, but i got to much work school and partyin to do at 21....
most i ever get is 6 hrs, but i got to much work school and partyin to do at 21....
marshallmadman
New member
I agree 100%. Overtraining is merely a weak way out of busting your balls to get results. There is no overtraining; only undereating, and undersleeping.
instant.muscle said:
daveyboy2345
New member
if your small boned, narrow framed and the sort of nervous anxiety prone type and have trouble sleeping soundly day 2 day, LOOK OUT, you will surely experience over training soon enough cause it doesn't take much for this type of individual.
If your 5-7-5-11 in height and have 8-9 inch wrists and shoulders as wide as a house you may just think you are under sleeping some and or not getting enough protein, it's different for everyone.
If your 5-7-5-11 in height and have 8-9 inch wrists and shoulders as wide as a house you may just think you are under sleeping some and or not getting enough protein, it's different for everyone.
Tweakle
New member
If you're squatting 600+ week in week out for reps and feel perky enough to do arnold type volume with that kind of load then you truely are a freak.
Otherwise, when I read 'there's no such thing as overtraining!!' it's almost always it's a wee fella who wants to believe that 'you don't need to be strong to be big' and thinks 10 sets with 180 is going to give him 30" + legs if he just eats his wheaties and takes his Human Grade
Otherwise, when I read 'there's no such thing as overtraining!!' it's almost always it's a wee fella who wants to believe that 'you don't need to be strong to be big' and thinks 10 sets with 180 is going to give him 30" + legs if he just eats his wheaties and takes his Human Grade
Tweakle said:
LOL right on tweakle...
but for the most part dont u feel "overtraining is undereating?"
alot of people on the board will NEVER train like you and I. I'm overtrained from my MAX Squat (Finally took and lowered 639lbs, was about 3-5 inches above parallel , but shit i got up without a spot.) And i would SAY im overtrained....but i also have increased my calories big time.
So do u think its fair to say, that the majority of overtraining is undereating?
So if someone says " i think im overtraining"
first we check his diet...
second we check his routine...
just wondering your opinion on things (i have learned too much from you not to keep bugging u with questions lol)
Tweakle
New member
Nice! you might make 700 next year at that rate.
I took 635 off the pins on Friday (also a little above parallel lol) which is the most I've done in years and I'm feeling it deep in my hips today
I find when I eat lots I can bounce back a little quicker, but its the overuse that grinds me down.. joint aches and pains , aching elbows when you get under the squat bar, CNS fatigue all kills me
If I was 21 again that wouldnt be such an issue but getting older does make it harder to bounce back I'm finding, even on hrt :s
I took 635 off the pins on Friday (also a little above parallel lol) which is the most I've done in years and I'm feeling it deep in my hips today
I find when I eat lots I can bounce back a little quicker, but its the overuse that grinds me down.. joint aches and pains , aching elbows when you get under the squat bar, CNS fatigue all kills me
If I was 21 again that wouldnt be such an issue but getting older does make it harder to bounce back I'm finding, even on hrt :s
Ralph_Wiggum
New member
u418936 said:
GREAT POINT! The CNS is one of the main things I look @ when I'm planning my training routine for the coming months. I always leave room to re-adjust or re-do in the case of needing extra time for CNS recovery. I usually change the exercises into more heavy/compound exercises as my reps get lower in my HST routine.
There is definitely a distinct difference in the way I feel when I move into the heavy phase of my HST routine... Basically, you get a "drained" or "fatigued" feeling when you get up out of your seat and go into motion to do something. Physical activity feels more demanding and your body is hypersensitive to it. These feelings go away if you give yourself adequate recovery time. If your next workout includes the big lifts, then you will be in a constant cycle and/or perpetually worse. I combat this by lowering my frequency of squats/deads and/or alternate between the two in each respective workout as the workouts get heavier.
Trendsetter21
New member
Training for 10 hours a day straight would probably be over training.........rest and diet are extremely important.
Tweakle said:
yeah your def right i know what you mean. I hope to hit 700 within 6 months. If i fill out my powerlifting gear more, ill be able to utilize the gear more...
yea cutting for more i recover slower, bulking i recover nice and quick...
UNLESS I DO MAX DEADLIFTS OR A MAX SQUAT, then your right my CNS is totally fried...
TC2
New member
marshallmadman said:
Thats bullshit...I used to eat a ton, sleep plenty, run circles around lifting partners and always use super strict form and go balls to the wall on every rep.
But I go to a point where I just didnt feel good all the time and actually got weaker and smaller.
I backed off the aneurysm inducing weights and volume and got back to basics and can tell my body is responding way better now.
That's the most ignorant, uninformed statement i've heard on this forums.
marshallmadman
New member
I stand by my first statement because it comes from John Parrillo, a guy that's trained more champion bodybuilders than anyone else I can think of. As for your guess about squats and deadlifts, I would venture to say that I have done more squats and deads than anyone else I know. Let me break it down for you: 3 year starter high school football. Two year starter at a Big 10 school, and two years in the NFL. Rest assured, I have seen squats and deads. Keep making excuses for why you can't gain. I'll be the guy at the gym that you go out of your way to say "excuse me" to when you walk by. Have a nice day. 
u418936 said:
silver_shadow
New member
this thread seems to have come here from another forum judging by some of the earlier responses 
here's my take: there is definitely a thing called overtraining and it's definitely required. this guy explains how better:
http://www.higher-faster-sports.com/PlannedOvertraining.html
here's my take: there is definitely a thing called overtraining and it's definitely required. this guy explains how better:
http://www.higher-faster-sports.com/PlannedOvertraining.html
I squat and deadlift at least 2x per week.
I also train only 2-3 days a week, am currently pushing near 290 lbs (up from 240 or below earlier this year), deadlifted a raw and easy 700 (as a 6th event) recently, and I also sleep 8+ hours a night and eat A LOT of food.
The key is knowing your body's ability to recovery both mentally and physically. There are times when I simply have to back down on things, I just have to recognize the exact time when to do this.
I also train only 2-3 days a week, am currently pushing near 290 lbs (up from 240 or below earlier this year), deadlifted a raw and easy 700 (as a 6th event) recently, and I also sleep 8+ hours a night and eat A LOT of food.
The key is knowing your body's ability to recovery both mentally and physically. There are times when I simply have to back down on things, I just have to recognize the exact time when to do this.
I wander how much and what type of training some of the ppl here do who say that overtraining does not exsist because if you push yourself to the max at one point or another most of us run into some type of overtrainig where you feel like the gym is not appealing anymore and instead of making progress you go the opposite way and feel like shit......!
I think many confuse hard training with overtraing, too.
It is proven all over the place that overtrainig is real.....and that's how many ppl will take this advice from here, go to the gym and try to bomb and blitz body parts to obliteration only to find out that their bodies and mind cannot recover from that kind of punishment no matter how much you sleep or eat!
I think many confuse hard training with overtraing, too.
It is proven all over the place that overtrainig is real.....and that's how many ppl will take this advice from here, go to the gym and try to bomb and blitz body parts to obliteration only to find out that their bodies and mind cannot recover from that kind of punishment no matter how much you sleep or eat!
