Training For Reps...

[b fold the truth]

Ok...contest events were finalized yesterday for my Nationals. Two of the events are for max reps in 60 seconds...how would you train for them?

Deadlift: 500 pound, max reps in 60 seconds
2" Thick Bar Clean and Press: 240 pound, max reps in 60 seconds

Would you focus on bringing up your 1RM strength and letting the numbers fall into place or would you work a little bit lighter and focus a bit more on reps?

I just finished reading an article by Louie Simmons that lead me to believe that I should still focus on my singles and heavy work and everything else would fall into place.
http://www.elitefitnesssystems.com/documents/repetition-method.htm

Either way...I plan to test myself with the full contest at 8 and 4-5 weeks out.

B True

 

[brian747478`]

i would think train with the singles and it would fall into place. possibly try some reps every few weeks or once a month to get the feel of it, but i think the strength will be built with the singles, and then that rep weight will feel very light come contest day.
brian

 

[coolcolj]

function follows form

train for specificity

 

[JOKER47]

I would think you would still want to do some of the training for reps. (Just like the competiton.) If for nothing else but to check your fitness on the cardio portion of it.


.02,
Joker

 

[CrimsonKing]

function follows form

train for specificity

Ditto!

 

[b fold the truth]

bump for ideas...

Hannibal???

Cornholio???

Big D???

B True

 

[b fold the truth]

bump...

B True

 

[Hannibal]

Would you focus on bringing up your 1RM strength and letting the numbers fall into place or would you work a little bit lighter and focus a bit more on reps?

I just finished reading an article by Louie Simmons that lead me to believe that I should still focus on my singles and heavy work and everything else would fall into place.
http://www.elitefitnesssystems.com/documents/repetition-method.htm

"When your top strength goes up, so does your strength endurance with less than max weights."

I would tend to think you should just keep working on 1RM Strength. Perhaps in one of your two lower body days you might do a few more reps to build some muscular endurance, but I wouldnt prioritize it to the point that it stalled your progress on 1RM.

Another idea that I think you are already doing...is dragging the sled for TIME not distance...that is where I think you should get your specificity. Drag the sled for 60 seconds at a time...gradually work up in weight handled...just a thought.

 

[coolcolj]

Bfold have a look at what footballers do to get the most reps on the Bench Press when they train for a combine camp.

They optimise their technique for effeciency - probbaly not that applicable to the deadlift, but who knows.

They off course increase their 1 rep max as well, but if you ever read any studies on muscle endurance, Best results always come when your train your muscles to do so. Increasing your 1 rep max will help, but it will never be as good as training your energy systems for endurance.

But unlike the footballer you have a time limit.
Since there is a time limit, then your goal is to pump as many reps as you as fast as possible, This require great power, more so than straight endurance.

So I think you should train for maximal explosion and power, and the ability to sustain it for 60 secs with minimal drop off. This require great strength, which you already know how to do, and also great speed. May I suggest continous jumping deadlifts intervals. These will build anaerobic enurance as well.

Just random ideas

 

[Exodus]

some reps would be good just for practice sake...... hey..... it couldnt hurt a big ole bear like you much anyway.

X

 

[The Shadow]

Ok...contest events were finalized yesterday for my Nationals. Two of the events are for max reps in 60 seconds...how would you train for them?

Deadlift: 500 pound, max reps in 60 seconds
2" Thick Bar Clean and Press: 240 pound, max reps in 60 seconds

Would you focus on bringing up your 1RM strength and letting the numbers fall into place or would you work a little bit lighter and focus a bit more on reps?

I just finished reading an article by Louie Simmons that lead me to believe that I should still focus on my singles and heavy work and everything else would fall into place.
http://www.elitefitnesssystems.com/documents/repetition-method.htm

Either way...I plan to test myself with the full contest at 8 and 4-5 weeks out.

B True

Depends.....how many reps are you looking at..if ti is over 10 - def train for the reps and load up on creatine

 

[b fold the truth]

Thanks for the ideas. I am thinking about doing an all out set with 500 here either this week or next to see about where I am at.

Remember...I can do 5 reps then rest for a few seconds and get a few more...etc...till my 60 seconds is gone. I hope to get 10 though...

B True

 

[The Shadow]

hmmmmm...right at the breaking point imo - I know that you can train specifically for the ability to do higher reps....still though tume under tension should still be considered...5 reps on deads each burst would be how many seconds for you Clint?

 

[b fold the truth]

I'm not really for sure how long it will take me...maybe 15-20 seconds for 5 reps with 500 pounds...something like that.

B True

 

[The Shadow]

so - maybe 12-15 reps then????

I would start at say 480 and add 10-20 pounds at each session and try to keep the reps as high as possible...once you hit 520 - back back to around the 480 range and work up again....

 

[b fold the truth]

I would like to get 500 for 10 reps. I can use straps, belt, and a suit if I choose. I did a raw 650 the other day and felt that I had 665-675 in me...but who knows.

I plan to try some higher rep deads this week...but they always kill my spine a lot... Can't go too hard or too heavy on too many things at once....it is only just one event.

B True

 

[lemur]

I've done stuff like this a lot , with a ton of different coaches, with multiple different exercises, and none of them trained me even remotely similar. Some had me start at 1:30 and heavier weight and gradually even it out, some had me training for 1 rep max still, some had me do exactly what I was supposed to do in tryouts, and some had me train super light. There is absolutely no consensus.

There was only one thing they agreed on, and it was: set your goals high. if you want 500x10, don't train for 500x10. train for at least 520x12.

 

[b fold the truth]

The only thing that bothers me about all of these approaches is...

To build the deadlift...you don't need to be deadlifting very often...

B True

 

[Hannibal]

To build the deadlift...you don't need to be deadlifting very often...

Thats why I was thinking it would be a better idea to build endurance in the "muscle" and not in the movement. Go a little higher on reps on accessory work...concentrate on TIME for those sets. At least on one of your two lower body days....on the other I would stick to your normal rep range...the one that made you strong in the first place.

 

[b fold the truth]

Please elaborate Hannibal.

This is basically what I have been doing to increase my deadlift..

Box Squats
Pull Throughs
Reverse Hypers
Band Ham Curls
GM's

What do you suggest I go higher reps or for time on?

B True

 

[coolcolj]

Ok since you can rest that changes things a lot

I still think you should do some lighter deadlift intervals. The jumping dealdifts can kill two bird with one stone - build your explosiveness and your anaerobic energy systems to help all your events I think.

Something like 5 reps. rest 1min. anotehr 5 reps etc
Over time shorten the rest periods until you get to 30secs.
It will strip the fat off ya as well

Use 30% of your 1 rep max deadlift - about 200lbs for you.
You may wanna round it up to 225
This is quite light for you and should not incur too much of a recovery penalty. And it will boost your deadlift max! Trust em on this

 

[Hannibal]

Please elaborate Hannibal.

This is basically what I have been doing to increase my deadlift..

Box Squats
Pull Throughs
Reverse Hypers
Band Ham Curls
GM's

What do you suggest I go higher reps or for time on?

B True

The pull thrus, reverse hypers, and ham curls....the exercises that work the muscle. As opposed to compound movements like Box Squats or GM's. I would definitely try the sled for time...at least once a week...for 60 secs a trip. Then try to increase either distance traveled or weight used each week.

 

[b fold the truth]

So many ideas...time to implement several of them...

B True

 

[Lord_Suston]

Bfold to get the endurance at the end of every dead workout if you go heavy to build on one max rep try to do reps with a comfortable weight without stopping and impecable form. This way of training will make your endurance levels go up so when you compete and can rest during it will feel like you have all the time in the world...

 

[Lumberg]

My first thought was, every week, on deadlift day, warm up just like you would do on contest day then let 'er rip with 500.

My second thought was, hey, start low, then work your way up, just like Cornholio.

Then I thought, well if you're going to vary the weight, vary the time, too.

So vary the times from 45 secs. to 1:30.

Also evaluate yourself and see if the limiting factor is endurance or raw strength.

Say you are strong enough to get 500 a certain number of times but you are getting out of breath or whatever, work on just repping as fast as you can.

If you feel you can only do a certain number of reps because you just don't have the strength, work on increasing strength.


Good luck.

JC

 

[Blkout]

I would say train for maximum reps. I know guys at my gym who can squat more than me for 1 rep, but they cannot touch what I can do for 15-18 reps. Why? Becuase those guys always train for 1 rep and I always train for 15-18 reps.

 

[b fold the truth]

Hard to do this...and this is why I asked these questions...

Two of my events are for reps:
1) Overhead Press with 240
2) Deadlift with 500

These are ONLY 2 of 5 events...can't put everything I have into them...

Also...the deadlift increases by NOT doing the deadlift but doing exercises which build it...that is the problem.

B True

 

[The Shadow]

maybe focus on good mornings, pull thrus and tricep work then?

 

[b fold the truth]

maybe focus on good mornings, pull thrus and tricep work then?

I am thinking that you are right. After watching my heavy overhead pressing work...I notice that I often come short of the lockout with the weight...triceps I guess.

B True

 

[The Shadow]

yep -- tris might be lagging a touch.......maybe touch up rotators as well...

 

[The Shadow]

..some midback work as well...lower trap regions

 

[b fold the truth]

..some midback work as well...lower trap regions

Suggestions?

B True

 

[The Shadow]

incline bumbell shrugs

seated CABLE rows pulling higher than normal or cable pulldowns (face pulls) will help a lot

 

[Hannibal]

..some midback work as well...lower trap regions

...seated power cleans, or rig up a chest supported row with DB's and the end of your bench elevated.

 

[The Shadow]

seated power cleans???

seems like the only part of the trap that would activate would be the very top portions due to the lack of load at the bottom position....??

Dunno - can't picture it.

 

[coolcolj]

Yates 80 degree overhand rows with back squeeze?

 

[b fold the truth]

Man...so much to think about...

Cornholio...seated power cleans aren't like doing them with a barbell. They are done with a dbell and mainly for rotators...kinda like the shoulder horn type of deal..

B True

 

[corndawg]

truth...I'm far from an expert but I would train maximal weights for strength but just adjust my rep range and tempo to where each working set would last ~60 seconds. That way you can get the best of both worlds...

 

[Lumberg]

Hey bfold how many events are there?

Here's an idea:

For the last 2-4 weeks train ME for each event each day.

If there are more than 5-6 events do one in the am and one in the pm.

I think you could afford to overtrain for a few weeks. Then take a nice long week off right before the event.

Of course the drawback would be that your body doesn't get used to doing all the events on one day (is it even a one day event?)

JC

 

[b fold the truth]

Hey bfold how many events are there?

Here's an idea:

For the last 2-4 weeks train ME for each event each day.

If there are more than 5-6 events do one in the am and one in the pm.

I think you could afford to overtrain for a few weeks. Then take a nice long week off right before the event.

Of course the drawback would be that your body doesn't get used to doing all the events on one day (is it even a one day event?)

JC

Yeah, I will do 5 events in 4 hours or less. Sounds fun...

I will probably slightly overtrain the weeks prior but will take the week before completely off to recover and become a mad man..

B True

 

[Lumberg]

Hey b fold now that I am sponsoring you does that mean I get to tell you what to do?

You will use my training methodology.

Anyways on contest day diet is going to be very important as well.--lots of simple carbs all during the events.

JC

 

[b fold the truth]

I am putting all that I have into this contest...everything. The way that I have been eating it will be difficult for me to stay under 300 pounds.

B True