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Sprinter look!

N

Needhelp

New member
http://www.nccu.edu/campus/athletics/tfsmoots.html
Damn, that guy is huge!

That's what I want to look like SOME DAY.

Do you think this:

http://www.testosterone.net/articles/173melt.html

would be a good routine?

and this a good diet:?

http://www.testosterone.net/html/83diet.html

I'm gonna repeat the meltdown training 4 times, it's only a 3 week program...

I want to cut my bf down and get my abs showing before the end of summer... then bulk and add more muscle during the winter...

I'm 165/5'11 now... What do you guys think?
 
Let me point something out to you.....you are 5'11 and 165. You shouldn't be worrying about cutting back right now. 165 is very very light at your height.....if I were you I'd be bulking right now.

The sprinter you linked to......well he has pretty sizeable arms but thats it......I think that is Screwballs point. There are pics of screwball on here somewhere.....look em up. He is getting towards huge!!

Needhelp said:
http://www.nccu.edu/campus/athletics/tfsmoots.html
Damn, that guy is huge!

That's what I want to look like SOME DAY.

Do you think this:

http://www.testosterone.net/articles/173melt.html

would be a good routine?

and this a good diet:?

http://www.testosterone.net/html/83diet.html

I'm gonna repeat the meltdown training 4 times, it's only a 3 week program...

I want to cut my bf down and get my abs showing before the end of summer... then bulk and add more muscle during the winter...

I'm 165/5'11 now... What do you guys think?
Click to expand...
 
I don't want to be a huge guy.. Decent size, 180-190, and pretty low bf..

Is that diet and routine good? It's not really cutting, since I'm a normal teen--last week I barely ate any food... SO even this T-Dawg diet is a lot more food than I would normally eat.

I don't want to be fat for the summer though, I want my 6 pack to show more (AT least by end of August) then, I want to bulk during the winter...

What do you guys recommend if this isn't good?

I think i'm gonna try the T-Dawg or Anabolic diet either way.. They look pretty interesting. Since i'm a beginner, what supps, if any, should I take?

Thanks
 
If you want good advice on dieting speak to the guys on the diet board. They are very knowledgable......far more so than me :). It also sounds like you are more bodybuilding orientated......being a powerlifter, it is difficult for me to help you there. But, there is a good search function that will give you some good solid routines. Or post a new thread with a name that shows people that you want routine advice.

Needhelp said:
I don't want to be a huge guy.. Decent size, 180-190, and pretty low bf..

Is that diet and routine good? It's not really cutting, since I'm a normal teen--last week I barely ate any food... SO even this T-Dawg diet is a lot more food than I would normally eat.

I don't want to be fat for the summer though, I want my 6 pack to show more (AT least by end of August) then, I want to bulk during the winter...

What do you guys recommend if this isn't good?

I think i'm gonna try the T-Dawg or Anabolic diet either way.. They look pretty interesting. Since i'm a beginner, what supps, if any, should I take?

Thanks
Click to expand...
 
the link to the sprinter you posted is much better condition than you screwball. your a big guy but your bodyfat is really high. the sprinter in the link goes to my gym every now and then and so do alot of nccu players and unc and some duke athletes. i cant beleive you actually think you are bigger or stronger than this guy LOL. ive seen this guy rep 405 on the bench, im pretty shure you would look silly comparing yourself to this guy without your shirt
 
What is his BF %? (The sprinters) It's gotta be damn low like 4%...

Do you think I should do the T-Dawg diet, and the meltdown training routine (Probably drop bf down and maybe gain some muscle), and then bulk during the winter?

Or
Bulk now, and go on a normal routine?

Bulk now till i'm @ 180, but, bulk to 200, bulk to ~215, and then cut..?

I don't want to become a fatass, though, lol...

The other thing is, with a normal routine... you squat heavy... With the meltdown you go at like 50% (Cuz you have no rest).. I don't have a cage or a spotter, so I don't squat with heavy weight, I go real light (120)..
 
but before you get mad at me screwball. this guy gets help i beleive from growthhormone. tons of athletes around here do. i choose to stay natural. i wonder what hes gonna look like in a few years. people at my gym talk about poppin pills and shit like that like its everyday shit. theres alot of people at my gym his size mainly a bunch of jacked up black dudes im like the only big white guy there. alot of cops workout here too and you can overhear them talkin about roids i doubt they really know what there doing to their bodies its gonna catch up with them
 
i wonder if the sprinter is dead or not lol. i havent seen him in a long time at the gym. he would stay about 5 percent bodyfat year round
 
Anyone have suggestions for me? I want to get started Monday, on whatever i'm doing... You guys are the experts; I NEED YOUR HELP :)
 
ditto to Imnotdutch...you need to put on about 25 lbs of LBM. which is going to take a while if you are lean at 165. why do you not eat ? are you an athlete or just want to look like one ?

nclifter6feet6...what are you talking about gh ? that is the physique of any typical college sprinter, no need for gh to look like that. I was the exact same size while running track in college at 5'10 205 lbs at 6.5% bf.
 
So, I should bulk..

And is this routine good, if i'm bulking...

4 sets of 8, for everything..

Monday: Chest/Triceps
Incline Press
Flat bench
Flyes
Skull Crushers
Dips

Tuesday: Legs/Abs
Squat
Front Squat
Leg extensions
Weighted crunches (3 sets of 10)
Reverse Crunches

Wed: OFF

Thursday: Back/Biceps/Forearms
Deadlift
DB Rows
Chins
Standing Barbell Curls
Concentration Curls
Hammer Curls

Friday: Shoulders/Abs
Military Press
Front Db raises
Clean and Press
Shrugs
Weighted Crunches (3 x 10)
Twist Crunches

Sat and Sunday: OFF

Is that ok? Should I change up some of the lifts, different order, different movements? What about for abs?

What would a typical bulking diet look for me, at my weight?

I work from 1:00-6:00, most days... so I really can't eat food for those 5 hours... I still should be able to get in 5-8 meals/day like people say to get...

When, I do bulk up 25lbs, what should I change?

How long do you think that'll take? A year, half a year?
BTW, nice build fitness :)
 
I'm gonna do what I was gonna do before.. Try to drop the BF down below 10%, then i'm gonna start bulking...

If I bulk now, 15%, I could be up to 20% when done bulking and that'd take a long time to cut down to single digits...
 
The guy hoovers around a nicely shaped, decent sized upperbody (especially considering the low BF) His legs are surprisingly small in comparison, but this seems actual an advantage for sprinting (cuase the the big powersource is the glute-ham tie-in and fast running animals like horses have thin legs also and only thick muscle near the belly)

Hey, I am mostly 13 procent BF and sometimes i amange to drop to around 8 , but I would like sometimes to get as low as these guys and get that beautifull frontdelt biceps tie-in. Well, I guess I should quit being an AAS virgin, otherwise I definately would loose too much to get at 4-5 % BF
 
Ok......

Well, do you think my plan of cutting down... then bulking, cutting, bulking is good?

How fast do you think I can get under 10%? When, I drop that 10%BF and start bulking, how long do you think it'll be, before I reach 180?
 
im 16 in 2 weeks i put on 9 lbs

i dont really know how i did it andi didnt really even plan for it. i just ended my winning season (won the provincials) so i wanted to bulk (basketball player) so i can put on a bit more muscle mass. i was 5"8' 174 with an 18% bf. well after my season ened i cut my foot on glass really bad and i couldnt do any cardio. so basicly all i did was eat and maybe do abs and another muscle group in a day. next thing 2 weeks i measure myself in gym class i was 183!!! im thinkin of goin up to 190 lb and i want to stay there manly in my legs. just thought i might tell someone
 
That guy is pretty big in the first pic, which I think is his most recent pic!

That's pretty close to my goal as well :) Although my legs and calves, even after 6 months training are bigger than his :p
Thanks to my years of intense jumping and 6 months worth of sprinting.

I'm 5'9" and weigh about 182-184lbs at 9-10% bodyfat. Another 6months of my power training and diet, I think I will be at 190 6% bodyfat. Natural as well.
Its not hard to lean up and put on size and strength together if your smart about manipulating yoru insulin and GH hormones with your diet.
I weighed 210lb 2 20-25% BF 6 months ago, with weak strength and a 32 inch vertical jump. Now I weigh 182-184lbs at 9-10% BF, and a tiny bit stronger! Added 8 inches on my vertical jump too, now around 40 inches :)

The size will come when you training for power without really thinking about it, snatches, plyos, full squats, deadlifts, chins, dips etc.

190 6% bodyfat and a 44+ inch vertical, I'm gonna be a weapon on the playground BBall courts :D
 
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Do sprinters look the way that they do because of the way that they train...or are they good sprinters because that is the way that they were born...looking that way?

B True
 
don't get me wrong! I'm only 182-184 now at 9-10% BF.


190 @6% BF with a 44inch vertical jump is my goal in 6 months time :)

see my diet thread for diet specifics - I'll be posting a pic in a couple of weeks time when my waist hits the 30s, added quite a bit of size. Not much change in bodyweight

http://209.11.101.244/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=133563&pagenumber=3

My training changes quite regularly depending on the the way I feel and results of course.

currently I train 3 times a week - Mon, Weds and Sat

Monday is

Jump hang snatches - 3x5 with 3 vertical jumps before each set
2 sec pause at hang position

3 vert jumps and then straight after
Full squat 1x6 (tempo is 5 secs down, 1 sec up) , rest 1 min then 5 vertical jumps

Fullsquat 1x3, rest 1 min 5 standing long jumps

front squat 1x6

deadlift 1x6 slow

reverse lunge 1x10 slow

calfraise 2x6 temp is 5 sec down, explode concentric, 2 sec puase at top, 2 sec pause at bottom

revese hypers 2x15

Toe raise to work shin muscles, different directions

Hanging leg raise 2x15



Weds -

Snatches as above
Squats as above

Gluteham raise or stiff deadlifts 2 sets

these are done 1 set to failure - tempo is 5 secs down, 3 secs up
incline dumbell BP
Rows
shoulder width chins
cable lateral raises
incline curls
dips

abs 2x15
revers hypers 2x15
external cuff raises 1 set to failure
Toe raise

Sat as per Weds, except no squats, or leg work, ab and cuff exercises
 
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Well, what should I change up in my routine? It's on the first page...

Do you need a swiss ball to do reverse hypers? I have no swiss ball...

No calf machine, could I just use a barbell...?

What would be a good weight to start out with for both legs, or for a single leg?
 
Full size pic

Full size pic -

jsmoots.gif



Ever see those Ice skating sprinters in the olympics? Now those guys have some quads on them... 185lbs and very lean
Since they lean more while skating, quads are more important to them than 100m sprinters.

Hmm well meltdown training would overtrain the hell out of you. You'd be lucky to last a week, because a lot of those exercises are new to your body, each new exercise would make you sore, even before you factor in the intensity from the short rest periods! Its not a routine for long term gains.

I suggest you start sprinting, no ifs or buts, sprint to look like a sprinter :)
Keep the distance short to build power and muscle, 50ms or less.
This is where Olympic Weightlifters can blow away sprinters :)

Just do reverse hypers on a table. Bend your legs if their too long and starighten them as you go up. hold weight ebtween your legs as you gets tronger, Bodyweight is fine to start of with.

Well I myself will abandon calf training all togwther now. Sprinting, jumping and all power and leg exercises work them enough for mine to get bigger and stronger. In fact they're bigger than my arms :)
But you can do them on some stairs. One leg at a time, and hold a dumbell as you get stronger.
 
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I accredit all my lower body mass to sprinting. Started at the age of 9, and competed on a national team...17 years in total. It's VERY anabolic.
 
What, if anything, should I change in my routine????

I'm doing cleans, deads, squats, chins, etc.. Just on diff days.....
 
NeedHelp .....

if you're going to cut, then bulk ... why bother? youre just going to throw the original fat back on. you said youre 5'11, 165. gain weight. bulk like a madman, THEN cut.
 
gettinlarger said:
NeedHelp .....

if you're going to cut, then bulk ... why bother? youre just going to throw the original fat back on. you said youre 5'11, 165. gain weight. bulk like a madman, THEN cut.
Click to expand...

Amen.

B True
 
forget a heavy bulking plan

Why should you try and bulk at this point? I think that is a bad idea. Eat a good diet with a lot of protein. You should be able to gain a lot of muscle and get more cut at the same time instead of adding a lot of fat with a bulk cycle. Weight is nothing unless it is lean muscle. I see fat people at the gym all the time who think they are strong just because they are fat.
You shouldnt have to do a drastic bulk then cut cylce unless your juicing or something. 5'11" and 165 is not necessarily small. It depends on how lean you are. I am about that size and when I ask friends to guess my weight they always say something between 180-190lbs because i have muscle and i am cut. You will be supprised how much fat you have to lose. About 2 months ago I was around 175 and I thought i was pretty lean and couldnt possibly loose 10 pounds but add more strength but i did. I Had a good high protein diet.
Its a lot better to be lean and when you are , your muscle stands out a lot more; oh and it impresses the ladies :fro:
Have a good diet, take whey protein , and have a good workout cylce and you wont be dissapointed.
 
Re: forget a heavy bulking plan

ant256 said:
Why should you try and bulk at this point? I think that is a bad idea. Eat a good diet with a lot of protein. You should be able to gain a lot of muscle and get more cut at the same time instead of adding a lot of fat with a bulk cycle. Weight is nothing unless it is lean muscle. I see fat people at the gym all the time who think they are strong just because they are fat.
You shouldnt have to do a drastic bulk then cut cylce unless your juicing or something. 5'11" and 165 is not necessarily small. It depends on how lean you are. I am about that size and when I ask friends to guess my weight they always say something between 180-190lbs because i have muscle and i am cut. You will be supprised how much fat you have to lose. About 2 months ago I was around 175 and I thought i was pretty lean and couldnt possibly loose 10 pounds but add more strength but i did. I Had a good high protein diet.
Its a lot better to be lean and when you are , your muscle stands out a lot more; oh and it impresses the ladies :fro:
Have a good diet, take whey protein , and have a good workout cylce and you wont be dissapointed.
Click to expand...

And don't forget your andro too...lol.

B True
 
I think i'm gonna bulk... About ~ 3,200 calories/day.. Then when I reach about 180, i'll cut, then 210, i'll cut down to 190 or so...

Is my routine good???
 
I'm against bulking myself, because losing fat ain't that easy. Gaining muscle is much easier IMO. You can get to point where no matter how low in cals you go the fat won't come off, but the muscle melts. Whereas with muscle, just change up and train intense enough and the muscle comes on.
Its all about hormonal control with food. Use insulin to gain fat and muscle, use GH to lose fat. Juggle them correctly and you can gain muscle and lose fat together, or if you want gain muscle and maintain fat elevls. But chances are you will get lean, since more muscle = more caloriies burned.

If your fat you can't see the muscle, so how do you know where the muscle is going? :)

As far as your routine, try it and see how you go. Everyone is different. Only you yourself will know your percentage of fast/slow twitch fibres and how they respond to exercise.
Weight Training is a apprenticeship everyone must go through by themselves.
 
Well here's my bulk diet:

8:00/Whey W/ Milk, Multivitamin, Vitamin C

10:00/ 2 Whole eggs, 4 Egg Whites, Oatmeal, Banana

12:00/ Chicken Breast, Rice, Veggies

1:00/Work

6:00/OFF

6:30/Whey W/ Gatorade

6:45/WO

7:45/Whey W/ Gatorade

8:15/ 2 chicken breasts, rice (Might drop this), Veggies

10:00 / 8 slices of turkey, Milk

If I didn't do that, Cool, what would you recommend?

I know you said look @ your routine and diet (Since our goals are similar), but you do snatches and stuff--I dont know how to do those... Your diet seems pretty complicated too :(

Losing fat and gaining muscle would be great, so if you have suggestions.. Tell me :) Otherwise, I start my bulk and this routine on Monday :)
 
complictaed? nah its easy

I eat meat, raw nuts and veges at all meals, except at breakfast and after training. At those 2 times I can eat more carbs, I generally pigout out then :)

every 4 days or so I have a pigout day where I eat lots of carbs and pretty much anything I want, junk food etc all day.

my last meal is at 4 pm

easy

fat goes down, muscle goes up. I don't bother counting calories, proten or carbs either.

I also take a multivitamin at breakfast and after training

a calcium+cofactor tab at the last meal

2 fishoil capsules at every meal, that's about 12 grams a day.

No protein powder either - I think they're a waste of money

------------

I think your eating way too late at night to be losing fat. I'm in bed by 7 pm, up at 3am. But I do start work at 4:30pm :)

I think you should just combine your last 2 meals into one
 
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CoolColJ said:
I'm against bulking myself, because losing fat ain't that easy. Gaining muscle is much easier IMO. You can get to point where no matter how low in cals you go the fat won't come off, but the muscle melts. Whereas with muscle, just change up and train intense enough and the muscle comes on.
Its all about hormonal control with food. Use insulin to gain fat and muscle, use GH to lose fat. Juggle them correctly and you can gain muscle and lose fat together, or if you want gain muscle and maintain fat elevls. But chances are you will get lean, since more muscle = more caloriies burned.

If your fat you can't see the muscle, so how do you know where the muscle is going? :)
Click to expand...

No offense intended...but I mostly hear statements like this from "small" guys. I am 16 weeks from stage contest shape...can you be big in 16 weeks?

Muscle is much harder to build than fat is to burn...

B True
 
I'm against bulking myself, because losing fat ain't that easy. Gaining muscle is much easier IMO. You can get to point where no matter how low in cals you go the fat won't come off, but the muscle melts. Whereas with muscle, just change up and train intense enough and the muscle comes on.
Click to expand...

You must be joking. It is much, more difficult to put on lean body mass than it is to lose fat. Building lean muscle mass takes hard work, smart training and TIME. If I set my mind to it I could be ripped in 12-15 weeks by losing 30-40 lbs. of fat and water weight but it would take years to put on that same amount of lean muscle mass (with the exception of steroid use). That is just the way it is...
 
since everyone is flying way off the topic of 'sprinter look,' i figure id ask a question ... im having a hell of a hard time gaining weight. a buddy of mine suggested i up my carb intake. that sounds very logical, because when i think about it, i get good protein ... but not too too many carbs. ive also read that when at a plateau, you should up the carbs ...
 
Your talking about time , not effort.

Its very easy to go to the gym and pump iron, muscles get big from that, I enjoy going to the gym. In fact I wish I could go more often, but I would overtrain. I like training intense, its not like I'm forcing myself to be there.

but it takes a hell a lot more discipline to shred up. I do have to force myself to eat right to get lean. Its so easy to pigout on some junk food.

Everytime I train, the next day the muscle get slightly bigger, its noticable, and the next time I'm at the gym I'm stronger too, as long as I'm not overtraining. Sure it takes a while, but its just a matter of time. If you don't enjoy it, why are you doing it?

Now losing fat is much less predictable. Its not just a matter of cutting calories and doing HITT. If it were, there would be a lot more shredded folks walking around. In fact bulked up dudes outnumber lean guys by a factor of 99 to 1 :)

I'm getting stronger, bigger, leaner and jumping higher everyday doing it my way. That's all that counts to me. If my vertical jump, speed and Basketball performance goes down from bulking up that means I've failed. Bodybuilders and athletes who don't need to propel their own bodies around can bulk all they want, but to me bulking up is just adding on useless fat!
I've bulked in past in my mid 20s, I do not get any bigger or stronger faster. 5% increase in strength per week is about the most I got then, and its the same now.

Fat does not flex

Do I want to get bigger? Yes if my performance, flexibility and range of motion is not compromised. And I'm achieving that just fine.
But HUGE ? NO. I don't see huge guys being like Mike or capable of being slippery, or not looking like an ass. I'm training for relative strength, to be able to run faster and jump higher than I have ever had before. I can't see some some of these bodybuilders running rings around me or dunking on me :)

I think I've done very well for 6 months training especially since the first 3 months were just spent getting into the groove, just give me another 6 months and I bet I gain more than most people bulking up. I'm on a roll now, just watch me. And I will be able to boast a 44+ inch vertical jump which the fat guys won't and all at 31 years old and natural. I'll post some before and after pics in 6 months time and mpegs of me touching the top of the small square on a basketball ring :)
 
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I really do hope that you get all that you wish. Your statement about how it is easier to build muscle than it is to lose fat is still incorect. If it were easier to build muscle than to burn fat...you would see a lot more 300 pound monster roaming the earth.

For your sport, you are doing good but remember that you are training for basketball and not bodybuilding. If you don't want to get big because it may hinder your athletic performance...that is cool and I understand that. At 285 pounds I can still do some pretty freaky flips though...and still grab the rim on a 10 foot goal easily. I can also still do the splits.

If you want to say that because someone may have a weak mind it is harder to cut...then that is ok. But if they are mentally tough enough...dieting is much easier than building muscle. Lots of people walk on stage ripped...but they are still skinny.

B True
 
They probably lost the muscle to get ripped, which is not the case if they did it together :)

Aren't all those guys on roids anyway? So whats the problem? :p
 
CoolColJ said:
They probably lost the muscle to get ripped, which is not the case if they did it together :)

Aren't all those guys on roids anyway? So whats the problem? :p
Click to expand...

Can you explain what you just posted? I am not understanding what you are trying to say.

Sent cha some karma too...

Thanks

B True
 
All I was saying that aren't roids supposed to help one hold onto muscle when you rip up? So why are they skinny? :)

I think it works both ways. Some people have trouble gaining muscle, some people have trouble getting ripped. The rest of us are somewhere in between. I kinda lean towards the gain muscle easier side, but can still lose fat with slightly more effort.
For that reason I tend to workout for a short period of time and then lose interest - but this time I'm gonna stick at it for the long haul :)

Karma for what? :confused:

I'm gonna give you some karma too because your a cool guy!

BTW to answer NeedHelp's question, you should avoid eating within 2 hours of going to bed. You want the insulin levels on the low side so GH release will be larger when you enter deep REM sleep. I find this is when I lose the most fat.

Well if you wanna bulk up do a good job of it.. Serge Reding
5' 8" ... with a 1+ metre vertical leap - scary.... if it can help me jump 4 feet into the air, I'm willing to get my legs like his, I have the genetics for that type of leg :D


at 23 1965
1.jpg


1971 303lbs
2.jpg


1974 315lbs
3.jpg
 
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Well, athletic performance isn't my main goal.. If I bulked to 190, and i'm ~12-15% Bf now, how much weight @ 190 would I have to lose to get under 6%?
 
well say 15 % Bf at 190 that 28.5 lbs of fat

to get to 6 % you would need to lose about 16 lbs of fat or so.

but if you bulked up your final bodyfat percentage is the determining factor. You'd be surprised how much fat you have to lose to get to 6% after a bulk up.

I wouldn't worry about the weight, look at your waist measurement
 
I think im gonna bulk to 180, then cut down the BF under 10%, then bulk up to 210, and cut down under 6% BF..

So, i'll probably be around 13% BF @ 210, right? Then, I cut down from that to around 190 @ 6% BF?

A friend of mine gained about 20lbs with only adding 3% BF in 5 months, is that typical for a beginner?
3500 calories/day
 
How fast do you think I can reach 180lbs, without increasing the BF too much? Then, how long do you think it'll take to get the BF lower than 10%?

For my goals, do you think what i'm doing is good? If not, what should I do?
 
Needhelp said:
I think i'm gonna bulk... About ~ 3,200 calories/day.. Then when I reach about 180, i'll cut, then 210, i'll cut down to 190 or so...

Funny, your bulking diet would starve me to death. I eat more than that while trying to make weight. I am still trying to figure out what you are trying to do. If your goal is to look like that sprinter, and you don' t already look like him, then you are in trouble.

Train like him, eat what he does, run enough to make a gazelle puke, do glute ham raises till you want to die, and unless you happen to be that guy, you still are not going to look like him.

If you are trying to get bigger, then there are ways of doing that. If you want to try and get leaner (bad idea at your size) then there are ways of doing that. But you ain' t going to look like that guy unless you already do. People have been trying to recreate the Arnold physique since the 70's. They cannot get there, even with drugs and plastic surgery. He looked like he did, because he was born to.

The best you can do is improve on the hand you were dealt by mother nature. I agree with the point b-fold made. I think these guys look the way they do, and are great sprinters, because they were born to be that way, PLUS they trained for it. You cannot make a race horse out of a pig. However, you can make a very fast pig.

Just my 2 cents.
Click to expand...
 
Amazing post..

B True
 
I just want to gain more muscle, and get leaner..

3500 calories isn't a good bulk for 165lbs??

Do you have any suggestions about how to get bigger, and leaner? My goal is 190-205, 6% BF..
 
Thanks, B-fold,

Needhelp,

200 lbs and 6 percent bodyfat is an acheivable goal, but not a maintainable goal. Guys read this next sentence very very closely.

It is not normal or natural to maintain bodyfat levels in the single digits and still be able to build muscle.

Did you get that? Read it again. Even IFBB pros, who are the most roided out people on the planet do not stay at 6 percent bodyfat all year. It cannot be done by a walking pharmacy, so wy do you think it is even remotely possible for someone who is clean?

Muscle gets built when you have proper stimulation through training, proper rest, enough micronutrients (read Flintstones vitamin here) and WHEN YOU HAVE AN EXCESS OF CALORIES.

Without an excess of calories, you cannot consistently build muscle, even if you are taking every steroid in the world. At 6 percent bodyfat, you do not have an excess of calories. Anyone I have ever known in my life has had a natural setpoint of 10 percent or higher. Years and years of overeating has raised my setpoint to around 12 to 15 percent. I have to overeat to get above this point and have to undereat to get below this point. It is where my body is in its natural state.

I am not at all trying to discourage you. I am simply wanting you to see that you have conflicting goals, and not realistic goals, if you expect to stay this way all the time. It just ain't there. You are probably naturally skinny, so staying lean is relatively easy, and gaining muscle is relatively tough. Unless you do something drastic with diet and training, that is never going to change.

But when you do something drastic, you change your body's natural setpoint. I have dramatically raised my body's setpoint in the last 10 years. 10 years ago, I was about 150 to 155 lbs. As I type this I am 225 lbs, same height as 10 years ago.

I am much stronger now than then. But while I can still do the splits, I can no longer grab the rim on a basketball goal. (I am five foot 7 BTW) I am immensely stronger in the legs, and still very explosive, but a 75 lbs gain in body mass is tough on the ole vert.

You just cannot have it all. I hate to tell you that but you cannot. You cannot have Ronnie Coleman's body without his genetics, and an insane amount of anabolic drugs. Sorry to burst your bubble guys but Ronnie ain't clean. You also cannot run a 4 minute mile while benching 400lbs. These are diametricly apposed goals. Getting bigger while getting leaner at the same time, is, unless you are a total couch potato, next to impossible.

I hope some of this helps.

B.
 
benchmonster: The more you post, the more I like you.

I hope that Needhelp really reads this. At 165 you have much to learn.

B True
 
Yeah, I know. This is why I ask :)

My 3.5K bulk looks like this:

8:00/ Whey W/ Milk, Mult vitamin, vit C

10:00 / 3 Egg whites, 2 whole eggs, 1/2 cup oatmeal, Banana, Milk

12:00/ Chicken Breast, Cup of rice, veggies, Milk

1:00/ Work :(

3:00 / Sunflower seeds

6:00/ Off work :)

6:30 / Whey W/ Gatorade
6:35 /WO
7:35/ Whey w/ Gatorade

8:45/ 2 Chicken Breasts, Veggies, Milk

1.5 gallons water/day

So you recommend I start off by just bulking for a while and doing a normal split (Work each muscle group 1x/week).....?

Should I cut when I reach a certain weight, or just wait 'till i'm around 210?
:confused:
 
b fold the truth said:
benchmonster: The more you post, the more I like you.

I hope that Needhelp really reads this. At 165 you have much to learn.

B True
Click to expand...

B-fold,

That really means a lot to me coming from you. Thank you.

Needhelp,

Your diet looks great for a bodybuilder, I guess. But if you want to get big, eat like the big guys do. What you are eating would shred me like a razor. I would also lose size and strength. I am not about to do that.

I think B-fold probably eats a little bit like I do. I eat a lot. That is criteria number one. Unless I am trying to make a weight class, I eat tacos, burritos, hamburgers, pizza, any and all kinds of beef, porkchops, any kind of chicken, eggs as often as possible, and whatever else falls in on the way.

I don't overeat like I used to, probably around 4K calories per day, just guessing. Honestly nutrition is highly overrated, other than to control bodymass. And that whey stuff, unless yo u like the way it tastes, I would can it. I think that stuff is a total waste of money.

I have made my best gains, by far, since I quit spending any money at the GNC. That stuff does not work. Food, good training, rest, and anabolics work. Not much else does.

Regarding a training program, I am a powerlifter, B-fold is a strongman, we know about getting big and strong. I am not an expert on getting pretty, or symetrical, or striated. Others on the board can help you more with a bodybuilding workout.

B.
 
Last edited:
Its much easier to get bigger from sacroplasmic growth - muscle goo. Typicaly what BB'es display. Big puffy muscles. Muscle growth from contractile proteins look diffferent, harder and denser. This is the muscle size atheletes normally display.

So if you want a sprinter look, don't train the way Bodybuilders do. Use big compound movements with heavy weights. Generally speaking olympic lifts will figure in there somewhere, but Ben Johnson didn't do an O lifts, but he can squat 600lbs for 6 reps :)
 
I've got all the big compound movements in my routine already, I think...

Squats, Deads, Chins, Bench, Cleans, Shrugs, etc...
 
yeah but do low reps 2-5. Not good for growth generally speaking.

They think in terms of reps. So say you need to do 15 reps for squats. You would do 5 sets of 3 or 3 sets of 5.

Athletes are mainly concerned with developing fast twitch muscle fibres and rate firing. That means heavy weights, but because they are so fast twitch heavy they do actualy get big from large volume sets of low repetitions. Which you may not, depending on how your muscle fibres are set up.

For example my legs grow bigger from doing 2 sets of 5 and 3 reps of full squats to failure. Even though I don't want them too, not much I can do about that. You deal with the cards your given.
 
So 5 x 3 for everything or just for the big movements like Squat, Dead, Clean, etc.

What about Chins? Go to failure?
 
Chances are you will not gain size from doing so low reps, but then again you might, you won't know till you try it. You'll need plenty of fast twitch fibres for that too happen, as not too many slow twitch fibres will be recruited when your train that heavy.
In any case, if you don't have a foundation of strength training under your belt, 3 reps may be more harm than good. Watch your tendons and ligaments.

experiment. I don' think too many sprinters do chins. Its not a require movement for sprinting. Plenty of rows though.

Just train like a bodybuilder, the sprinter look is because these guys are born that way, the training they do just brings that out. I have yet to see a white sprinter look like a black sprinter, and vice versa :)

Having said that, the way you train does has some influence.
 
CoolColJ said:
Generally speaking olympic lifts will figure in there somewhere, but Ben Johnson didn't do an O lifts, but he can squat 600lbs for 6 reps :)
Click to expand...

I don't think that there has ever been any proof of that...

B True
 
Well his coach said so :)

link

http://www.charliefrancis.com/board/philboard_read.asp?id=22

Q: How deep should a track and field athlete be squatting for maximal results, and what percentage of the athlete's one rep maximum are most commonly used in training? I am primarily interested in squatting for shot-putters and sprinters. I have seen answers all over the board on this one. I would like to hear the opinion of a coach who knows.

A: We always tried to ensure hamstring involvement. There are many theories about how high an athlete’s 1 RM squat should be relative to his weight, but the answer is there really is no answer! How long are the athlete’s legs compared to his torso? If he is a sprinter, what is the strong part of his race? Should you emphasize the start or the finish? Even with the shot-putter the question can become complicated. He will eventually become so strong that a 1RM is too dangerous to perform, so top throwers often have to adjust their programs by feel or by making assumptions about their 1RM based on max triples etc. I never tested Ben for his 1RM squat, though he did squat 2 sets of 6 at 600! Though, obviously Ben was capable of lifting more with fewer reps, he never did for safety’s sake. After all, how strong did he need to be? Remember, there is a lot of strength endurance involved in sprinting, so Ben’s 1RM squat would not be as high as a shot-putter who could handle the same 6RM.
 
I don't doubt that someone said that he did it...coach or not...and I don't want to turn this into a Ben Johnson debate (did that a while back..lol). I just highly doubt that he did it.

B True
 
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